Guide to Successful Teams
As always, Phil, insightful (if not a little Prozac-y ) and inspiring.
Of course, you'd have to pull out my fingernails to get me in the Shard.
Carl and Sons @Aurora Girl (Pinnacle)
Nice work !
i must admit i make a very poor leader, but haveing played CoX since it came out, i can tell very fast a good leader from a bad one ( and bad tf players to .. those are the ones that refuse to listen to leaders )
almost everyone of the TF's i've been on where pug's. most went well. only bad ones i was on was becouse of bad players causing problems and fighting.
the first tf i did was the one in steal canyon with 3 other friends.( and we all know how horable that TF is becouse of the time it takes, and this was befor the bank mission to get travel powers early.. and so most charactuires didn't have travel powers when they did this. we got 1/2 threw it befor they had to log becouse it was to late for them.. sigh. but the next day i was standing there and got invited to it again. we took off with 6 or 7 hero's ( can't remember, it was 4 years ago geess ). after 1 or 2 door mission somoen dropped.. then next mission another dropped, about 1/2 way fighting began with most of the rest of the players and most dropped out. all that was left was my ill/rad and a fire/? controller. we stood there wondering if we should go on, and even if we could do it. i had nothing to do the rest of the night, and said we might as well see how far we can get, i doubted we would beat the boss at the end. the other player was game for trying.. so we forged on ... yeah, a level 12 and 13 controler w/out travel powers on one of the long tf's .. it was painfully long. we joked that it took so long, but at least we were safely defending ourselves. and yes.. after about 6 1/2 - 7 hour, we managed to beat the end boss and complete the TF.
maybe i'm out of place saying this on a CoX forum .. but i've played several MMO's and in each one, there is always folks that say you nead this or that archtype in your group to be good. and in each game, that totaly wrong. i've seen groups made completly out of the most undesired class's in the game team up to complete quest/mission/hunt that most folks would give them no chance at.
it's good player's + working together + good leader= success
congratz Phil ... i'd love to be on a TF with you sometime.
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While the Statesman TF may NEED a strong tanker, just to hold onto Lord Recluse long enough to bring the towers down, I've never run across ANY OTHER TF that "required" a certain type of character.
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Untrue. The Statesman TF can be accomplished with a good illusionist who can taunt with phantom army. Unless they've changed this recently and did away with the ability of PA to taunt. I've run several STFs with only an illusionist as the taunter. The STF doesn't need a tank.
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While the Statesman TF may NEED a strong tanker, just to hold onto Lord Recluse long enough to bring the towers down, I've never run across ANY OTHER TF that "required" a certain type of character.
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Untrue. The Statesman TF can be accomplished with a good illusionist who can taunt with phantom army. Unless they've changed this recently and did away with the ability of PA to taunt. I've run several STFs with only an illusionist as the taunter. The STF doesn't need a tank.
[/ QUOTE ]Technically, you'd still have a contanker. :P
Originally Posted by Back Alley Brawler
Did you just use "casual gamer" and "purpled-out warshade" in the same sentence?
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Fantastic guide Philotic, thank you for taking the time writing it.
Two issues:
The "Don't be a tool" factor, very very important. Was on a MoSTF run on a Storm Defender that had previously completed it...kept being told what toggles to use, that I was ruining the run for people, etc...you need a certain amount of trust in your teammates' abilities, while having directed focus.
The flattery thing is key...when we're doing a longer task force I always ask "Is everyone having fun?" "Thanks for the great buffs" "You're clearing that whole map yourself!" Basic psychology, people like to feel validated.
Very nice guide.
Questions about the game, either side? /t @Neuronia or @Neuronium, with your queries!
168760: A Death in the Gish. 3 missions, 1-14. Easy to solo.
Infinity Villains
Champion, Pinnacle, Virtue Heroes
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Prozac-y
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Definition please.
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While the Statesman TF may NEED a strong tanker, just to hold onto Lord Recluse long enough to bring the towers down, I've never run across ANY OTHER TF that "required" a certain type of character.
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Untrue. The Statesman TF can be accomplished with a good illusionist who can taunt with phantom army. Unless they've changed this recently and did away with the ability of PA to taunt. I've run several STFs with only an illusionist as the taunter. The STF doesn't need a tank.
