Just to clarify my stance one last time.
In game cannon states that six years ago the entire world (well maybe not Arachnos) joined together to fight the invading Rikti.
Many many lives were lost and all major cityies devestated, six years post war the richest most important city in the world still hasn't rebuilt its self fully.
Real world situations ceased being useable at that point, the countryies in CoX are simply not in the same state as they are in the real world.
North Korea hates South Korea? They probably still do, would they do anything about it? No they are still rebuilding from the recent Rikti attacks if not from the 2002 war.
Even if you go the Marvel route and have contries and events that are suspiciously like real world events, you have to remember they are still rebuilding from attack by the Rikti, the people still living infear of a new wave of drop ships.
Who cares about the Muslims across the border, from the sky is where a real threat one that killed your wife/sibling/parents/child six years ago/ two months ago may just suddenly attack.
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
Bah. My wifi reset and lost me my first reply to you, CB. Will try to encapsulate the main points of it again.
[ QUOTE ]
If you were correct that this fictional world remains fractured with countryies at war despite the unifying effects of a global attack.
[/ QUOTE ]
One really huge clue is the UN. In the game cannon, we know that the UN exists, and we are told that the major change is simply that it added a bit of a sub-group dedicated to Super-human Affairs.
[ QUOTE ]
The United Nations (UN) is an international organization whose stated aims are to facilitate cooperation in international law, international security, economic development, social progress and human rights issues. The United Nations was founded in 1945 to replace the League of Nations, in the hope that it would intervene in conflicts between states and thereby avoid war.
[/ QUOTE ]
The UN exists purely to attempt to minimise international tensions. Not all countries subscribe to it. I am pretty certain that should any new global accord eliminate the threat of war, most Governments would far rather stop paying millions or billions of dollars into the UN, even if only to offer their citizens a tax cut and assure election victories.
Game cannon goes further. It tells us that Vanguard was created under the UN control and funding. Not equal to, and certainly not above UN authority, but under it. Why? Because the threat of countries not pulling together is still greater than the threat of the Rikti. The politics of ensuring that no nation decides to make a deal with the Rikti is still above the actual effort of fighting them. Why place the force under the UN? Because otherwise the Vanguard members would be partisan, fighting to defend their own turf, and not going abroad to where the key to victory might be. Only under UN guidance can they be reasonably sure that Vanguard won't just protect the first-world nations and ignore the lesser ones.
Its simple logic.
[ QUOTE ]
Then why hasn't Nemisis done what the LoRDs are planning to do?
[/ QUOTE ]
Lord Borealis said "Because Nemesis is a moron, you dolt!"
Game cannon tells us that of all super-villains, Nemesis came the closest to a major victory when he attacked Washington and almost took control of the US. But the entire subtlety of his plan was to field the biggest army of clockwork robots the world had ever seen, and threaten to set off deadly toxic bombs he'd pre-planted in the major US cities if he was opposed.
All the brilliant subtlety of a brick to the head. His tactic was to use a bigger, clockwork powered hammer than anyone else had.
Only all these years later, in the timeline that we uncover in game-play, has he developped the subtlety of attempting to replace important people with clockwork doppelgangers.
Nemesis is still focussed on conquering the US too much, perhaps due to still fighting some personal grudge over WW1. All his brilliance is in the geeky sense of the mad inventor. He's not a people person, not gifted at manipulation, and has to expend considerable resources on creating an army of automata he can control because he's not that good with the far more readily available resource of people. Game cannon pretty much states he's not good at politics or manipulating people, and surrounds himself instead with automata.
One thing I personally find most interesting is that HeroCorps has global franchises in major cities all over the globe. Yet even with this resource as an already established international crime-fighting and peace-keeping force, they have not replaced the UN.
To rationalise that reality into something you can play with tells you that the international political situation is still very much as we know it, with super-humans only adding an additional tension.
Game cannon tells us that the governments were naturally displeased at certain heroes declaring themselves above the law and authority of nations. I can't blame them in a way, because as far as I can see, nobody ever elected Statesman, and he refuses to be answerable for his actions. This is precisely how, the game cannon tells us, so many super-heroes became super-villains.
Incidentally, while Game cannon specifically mentioned the ending of the cold war, you somehow think that the sudden outbreak of world peace, international cooperation, and a global cessation of hostilities was just ommitted? 
http://www.savecoh.com/
[ QUOTE ]
I suggest a private forum on one of the Shades, Militia or Blood Countess sites.
[/ QUOTE ]
Romanov, I believe that everyone of the LORDs players except perhaps for Liz is already a member of the Militia forums, so asking Crimson Archer to set up a private forum viewable only with certain group permissions seems the sensible course.
