How to solve the Purple Problem
By
300_below,
Posted on: 2009-06-24 02:45 in The Market and Inventions
The purple problem consists of the one eye one horned flying purple people eater!
Virtue: @Santorican
Dark/Shield Build Thread
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So put a little differently, The devs can't make you play a lot of hours, but they can make sure that if you don't, you fall behind those that do. Put in the effort, and you'll get the rewards. Kind of the backbone of an MMO.
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And here I thought the backbone of MMOs was the fact that they are a game, and are therefore for fun! I must be doing this wrong.
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Of course games are for fun. But MMOs largely cater to people who enjoy a certain KIND of fun putting in effort to get rewards. Or put another way, running endlessly on a treadmill for the next level, the next shiny enhancement, the next whatever.
If your fun doesn't include the putting in effort part, and going straight to the rewards, there are a lot of games out there that cater to that kind of fun too. But I don't want my MMOs turned into first person shooters, or even into regular RPGs with 30 hours of content and suddenly you're maxed out. I LIKE that it takes hundreds of hours of play to get what I want. It gives me time to get good at playing my characters, to get attached to them, to want to make them even better. That's FUN for me.
Heck, if I had my way, I'd cut the XP in half (in practice, I do this by level pacting every character to someone that I pretty much drag along). And if anything, purples are just a little too easy for me to get my hands on. But hey, we have the PvP IOs now, so that'll take some effort to get.
Anyway, fun is where you find it. The developers have to strike a balance between people like me (it's too easy to get what I want) and people that think there's a purple problem to be solved (it's too hard to get what I want).
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Also, what difference does it make if you "fall behind" when there is absolutely no in-game content that requires* you to be "ahead" of anyone in terms of IOs or Purples?
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No difference at all. This game is easy. Nobody needs purples. Nobody needs set IOs. If you can't play this game using SOs, you need help with your builds and your play skills, and teh uber lewt is just a way of covering up some serious issues. That said, look! It's Shiny! Must have Shiny! I'm a sucker for it as much as anyone.
"That's because Werner can't do maths." - BunnyAnomaly
"Four hours in, and I was no longer making mistakes, no longer detoggling. I was a machine." - Werner
Videos of Other Stupid Scrapper Tricks
I like purples for the fact their bonuses can go all the way down to level one. I think I have two toons that are tricked out with purples, A Dom and a scrapper. They both benefit from high recharge, high accuracy, and high recovery, making exempting to lower levels not such a pain.
My Dom has 20% recovery, 50% recharge, 8% Damage, 75% accuracy, and 48% regeneration all the time. To sum it up you could say he runs stamina, health, Assault, Tactics, and hasten (all with slightly less values) all the time any level no crash no nothing. Was it worth the amount of time and money I invested in him? To me yes, I like the fact in low level content I am still a beast. And knowing that I can be permadom as low as level 7 is a good feeling too.
As for the drop rate or problem doesn't bother me, gives me a reason to keep playing post 50 content. To either get a purple drop or get enough money to buy one.
"Yes, winning all the time can be boring."
-Knight_Chill
"It's amazing how well you can put up with endurance issues if you hide them under a large enough pile of bodies."
-Spiritchaser speaking on Dom Revamp
The only thing I'd like to see changed is the way drops work for teams versus solo play. I can run a months worth of team play, 1 or 2 TF's per night and get *maybe* 1 or 2 purples.
Or I can run solo, and get one every day or so in the same amount of time. Last three days I've been 3 for 3 with a Hecatomb Acc/Dmg/rech, Absolute Amazement Acc/Stun/Rech and Armageddon Rech/Acc
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The only thing I'd like to see changed is the way drops work for teams versus solo play. I can run a months worth of team play, 1 or 2 TF's per night and get *maybe* 1 or 2 purples.
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I absolutely agree, this is the real "purple problem".
I think the supply needs to increase because the market value, expressed in terms of the time it takes to produce that much raw inf from NPCs, is "too high". But that's entirely a subjective game design issue.