[/ QUOTE ]Technically, you'd still have a contanker. :P
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True dat.
Hell, with the right enemies, my Force Field Defender can tank just about anything, so I'm the "tanker" often times.
Very good guide. I have sorta unconsciously doing most of this stuff the whole time (I am always effusive in my praise for when teammates do something really well... especially for the AT's that don't normally get much praise, like that /TA defender) and I almost never have a problem getting a full pug through most of the TF's. It's glad to have a lot of these things put into writing so other people can use them.
Great guide, Phil. I've found your methods to work quite well. When I start a TF that I've organized I almost always tell the group, "I'm really looking forward to doing this TF with all of you."
You're so right about + reinforcement. Plus you're reinforcing your own gaming experience... that you're here to have fun too.
Seismic did all the tfs as PuGs and they were fun. The Dr. Quarterfield was the only one that was painful, since it was so long. But in all those cases people stayed. One of the groups had six Controllers, 1 Warshade, and a Scrapper. I called that the flying guillotine team....
Keep up the good work on the guides!
That was a great guide. I don't know why PuGs have such a bad rap (at least above lvl 20). They're a great way to get a feel for some of the other ATs and add some variety to the game. The only thing I'd add as far as keeping the team moving is that on the longer ones a lot of peeps appreciate it if there is a 15 minute break taken around the halfway point so everyone can do some extended selling/crafting or take a RT break.
I find that there's a paradox when it comes to estimating PuG task force time. When you have a team of people honestly willing to commit to say 6 hours to do Positron, you end up with great players and as a result it only takes 3 hours. But when you get a bunch of people expecting to do it in 3 hours, that's when it always ends up taking 6 hours (assuming it doesn't fall apart at Rollister). Anyone else have this sense?
Great and friendly guide!
One thing i'd like to add is the level-differences.
The TF scales its difficulty according to the highest level member of the TF. So...
If you're a level 16, doing the level 15-20 TF, and you have 4 other level 16's on your team... Avoid getting that level 19+, or you'll find yourself in over your head.
I've seen a TF break apart because the leader was asked to let some friend join the TF, only to find out that said friend was level 30, while all 5 other members of the team were 16-18(Synapse TF).
This made it very difficult for the leader to find members for the team, and the TF broke up eventually.
Mains (Freedom) @Auroxis
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Pelvic Thunder - SS/Elec/Mu Brute
Sorajin - Elec/Nin Stalker
Neuropain - Sonic/Mental/Elec Blaster
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While the Statesman TF may NEED a strong tanker, just to hold onto Lord Recluse long enough to bring the towers down, I've never run across ANY OTHER TF that "required" a certain type of character.
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Untrue. The Statesman TF can be accomplished with a good illusionist who can taunt with phantom army. Unless they've changed this recently and did away with the ability of PA to taunt. I've run several STFs with only an illusionist as the taunter. The STF doesn't need a tank.
[/ QUOTE ]Technically, you'd still have a contanker. :P
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True dat.
Hell, with the right enemies, my Force Field Defender can tank just about anything, so I'm the "tanker" often times.
[/ QUOTE ]Trust me, I know all about Bubbletanking. Did it on a couple of praetorians with my controller when the SR scrapper got nailed badly by the streakbreaker, and we had no rezzes (grav/ff, grav/kin SKed up, and claws/sr).
Originally Posted by Back Alley Brawler
Did you just use "casual gamer" and "purpled-out warshade" in the same sentence?
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I find that there's a paradox when it comes to estimating PuG task force time. When you have a team of people honestly willing to commit to say 6 hours to do Positron, you end up with great players and as a result it only takes 3 hours. But when you get a bunch of people expecting to do it in 3 hours, that's when it always ends up taking 6 hours (assuming it doesn't fall apart at Rollister). Anyone else have this sense?
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That doesn't surprise me, actually. People who are willing to commit to a TF for 6 hours have enough patience to listen to directions and look at something other than the next mob standing next to them, so they're more likely to play well together and be successful.
Nice work on getting PUGs through those, OP, I would have expected it to be hard to find people to run those on a whim unless they were badge collectors.
I'm still nervous about team leading, but you give me hope that, perhaps a PuG will do the job.