If there are any problems with that, I'll simply set it up at the Shades forum as I have for a couple of other projects we wanted to work on without spoiling the surprise to everyone, as again, I think all but 2 of the LORDs players are already registered at the Shades forum.
http://www.savecoh.com/
[ QUOTE ]
Incidentally, while Game cannon specifically mentioned the ending of the cold war, you somehow think that the sudden outbreak of world peace, international cooperation, and a global cessation of hostilities was just ommitted?
[/ QUOTE ]
Well since the time lines ends with a paragraph saying that since so many of the police, heroes and armed forces of the world died Supervillians started to flourish you'd think they would have toher things on their mind than waging war on each other.
Now while I have no problem with the idea of you taking over a country, its the whole by exploiting political unrest in the area.
The LoRDs are ment to be the cream of Supervillianry but you are acting like 12 year old thugs waiting until the shop keeper isn't looking so you can run off with a pack of sweets.
You should be able to engineer everything, start the unrest, take over and gain control without any one suspecting you.
That and taking a real world situation and just putting different names on it is a bit uninspired to say the least.
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
[ QUOTE ]
Well since the time lines ends with a paragraph saying that since so many of the police, heroes and armed forces of the world died Supervillians started to flourish you'd think they would have toher things on their mind than waging war on each other.
Now while I have no problem with the idea of you taking over a country, its the whole by exploiting political unrest in the area.
The LoRDs are ment to be the cream of Supervillianry but you are acting like 12 year old thugs waiting until the shop keeper isn't looking so you can run off with a pack of sweets.
You should be able to engineer everything, start the unrest, take over and gain control without any one suspecting you.
That and taking a real world situation and just putting different names on it is a bit uninspired to say the least.
[/ QUOTE ]
I don't want to get drawn into this, but I really have to ask you where is this coming from? All that has happened IC is a meeting of an hour or two in length which ended with an agreement to discuss taking over a nation at a later date. While the people involved in this discussion may think it has merit, it really has little to do with the LoRDs characters and any plot that may or may not happen in the future.
@Romanov
Nadja Romanov, Lily Pink, Little Death - The Cadre
Estoque, Bastinado, Spidermonkey, Chic Doyle - The Militia
Miss Teen, Dead Reckoner, Dee Dee Diablo, Kaneko
Basically from the second page of this thread where Amoon says that fictional places should be set close to real world trouble hot spots, so that you can leach off of real world situations to help the plot.
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
EDIT: Deleted by me.
Right. I see that has a post in the wider discussion that this thread became. It really remains to be seen whether that plays any part in what the characters do or do not do.
Obviously, Ammon has a great knowledge of game cannon and history so he will have an input into what is done OOC and through his character IC. But nothing has happened yet or even been discussed, so much of any argument here is unecessary.
@Romanov
Nadja Romanov, Lily Pink, Little Death - The Cadre
Estoque, Bastinado, Spidermonkey, Chic Doyle - The Militia
Miss Teen, Dead Reckoner, Dee Dee Diablo, Kaneko
Good point. I agree completely and I'll shut up now.
I think that this discussion is all-in-all a good thing. Not merely specifically for finding the boundaries and game-realities we may need to use in the plot for LORDs, but for getting an idea of general feeling and concensus, and maybe hammering out some shared reality without which all plots become fundamentally flawed.
So yes, this discussion is a lot wider than just the current LORDs plot, and thus not every point I want to discuss or consider is directly related to LORDs alone.
I do favour a more realistic and believable gameworld than many. Some parts of the official game cannon make me cringe at how poorly thought out they are in real detail. If I were writing the game world from scratch then I'd be largely in agreement with CactusBrawler that the presence of super-heroes, super-natural entities, gods, magic, etc, for 80 years, should have had a major effect on the world around them, and radically altered the course of history.
The fact is that if this were a game world I was creating, I'd insist on a lot more detail and guidance regarding the state of the world. But the equally inescapable fact is that we didn't write this world. Instead there is a rather lazy and minimal game cannon that mirrors our own world except for a few sketchy details that don't even mesh together very well.
Somehow we all have to find just enough detail to tell a story that fits with our shared perception of reality. Because if we don't try to fundamentally affect the universe through RP (and yes of course there are game-world limits to that) then we are left without super-villains, left with nothing more than bank robbers with super-powers and no vision.