The easiest way to increase the drop rate a little and take away the powerful incentives to solo (or multi-box) farm instead of actually team with people is to scale the drops the way XP scales...if not even more.
That was a very good explanation of what this MMO is and couldn't have put it better myself. 
Virtue: @Santorican
Dark/Shield Build Thread
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Think I've mentioned before, that when extreme scarcity is introduced, it opens the door for RMT traders.
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The fact is that RMT'rs were here long before Purple IO sets.
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When I can work 4 hours and make enough cash to buy a billion INF, or I can marketeer for 20 hours to get the same amount, or farm myself for 40 hours to do the same, which is less "work?"
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Using your numbers, the equation seems like this to me.
[(4 hours of real world work)+(supporting RMT's)+(possible character deletion)+(possible account banning)] =
[(20 hours of marketing by supplying other characters what they want at a price they are willing to pay)+(possible badges for marketing)+(PvP'ing against other Marketers)] =
[(40 hours of farming)+(If in AE/MA, possible banning)+(boring repetition)]
I'll take Marketing for the win, but I'm not after purples either.
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I have never bought INF, but I know people who have. They value these virtual items enough to pay real money for them, and value their time highly enough that "grinding" to get them is unpleasant.
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Or it is much easier to "Catch'em All" now than actually work to achieve a goal.
That is to say, I don't think it is so much a "valuing their time" issue as it is "wanting something" and "wanting to have it now".
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When RMT becomes a problem in your game, your reward system is borked.
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Cheaters cheat as long as they can cheat.
Abusers abuse as long as there is something to abuse.
The RMT's don't just sell inf, the also sell PL'ing.
So you are saying that any system that has levels has a "borked" reward system. Part of having increased cost/obscurity of items in a game is a function of the level system as well.
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When people would rather work at a real job to get things than play your game to earn them, the reward system is not functioning properly.
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Or they players are jaded or brats.
Jaded by gaming and wanting to achieve without really playing a game.
Brats by wanting something now instead of working to get it.
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And the more broken your reward system is, the more of a problem RMT will become for you.
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Actually, the more people pay RMT'rs, the more a problem they will become for you.
It is greed and the "have to have it now" attitude by players that can lead them to paying RMT'rs.
You don't need purples to play this game.
When you get a purple, it should be really cool to get it. "I found a diamond!"
It shouldn't be "I'm all Purpled out on my 50. I'm so cool."
Players are distracted from what makes a game fun.
Play the game for the fun of it.
Purples are just not that important.
But believe me, when I get a purple I craft it and sell it for as much as I think the market can pay because
"There is a sucker born every minute" - P.T. Barnum.
So, do you still want to "Catch'em All!"
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I absolutely agree, this is the real "purple problem".
I think the supply needs to increase because the market value, expressed in terms of the time it takes to produce that much raw inf from NPCs, is "too high". But that's entirely a subjective game design issue.
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But the source of inf isn't just the raw inf from NPCs. The amount of inf from selling SOs and recipes to the vendors produces way more inf than what NPCs are directly dropping. Also, many items fetch for more inf now on WW than before, so players are able to get more inf when they sell their drops. Not only that, but AE is also producing way more inf and not any purples. The same can be said when players are leveling their alts instead of killing NPCs with their 50s.
That means if *you* want purples, get out of the AE and start playing exclusively on your 50s. If not, then don't complain about the "purple problem" because *you* are part of the problem.
IMO, the major cause of this so-called problem is too much inf in the market, causing hyperinflation on the highly-desired items. My solution would be to increase inf sinks and decrease the amount of inf created, mainly be decreasing the amount of inf the vendor pays for recipes and SOs.
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The easiest way to increase the drop rate a little and take away the powerful incentives to solo (or multi-box) farm instead of actually team with people is to scale the drops the way XP scales...if not even more.
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No problem with solo getting more. It's a trade-off. It just depends on what people value more: partying or higher chance of purples.
People just have to learn they can't have everything they want all the time.
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I think the supply needs to increase because the market value, expressed in terms of the time it takes to produce that much raw inf from NPCs, is "too high". But that's entirely a subjective game design issue.
