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On a side note, DA tanks may need a lot of healing, but they can cover that them self. What they need more is +recovery. That way they can afford to run their toggles, attack, and use dark regen.
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Dark Armor LOVES Kinetics
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Mine loves empaths more, but not for healing. Mine loves the +recovery power (which I keep forgetting the name of). As strong of a +recovery boost, but without the annoying +speed. Sure you don't get +recharge with it, but IMO +recharge is a double edged sword. If your already having end issues it can exasperate them. I know on my DM/DA scrapper I like speed boost at times, but sometimes I notice it doesn't really slow down the endurance bleed as much as I'd want.
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Some people neglect slotting speed boost for endurance recovery. It's always something I do because of the reason you stated.
The +speed is something you get used to. It used to ruin me on my Dark/Rad/Dark (lining up cones and then switching to PBAoEs and then lining up more cones...), but I've grown accustomed to it.
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Mine loves empaths more, but not for healing. Mine loves the +recovery power (which I keep forgetting the name of). As strong of a +recovery boost, but without the annoying +speed. Sure you don't get +recharge with it, but IMO +recharge is a double edged sword. If your already having end issues it can exasperate them. I know on my DM/DA scrapper I like speed boost at times, but sometimes I notice it doesn't really slow down the endurance bleed as much as I'd want.
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Empathy has 2 +recov buffs, both of them stronger than Speed Boost: Recovery Aura and Adrenalin Boost. Recovery Aura (of which you are probably referring), has a baseline +recov of 200%, with a baseline 18% uptime (95% +rech slotting brings it up to 35.1% uptime), and is a PbAoE. Adrenalin Boost (which is utterly awesome imo) has a baseline 800% +recovery, 500% +regen, and 100% +recharge with a baseline 30% uptime (95% +rech slotting bring it up to 58.5% uptime), but is only single target.
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Mine loves empaths more, but not for healing. Mine loves the +recovery power (which I keep forgetting the name of). As strong of a +recovery boost, but without the annoying +speed. Sure you don't get +recharge with it, but IMO +recharge is a double edged sword. If your already having end issues it can exasperate them. I know on my DM/DA scrapper I like speed boost at times, but sometimes I notice it doesn't really slow down the endurance bleed as much as I'd want.
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Empathy has 2 +recov buffs, both of them stronger than Speed Boost: Recovery Aura and Adrenalin Boost. Recovery Aura (of which you are probably referring), has a baseline +recov of 200%, with a baseline 18% uptime (95% +rech slotting brings it up to 35.1% uptime), and is a PbAoE. Adrenalin Boost (which is utterly awesome imo) has a baseline 800% +recovery, 500% +regen, and 100% +recharge with a baseline 30% uptime (95% +rech slotting bring it up to 58.5% uptime), but is only single target.
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Which works out great when dealing with the slow bleed /DA normally is combined with the spike endurance rupture that is having to use dark regen.
"The danger is not that a particular class is unfit to govern. Every class is unfit to govern." Lord Acton
Madam Enigma's History
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Mine loves empaths more, but not for healing. Mine loves the +recovery power (which I keep forgetting the name of). As strong of a +recovery boost, but without the annoying +speed. Sure you don't get +recharge with it, but IMO +recharge is a double edged sword. If your already having end issues it can exasperate them. I know on my DM/DA scrapper I like speed boost at times, but sometimes I notice it doesn't really slow down the endurance bleed as much as I'd want.
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Empathy has 2 +recov buffs, both of them stronger than Speed Boost: Recovery Aura and Adrenalin Boost. Recovery Aura (of which you are probably referring), has a baseline +recov of 200%, with a baseline 18% uptime (95% +rech slotting brings it up to 35.1% uptime), and is a PbAoE. Adrenalin Boost (which is utterly awesome imo) has a baseline 800% +recovery, 500% +regen, and 100% +recharge with a baseline 30% uptime (95% +rech slotting bring it up to 58.5% uptime), but is only single target.
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Which works out great when dealing with the slow bleed /DA normally is combined with the spike endurance rupture that is having to use dark regen.
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Getting either one of those should more than solve your endurance problems. Getting Adrenalin Boost just tells you to stop using Dark Regen at all because now you've got the hp/sec of a non-IH regen Scrapper to go with those luverly defenses and stun effects.