If you want villains that change nothing, and don't upset the status quo, then stick with missions and avoid RP. Because an RP villain is by nature never going to honour rules and limitations. The RP villain character needs to be rooted in some form of reality enough that he can live and breathe and run rampage through our imagination. He must present unthinkable threat and malice, because otherwise where is the thrill and exhilaration of foiling his plans?
http://www.savecoh.com/
[ QUOTE ]
I think that this discussion is all-in-all a good thing. Not merely specifically for finding the boundaries and game-realities we may need to use in the plot for LORDs, but for getting an idea of general feeling and concensus, and maybe hammering out some shared reality without which all plots become fundamentally flawed.
So yes, this discussion is a lot wider than just the current LORDs plot, and thus not every point I want to discuss or consider is directly related to LORDs alone.
I do favour a more realistic and believable gameworld than many. Some parts of the official game cannon make me cringe at how poorly thought out they are in real detail. If I were writing the game world from scratch then I'd be largely in agreement with CactusBrawler that the presence of super-heroes, super-natural entities, gods, magic, etc, for 80 years, should have had a major effect on the world around them, and radically altered the course of history.
The fact is that if this were a game world I was creating, I'd insist on a lot more detail and guidance regarding the state of the world. But the equally inescapable fact is that we didn't write this world. Instead there is a rather lazy and minimal game cannon that mirrors our own world except for a few sketchy details that don't even mesh together very well.
Somehow we all have to find just enough detail to tell a story that fits with our shared perception of reality. Because if we don't try to fundamentally affect the universe through RP (and yes of course there are game-world limits to that) then we are left without super-villains, left with nothing more than bank robbers with super-powers and no vision.
If you want villains that change nothing, and don't upset the status quo, then stick with missions and avoid RP. Because an RP villain is by nature never going to honour rules and limitations. The RP villain character needs to be rooted in some form of reality enough that he can live and breathe and run rampage through our imagination. He must present unthinkable threat and malice, because otherwise where is the thrill and exhilaration of foiling his plans?
[/ QUOTE ]
However the LoRD are ment to be more than simple opertunists. To take over a fictional country that just happens to be a bit like a real one down to its geography and political state. Well first of all its in bad taste, second it uninspired and third its not the kind of thing Supervillian of the LoRDs calibur should be doing.
Taking advantage of a pre-existing situation to take over a country? Its little more than a crime of opertunity, picking up and keeping some ones wallet when they've dropped it, only on a grander scale.
Hell if Lex Luthor despite trying to kill the worlds most loved hero several thousand times can use his intelligence to be elected president of the USA, then I'm sure you'd be able to come up with something more than, robbing a house while the owners away on a global scale.
Hell create a situation, start up hostilities, preform a terroist action and leave clue pointing to a different country. Kidnap the ruler of a country brainwash him, repalce him with a clone and have him bring you in as his new goverment. Hell do the same to all the people in power within the country.
But relying on 'bleed in' from real world situations is lame.
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
[ QUOTE ]
But relying on 'bleed in' from real world situations is lame.
[/ QUOTE ]
In your opinion.
Not using the resources and situations available for any self respecting villain (or hero, businessman, politician, heck anybody at all) is just foolish and negligent. Granted, it's important that there be more creativity present than "Burma has a lot of problems and political unrest, so the LoRD's just slide right in." But first off, having read the forum RP these guys produced and secondly having spoken to most of them at some time or another I have faith that they'll cook up something suitable.
If they ignore real world situations all together thenit could be argued that they're narrowed their scope onto the successful countries of the Western world which is, obviously, not *world* domination. If they're planning to take over the world, they're going to go after the unstable countries sooner or later. And it makes sense for those to be the countries they target first.
Some people may not be comfortable with real suffering being exploited for the sake of literature or roleplay, that the fictional people of a real country be harmed in some way. But if that's the case, then you need to stop watching action movies, reading the majority of comics and a hell of a lot of good books.
[ QUOTE ]
Hell if Lex Luthor despite trying to kill the worlds most loved hero several thousand times can use his intelligence to be elected president of the USA, then I'm sure you'd be able to come up with something more than, robbing a house while the owners away on a global scale.
[/ QUOTE ]
I think we simply have radically different ideas of 'realism' and believability.
Obviously so if you are a superman fan, with superman being the most loathesome, boring and stupidly unbelievable and inconsistent super-hero of them all.
You apparently believe that smart people don't aim for efficiency. That the brilliant man doesn't work out who to achieve his aims with the least effort and risk, but instead invites failure by constantly reinventing the wheel and seeking the most expensive and wasteful ways to attain his aims.
I don't.
[ QUOTE ]
Hell create a situation, start up hostilities, preform a terroist action and leave clue pointing to a different country. Kidnap the ruler of a country brainwash him, repalce him with a clone and have him bring you in as his new goverment. Hell do the same to all the people in power within the country.
