How could AV's and GM's be more... challenging?
By
Alvan,
Posted on: 2008-08-14 10:11 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
GMs:
they need a purpose. they need to actually be a threat.
Lusca for example just sits there and does nothing else. My suggestion:
Lusca goes on a rampage and attacks boats and anything on the shore. When she appears there is an event warning (make her appearances rarer though) and citizens start to run. have local bad guys (family and tsoo) try to hold her back as well. Lusca can also make appearances in the Rogue Isles (not fair that the heroes hog the good GMs 
).
As for making her more of a challenge AND making her more unique:
1. shed loads of HP, she's BIG.
2. High regen rate (squid octopi heal pretty quick)
3. Ranged attack: water jet , huge range, knockdown and negate toggles, -fly / sj for 10 sec.
4. Ink Cloud: PB AoE , anyone in the area of effect cannot target due to the nauseating effects of the ink
5. Crush: grabs and holds a target with a tentacle causes damage and target immobilised. victim can be freed if x damage is done to the tentacle.
6. as an option after crush: 1. throw: throws the character a huge distance. flying characters that re-toggle fly in time can avoid taking damage. 2. Batter: hits the victim off surrounding walls, ships, other characters causing damage to both parties, 3. bite and throw: drags the victim to the mouth for a massive damage bite attack then throws away whats left.
7. Splash: PBAoE: slapping the water with all tentacles sends a massive splash that affects all targets in an area around Lusca: foe Knock Back, foe disorient.
8. Fire resistance: mucus coating gives resistance to fire based damage, Cold resistance: rubbery fat of the body is less affected by cold, smashing resist: rubbery body compacts well to absorb shock, lethal resist: the sheer size and the rubbery nature of the octopus makes Lusca able to shrug off most piercing damage. Electrical resistance: the mucus layer over the skin acts like a natural faraday cage dispersing electrical charges into the surrounding water before they can damage Lusca herself.
9. susceptible to energy damage and Psionic damage
Now, the above is a real monster that in my opinion fights like a giant octopus from 20000 leagues under the sea etc.
points can be awarded for evacuating people from the tankers and boats in danger on the water or guiding scared civillians to safety away from the area where lusca is attacking (click on the civillian to initiate rescue, option to carry (flier/SJ/tp) or issue "follow me" command). On shore, random bits of debris gets thrown and tentacles nearest the shore make random grabs for civvies and heroes.
maybe SStr characters can lift boats out of the water and fly them to safety.....
Badges:
Angler Badge for facing Lusca
Badge for being part of the team that defeats Lusca (have to have done some sort of damage)
Fishbait Badge for being defeated by Lusca x number of times
Coast Guard Badge for saving civillians from lusca's rampage
Accolades:
thrillseeker badge for facing all gms
Scourge of the Sea badge for defeating Lusca and Sally
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But Gms dont DO anything. They are just there, waiting for someone to gather a load of players who then start to blast it until the tree falls down... a total non event.
[...]
They should have goals theyre trying to accomplish. (destroy certain buildings? cause chaos in the city? etc ) etc and there should be a marker of some sort to determine if we're preventing them from achieving they're goal or if they're winning.
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The Arachnos Flyer in Grandville and Ghost of Scrapyard in Sharkhead don't just stand around waiting to be killed and are part of the kind of event you're suggesting. The Flyer has a patrol path and lands 4 times to drop its force field and (if attacked) disembark troops. GoS rises from his grave in Potter's Field's cemetary, makes his way to the Hellforge reprocessing plant, and is slowly joined by more and more Scrapyarder followers from around the zone until he has a bit of a strike rally going on. He makes a speech, and then he leads them on a strike march through the streets of Sharkhead town, more Scrapyarders joining them all the time, as he heads towards the pier where Mako originally killed him. And then... well, nowadays his path takes him into the auto-death field around the BM and he just suicides there 
It would be nice if the Devs could retroactively change all other GMs to fit this pattern so at least there was some movement to them and scripted events they carried out (though with most GMs being in hazard zones there might not be much they can smash up that would matter - though Lusca could attack ships/bridges or pick up civilians off the quayside).
