With the knowledge that a power's DS is based on its recharge, here's a couple easy ones. DPA would improve at the cost of potentially needing more recharge to form an attack chain.
-Change BS's recharge from 8s to 10s to match Havoc Punch.
-Change Energy Blast's recharge from 6s to 8s.
Now, here's another fairly easy one.
-Make Push unique for Doms since it is in an Assault set. Make it do DS based on its recharge instead of considering it a control power and hamstringing its damage. This would make it do the same damage as Blast, though, making Blast unattractive due to the difference in Activation time. The guaranteed knock might offset this since it makes it hard to be in melee range, though.
Now, Power Burst does decent damage, but it is very hurt by its long Activation time. Moving its recharge from 11 to 12 would help a tad, but 15 might be even better but for the increase in recharge you'd need to use it often. Trimming its activation time would be great for ALL archetypes that get it. Get it down to 1.67 like Blast would be awesome, and it still wouldn't be as good as Blaze/BIB.
edit: Here's a weird thought... Is it possible to have a DoT triggered "on knockback"? If so, a small bonus DoT attached to the knockback (to simulate falling/impact damage) might be a cool add-on. Horribly unlikely, and completely unreliable, but kinda interesting.
edit2: DPA is something that plagues Energy. In the places it does comparable damage, the long activation times hurt it in comparison. The disparity between Burst and Blaze/BIB is the perfect illustration of this.
Is it worth adding to your list of deficiencies that the animations are quite slow in comparison to most of the other sets?
QR
Without the running afoul of the cottage rule, fixing */energy assault is difficult. It's quite a bit of fail. But here goes:
1) [u] Bone Smasher[u] - Replace melee AT version with Blaster version
2.6 DS, 14 sec. recharge
[u]Justification[u] - An early boom for the baby Dom.
2)[u] Power Blast[u] - Replace Dom 6 sec version with Blaster/Defender 8 sec version with larger 1.64 DS
[u]Justification[u] - At level 10, the Dom probably has at least one control and power bolt for filler damage, so the increased recharge is worth the increased damage.
3) [u]Power Push[u] - Increase DS to 2.4; increase recharge to 16 sec.
[u]Justification[u]: KB on a set that gets a lot of damage from melee better be worth using.
The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.
First off I think this is a great post. Kudo's Liliaceae. I keep reading over and over regarding Energy as being poor. We have threads about why people hate it. (It's starting to have a scary resemblance to the Troller threads)
My main concern when I tried rolling a /Energy was the knockback. We all know most dom powers focus on the melee for the most part, and I agree that knockback is not always the most sound option for a melee style build. Sometimes even with my Elec, I get annoyed with Havoc P, because it tosses them away from me. Still though Elec is pretty great.
This is simple. Im not nearly as experienced as you folk are when it comes to this. I always thought energy could have a -resist, but my only concern was if they create Sonic Assault. So obviously Stun is a pretty interesting idea, but why not use Knock Up (Like Air Superiority) over Knockback. I mean essentialy it has some of the same mitigation options, still fits generaly with the theme (Cottage Rule), but still keeps enemies in range.
Stun is fine (Don't count on it. The concept is fine)
Knockback (Never my favorite option)
Knock Up (Personaly I really like Knock Up. Sometimes it buys me a bit of time to throw a control down)
Ok, Im going to try and stay within the structure you set up but only comment on one of your points.
2. AOE Damage (Whirling Hands)
Rules of engagement
1. Keep Whirling Hands
2. Keep Whirling Hands in it's original power order
3. In keeping with theme... Whirling Hands has a nice animation. The poor range was justified by the reach of your hands not being long and its melee blah blah blah. I say keep the animation with a slight adjustment. Make the damage come when you actually land your fist on the ground (see Iron Man-Energy Attack?) that sends sort of an energy wave outward thus giving justification to a larger range. This wave could be added to the animation and slightly resemble PSW. (in wave animation only) Add some damage. Nothing overpowered but something that matches endurance cost.