[/ QUOTE ]
Brainwashing and clones huh? Never heard that before. I can see where your brilliance and originality lets you see my ideas as rather uninspired. Clones eh? My, that's stunningly original and unique.
Do you use a diferent version of the word 'uninspired' to mine? I ask because you seem to want us to do the same plots that already exist in game.
Raise an army of robots (Nemesis and the Council), replace people with duplicates under our control (Nemesis and Crey), or perform terrorist actions (every villain group, all three Terra Volta missions, every stop the bombs mission, etc) are all unoriginal.
Does your vesion of uninspired mean "something not directly inspired by or copying an existing idea"? My version means "lacking in inspiration, plaguarized, hackneyed, predictable"
[ QUOTE ]
But relying on 'bleed in' from real world situations is lame.
[/ QUOTE ]
or ruthlessly efficient and realistic.
Sometimes its a fine line.
Personally, I want their plan to be chillingly believable, so that players can far more radily immerse themselves in the plot, from both sides. But I'm just one of the LORDs players, and we'll reach a collective balance that we're all happy with playing out.
http://www.savecoh.com/
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
But relying on 'bleed in' from real world situations is lame.
[/ QUOTE ]
In your opinion.
Not using the resources and situations available for any self respecting villain (or hero, businessman, politician, heck anybody at all) is just foolish and negligent. Granted, it's important that there be more creativity present than "Burma has a lot of problems and political unrest, so the LoRD's just slide right in." But first off, having read the forum RP these guys produced and secondly having spoken to most of them at some time or another I have faith that they'll cook up something suitable.
If they ignore real world situations all together thenit could be argued that they're narrowed their scope onto the successful countries of the Western world which is, obviously, not *world* domination. If they're planning to take over the world, they're going to go after the unstable countries sooner or later. And it makes sense for those to be the countries they target first.
Some people may not be comfortable with real suffering being exploited for the sake of literature or roleplay, that the fictional people of a real country be harmed in some way. But if that's the case, then you need to stop watching action movies, reading the majority of comics and a hell of a lot of good books.
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm saying that using real world situations for a fictional enviroment is lame.
For example take the middle east, most trouble there is based on religion in CoX gods and demons actually exist and take a hand in real life. So the situation there would be different (Statesman and Recluses origins, The Mu, Circle of Thorns)
The real world mounting tension over Nucleur weapons, Iran and North Korea? Not an issue after all any nutbag can create devices that threaten the multiverse (Faultline zone story line, Warburg)
War over resources? Its not like they could get these resources from a parell world or anything oh wait! They can. (Anything Portal Corp related)
So were basically left with Communism vs Commercialism as a founding for real life situations becoming ingame, and the chances of one those countryies being taken over without notice are low to none existent.
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Hell if Lex Luthor despite trying to kill the worlds most loved hero several thousand times can use his intelligence to be elected president of the USA, then I'm sure you'd be able to come up with something more than, robbing a house while the owners away on a global scale.
[/ QUOTE ]
I think we simply have radically different ideas of 'realism' and believability.
Obviously so if you are a superman fan, with superman being the most loathesome, boring and stupidly unbelievable and inconsistent super-hero of them all.
You apparently believe that smart people don't aim for efficiency. That the brilliant man doesn't work out who to achieve his aims with the least effort and risk, but instead invites failure by constantly reinventing the wheel and seeking the most expensive and wasteful ways to attain his aims.
I don't.
[ QUOTE ]
Hell create a situation, start up hostilities, preform a terroist action and leave clue pointing to a different country. Kidnap the ruler of a country brainwash him, repalce him with a clone and have him bring you in as his new goverment. Hell do the same to all the people in power within the country.
[/ QUOTE ]
Brainwashing and clones huh? Never heard that before. I can see where your brilliance and originality lets you see my ideas as rather uninspired. Clones eh? My, that's stunningly original and unique.
Do you use a diferent version of the word 'uninspired' to mine? I ask because you seem to want us to do the same plots that already exist in game.
Raise an army of robots (Nemesis and the Council), replace people with duplicates under our control (Nemesis and Crey), or perform terrorist actions (every villain group, all three Terra Volta missions, every stop the bombs mission, etc) are all unoriginal.
Does your vesion of uninspired mean "something not directly inspired by or copying an existing idea"? My version means "lacking in inspiration, plaguarized, hackneyed, predictable"
[ QUOTE ]
But relying on 'bleed in' from real world situations is lame.
[/ QUOTE ]
or ruthlessly efficient and realistic.
Sometimes its a fine line.