But first they need to make GMs worth defeating. First I'd increase GM xp/inf rewards, then I'd make them always drop a rare/orange recipe, and in addition a guaranteed rare/orange salvage piece too - nothing major, but at least a worthwhile reward. Lastly I'd add an Accolade badge called "Monster Hunter" earned by getting all of the GM defeat badges on your side of the game (CoH or CoV, though I'd include U'kon Gr'ai from RWZ as a requirement for both) - yes, allegedly this would make it easier for villains as they have less GMs their side, but the Arachnos Flyer being tougher than a lot of GMs and having to force-spawn Caleb & Deathsurge evens it up a little.
The new Accolade would also grant a desireable power - perhaps a passive that added 10-20% end recovery, or a click that completely refilled your end bar with a 30-60min rchg, or maybe just a click power on a 60min rchg that replicated the level-up inspiration buff (i.e. applies 1 of every large insp to you - yes, including the awaken, so it would work as a self-rez).
Lusca should throw stuff like cars and dockside containers - maybe aim them at the station to encourage Heroes to get rid of her
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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Lusca should throw stuff like cars and dockside containers - maybe aim them at the Talos station to encourage Heroes to get rid of her
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Fixed to reflect where the 20-30s really hang out
I don't think she could hurl them all the way across the city
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
Read the first few posts and my idea is:
Make all AVs and possibly GMs... immune to Taunt.
Pure chaos! It would be so awesome!
Concept wise, AVs being immune to Taunt would fit. I can't really imagine Lord Recluse being Taunted by a Tanker.
Tanker: You're mother is so fat, a whole army of Super Strength Tankers couldn't lift her.
Lord Recluse: ... really? *yawn* Oh! A Defender! They heal you! After them!
That said, I think CoX should take an idea from WoW. Healing causes aggro. Why? Because the enemy you're fighting is going to be pretty miffed when the target he/she is trying to kill gets healed.
Another idea: Let AVs be able to nuke and/or use God Modes whenever they feel like it instead of when they're at 5% HP and the next six attacks will finish them off anyway.
Nerf Granite Armour! If you have one of these in your team, said AV is surely... dead. If you don't have a Granite Armour in your team, it's a little trickier, but more fun.
That's my two cents.
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Twitter: @TonyParkeze
Facebook: www.facebook.com/anthonyjp91
Email: anthonyjp91@gmail.com
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Make all AVs and possibly GMs... immune to Taunt.
Pure chaos! It would be so awesome!
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You really hate Blasters, don't you? GMs would just be a death sentence for them if you do this.
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Another idea: Let AVs be able to nuke and/or use God Modes whenever they feel like it instead of when they're at 5% HP and the next six attacks will finish them off anyway.
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Side-lining whether the AI could handle preferences without a major code re-write, I can tell you've not fought Honoree on the LGTF - it takes quite a lot more than half a dozen attacks to finish him off when he goes Unstoppable - in fact if your team doesn't have enough damage/debuffs he'll just out-regen whatever damage you manage to do while he's in it. I've seen LRSFs get ugly when Statesman and/or Positron go Unstoppable too.
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Nerf Granite Armour! If you have one of these in your team, said AV is surely... dead. If you don't have a Granite Armour in your team, it's a little trickier, but more fun.
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Granites (tankers & brutes) do make AVs a lot easier, but then they do pay rather large penalties in non-AV situations for that power - I think calling a nerf down on them would be somewhat unfair when most people probably play Stone Armour purely for that capability. Besides, my EM/Elec can make himself just as unkillable for 3mins against any AV with Power Surge, and adding 1min of Demonic to that and potentially opening the fight with a Luck overdose he can usually hold aggro for 5mins with impunity, which is often plenty of time to down most AVs. If you pick on Granite you pretty much have to pick on most tier9 godmodes.
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Read the first few posts and my idea is:
Make all AVs and possibly GMs... immune to Taunt.
Pure chaos! It would be so awesome!
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Not for Tankers, who would become effectively useless O.o
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Lusca should throw stuff like cars and dockside containers - maybe aim them at the station to encourage Heroes to get rid of her
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I have a better idea what lusca could do... with female heroes.
