WHITE QUEEN (3D Marvel stuff in Poser)

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Emma's someone with the best body money can buy.

[/ QUOTE ]I loved that line in Joss Whedon's run on Astonishing X-men. Logan finds Scott and Emma shacking up and attacks him accusing him of betraying the love of Jean, who is dead. As they fight, Emma says something like "A powerful telepath, a brilliant intellect, and the best body money can buy. And I still lose to a dead readhead."

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This may be just personal taste, but I don't think that's the right face for Emma. Remember, Emma's someone with the best body money can buy. Literally. She's been touched up and nipped and tucked for years before the Hellfire Club.

I guess it's just that roundish nose. I don't see her settling for something as pedestrian as that and demanding something a little more... Patrician. (Though perhaps not literally Patrician, i.e., Italian, but something suitably WASP-y and East Coast moneyed.)

It's all technically brilliant as usual. I just got hung up on her face.

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I dunno, I didn't think it was that bad of a choice all things considered. And everything else is fairly brilliant, but that's somewhat standard with Doug's work as a whole, really. It was a sort of disconnect mentally there, but upon closer examination it does work. Just not what I would have initially went for. It also really depends on just who is drawing her that week - consistency with that sort of thing is a real bear. :/

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Post Deleted by Moderator_08

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My darling Valentine's Day Drawer... all of us here know you're not pointing out flaws to be helpful. You want a little negative attention and maybe some flame wars starting. We get it. Had you REALLY wanted to help anyone you've critiqued thus far, it would have been in a different tone.

That being said, brutal honesty is helpful in the right settings. I know some professors are just as blunt. If you think you can really help people out and spread your undeniable expertise far and wide, you might want to try some dedicated art forums... not a little fan art section for an MMO. That is, of course, if your real intentions are what you say they are!!

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Post Deleted by Moderator_08

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My darling Valentine's Day Drawer... all of us here know you're not pointing out flaws to be helpful. You want a little negative attention and maybe some flame wars starting. We get it. Had you REALLY wanted to help anyone you've critiqued thus far, it would have been in a different tone.

That being said, brutal honesty is helpful in the right settings. I know some professors are just as blunt. If you think you can really help people out and spread your undeniable expertise far and wide, you might want to try some dedicated art forums... not a little fan art section for an MMO. That is, of course, if your real intentions are what you say they are!!

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Uh ok, she said she wants to do pin-ups for Marvel in her post. The rest of the forum basically says "omg so good, no critiques". I'm saying it's not Marvel quality, and I'm the bad guy, ok then. Really I was going to just keep it short (see my post on the first page) until fanbois tried to call me out.

1. Doug is a he. Not your fault, but thought I would point it out.

2. My point was that this isn't really a critique type forum. I was pointing out you might get a better response and not be so be-fuzzled by people not liking your input if you were critiquing in one of the countless dedicated art forums out there that are specifically for that intention. Its just not the vibe around here, is all. As I said... fan art section for a niche MMO. Its a gallery more than anything.

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Uh ok, she said she wants to do pin-ups for Marvel in her post. The rest of the forum basically says "omg so good, no critiques". I'm saying it's not Marvel quality, and I'm the bad guy, ok then. Really I was going to just keep it short (see my post on the first page) until fanbois tried to call me out.

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No, I'm fairly certain you're the bad guy for being non-constructive, rude, snarky, and a total [censored], but that could just be my opinion of things. You certainly haven't shown any desire to be anything but, at least in this thread.

For someone who claims to have the credentials and backing to critique work (which, when you posted your original thread, I did indeed question - I am fully willing to admit that I'm therefore biased in this regard), you sure do seem to completely lack anything even remotely approaching professionalism, and seem more interested in forum-street cred (because you one hard [censored], what what) then anything else. Otherwise, you would've actually stated things in a helpful and informative fashion rather then throwing vitriol around without any real productive reasoning.

Especially when it's, for the most part, fairly unsolicited (I don't recall anything in the OP stating a critique was necessary, but hey, I'm human, I could be wrong, and I'll adjust this post as necessary upon further review) in addition to all of the above mentioned (and implied) faults.

Clearly, being appreciative of someone else's hard work and dedication makes me a fangrrl, but I'm not above giving a professional (sounding - I make no illusions that I am not a professional anything except maybe pervert or jerk) opinion when it's specifically asked for. I don't feel the need to throw it around like I'm somehow important or special, nor do I go off on passive-agressive fits when my poor behavior is pointed out (to my recollection, at any rate).