Personally, I want their plan to be chillingly believable, so that players can far more radily immerse themselves in the plot, from both sides. But I'm just one of the LORDs players, and we'll reach a collective balance that we're all happy with playing out.
[/ QUOTE ]
1st problem= Several of the big seven have been around for thousands of years they could quite easily of taken over the Earth from the shadows through money alone. Though why they in character didn't would be fun to see.
2nd problem= As I just posted real world situations just don't work in CoXs world.
Take all the religious problems we have in the middle east, people waring over differences in holy script, in the CoX universe they could literally just ask their God to clarify it a bit.
Problems with Iran pursuing nucleur weapons? One guy made a hat that let him alter reality with a thought, nucleur weapons are nothing, particularly as the US accidently lost a load of them in Warburg.
So yes using real world events despite them not working in CoXs universe is uninspired.
At least the 'hokey' comic book plots of in game villian groups actualy show them to be what a villian should be, pro-active.
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
Its really really good that you have all these creative ideas.
So why haven't you done anything with them of your own, rather than trying to control where someone else's plot is going?
If you want a more 'fantastic' style of villainy, then great. I'm all for choice and diversity. Go and start it. But its a different thing entirely to what the LORDs RP has so far been about, and exciting because of.
Seriously, go create a more fantastic, less psychological style of villain plot so people have a choice over what they can take part in.
But you might want to note that no real active faiths are used/abused in CoX. The closest they dared go to opening that can of law suits in the most litigatious nation on earth was to use bits of the Bible to inspire their Lady Grey TF.
There is no reference in game cannon to any real-world gods being any more vocal or physical than they are in our own world. (Apart from Zues, but I gues they were prepared to risk the wrath of religious zealots from the Zues worhippers ) To be sensitive to other faiths, you have to remember that those gods are already real, gettit?
<edit to add>
What I was getting at earlier when pointing out that gods are real in the CoX universe, isn't saying that gods are not real in ours. I'm saying there can be no such thing as an unbeliever in the CoX world where evidence of the existance of gods is right there in your face.
America is a Christian nation. God is already real, and has chosen, for his own reasons, to want people to show faith. The same with Allah, Budha, etc. They are already real, so there is absolutely no difference in how they behave.
</edit>
http://www.savecoh.com/
[ QUOTE ]
God is already real, and has chosen, for his own reasons, to want people to show faith. The same with Allah, Budha, etc. hey are already real,
[/ QUOTE ]
Prove it. No, really.
Oh, you mean in game. Well, in-game, nothing has been said about the religious affiliations of the country.
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
I do believe I can step in on the religion front.
My character, along with Pious's is a Christian.
Though mine hides his zealotry beneath a fun loving and slightly mad exterior.
There is no ingame cannon for real world religions existing within it. However there are two types of Deities, those who are vocal and those that require faith in their existence.
Zeus and therefore his counterpart, Hades must exist, we know of them from the game lore and their incarnates. Statesman the incarnate of Zeus and Recluse the incarnate of Hades. Though considering in myth Hades and Zeus were opposites (one ruled the sky, the other the underworld) they weren't exactly hostile to one another and Hades was far from evil, he was a passive force, merely maintain the balance between the living and the dead.
By this conjunctoure in ingame lore we must therefore assume that the rest of the Greek pantheon exist, Athena, Ares and so on.
And to this end we must assume that the Greek heroes of old also existed, though these would have been the super heroes and super villains of their day.
So we know that classical greek mythology to be true within the game world, though merely assumption to be perfectly honest.
The other thing we know is that the Arthurian legends are true, since Excaliber is held by Ms. Liberty.
The distinct lack of catherdrals, churches, mosques, temples (beyond that of the temple of the leviathan in the Isles) says that they didn't one to offend any real world religions by having such holy places of worship situated in the game world since once you include one, you tend to have to include the rest, thus the already fairly small zones would be crowded for space due to the holy buildings taken up.
We can, however, know that christianity exists within the game world.
You may be asking yourself, "Well doc, how the hell can you know that?"
Simple...a cemetary...Moth Cemetary to be precise, a Cemetary is a place where people bury their dead, and judging from the apperance the cemetary is some centuries old, specially by the looks of the lay out. That and there are Mausoleums which fell out of use long ago.
Due to the age of the cemetary it must therefore have been created surrounding a church or, as Pious has placed in the game world (but not the game itself), a Cathedral. Only large christian holy places tended to surround themselves with the graves of the dead, I haven't seen a mosque do this but then they may do so. However most of the statues are of angels or angelic beings, so we must assume that there are christians buried in this cemetary.