Your awful Muriel...
Do tell...
Got my suggestion (for GM's) right here:
http://uk.boards.cityofheroes.com/sh...Number=1182615
It includes a way to make them both easier and at the same time more challenging.
Nuff Said...
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Creator of: Coolio's Tech Beacon Replacements
AE arc 402506, 'The Rise and Demise or Otherwise of Tekna Logik...'.
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Got my suggestion (for GM's) right here:
http://uk.boards.cityofheroes.com/sh...Number=1182615
It includes a way to make them both easier and at the same time more challenging.
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Yeah but that didn't make an awful lot of sense compared to current game mechanics and would require a lot of programming to put new systems in place.
I'd rather add challenge by having more random events, which could easily be done with the systems the game already has in place.
You could have ambushes that come to aid the GM/AV, perhaps made up wholly of EBs, so that off-tanking becomes useful to have. Instead of purple triangles you could have trade-offs between different up-triangle/down-triangle states so GMs resist different damage types or status effects in the different states - and make these states more visual, such as the GM changing appearance (as those little purple triangles can be so hard to see).
You could also have AVs/GMs being granted weaknesses/strengths or special abilities by the environment around them, e.g. maybe Jurassik moving/healing/attacking faster on land, but moving/healing/attacking slower in water. Or have Adamastor able to heal himself by absorbing the life force of any BP shaman nearby and have ambushes of those rush towards him periodically, so you'd have to kill them before they got near him to prevent him healing.
Put them all together and you might get something like this:
Babbage spawns at one end of Boomtown and ponderously moves towards the other side of it, where he is going to attack a team of surveyors trying to assess the damage to some of the buildings near the Steel Canyon gate. Heroes have to stop him. As well as the badge for defeating him, there is also a badge for stopping him before he harms any surveyor teams with their Longbow bodyguards.
Phase 1: Babbage would begin a fight:
- resistant to psi/fire/lethal (cant do much against his armoured shell)
- protected against holds/stuns/fears/confuses (ditto)
- resistant to repel/kb/-spd/-rchg (weighs so much he is hard to affect)
- with good accuracy/ToHit (full power, unconcerned for his safety)
- with good regen
But also:
- weak to energy (overloads circuits), cold (freezes joints) & smash (dents armour plates)
- attacks slowly for lower damage (ponderously heavy)
- slow moving (because of his bulk)
- resistant to Taunting (he tries to keep moving towards his objective)
- weak to being Phased (just because
& a way to slow his progress if you needed to regroup)
As soon as he gets damaged Babbage would start moving towards the nearest junk pile in the direction of his objective (these could be destroyable objects, placed all over Boomtown) to scavenge pieces of armour from it and thus rapidly increase his own health. You could stop this by destroying the junk pile before he reaches it (it could be EB level with decent resists, but still easier to harm than Babbage himself).
Phase 2: at half health, Babbages resists/protections flip and visually his outer armour falls away to reveal the workings inside, then he becomes:
- weak to psi/fire/lethal (you can now attack his psychic control net and circuits/wires)
- weak to holds/stuns/fears/confuses (can get at his inner workings more easily)
- weak to repel/kb/-spd/-rchg (doesnt weigh as much now)
- with poor accuracy/ToHit (targeting optics damaged when armour fell away)
- with poor regen (the damage you do to his internals is harder for him to self-repair)
But also:
- resistant to energy (his unshielded capacitors absorb it)
- resistant to cold (chilling his components directly makes him more efficient)
- resistant to smash (doesnt do much to his wiring, compared with lethal)
- attacks faster for higher damage (less bulky now, but is frenzied as he feels threatened)
- moves faster (because he weighs less now)
- can be Taunted normally and stops trying to reach his objective
That way he becomes easier to control but harder-hitting as the fight goes on. Also during this phase Babbage can no longer use junk piles to restore his health, but ambushes of Psychic Clockwork rush out to repair him instead and have to be stopped before they reach him. Each Psychic Clockwork that reaches Babbage merges with him to form part of his restored armour (and thus increases his health, which if it increases past 50% would put him back in his phase 1 state).