Darkjedi, as you might be able to tell by little things like his name, is male.

This is a Screenshots and Fan Art section on an internet forum, where people post a staggering range of art, from first attempt pencil sketches to commissioned watercolors and renders that can cost hundreds. People are showing off their cool stuff, and most of us have the common sense to realize that. If the professional artist with decades of experience wants his art critiqued, I doubt he'll turn to the "artist drawer" who thinks "lefted" and "pickyer" are words to do it.

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Uh ok, she said she wants to do pin-ups for Marvel in her post. The rest of the forum basically says "omg so good, no critiques". I'm saying it's not Marvel quality, and I'm the bad guy, ok then. Really I was going to just keep it short (see my post on the first page) until fanbois tried to call me out.

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No, I'm fairly certain you're the bad guy for being non-constructive, rude, snarky, and a total [censored], but that could just be my opinion of things. You certainly haven't shown any desire to be anything but, at least in this thread.


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What's you definition of constructive critique? I'm curious.

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For someone who claims to have the credentials and backing to critique work (which, when you posted your original thread, I did indeed question - I am fully willing to admit that I'm therefore biased in this regard), you sure do seem to completely lack anything even remotely approaching professionalism, and seem more interested in forum-street cred (because you one hard [censored], what what) then anything else.


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Ahahaha. Have you being in any sort of production company? You'd be lucky if your editor even tells you what to fix. They just tell you to "redo it better" (but they're mostly idiots so...).

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Otherwise, you would've actually stated things in a helpful and informative fashion rather then throwing vitriol around without any real productive reasoning.


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What not helpful about pointing out your flaws? That's more helpful than some vague response, say "hmmmm, the background could be better". Like in some art school by some professor too chicken to give proper critiques because they might drop her class(I've had a bunch of those).

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Especially when it's, for the most part, fairly unsolicited (I don't recall anything in the OP stating a critique was necessary, but hey, I'm human, I could be wrong, and I'll adjust this post as necessary upon further review) in addition to all of the above mentioned (and implied) faults.


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Posting on a public forum and not expect/want critiques...uh ok. So..why are you posting...?

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Clearly, being appreciative of someone else's hard work and dedication makes me a fangrrl, but I'm not above giving a professional (sounding - I make no illusions that I am not a professional anything except maybe pervert or jerk) opinion when it's specifically asked for. I don't feel the need to throw it around like I'm somehow important or special, nor do I go off on passive-agressive fits when my poor behavior is pointed out (to my recollection, at any rate).

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Uh if I wasn't appreciative of people's hard work I wouldn't give critique at all. I'd just say "[censored] sux" and move on.

Looks great, Darkjedi. Dude, good job.

I do agree with The_Foo that the model isnt a lot similar to the way Emma is traditionally depicted (as in, pale with european-american traces), but characterization is too small of an issue considering the way the whole piece is interesting.

Keep it up.

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For someone who claims to have the credentials and backing to critique work (which, when you posted your original thread, I did indeed question - I am fully willing to admit that I'm therefore biased in this regard), you sure do seem to completely lack anything even remotely approaching professionalism, and seem more interested in forum-street cred (because you one hard [censored], what what) then anything else.


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Ahahaha. Have you being in any sort of production company? You'd be lucky if your editor even tells you what to fix. They just tell you to "redo it better" (but they're mostly idiots so...).

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I didn't want to say anything else... but.... I have to for this one. Not only did you totally skirt the question of credentials... but did you call yourself an idiot? You've been touting that you're trying to be hard-nosed like an editor, and then said they're mostly idiots!!

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For someone who claims to have the credentials and backing to critique work (which, when you posted your original thread, I did indeed question - I am fully willing to admit that I'm therefore biased in this regard), you sure do seem to completely lack anything even remotely approaching professionalism, and seem more interested in forum-street cred (because you one hard [censored], what what) then anything else.


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Ahahaha. Have you being in any sort of production company? You'd be lucky if your editor even tells you what to fix. They just tell you to "redo it better" (but they're mostly idiots so...).

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I didn't want to say anything else... but.... I have to for this one. Not only did you totally skirt the question of credentials... but did you call yourself an idiot? You've been touting that you're trying to be hard-nosed like an editor, and then said they're mostly idiots!!

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So you're saying you only take critiques from people with credentials? lol. I guess everything I point out is non-existent, and the picture is perfect.

Yeah most editors are idiots. Ok...?