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Getting either one of those should more than solve your endurance problems. Getting Adrenalin Boost just tells you to stop using Dark Regen at all because now you've got the hp/sec of a non-IH regen Scrapper to go with those luverly defenses and stun effects.
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Oh yes... Just wish I could get them more often :P
Pre-20 I got invited to plenty of teams with empaths, none of them understood the value of things like Fort and the two auras. Now, my DM/DA never gets invited to teams with empaths. I've teamed with everything but empathy now. Then again, I'd also kept getting invited to Synapse TF's where the team leader got 2 invuln tanks and 2 other scrappers (both /invuln) and expected them to tank Clockwork King. Yeah right. I would consistently end up tanking CWK for them since the tankers were going down FAST and the /invuln scrappers would see this and hide around the corner and out of the fight..
"The danger is not that a particular class is unfit to govern. Every class is unfit to govern." Lord Acton
Madam Enigma's History
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Does fort provide psi defense? If not, then ice tanks may honestly not get much use out of it... unless dealing with things that only do fire damage.
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As has been said upthread, fort is def(all). I find, however, that whether or not I need to use fortitude on a tank is more related to their slotting and tactics than what specific powerset they take. I've played with Ice tanks that don't need fort against anything, and I've played with Ice tanks that need fort against everything.
But psi is definitely a hole for most tanks.
I figure my job as an empath is to make sure that I mitigate anything that happens to the team's endurance or health bars. For the most part I do this with auras and fortitude rather than healing.
But did we hijack this thread away from the subject at hand? Fortitude is a pretty good proxy for bubbles, because its biggest effect is def(all), but a FFer can easily manage to bubble a whole team. My experience with fortitude tells me that generally isn't necessary, but if one of the critical people on the team (could be the tank, to bring this conversational thread back to the subject) was asking not to have fortitude/bubbles and yet was taking more damage than he regenerated, I would start getting annoyed at the tank that wasn't letting me do my job properly. (And if it was for some silly RP reason rather than some kind of health-related reason, well, then I'll RP my bubbles onto you.)
As far as I recall, FF doesn't give psi defense at all. Granted, many psi powers are also ranged, melee, or aoe flagged so that's less of an issue. But back to the topic of not wanting buffs, there are legitimate reasons. RP can be one, and people aren't required to give a reason when they ask not to be buffed.
I know my WS once got an empath to go "WTF?!" when I asked not to be healed unless critical. They understood part way into the mission, but they still didn't understand me NOT wanting healing.
"The danger is not that a particular class is unfit to govern. Every class is unfit to govern." Lord Acton
Madam Enigma's History
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As far as I recall, FF doesn't give psi defense at all. Granted, many psi powers are also ranged, melee, or aoe flagged so that's less of an issue. But back to the topic of not wanting buffs, there are legitimate reasons. RP can be one, and people aren't required to give a reason when they ask not to be buffed.
I know my WS once got an empath to go "WTF?!" when I asked not to be healed unless critical. They understood part way into the mission, but they still didn't understand me NOT wanting healing.
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Dispersion Bubble provides psi defense, but Deflection Shield and Insulation Shield don't.
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As far as I recall, FF doesn't give psi defense at all. Granted, many psi powers are also ranged, melee, or aoe flagged so that's less of an issue. But back to the topic of not wanting buffs, there are legitimate reasons. RP can be one, and people aren't required to give a reason when they ask not to be buffed.
I know my WS once got an empath to go "WTF?!" when I asked not to be healed unless critical. They understood part way into the mission, but they still didn't understand me NOT wanting healing.
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Dispersion Bubble provides psi defense, but Deflection Shield and Insulation Shield don't.
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Dispersion Bubble: +def(all types, melee, ranged, aoe)
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As far as I recall, FF doesn't give psi defense at all. Granted, many psi powers are also ranged, melee, or aoe flagged so that's less of an issue. But back to the topic of not wanting buffs, there are legitimate reasons. RP can be one, and people aren't required to give a reason when they ask not to be buffed.
I know my WS once got an empath to go "WTF?!" when I asked not to be healed unless critical. They understood part way into the mission, but they still didn't understand me NOT wanting healing.
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FF has much less psi defense than every other type of defense but still has a decent amount in Dispersion Bubble. I believe the rule for whether or not a psi power is tagged with a positional type is whether or not it's in Mind Control (a glance over that powerset makes me think it has no positional tags, whereas psi blast always does.)