4. This may break it but just a thought. Add chance to Knockdown. Endurance cost or recharge could be adjusted if points 3 or 4 were implemented to slightly offset anything over-performing.
In conclusion you have some nice solutions. I would argue that while most choose Energy for single target, most that solo or PVP enjoy having at least one capable AOE to help level up or when in team situations. Right now I would guess that those same people are choosing Electric over Energy as it stands.
[ QUOTE ]
QR
Without the running afoul of the cottage rule, fixing */energy assault is difficult. It's quite a bit of fail. But here goes:
1) [u] Bone Smasher[u] - Replace melee AT version with Blaster version
2.6 DS, 14 sec. recharge
[u]Justification[u] - An early boom for the baby Dom.
2)[u] Power Blast[u] - Replace Dom 6 sec version with Blaster/Defender 8 sec version with larger 1.64 DS
[u]Justification[u] - At level 10, the Dom probably has at least one control and power bolt for filler damage, so the increased recharge is worth the increased damage.
3) [u]Power Push[u] - Increase DS to 2.4; increase recharge to 16 sec.
[u]Justification[u]: KB on a set that gets a lot of damage from melee better be worth using.
[/ QUOTE ]
I am on board with any changes that involve longer Recharge, more Damage, and the same Activation time. That gives us bigger DPA, making powers worth the animation time. And Doms have enough click powers between the primary and secondary that we can make a nice attack chain even with longer recharges.
If I have a nice Bonesmasher available... then if I'm going to blast someone with a blast that may knock them away from my BS, that blast needs to do worthwhile damage. Frankly, I'd do a first and move the first 2 ST ranged blasts to 5 and 10 seconds, since their knockback is counterproductive to the melee. Alternately, make them do knockDOWN, though that is kind of against the Energy Blast theme.
So, I like EG's changes, and would also move Power Burst to 12-15 second recharge and make it a really heavy hitter, so that its animation time is worth it.
With power build-up, you'll have nearly the same big single target damage attack as elec (actually more, if you consider dam res). It will also help whirling hands damage.
Speaking of hands, make it 100% chance to stun with a shorter duration (5 sec) PVE only.
Dark Bard, Zoobait, Debacle
jmsb
Por vezes d� vontade...
chucknorriss
speak american godamnit
Screw the cottage rule. It's not my fault the designers made bad set choices.
Replace Whirling hands with torrent. Fire and Cold get cones, why not energy?
Pushing the recharge and damage of power burst is definitely a strong move. Doms already have no problems filling an attack chain.
In every other energy attack set, it is the ST burst damage set. For doms, it works more as a soft control type secondary.
Right now, Icy and elec are much better in the area of ST burst dmg than energy while both also have better AE damage potential.
Going even further, now that power boost no longer affects knockback, energy basically received a nerf as the power lost much of its built-in utility within the set.
Solution:
Significantly increase the damage of each attack to make the set more bursty.
*Violates Cottage rule* Replace snipe with energy transfer. The new animation for ET makes this a respectable option.
*Violates Cottage rule* reinterating how swapping power boost with power build-up would be a good idea. Even better idea, swap out the snipe and power boost for energy transfer and boost range.
[ QUOTE ]
Ok, Im going to try and stay within the structure you set up but only comment on one of your points.
2. AOE Damage (Whirling Hands)
Rules of engagement
1. Keep Whirling Hands
2. Keep Whirling Hands in it's original power order
3. In keeping with theme... Whirling Hands has a nice animation. The poor range was justified by the reach of your hands not being long and its melee blah blah blah. I say keep the animation with a slight adjustment. Make the damage come when you actually land your fist on the ground (see Iron Man-Energy Attack?) that sends sort of an energy wave outward thus giving justification to a larger range. This wave could be added to the animation and slightly resemble PSW. (in wave animation only) Add some damage. Nothing overpowered but something that matches endurance cost.
4. This may break it but just a thought. Add chance to Knockdown. Endurance cost or recharge could be adjusted if points 3 or 4 were implemented to slightly offset anything over-performing.