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I don't think it's too high at all. Considering how easy it is to make influence I think 200 million per purple is reasonable.
As has already been mentioned: it's possible to get a purple per day if you farm in a certain manner. (That might be lower than some people - I don't farm purples so I wouldn't know.) If each sells for 200 million then you're making 1.4 billion per week.
I think purples are fine as they are. Drop rates/prices included. The reason for this is that they are a good way to make money in the game. If I farm enough random purples I can make enough money to buy the specific purples/IOs that I want.
I mean without purples as the high-end content...what's the point of making money?
So I can make one post here claiming i'm ebil?
Once all your characters are purpled out there's absolutely no point in accumulating influence. If we make the end game content not last as long then there would be no real purpose to purples anyway. (Either that or this entire thread will be about PVP IO's instead...)
I say keep them as is and stop pretending there's a "problem". A "problem" would be players not being able to afford them and not having access to them. This is not the case at present.
I'm assuming that's 200 million + WW/BM fees. 
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Go for it.
As far as I'm concerned, the fewer people that have Purples the better. Oh, and what "Purple Problem" are we speaking of? I know of no such problem. Do recall their status of "ultra-rare" as in more rare than even rare things.
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I see that explanation thrown out a lot anytime someone complains about the price of purples.
Can we get a solid definition of what "ultra rare" means? Was it the amount before MA or after? Because that's two different levels of rarity.
If the Devs were happy with the level of rarity before MA, that can only mean they are too rare now. I don't think "Ultra Rare" was meant to mean "no amount of rarity is too much".
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Go for it.
As far as I'm concerned, the fewer people that have Purples the better. Oh, and what "Purple Problem" are we speaking of? I know of no such problem. Do recall their status of "ultra-rare" as in more rare than even rare things.
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I see that explanation thrown out a lot anytime someone complains about the price of purples.
Can we get a solid definition of what "ultra rare" means? Was it the amount before MA or after? Because that's two different levels of rarity.
If the Devs were happy with the level of rarity before MA, that can only mean they are too rare now. I don't think "Ultra Rare" was meant to mean "no amount of rarity is too much".
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Then the devs should address that? Oh wait. they did in the opposite direction by villainizing farming, the single largest source of purples.
Its darkly ironic that the same people who hate farmers and marketeers are the same people who want cheap purples.
Want comedy and lighthearted action? Between levels 1-14? Try Nuclear in 90 - The Fusionette Task Force!
Arc ID 58363!
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If the Devs were happy with the level of rarity before MA, that can only mean they are too rare now. I don't think "Ultra Rare" was meant to mean "no amount of rarity is too much".
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Then the devs should address that? Oh wait. they did in the opposite direction by villainizing farming, the single largest source of purples.
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The devs came down hard on AE farmers, but the AE doesn't generate purples (except for Devs choice, which weren't farmed), so their ham-fisted anti-farm measures had nothing to do with the purple supply either way.
The devs have taken no action in years with regard to non-AE farming, which IS a source of purples. The last anti-farm moves I can recall was putting Dreck on a timer and reducing Family XP, and both of those were a long time ago.
Freedom: Blazing Larb, Fiery Fulcrum, Sardan Reborn, Arctic-Frenzy, Wasabi Sam, Mr Smashtastic.
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If the Devs were happy with the level of rarity before MA, that can only mean they are too rare now. I don't think "Ultra Rare" was meant to mean "no amount of rarity is too much".
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Then the devs should address that? Oh wait. they did in the opposite direction by villainizing farming, the single largest source of purples.
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The devs came down hard on AE farmers, but the AE doesn't generate purples (except for Devs choice, which weren't farmed), so their ham-fisted anti-farm measures had nothing to do with the purple supply either way.
The devs have taken no action in years with regard to non-AE farming, which IS a source of purples. The last anti-farm moves I can recall was putting Dreck on a timer and reducing Family XP, and both of those were a long time ago.