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For someone who claims to have the credentials and backing to critique work (which, when you posted your original thread, I did indeed question - I am fully willing to admit that I'm therefore biased in this regard), you sure do seem to completely lack anything even remotely approaching professionalism, and seem more interested in forum-street cred (because you one hard [censored], what what) then anything else.


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Ahahaha. Have you being in any sort of production company? You'd be lucky if your editor even tells you what to fix. They just tell you to "redo it better" (but they're mostly idiots so...).

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I didn't want to say anything else... but.... I have to for this one. Not only did you totally skirt the question of credentials... but did you call yourself an idiot? You've been touting that you're trying to be hard-nosed like an editor, and then said they're mostly idiots!!

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So you're saying you only take critiques from people with credentials? lol. I guess everything I point out is non-existent, and the picture is perfect.

Yeah most editors are idiots. Ok...?

[/ QUOTE ]I believe what she means is that you say you have credentials (working in the biz) yet don't share them.

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If the professional artist with decades of experience wants his art critiqued, I doubt he'll turn to the "artist drawer" who thinks "lefted" and "pickyer" are words to do it.

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You don't turn to anyone, you post your art like he's doing right now, ask for feedback and pickout which critiques you think are valid. If you think everything I said is because of my untrained eyes or whatever or your stuff is on par with what's in the industry right now, don't take any critiques, just go ahead and send it to Marvel and Pixar.

I could be a snot and go on a multi-quote point-by-point dissection, but I personally find them fairly irritating to have to read through, let alone actually type up, so I'm going to just assume we're of a mature enough mindset that such matters are completely unnecessary. (DISCLAIMER: That's not exactly a proclimation of fault on your part, as you're well within your rights to do so, but more an explanation on why I'm going for a more debate/discussion-oriented format that's somewhat easier to read. I realize it can be taken that way, but I have this nagging need to be clear about things and feel an up-front statement of intent in such matters is worth a lot more then the likely misunderstandings that will most assuredly result. You therefore have my humble apologies in advance, particularly if there's any issue you have keeping straight what applies to what.)

I'm not entirely sure I can break down constructive criticism better then Electagonist has already done further up in the thread, so I'll do nothing more then direct you to at least the first part of his post and state firmly that I do agree with that particular post, and further continue to try and put the rest of this post as an example of such. I may fail, but being human and thus not quite infallible, I frankly am not the least worried.

I can say with certainty that I am, indeed, not affiliated with a production company, and honestly fail to see how that necessarily gives any realistic, tangible credentials to critique other's works, or how that's exactly an excuse to be a rude prat and get away with it. I am, however, highly interested in the field of journalism (to the point I've taken multiple classes in both it and general debate, at a college level), and in particular have studied the field of review and critique because I find it faskinating (that's an intentional misspelling, mind you, so feel no need to point that out - I refuse to be 100% serious on an internet forum), and make it a point to always improve my ability to offer a professional level of criticism when it's asked, and at least be respectful when not asked. That, however, is nowhere near anything I would list as active credentials, however, and the only thing I would accept in that nature is a certificate or degree (verifiable) that you (or I, for that matter) am both qualified and requested to critique anything. So far, I've seen less effort on your part to actually pretend to be anything professional at all, and I find that a great disservice to yourself and the community you seek to 'help' (and I do use that term loosely).

On the next point, dear sir, there is a fine line between pointing out flaws in a polite, respectful, and informative manner, and doing what could be considered self-important snark of other's works simply because you feel the need to reinforce the fact you value your opinion so much over others, and they should as well. There's nothing at all relating to this that necessitates calling anyone names, being insulting, or using words like 'horrible' without actually meaning it (and I have no doubts that you do, however I find that if one is properly educated there are far more specific and less harsh words that could be of greater benefit to use).

In regards to posting on a forum - it's a place to discuss things. Not critique, but discuss. The two don't often have to bandy about hand-in-hand to be fun and interesting, and some people just like to show what they're currently working on, have done, or have gotten done for them because that's what they feel is fun and/or interesting. If all you're going to do is critique things (and I will state again, poorly), then you can fully expect people to be upset with you at every turn. That's not discussing at all - that's just being a prat.

At your last line, I'm not entirely sure it's worth bothering to go over in great detail. I'll simply state that it's cute that you think so, but unless you're under the age of 10, cute doesn't exactly make you many friends, especially not when you're busy hiding behind the pillar of professionalism.