In conclusion you have some nice solutions. I would argue that while most choose Energy for single target, most that solo or PVP enjoy having at least one capable AOE to help level up or when in team situations. Right now I would guess that those same people are choosing Electric over Energy as it stands.
[/ QUOTE ]
... forget "Chance to" and I'd buy it. >.>
I also wouldn't argue with that being ported to other sets with Whirling Hands - Fire/EM isn't a spectacular set, IMHO, since it seems the KD of things like Stone melee and SS help survivability.... which is also my argument for losing the "chance to" on this suggestion for doms.
I played an EM/EA brute to 50 (yeah, I know, but I liked it) slotting several things for stun in mind. In the PVP zones of the time, yeah, that got noticed - then again, PVE, the brute also had damage that the dom doesn't have.
Of course, the KD may cause an issue with Ice and Earth doms (Slick and EQ) adding enough to *their* KD to turn it into KB for some foes. And, of course, the AOE Immob counters it in most instances.
[ QUOTE ]
QR
Without the running afoul of the cottage rule, fixing */energy assault is difficult. It's quite a bit of fail. But here goes:
1) [u] Bone Smasher[u] - Replace melee AT version with Blaster version
2.6 DS, 14 sec. recharge
[u]Justification[u] - An early boom for the baby Dom.
2)[u] Power Blast[u] - Replace Dom 6 sec version with Blaster/Defender 8 sec version with larger 1.64 DS
[u]Justification[u] - At level 10, the Dom probably has at least one control and power bolt for filler damage, so the increased recharge is worth the increased damage.
3) [u]Power Push[u] - Increase DS to 2.4; increase recharge to 16 sec.
[u]Justification[u]: KB on a set that gets a lot of damage from melee better be worth using.
[/ QUOTE ]
I like all of these. Might have to nerf PP's Accuracy to make that balanced, though, but that'd be a welcome change if it was going to become our version of TK Blast.
[ QUOTE ]
Replace Whirling hands with torrent. Fire and Cold get cones, why not energy?
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm all for that change, as well as the ones Evil Gecko listed.
I'm also one to push for Power Boost to be changed to either Power Build Up (which would be MUCH more unique and fun for Energy...) or at least Build Up. If the dev's could fit Boost Range into the set, we'd be golden, and I doubt they'd hear anymore complaints about "energy" 
[ QUOTE ]
Screw the cottage rule. It's not my fault the designers made bad set choices.
Replace Whirling hands with torrent. Fire and Cold get cones, why not energy?
Pushing the recharge and damage of power burst is definitely a strong move. Doms already have no problems filling an attack chain.
[/ QUOTE ]
If I were ignoring the cottage rule, beside the changes I posted before, I would remove the snipe and replace it with Energy Torrent. I would keep Whirling Hands. Nothing wrong with two AoEs.
The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.
[ QUOTE ]
Screw the cottage rule. It's not my fault the designers made bad set choices.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes indeed, but let's observe it to keep the discussion realistic. Feel free to start a no-cottage rule thread as well, but it's a much larger and more subjective discussion.
[ QUOTE ]
Is it worth adding to your list of deficiencies that the animations are quite slow in comparison to most of the other sets?
[/ QUOTE ]
They are probably below average, so sure, why not.
[ QUOTE ]
1) [u] Bone Smasher[u] - Replace melee AT version with Blaster version
2.6 DS, 14 sec. recharge
2)[u] Power Blast[u] - Replace Dom 6 sec version with Blaster/Defender 8 sec version with larger 1.64 DS
3) [u]Power Push[u] - Increase DS to 2.4; increase recharge to 16 sec.
[/ QUOTE ]
These changes with Power Build Up seem reasonable, but do they really fix /Energy's woes? What they give is better burst damage, but I suspect that /Electricity and /Fiery will still be ahead.
[ QUOTE ]
Larger range Whirling Hands with Knockdown.