A note about alt-tabbing: I've found that using alt-tab with City of Heroes works much better when you run it in Windowed mode (found under the graphics tab under options, it has a list of resolutions to set to, one of which is "Windowed"). Full-screen mode will give me a slight delay on each alt-tab as the computer switches resolutions or whatever it's doing, and switching to windowed mode makes it much smoother and allows the kind of frequent alt-tabbing that Philotic describes. Plus CoH won't minimize if I alt-tab while it's in windowed mode, so I can keep looking at the game even if there are smaller windows on top of it.
YMMV, other OS/hardware/software setups might work differently.
You can also keep the game at full screen and just set the resolution to be exactly the same as your desktop resolution.
At least, that's what I do. Then, when you alt-tab, no resolution change.
Just had to add this:
over the weekend i was in 2 katie's TF and 1 ITF .. all PUG. and all extremly succesfull ( infact i was amazed at how fast each was done )
i've never been on a full katie task force befor.. and the two group i was in did 'em both in around 24-25 min .. i was told thats very fast )
have to remark in ITF i did sunday ( 2hr 14 mins i think .. i know it's done faster.. but consider the group make-up we had )
1 ice tank
4 scrappers ( didn't catch type.. one was a db thoo )
1 TA defender
2 archer blaster.
you got it .. not one healer ( thoo i'm sure the TA was very helpful , and scrappers might have has willpower,dark, or regen but that only helped them. )
good job to all thos PUG's .. you'll soon be getting a good reputation.
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If you're a level 16, doing the level 15-20 TF, and you have 4 other level 16's on your team... Avoid getting that level 19+, or you'll find yourself in over your head.
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I would ordinarily let this slide, but since this is a guide, I need to point out that this is not true for most tfs. In fact it's the exception, not the rule. The big 6 tfs (for the accolade) are hard capped. You can bring 8 level 15s to Synapse. Good luck against the 20s you will be fighting.
Respec trials are different, I hear Moonfire is different. ITF scales for sure. Otherwise, you better invite that higher level or you'll struggle.
I made the following comments in another thread and Phil asked me to include them here, so I shall:
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1) I like to actually begin the search at level 50. Many 50s put "Looking for Posi" in their search comments. Getting 50s helps because these are folks that a) want to do it fast and b) should be proficient with their char.
2) I like to make it crystal clear that anyone exemping does not get xp. This is just of those points of failure that I see cause premature attrition.
3) Your guide is very upbeat. There's a dark side to effectively running a tf as well. Sometimes (and it's fortunately rare) you have to kick someone. Sometimes you have to nudge someone that seems to be going afk once they enter the mission, but miraculously are able to hit the exit button right on time.
Also, selfishly speaking, I like to begin recruiting what will most accentuate the character I'm playing. For example, with a kin, I first try to recruit debuffers with -Res and scrappers.
Obviously you have to make compromises as you go, but you might as well start with the ideal (according to you).
Still, that's a very nice guide that I think any tf leader should read.
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I would ordinarily let this slide, but since this is a guide, I need to point out that this is not true for most tfs. In fact it's the exception, not the rule.
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Good thing I didn't write that and it's not in my guide then.
Love the guide, fantastic stuff. I have been trying to get Quarterfield done for ages...but no one runs it with me.
Congrats on the successful runs!
Made some modifications so that it's a regular teaming guide, and I also cleaned up a few dirty sections. I think I like the way it looks right now for the most part.
To the smart-*** that posted this:
Guide to Successful Teams 10-14-2009 06:31 PM lol you call this an update, you don't get a Task recipe for doing task anymore FNEE
Number 1: You CAN get a Task recipe for doing a task, if that's what you CHOOSE to use your merits for. So my statement was not false.
Number 2: Exactly how many guides have YOU contributed to help your fellow player, oh random negative repper?
I thought so.
Nice guide! I just stumbled on this.
As someone who has been playing almost a year now almost exclusively with pick-up groups, I can say you nailed it. You give some pointers that I hadn't tried or experimented with yet, particularly with the search window. It's kinda funny... I tried the method of using their character name just last night (as you said, "people love to hear their own name") and it worked like a charm.
Super guide, perfect comic, and thanks!