Perhaps there are legitimate reasons to not want buffs, but if you're just going to assert that there are legitimate reasons without giving any of them, I'll assert that there are legitimate reasons to give the buff even though you don't want it. And in those cases, a decent team leader would have a legitimate reason to kick one or both of us. While there's nothing requiring you to justify yourself when you ask for no buff, if I don't understand the request I'm much less likely to follow it. (As much as I've said that when I play kin I think you should SB everyone so they actually learn to control their toons, I will hold back on SB in cave maps that people find especially unnavigable. Then again, in a couple of those maps, their mistakes are disproportionately likely to result in death, unlike in most regular maps, where mistakes in placement might just reduce effectiveness a little bit.)
I can come up with a justification as to why you wouldn't want healing on a WS, but recognize that in refusing buffs, you're actually preventing someone else from playing their toon the way they're used to. And the reasons for them playing the way they're used to may be justified by RP as well. My emp is a little robot, and embedded deep in his programming is an imperative to heal allies who are injured.
Is your RP requirement more important than mine simply because yours runs counter to the usual play style people use?
In practice, I'll probably follow pretty much any request as long as I feel it's not slowing down the team. I honestly might find it hard to avoid healing in certain circumstances, although I manage to avoid healing certain tanks on my teams that I know can handle what they're doing, so I could probably manage it in this circumstance too. But getting away from empathy and kinetics and back to Force Fields, which was the subject of this thread, under my rationale, having increased defense will pretty much always speed up the team. And my bubbler is a lizard, who if I were to RP, wouldn't understand English particularly well, so he wouldn't understand your requests not to bubble him. (He'd magically gain some understanding if you uttered the word "migraine," because I don't like inflicting real-world discomfort on people, but I've never played on a team with anyone who claimed FF had this effect on them.)
In this context, why does some other player's RP trump mine? After all, mine is the one passing out bubbles; you've got a perfectly reasonable RP explanation for them being there.
True, very true. As I said, RP can be a legitimate reason. This is an MMORPG after all. In the case of a warshade asking not to be healed unless at HP critical state, a robote could legitimately then RP having a logic error.
Overall I'll accept most any buff. Even speed boost since it can be helpful. That said, yes I do have some characters that do refuse it. Some for RP reasons (most call it crack, and the char doesn't do drugs). Others refuse for practical reasons (lack of fine control, or really doesn't help much). Even when I refuse speed boost, I'll do my best to 'keep up'. Be it running a slotted sprint, using a travel power to move faster, whatever. And I'll never refuse it on a char who actually needs the +recovery.
My TA/A doesn't really *need* +recharge right now. After all, powers recharge in time to keep perma (mostly). However my TA/A rarely refuses speed boost. I love casting oil slick more often 
"The danger is not that a particular class is unfit to govern. Every class is unfit to govern." Lord Acton
Madam Enigma's History
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So, I've been playing my new Force Field / Dark Blast Defender for a little over a month now, and I ran into this the other day.
"Don't bubble me, please. And turn off your big bubble. I don't like the way they look on my toon. Nothing against you personally."
Now, I've been playing the game off and on for four years. I've heard of people asking not to be speed boosted, and asking Thermals not to buff them. This is the first time I can ever recall someone asking not to be bubbled, and for Dispersion Bubble to be turned off. WTF?
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That's when you tell them about this nice little option called "supress player FX"...
Plasmic's Guide to Sonic/Mental
Plasmic's Guide to Regeneration
Plasmic Fire - 50 Fire/Rad Victory Server
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On a side note, DA tanks may need a lot of healing, but they can cover that them self. What they need more is +recovery. That way they can afford to run their toggles, attack, and use dark regen.
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Dark Armor LOVES Kinetics
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Mine loves empaths more, but not for healing. Mine loves the +recovery power (which I keep forgetting the name of). As strong of a +recovery boost, but without the annoying +speed. Sure you don't get +recharge with it, but IMO +recharge is a double edged sword. If your already having end issues it can exasperate them. I know on my DM/DA scrapper I like speed boost at times, but sometimes I notice it doesn't really slow down the endurance bleed as much as I'd want.
"The danger is not that a particular class is unfit to govern. Every class is unfit to govern." Lord Acton
Madam Enigma's History