[/ QUOTE ]
This would be a nice buff to the power, but is it really that useful to a Dominator? Your enemies should largely be controlled already with the primary. The biggest use I would see is for bosses if Domination's not up, which is rather silly given it's an AoE. Sounds awesome for melee ATs though.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
1) [u] Bone Smasher[u] - Replace melee AT version with Blaster version
2.6 DS, 14 sec. recharge
2)[u] Power Blast[u] - Replace Dom 6 sec version with Blaster/Defender 8 sec version with larger 1.64 DS
3) [u]Power Push[u] - Increase DS to 2.4; increase recharge to 16 sec.
[/ QUOTE ]
These changes with Power Build Up seem reasonable, but do they really fix /Energy's woes? What they give is better burst damage, but I suspect that /Electricity and /Fiery will still be ahead.
[/ QUOTE ]
Not much else you really can do if we're trying to be realistic. If I were really trying to fix */Energy I would remove the KB from everything but Power Push and add a chance to disorient instead.
But then you have the KB lovers screaming that you nerfed their set.
The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
1) [u] Bone Smasher[u] - Replace melee AT version with Blaster version
2.6 DS, 14 sec. recharge
2)[u] Power Blast[u] - Replace Dom 6 sec version with Blaster/Defender 8 sec version with larger 1.64 DS
3) [u]Power Push[u] - Increase DS to 2.4; increase recharge to 16 sec.
[/ QUOTE ]
These changes with Power Build Up seem reasonable, but do they really fix /Energy's woes? What they give is better burst damage, but I suspect that /Electricity and /Fiery will still be ahead.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes, but /EM would now be in a sweet spot of good ST melee and good ST ranged but not best at either.
Power build up would give it an edge in control.
Dark Bard, Zoobait, Debacle
jmsb
Por vezes d� vontade...
chucknorriss
speak american godamnit
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
1) [u] Bone Smasher[u] - Replace melee AT version with Blaster version
2.6 DS, 14 sec. recharge
2)[u] Power Blast[u] - Replace Dom 6 sec version with Blaster/Defender 8 sec version with larger 1.64 DS
3) [u]Power Push[u] - Increase DS to 2.4; increase recharge to 16 sec.
[/ QUOTE ]
These changes with Power Build Up seem reasonable, but do they really fix /Energy's woes? What they give is better burst damage, but I suspect that /Electricity and /Fiery will still be ahead.
[/ QUOTE ]
Not much else you really can do if we're trying to be realistic. If I were really trying to fix */Energy I would remove the KB from everything but Power Push and add a chance to disorient instead.
But then you have the KB lovers screaming that you nerfed their set.
[/ QUOTE ]
If the KB is kept, then users could mitigate it with their primary. Besides, its all single target KB, not TOO bad in team play.
You know, with the tweaks and power-build up, it really doesn't change the play of /EM, just makes it better. Should be acceptable to the devs and players.
Dark Bard, Zoobait, Debacle
jmsb
Por vezes d� vontade...
chucknorriss
speak american godamnit
[ QUOTE ]
Not much else you really can do if we're trying to be realistic. If I were really trying to fix */Energy I would remove the KB from everything but Power Push and add a chance to disorient instead.
But then you have the KB lovers screaming that you nerfed their set.
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm sure we can push harder to come up with something reasonable. At the bottom of the very first post I put my current favourite suggestion, replacing the %knockback in the blasts with a -Res debuff.
I can't imagine there are very many people who love Energy Assault for its knockback, but they still have Power Push, the king of knockback!
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Not much else you really can do if we're trying to be realistic. If I were really trying to fix */Energy I would remove the KB from everything but Power Push and add a chance to disorient instead.
But then you have the KB lovers screaming that you nerfed their set.
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm sure we can push harder to come up with something reasonable. At the bottom of the very first post I put my current favourite suggestion, replacing the %knockback in the blasts with a -Res debuff.
I can't imagine there are very many people who love Energy Assault for its knockback, but they still have Power Push, the king of knockback!
[/ QUOTE ]
Except that it would walk on the toes of a potential future sonic assault.