So while Christianity doesn't have a 'holy place' within the game we can say that judging by appearances christians do indeed exist with the game since the appearance of a winged angelic statue is normally only associated with christianity and christian burial.
So therefore we know Christanity exists within the game, however, as in the real world, gods needn't be of the vocal variety who speak with their followers, except on rare occasions through a prophet or some random person who would appear to others to be crazy in the modern age.
If we can see Christanity exists within the game world then the other major religions of our world must exist there also, they merely have no holy places making an appearance within the game, just as christanity has no churches, cathedrals or the like within the game.
Thanks for reading.
Peace out ya'll
Badge Earned: Wing Clipper
A real showstopper!
In this we have to assume simply that all religions excist in the game. The reason there isn't any proof in buildings (they simply forgot that the look of Moth cemetary would gave some away) is that they are afraid of the problems it would bring in law suits etc. Place a prominent churche and you will have to place a Moskue too... and a budhist temple and... They avoid those problems by removing all.
aside from that.. in fiction its almost standart to say that gods are as powerfull as the number of worshippers. Meaning even that without at least one worshipper the god would cease to excist. This is the safest way to go. If only a handfull people actually believe in Zeus, Zeus wouldn't be powerful enough to walk the Earth anymore.. or do any of those things he did in the Greek mythology.
Aside from that... having aliens around will make lots of people fall from their religios believe too... creating more atheist who would go-on and see Statesman as an alien or mutant with a disillusion that he thinks his powers come from a mythological god. As that is much more logical.
In real life... people are often only capable of believing that which they want (or can) believe. If an alien would walk over the highway telling everyone incl police he is from another planet he would be hold as lunatic or monstrous mutation. No-one would believe him. It would take much more then a single man saying his powers come from Zeus, to make people starting to believe Zeus excist. So the number of new worshippers for Zeus would increase but still be ridiculus low. Ergo... no temple and no problem for the other religions.
- The Italian Job: The Godfather Returns #1151
Beginner - Encounter a renewed age for the Mook and the Family when Emile Marcone escapes from the Zig!
- Along Came a... Bug!? #528482
Average - A new race of aliens arrives on Earth. And Vanguard has you investigate them!
- The Court of the Blood Countess: The Rise of the Blood Countess #3805
Advanced - Go back in time and witness the birth of a vampire. Follow her to key moments in her life in order to stop her! A story of intrigue, drama and horror! Blood & Violence... not recommend to solo!
Christianity exist in Paragorn city.
http://coh.redtomax.com/contacts/contact.php?id=123
And as Supervillians you should be able to create a situation to take over rather than just rely on one.
Also beliveable situations don't need to be based on real life other wise you end up with the [censored] Marvel pulled with 9/11
Method: Replacement/ Brainwashing
Event: General <insert name here> is the tyrannical ruler of <insert country name> hated by his people he is constantly wary of an uprising and takes great pains to keep himself secure.
Like this trip to a neighbouring country, his private plane surrounded by elite fighter jets from his air force is set to land in several days. However you know for a fact that this is just another diversion, the General is actually travelling in a different jet guarded only by a few of his bodyguards, grabbing hold of a powerful telepath/robotic double/enslaved shape shifting demon you head to intercept his jet.
One way or another, the General will be giving your orders from now on.
Event: In the democracy/tyranny that governs <insert country name here> Prime Minister/King <Insert name here> has sole choice over his government. Knowing that he is heading back to start the new government year, you decided to influence who gets selected to be the new government
Event: The nation of <insert name here> has fallen apart in the past during times when the government were killed off. To prevent this from happening in the future they have a strict hierarchy of who takes over if some one is incapacitated. While it would be troublesome to replace the higher ups of government, those lower down the ranks would be much easier, and well if enough people higher up than them die they will be in charge any way and youve always said Guy Fawkes had style.
Method: Election
Event: After centuries of being a monarchy/dictatorship the country of <insert name> has finally embraced democracy. This being their first election they are woefully under prepared for events that have been seen in other more developed countries. Deciding to simply buy the winner you embark on subverting the candidates offering the wealth, women, drugs and other pleasures satisfied, after all everyone has their price. Whoever wins, it doesnt matter it will be your puppet in the seat of power.
Event: As above however one particular candidate catches your intrest before your approach them all, perhaps he reminds you of yourself at a younger age, perhaps its how readily he responds to your offers. You decide to fix the election in this candidates favour, you arrange the best campaign money can buy, complete with telepathic campaign managers and mind controlling TV adverts. Eventually your puppet is elected and it all seems so nice and legal.