(ed. to remove 'reference' from 'perfect comic reference'. Thanks to Westley for the comics thread link - hilarious!)
To the smart-*** that posted this:
Guide to Successful Teams 10-14-2009 06:31 PM lol you call this an update, you don't get a Task recipe for doing task anymore FNEE |
(Of course what I continue to hope for is a "Team LFM" function since some people just won't form their own teams no matter what; but that's another subject entirely.)
Freedom: Blazing Larb, Fiery Fulcrum, Sardan Reborn, Arctic-Frenzy, Wasabi Sam, Mr Smashtastic.
Table of Contents
- Preamble
- My Credentials
- Preparation
- Getting the Team
- Keeping the Team
- Success and Follow-up
Preamble"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all teams are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Team Leaders are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Team Leader becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to leave the team with proper notice, and to form their OWN Team, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness."
-Jefferson Thomas IV, Evil Mastermind from the Eighth Dimension
My Credentials
The reality of the existing game community has caused certain people to start calling the game a "Ghost Town". This is mostly because A) Server loads [those little dots] almost never turn red anymore because we now have much MORE powerful servers than we ever had before that can handle a bigger load, B) Instanced missions are more attractive than street sweeping so few are standing around outside and C) The community has moved away from the model of gathering in Atlas Park and forming teams with whoever is shouting over Broadcast.
Now if you want a team, you need to FORM YOUR OWN DAMN TEAM. Here, I hope this comic will illustrate it a little better:
This belief is B.S., pure and simple. The game is NOT a "Ghost Town" and you CAN get a team EASILY. ESPECIALLY with the new Super Sidekicking System, which allows ANY group of characters to team together and still earn XP no matter what their level ranges.
I just spent 45 levels running my own FULL PuGs (That's Pick Up Groups) full of villains of random archetypes on a server that was NOT Freedom or Virtue. I have so far had NO problem "getting a team". How? Well that's what this guide is here for.
So who am I, to be so arrogant and fly in the face of "common knowledge"? The short answer is that I'm a five year veteran of the game.
The long answer is that I am, the writer/editor of The Combat Handbook, where I showed that even veteran players can still learn something new, and The Force Fielder's Bible, where I proved that a set that "has only 3 useful powers" is actually a set where EVERY power can be an amazing addition to your arsenal, with some creative thinking.
People need to think outside of the standard path, and apparently I'm the one that need to smack them around and show them that other path. So here we go.
Preparation
So, how do I do it? Well the first rule of being a successful leader is to plan. This is DOUBLY true when you are running a pick up group. Why? Because most of the people that will accept your invite don't want to mess around, they want to PLAY, and you are an unknown quantity to them. They do NOT want to stand around waiting for this or that. As such, YOU need to be the glue that holds the whole thing together and YOU need to be prepared. You are hiring them for their talents, you are hiring them to do THEIR jobs of being good players. YOUR job is to keep the team together and running smoothly. Here is what you need to do to prepare: Getting the Team
Now it's time to put together an AWESOME team! Which is.... any team!
Keeping the Team
Now you have 7 other players ready to go, right? Well, they are on your TEAM at least.
This special little section is for Task Forces: Now back to teaming in general... Success and Follow-up
So you did it! You managed to put together a motley crew of misfits and run them through a bunch of missions! You get a cookie! Now that the team is over, because you've got to go or something, you all might want to celebrate. Sing Kumbaya, take group photos, exchange /friends lists or add some new global friends. Make use of the new Ratings and Notes system so that when you run across these guys in the future, you'll remember what you did with them. Most important of all, make sure to say thank you to the team before leaving the team. Offer to pass the star to someone else. If no one answers, just shrug, thank them once more and be on your way. Who knows, maybe someday you'll have a whole supergroup or coalition of people that you've teamed with that all remember your great and noble leadership.
Playing this game mostly on Pick up Groups, and more recently falling into the role of team leader has proven a few things to me:
- You can take ANY 8 random players and successfully complete some of the hardest stuff in the game.
- There are ALWAYS more people to fill up your ranks if you follow the advice in this guide.
- And finally... being a team leader means you're NEVER without a team. So LEAD!
So, LEAD. And help this City of Wallflowers become a City of Awesome!