Dark Bard, Zoobait, Debacle
jmsb
Por vezes d� vontade...
chucknorriss
speak american godamnit
Plus, to be honest I'd kinda miss the knockback if it were removed. While it may not be the most useful effect (especially on an AT with a control primary), there's very little that makes me feel as superpowered as sending an enemy flying. I chuckle every time I hit/shoot someone and send their rear smacking into a wall or the floor. If I ever make an energy assault dom, I'd definitely be sad if I couldn't knock stuff over with anything but power push.
Honestly, just upping the damage and recharge on stuff would go a long way. With the multiplicity of abilities we use continuously making dpa the most important attribute of an attack, just sending bonesmasher and power blast to the blaster version would make a difference. Give power push the damage of a typical 6s blast too, maybe? Just give the set some more damage, that's all it needs IMO.
@MuonNeutrino
Student, Gamer, Altaholic, and future Astronomer.
This is what it means to be a tank!
All I want out of knockback is a way for it to be reliable. If it was a % to KD or a 100% knockback I'd be far happier with it.
So there has been much lamentation about the state of Energy Assault, and some suggested fixes as well. What we haven't had (or is my memory failing?) is a thread with the premiss that Energy Assault stinks, and with a goal of discussing solutions. This is that thread! (This intro is very derivative so please don't assume I am a beacon of clarity and incisiveness based on the content of this post.)
First, what are the problems:
<ul type="square">[*]Mediocre single target damage. The single target powers are all mediocre at best, which results in completely unremarkable damage. This is true even when damage buffs from other sets are ignored. This isn't significant in of itself, but:[*]Laughable AoE damage. Whirling Hands I'm looking at you. Even discussing AoE potential is insulting.[*]Marginal secondary effects. If you're depending on a 30% chance to stun, then it's 70% chance to die. Knockback and stuns only work on the same enemies as the primary, and "if you're depending on your secondary for control you're bad at playing Dominators". At least the -Rech from /Psionic and /Icy works on PToD enemies.[*]Self-defeating secondary effects. Every blast has a chance to knockback on a set that needs to mix melee and ranged attacks to be acceptable.[*]Dull utility. A ranged single target knockback is not very exciting. Power Boost is popular, but shared by /Icy. [/list]
Second, the rules of engagement:
<ul type="square">[*]No replacing powers or changing their main purpose. (Is this the so-called "cottage rule"?)[*]No reordering powers. While not as strong a rule as the first, this is still considered a major change.[*]Additive changes are ok, but "theme" must be respected. Don't ask me what the theme of Energy Assault is, "except to suck".[*]Don't "break" powers. They are supposed to follow certain rules, and we don't want another Psychic Shockwave here.[*]As few changes as possible. Don't change absolutely everything in the set, this will upset people. [/list]
I hope you like difficult problems.
Third, some possible solutions:
<ul type="square">[*]Increase damage of single target powers, to bring it to the top. I've looked at this on a few occasions and concluded that it's not possible to bring it to the top without breaking powers. The problem is competing with the /Fiery blasts (which are broken) or the fact that /Electricity has an extra melee attack and the excellent damage boosting Voltaic Sentinel.[*]Increase the usefulness of the stun effects, by giving Bonesmasher 100% chance to stun. The net effect is an improvement to the attack chain since the single target hold can now be skipped. Unfortunately I've concluded that the improvement to damage output is fairly minor because /Energy doesn't have the extra attacks to take advantage of the extra time.[*]Fix Whirling Hands. Even with a larger radius and appropriate damage Energy Assault would still have poor AoE damage because it only has one AoE attack. Furthermore, the people who chose /Energy were interested in single target damage, not AoE.[*]Replace Power Boost with Power Build Up. This is running afoul of the power replacement rule, but remains under consideration since it's really an additive change. It's a strong contender for improving /Energy's lot, but certainly is not sufficient on its own. It's also lore that Castle does not like Power Build Up so it may be discounted on that basis.[*]Replace chance to knockback on the blasts with a -Res debuff similar to the sonic blasts. This is my current fix du jour. It solidifies /Energy's position against single hard targets, making it competitive solo, and unparalleled (amongst Dominator secondaries) teamed.[/list]
Fourth, discuss. Geez, a discussion starter shouldn't be so exhaustive (or is it exhausting?)