Method: Civil War
Event: The kingdom of <insert name here> is in a dire state, shortly after the Rikti War the King of <insert name here> <insert name here> the <insert number> was approached by Crey industries and a deal was made. Crey were given exclusive business rights in the country, in exchange the King got super weapons and soldiers for his armed forces. While the King was happy his people however suffered, working for Crey what little they earn has to be spent in Crey owned shops on Crey grown food, the people live just above the poverty line.
The unhappy people have started to form rebel bands, woefully under matched compared to the Crey supplied royal military. That is until you step in providing weapons and super soldiers, however in the anarchy that follows you defeat both the government and the rebels. Soon the people will see life under Crey wasnt so bad.
Event: The country of <insert name here> has always been tribal in nature, for centuries the four feuding tribes have been increasingly violent towards each other, with increasing terrorist activities towards each other. The violence kept increasing until it seemed that a full blown war would break out, and perhaps it would of if not for the Rikti, as the violence reached its peak the country was devastated by Rikti bombings, the four tribes joined together out of fear and desperation. Even after the Rikti retreated the tribes stayed in union due to fear of another attack. This fear born union has continued to this day. Well up until yesterday when your assassins struck killing respected members of each tribe and sending the country into civil war. As the they fight they are unaware of a fifth force within their country, as you wait for them to tire weaken themselves enough for you to decisively take over. Finally as the four forces get ready to fight suddenly to my surprise.
He did the mash
He did the monster mash
The monster mash
It was a graveyard smash
He did the mash
It caught on in a flash
He did the mash
He did the monster mash
From my laboratory in the castle east
To the master bedroom where the vampires feast
The ghouls all came from their humble abodes
To get a jolt from my electrodes
They did the mash
They did the monster mash
The monster mash
It was a graveyard smash
They did the mash
It caught on in a flash
They did the mash
They did the monster mash
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
Hey guys, wow. Feels like I dropped the bomb, literally.
I kinda left my computer over Friday and Saturday to visit friends/family (a foolish mortal's mistake I know!) and didn't, expect this to blow up as bad as it did, as quickly as it did. I see people posting posts that are so long, or thought through so hard that they're followed directly by another post from the same poster of equal length.
There's deep seated hatred in some peoples words, so everyone take a step back and remember what we're fighting about.
It seems to have started with my opinion that I don't think it's right to invade real countries. I was angry, because things anger me and I was in a bad mood, and I apologise for doing that human thing of jumping to conclusions and making ham-fisted demands without considering the impacts when in a position of power. I openly welcome anyone to /em slap or /em batsmash me.
Like the filthy Neo-Hippy without Guitar skills that I am I want to say, in my best Hippy voice;
"Hey dudes! No worry about it yeah? Everyone has like totally valid points, so we should still all be friends. I baked brownies, think of the brownies guys, yeah?"
If there's any Hatred left after that speech, I think I've found a Catalyst for any remaining Hatred!
[u]The Game: Hate It[u]
Because the only reason we're role-playing Super-Villains here is because we don't have another choice, we have to do it here because it's the only decent Super-Hero MMO around, and we can make our character look a million different ways, and have clone-like henchmen who don't follow us properly and stuff.
On the character creation point, the game-world is a sand-boxy mirror of our world because it's for making characters in by non-roleplayers... gamers. I mean, it's very much player character friendly, allowing players to invent Super-Heroes without thinking too long if they'll fit. They're gonna fit most of the time.
The reason to Hate this game then and not each other? It's because the developers have a freaking vendetta against Role-Players!
For years they ignore us, and then they sort of add a club that we can invade, but they haven't thought about us in it... it's instead a place for people to use to get about quickly and to use for L33TZOR prizes on public holidays.
They built a world with so many damned inconsistencies that it's a nightmare to try to do anything like this plot without stepping on someone's toes. It's bad enough (I'd imagine) trying to RP in a world based on Lord of The Rings Lore, but this is based on the REAL World, Real World Lore, so you have a horrible conflict regarding whether or not real-world things apply, or if we're living in a fantasy.
The developers didn't think about this because they made this game for fun, for gamers.
And what's worse is that they made us Love this game like an addiction. I do love it like an addiction I do. I'm addicted to logging in to improve my character, which is what this game is designed to do. It's not designed for Role-Play because that is, definately 100%, a secondary addition to Video Games. 
Even that Holy Grail of Pen and Paper RP is a secondary addition, because those games are originally board games that in time evolved into Role Playing classics. (I didn't read the Pen and Paper Wikipedia entry so I'm only guessing this. As a result, if you tell me I'm wrong, I will slap you with a fish and tell you that an argument isn't invalid if the only thing wrong with it, is down to technicalities.)