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Yes, i know that. But at the same time even coming down on AE farmers gave the anti-farming crowd all sorts of fuel for their vitriolic hatred of farming.
Want comedy and lighthearted action? Between levels 1-14? Try Nuclear in 90 - The Fusionette Task Force!
Arc ID 58363!
Cavatina said:
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Its darkly ironic that the same people who hate farmers and marketeers are the same people who want cheap purples.
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I don't like being on farm teams. I don't like being lied to by people filling farm teams. (It's happened.) I don't like playing with PL'd incompetents (or any incompetents, really.) So I guess I'm an anti-farmer.
I don't care how expensive purples get. Perhaps your generalizations need qualifiers?
Mini-guides: Force Field Defenders, Blasters, Market Self-Defense, Frankenslotting.
So you think you're a hero, huh.
@Boltcutter in game.
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Go for it.
As far as I'm concerned, the fewer people that have Purples the better. Oh, and what "Purple Problem" are we speaking of? I know of no such problem. Do recall their status of "ultra-rare" as in more rare than even rare things.
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I see that explanation thrown out a lot anytime someone complains about the price of purples.
Can we get a solid definition of what "ultra rare" means? Was it the amount before MA or after? Because that's two different levels of rarity.
If the Devs were happy with the level of rarity before MA, that can only mean they are too rare now. I don't think "Ultra Rare" was meant to mean "no amount of rarity is too much".
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I am sure the original poster would be happy with levels of rarity far beyond what we have now.
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Cavatina said:
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Its darkly ironic that the same people who hate farmers and marketeers are the same people who want cheap purples.
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I don't like being on farm teams. I don't like being lied to by people filling farm teams. (It's happened.) I don't like playing with PL'd incompetents (or any incompetents, really.) So I guess I'm an anti-farmer.
I don't care how expensive purples get. Perhaps your generalizations need qualifiers?
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I dont like that stuff either. but not all farmers do that. Thats as much a generalization as what I said. I mean. I farm occasionally, i admit it. But if I do, then if anyone pulls that sorta [censored] I drop team immediately. I'd do the same if any other sort of team decided to be unethical about their playstyle.
Want comedy and lighthearted action? Between levels 1-14? Try Nuclear in 90 - The Fusionette Task Force!
Arc ID 58363!
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Go for it.
As far as I'm concerned, the fewer people that have Purples the better. Oh, and what "Purple Problem" are we speaking of? I know of no such problem. Do recall their status of "ultra-rare" as in more rare than even rare things.
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I see that explanation thrown out a lot anytime someone complains about the price of purples.
Can we get a solid definition of what "ultra rare" means? Was it the amount before MA or after? Because that's two different levels of rarity.
If the Devs were happy with the level of rarity before MA, that can only mean they are too rare now. I don't think "Ultra Rare" was meant to mean "no amount of rarity is too much".
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Then the devs should address that? Oh wait. they did in the opposite direction by villainizing farming, the single largest source of purples.
Its darkly ironic that the same people who hate farmers and marketeers are the same people who want cheap purples.
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I wasn't really talking about farming or marketeers. I don't think either one bothers me much. (Though flipping provides no service to anyone)
Back to what I WAS talking about: Can we get a definition of "ultra rare"? There must be a target there somewhere. I don't want to see it used to explain away all gripes about purples. Since the Devs made no alteration to drop rates before MA, that indicates they were ok with the supply back then. If that's true, it would seem an increase in the drop rate would now be in order to get back to that level.
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There must be a target there somewhere.
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1 purple recipe per X eligible mobs defeated.
X being set by the Devs.
(I have seen estimates as low as 3000 and as high as 5000, myabe TopDoc has better info on the actual rate).
It is set by the Devs and datamined relatively easily.
If you want more purples created ? Do your bit and defeat more eligible mobs, dont speed the ITF, but defeat the groups throughout (not kill all mind you but work methodically through all the foes).
(same concept for the Lady Grey)
Run a Rikti respec instead of the easier Freak one.