Most of the phase states can be done via the purple triangles system we have now and the visual change at 50% health would be just like Jade Spiders appearance change in the CoH-side Silos TF - I think only the AI changes would need major programming work. Oh and make Babbage much bigger - at least 3 times the height 
just have AV's have a 2-3x fight, one that it turns in your side when it's around 20% health and falls back to there helpers, up until the final fight.
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Lusca should throw stuff like cars and dockside containers - maybe aim them at the station to encourage Heroes to get rid of her
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I have a better idea what lusca could do... with female heroes.
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Surely only those in Japanese schoolgirl costumes...
But yeah, it would be nice if hey did something to make GMs more interesting. If they aren't going to make them worth killing again, at least make them rampage round the whole zone instead of just hanging in one corner.
However, it turned out that Smith was not a time-travelling Terminator
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Make all AVs and possibly GMs... immune to Taunt.
Pure chaos! It would be so awesome!
[/ QUOTE ]
You really hate Blasters, don't you? GMs would just be a death sentence for them if you do this.
[ QUOTE ]
Another idea: Let AVs be able to nuke and/or use God Modes whenever they feel like it instead of when they're at 5% HP and the next six attacks will finish them off anyway.
[/ QUOTE ]
Side-lining whether the AI could handle preferences without a major code re-write, I can tell you've not fought Honoree on the LGTF - it takes quite a lot more than half a dozen attacks to finish him off when he goes Unstoppable - in fact if your team doesn't have enough damage/debuffs he'll just out-regen whatever damage you manage to do while he's in it. I've seen LRSFs get ugly when Statesman and/or Positron go Unstoppable too.
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Nerf Granite Armour! If you have one of these in your team, said AV is surely... dead. If you don't have a Granite Armour in your team, it's a little trickier, but more fun.
[/ QUOTE ]
Granites (tankers & brutes) do make AVs a lot easier, but then they do pay rather large penalties in non-AV situations for that power - I think calling a nerf down on them would be somewhat unfair when most people probably play Stone Armour purely for that capability. Besides, my EM/Elec can make himself just as unkillable for 3mins against any AV with Power Surge, and adding 1min of Demonic to that and potentially opening the fight with a Luck overdose he can usually hold aggro for 5mins with impunity, which is often plenty of time to down most AVs. If you pick on Granite you pretty much have to pick on most tier9 godmodes.
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I don't hate Blasters! I never implied that! As for GMs, I said possibly. I have done the LGTF thank you very much ( ) and never found The Honoree that much of a challenge because our team was well equipped.
As for nerfing Granites, that might've been a... uhh... slip of the tongue. It just popped into my head and I didn't think it through.
Well, instead of making AVs immune to Taunt, why not let healing cause aggro?
Statesman is a pansy. Enough said.
P.S. Positron uses Overload. 
Contact Information!
Twitter: @TonyParkeze
Facebook: www.facebook.com/anthonyjp91
Email: anthonyjp91@gmail.com
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Lusca should throw stuff like cars and dockside containers - maybe aim them at the station to encourage Heroes to get rid of her
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I have a better idea what lusca could do... with female heroes.
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That's...
>_<
... sickening.
Contact Information!
Twitter: @TonyParkeze
Facebook: www.facebook.com/anthonyjp91
Email: anthonyjp91@gmail.com
[ QUOTE ]
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Lusca should throw stuff like cars and dockside containers - maybe aim them at the station to encourage Heroes to get rid of her
[/ QUOTE ]
I have a better idea what lusca could do... with female heroes.
[/ QUOTE ]Those tentacles aren't really of the ideal size though.
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That said, I think CoX should take an idea from WoW. Healing causes aggro. Why? Because the enemy you're fighting is going to be pretty miffed when the target he/she is trying to kill gets healed.
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Aaaaaaaargh noooooo please nooooo! That is SO annoying in LOTRO. I really doubt Morgana and I would enjoy the game were that implemented.
[url=http://vox-doom.deviantart.com]Take A Gander At This.[/url]
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Lusca should throw stuff like cars and dockside containers - maybe aim them at the station to encourage Heroes to get rid of her
[/ QUOTE ]
I have a better idea what lusca could do... with female heroes.