So, let's just hate them for making the world in which we play, so RP unfriendly. Let's accept that it's probably always going to be a problem in main MMO's (because they're Video Games made for fun) even if we don't like that fact.
Let's not be brash or hasty, and let me retract my threat that I was not going to play with the LoRDs if you didn't play my way. I'll RP in a real life country, if it settles things and provides that precious RP we find so hard to harvest. I'd rather not, but by jove I'll do it!
"Why?" I hear no one ask, because I'm alone at my computer.
Well, because I want to Role-Play my Villain attempting world-domination, that's why! I want to have fun with his insanity, and I want him to get his [censored] handed to him in an 8-Page written battle that puts the in-game engine to shame, really sticking it to those animators for not being Omnipotent Gods when it comes to game-design and allowing me to throw my enemy through a wall, or pick up a Mountain.
Because Ladies and Gentlemen that sounds like a mighty fine time to me. A mighty fine time for all.
Oh and someone's plotting to hijack us all if we don't.
HUGS AND KISSES. XXX
Disclaimer
The writer would like to apologise if the Tangent, Sprawling Nature of this post made you nauseous. Like car sickness. Actual Nausea may vary. Please read the following signature links, most terms and conditions may not apply. See in-game for details. Offer Ends 12.12.2064. All Rights Preserved.
It takes Chaos to move the world to Action.
HAHAHAHAHA!!
*wipes a tear from the corner of his eye*
My dear Architect... That was a very good speech. And I applaude you.
I couldn't agree more with you.
I would LOVE a real... a REAL...MMORPG. But alas! As you said, it wont happen anytime soon.
We are forced to use the meager substitutes this cruel world can offer and make the best of it.
And we all have to remember that this is just a game. Played for fun. And no reason to throw harsh words around and at each other.
If we can't get along on in-game plots then so be it! /ignore and move on!
Who cares if the different plots collide? The Marvel Universe is filled with inconsistencies and loopholes and they can work around it.
And even the Bible can't agree with itself! And it's supposed to be written (or at least inspired) by an omnisentient and supreme divinity!
If people can't accept the way the persons behind LORD play the game then leave that particular plot alone and start your own. They started it and they do with it as they please!
If you want to participate then play by the rules they set up. Easy as that.
Peace!
The administrator of the Milita forums has kindly created a LoRD section for us here. Im still waiting for the welcome cookies to be delivered
Im sure theyll be along shortly.
I think all but one of us is already a member, so anyone who isnt just needs to register.
This will mainly be for OOC discussion I think, but there is also an IC thread in case we need to rp events that would give away too mainly spoilers. However, I think we should keep as much IC content here as possible.
@Romanov
Nadja Romanov, Lily Pink, Little Death - The Cadre
Estoque, Bastinado, Spidermonkey, Chic Doyle - The Militia
Miss Teen, Dead Reckoner, Dee Dee Diablo, Kaneko
I've been away this weekend and just read through this thread. Very interesting debate between Cactus Brawler and Ammon, I've actually learnt a lot, thanks.
Now, attention all LORDS players, get your behinds to the Militia forums and we'll start plotting. Union roleplayers, thank you for your interest, your support and your faith in our abilities to entertain. We look forward to your own contributions to the coming plots. This here thread will suffice to update you OOC, and keep an eye out for further plotting in the (Sisarose) Thugz Mansion.
Just to very briefly bring this back to my original questions:
I think its clear that we do need a private OOC channel to discuss matters. While I enjoy reading such debates, I dont think we want to have a community wide discussion every time we want to decide what colour the hand towels should be in our base washrooms. When we have decided on things OOC we can introduce them to the community as plots where there can be as much OOC discussion and IC roleplay etc as people want. I suggest a private forum on one of the Shades, Militia or Blood Countess sites.
I was impressed by a lot of Ammons points and documented evidence which gives me faith that the experienced roleplayers involved in the LoRDs plot will not do anything to spoil other roleplayers enjoyment of the game. Quite the opposite in fact. The original post suggests a fictional country as it was never a possibility that a real country would be used. However, as the above discussion has shown it is not as straight forward as that. Just trust us that we will arrive at a course of action that is sensitive to the needs of roleplayers who dont want to get involved as much as those that do.
So not wanting to stop the debate here, but well continue the discussion from the OP elsewhere.
@Romanov
Nadja Romanov, Lily Pink, Little Death - The Cadre
Estoque, Bastinado, Spidermonkey, Chic Doyle - The Militia
Miss Teen, Dead Reckoner, Dee Dee Diablo, Kaneko