Personally, I'm happily running some level 50 radios and shard missions on Catwhoorg, I forgot how relaxing it can be just cranking through those. Got 1 Purple drop from them so far. Its not optomised return for sure, but its a durn site more drops than any number of AE boss farms will create.
@Catwhoorg "Rule of Three - Finale" Arc# 1984
@Mr Falkland Islands"A Nation Goes Rogue" Arc# 2369 "Toasters and Pop Tarts" Arc#116617
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Back to what I WAS talking about: Can we get a definition of "ultra rare"? There must be a target there somewhere. I don't want to see it used to explain away all gripes about purples. Since the Devs made no alteration to drop rates before MA, that indicates they were ok with the supply back then. If that's true, it would seem an increase in the drop rate would now be in order to get back to that level.
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Except MA hasn't been around that long. We don't know how much of a lasting impact it'll have on supply.
Since MA's introduction, there have been some wild shifts in the market. Right now, there are many indications that folks are returning to doing regular content. Will the numbers reach pre-MA levels? Honestly, I think it's too early to say.
But I bet the developers won't even consider adjusting drop rates until after Going Rogue has been out for a bit.
Oh, and it's not just MA that impacted purples. It was Merits as well.
My feeling is the drop rate will probably get adjusted at some point. It just won't be any time soon.
The Cape Radio: You're not super until you put on the Cape!
DJ Enigma's Puzzle Factory: Co* Parody Commercials
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I don't like being on farm teams. I don't like being lied to by people filling farm teams. (It's happened.) I don't like playing with PL'd incompetents (or any incompetents, really.) So I guess I'm an anti-farmer.
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You fail the anti-farmer litmus test by not moralizing and pontificating about the evils of farming and demanding that farmers be banned every chance you get.
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
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I don't like being on farm teams. I don't like being lied to by people filling farm teams. (It's happened.) I don't like playing with PL'd incompetents (or any incompetents, really.) So I guess I'm an anti-farmer.
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You fail the anti-farmer litmus test by not moralizing and pontificating about the evils of farming and demanding that farmers be banned every chance you get.
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How about this.... [clears throat]
Remember, if you support farmers, the terrorists win!
Freedom: Blazing Larb, Fiery Fulcrum, Sardan Reborn, Arctic-Frenzy, Wasabi Sam, Mr Smashtastic.
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I don't like being on farm teams. I don't like being lied to by people filling farm teams. (It's happened.) I don't like playing with PL'd incompetents (or any incompetents, really.) So I guess I'm an anti-farmer.
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You fail the anti-farmer litmus test by not moralizing and pontificating about the evils of farming and demanding that farmers be banned every chance you get.
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How about this.... [clears throat]
Remember, if you support farmers, the terrorists win!
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I'm a villain terrorist, I want to support myself 
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How about this.... [clears throat]
Remember, if you support farmers, the terrorists win!
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That's more like it!
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
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It seems to be working as designed.
If anything, there are too many purples around.
Purples are supposed to be Uniques - aka Ultra-Rares.
These things are not supposed to be easy to come by.
I'm not for jacking up prices, but - hey - the price is what the market can bear. It is too bad that there are so many RMT's out there and that someone will be paying cash for a purple going for 180+ mil inf, but that is the awful truth.
Your inf gain is probably also the gain of an RMT/gold-farmer.
Market PvP powers activated!
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Think I've mentioned before, that when extreme scarcity is introduced, it opens the door for RMT traders. When I can work 4 hours and make enough cash to buy a billion INF, or I can marketeer for 20 hours to get the same amount, or farm myself for 40 hours to do the same, which is less "work?"
I have never bought INF, but I know people who have. They value these virtual items enough to pay real money for them, and value their time highly enough that "grinding" to get them is unpleasant.
When RMT becomes a problem in your game, your reward system is borked. When people would rather work at a real job to get things than play your game to earn them, the reward system is not functioning properly. And the more broken your reward system is, the more of a problem RMT will become for you.
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This. I will add though the devs have themselves boxed in here. Purples are nearly game breaking, if they become more common it would most likely hurt the game.