[/ QUOTE ]Those tentacles aren't really of the ideal size though.
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then they need to use more force
"Well, they found my diary today.
They were appropriately appalled
at the discovery of the eight victims
They're now putting it all together.
Women wrapped in silk
with one leg missing
Eight legs, one body, silk,
spider, brilliant!"
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Lusca should throw stuff like cars and dockside containers - maybe aim them at the station to encourage Heroes to get rid of her
[/ QUOTE ]
I have a better idea what lusca could do... with female heroes.
[/ QUOTE ]Those tentacles aren't really of the ideal size though.
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then they need to use more force
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Wouldn't that... hurt?
Contact Information!
Twitter: @TonyParkeze
Facebook: www.facebook.com/anthonyjp91
Email: anthonyjp91@gmail.com
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Lusca should throw stuff like cars and dockside containers - maybe aim them at the station to encourage Heroes to get rid of her
[/ QUOTE ]
I have a better idea what lusca could do... with female heroes.
[/ QUOTE ]Those tentacles aren't really of the ideal size though.
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You just need bigger heroes (not necessary female ones) in schoolgirl uniforms
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[url="http://www.the-cow.net/"][color=red]The CoW Network (Blog) /[/url][url="http://www.collegeofwar.com/"][color=blue]/ College of War[/url]
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Lusca should throw stuff like cars and dockside containers - maybe aim them at the station to encourage Heroes to get rid of her
[/ QUOTE ]
I have a better idea what lusca could do... with female heroes.
[/ QUOTE ]Those tentacles aren't really of the ideal size though.
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You just need bigger heroes (not necessary female ones) in schoolgirl uniforms
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boy's in a schoolgirl uniform.....you have a dirty mind, shame on you
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Lusca should throw stuff like cars and dockside containers - maybe aim them at the station to encourage Heroes to get rid of her
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I have a better idea what lusca could do... with female heroes.
[/ QUOTE ]Those tentacles aren't really of the ideal size though.
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then they need to use more force
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Wouldn't that... hurt?
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See sig...
Pain so close to pleasure
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Make all AVs and possibly GMs... immune to Taunt.
Pure chaos! It would be so awesome!
[/ QUOTE ]
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You really hate Blasters, don't you? GMs would just be a death sentence for them if you do this.
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What if the Tankers taunted but only received the lions share but not all the aggro?
That way the Gm would still be mitigated by the Tanker but would be a threat to everyone on the team attacking.
I also think that if you are defeated you shouldnt be allowed back into the fight for a penalty period of maybe 2 or 3 minutes.
Dying really isnt much of a big deal at the mo but it should be laid out that 2 or 3 deaths can cause problems for the remaining team..
Don't get into a flap. It's only my opinion and I'm thick
Arc 56763 Lord Anarchys heaven
2 mission arc. Bring friends cause Lord Anarchy means business...
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I want GMs to be rare enough that they'll still be a treat after years of playing --
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Better do sommething about the pathetic risk-reward ratio then. I don't bother with GM's now unless someone wants a badge. They're simply not worth the effort at the moment.
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But Gms dont DO anything. They are just there, waiting for someone to gather a load of players who then start to blast it until the tree falls down... a total non event.
Lack of awards aside, its plain boring.
The Gms should, in my opinion have a lot more damage, a far faster attack rate. I dont remember anyone ever dying against a GM in a proper fight. I'm sure they have but it must be rare and, against a GM, it shouldnt be.
They should have goals theyre trying to accomplish. (destroy certain buildings? cause chaos in the city? etc ) etc and there should be a marker of some sort to determine if we're preventing them from achieving they're goal or if they're winning.
it should be a super hero event where we really have to struggle and there is a possibility of failure and defeat.
The closest I have really found of an AV truly worth their salt has to be Ghost Widow in RV. She should be a tenplate for all AVs in my opinion cause that lady is tough, full of surprises and beating her is an achievement.
Don't get into a flap. It's only my opinion and I'm thick
Arc 56763 Lord Anarchys heaven
2 mission arc. Bring friends cause Lord Anarchy means business...