Post deleted by Moderator 08

Nice art, looks fantastic, DJ!

*pauses and then looks again at Darkjedi's signature*

Hold on a mo... Doug Shuler?

Serra Angel?
The Zodiac Conspiracy?

NO BLOODY WAY!

Michelle
aka
Samuraiko/Dark_Respite

Post deleted by Moderator 08

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*pauses and then looks again at Darkjedi's signature*

Hold on a mo... Doug Shuler?

Serra Angel?
The Zodiac Conspiracy?

NO BLOODY WAY!

Michelle
aka
Samuraiko/Dark_Respite

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Yeah...what makes this whole thing funnier to me is Doug is a real professional artist type person who, I'm willing to bet, knows more about the industry than our "art drawer" here.

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I'm also, frankly, well aware of how the creative industry works, as I've talked with newspaper, magazine, and book editors before. I'm also fully aware that the majority of them have been polite, even while they were tearing my works down and setting them on fire. I'm not sure where you get this idea that being polite and respectful leads to hippy flower dancing - that's, in my opinion, laughable, because most of the time I think of it, I think of it more in terms of a debate room floor - where I don't have to like you, I don't have to agree with you (and I probably won't, just because that's what I'm there to do), but that doesn't mean I have any right to insult you when it's your argument and how you present it that's my real target. There's plenty of ways to tear someone down while, at least outwardly, seeming to be polite and respectful.


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You realize showing some guy your portfolio at a Comic-con is not the same as when you work for them right? Why? Because when you work for them, they pay you. And you better believe they want to get the $ worth, if it mean asking you to redo the whole thing everytime you get a dot in the wrong place.

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You also seem to be, still, of the impression that what you do is any way, shape, or form considered proper critique, and not just baseless mudslinging. Which I really find depressing, because if this is all the effort you're putting into this, you're even less interesting then previously indicated.


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Ok then...because from here it looks like you're the only typing up paragraphs of response.

As for the baseless mudslinging...lol. So you're saying Everything I'm pointed out is wrong? If it's not...it's not baseless, please understand wtf you're talking about.

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please understand wtf you're talking about.

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How delightfully ironic.

You know what they say about taking your own advice, right? :3

EDIT: Also, for clarification, could you please explain what 'you're the only typing up paragraphs of response' means? Because, honestly, I can't be arsed to care if I can't understand your jibba-jabba, foo'.

And, not, not THE Foo. Dat's an entirely different foo', foo'!

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please understand wtf you're talking about.

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How delightfully ironic.

You know what they say about taking your own advice, right? :3

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Oh lol. Ok, keep dodging the question. I'm sure it's a flawless piece of art in your eyes.

For the record I have a playset of Serras. No, I'm not just hating on him

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please understand wtf you're talking about.

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How delightfully ironic.

You know what they say about taking your own advice, right? :3

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Oh lol. Ok, keep dodging the question.

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What question? On whether your opinion is wrong, in my opinion?

That's a pointless waste of time, if you ask me. I can, however, state that the method with which you go about expressing your opinion is juvenile and petty, but that in and of itself is an opinion, as well.

We could do an opinion circular argument, but all that really does is prove absolutely nothing, and I'm at least pretending to try and be objective.

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please understand wtf you're talking about.

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How delightfully ironic.

You know what they say about taking your own advice, right? :3

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Oh lol. Ok, keep dodging the question. I'm sure it's a flawless piece of art in your eyes.

For the record I have a playset of Serras. No, I'm not just hating on him

[/ QUOTE ]Dodging the question? Hello pot, this is the kettle. What exactly ARE your credentials as a critic?

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please understand wtf you're talking about.

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How delightfully ironic.

You know what they say about taking your own advice, right? :3

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Oh lol. Ok, keep dodging the question. I'm sure it's a flawless piece of art in your eyes.

For the record I have a playset of Serras. No, I'm not just hating on him

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EDIT: Also, for clarification, could you please explain what 'you're the only typing up paragraphs of response' means? Because, honestly, I can't be arsed to care if I can't understand your jibba-jabba, foo'.


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Ahahahahahahhahahahah. You really don't understand what I was trying to say? Ahaha, oh wow, please, go back to elementary english. A gradeschool can figure it out given the context. I can see now you're typing loads of words to make yourself sound more intelligent than you really are.

I also like how you bring up other unrelated threads, just like when someone's at the end of their argument.


edit: before you ask me, I meant grade-schooler when I typed gradeschool. Ok?