Discussion: Full Powerset Proliferation Revealed
By
13th_Stranger,
Posted on: 2008-03-28 11:16 in News, Events and Announcement Discussion
Just a bit of a positive note to talk about heroes getting all the "good" powers and villains getting screwed. Out of the announced sets, there is one, maybe two heroes I might try out. One is the psi blaster, because I love psi but the disappointing damage on a dom is underwhelming. Don't worry though, this is one psi blaster who only pve's. As for the villains, there are at least three matched sets I'm gonna roll, not counting the two veats. Personally, I like storm, so storm/elec corr works great for me. Stone doms might be alright if they tweak the colors a bit so they're not so blah. Elec/Elec stalker might be fun too. All the naysayers that are saying that this set won't add up or just fail, remember that noone has seen the power lists or their descriptions. We don't know how these will shape up, or even how they'll change from closed to open to live. I for one love storm because it's unique. Mind you it takes some skill to just not knockback all the melee ATs targets all the time, but all ATs and sets have to keep certain things in mind when playing on a team.
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Tanker:
Black Brawler - Dark/Super Strength A mutant who discovered that he has super strength only when its dark. So he created a device that creates a dark armor around his body so he can use his strength powers in the daylight.
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Just had to QR this one, awesome idea!! =)
Galactron - 48 Inv/SS, Samurai Gecko - 50 Kat/Reg, Moulinet - 50 DB/WP, Galactress - 50 Fire/Kin, Miss Mayhem - 50 Rad/Psi, PyroWulf - 50 WP/Fire, Solis Invicti 50 Fire/Fire, Utahraptor - 50 Claws/SR
"You can't fix stupid. Dumb people breed more than smart people. Idiocracy wasn't a comedy, it was prophecy." - Bill Z Bubba
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I'll say it again... THIS IS JUST THE START.
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Actually....considering there will most likely be only one or two updates between this and CO's coming out party this may be the only round of PP many of us will see. 
Is anyone ever happy? I just read the first and last page of comments and found two completely positive comments and a couple more somewhat positive comments.
Free stuff is good. More options is good. I am very happy with the game. I am very happy to get new free stuff every few months. Thanks to the devs for all the work and the continual impovements in play experience. I LOVE THIS GAME!!!
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This paying customer is truly depressed and let-down...way to make heroes the focus of this game...you better make I13 about villains and villains only
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Or what? You're going to take your ball and go home?
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Word of advice devs...hire a seperate team for villains...if you truly think that this is a seperate game, heroes shouldnt develop for villains...
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Why because some 14yo little twit with no concept thinks he's entitled or owed something.
Word of advice kid, learn to use proper tone. Devs don't owe you a damned thing. You're here by choice. Deal.
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LoL... he is whining about whining.... good job 
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lol yeah, theres always a few 
I'm actually kinda excited about the elec/elec stalker, although from what I've read I may be a minority. The real qeustion in that set is what powers are gonna be dropped for the Assassin strike, placate, hide, etc.
As for the masterminds, I think Storm will be a nice set, although (speaking from experience) finding a team won't be any harder then it is normally with a mastermind (or several other AT's at that). The plant controler sounds really fun, as does the thermal rad set.
I am kinda surprised there wasn't an ice stalker set (keep in mind I have one at level 16). The blaster ice manipulation could be adjusted I would think. The Assassin strike could be done with an Ice sword or greater ice sword. Personally I'd say drop ice patch for the AS strike power, other then that the set could mostly left intact. It'd be different and the effect powers (immob, slow and sleep) would actually give a stalker a chance to get away if need be.
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AWWWWWW come on, any chance we can get poison in there for controllers. Thermal is just almost an exact copy of empathy with a tad of sonic lets get something new. Besides it themes with plant nicely anyways PLEASE.
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Judging from your post there, you clearly have no idea what you're talking about nor have you played a thermal corruptor.
An empathy's Fortitude and Clear mind is nothing compared to Forge and Thaw.
Not to mention, Fortitude grants, defense(and this is defense to ALL, smashing, lethal, cold, fire, psi, etc), damage, and To Hit, AND it an be powerboosted.
Forge grants damage and to hit and cannot be powerboosted.
Clear Mind grants resistance to Immob, hold, disorient, sleep, confuse, fear and it grants +perception. Seeing as how this stacks, you can be at the perception cap with 2 applications of CM.
Thaw however does not grant any sort of perception at all.
Also, Empathy has 2 single target heals, one is an "oh crap" heal that heals for 90% of a targets HP. So just about anyone can be kept alive for quite a while if you keep switching between heal other and absorb pain.
Thermal has only the equivalent to heal other and cauterize, and even at level 50, the heal values are not close.
Empathy also has the ability the buff others and the caster. Using Recovery aura and regeneration aura which makes the caster more survivable in pve AND pvp.
Thermal just has shields and cannot cast on themselves (obviously) and without a RA like power, Thermals are very end heavy.
I'm not trying to say Thermal should have RA, just pointing out that there are differences.
Also, Empathy is solely an all buff powerset, while thermal radiation, has buffs but also has debuffs with melt armor and heat exhaustion.
Next time, play the AT/Powersets before you jump to conclusion that they're the same, and judging from your sig, you haven't.
And no, heroes have gotten more than enough don't need poison. If anything Villains should've gotten empathy.
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Wow, you took that WAY too specifically. It is an almost exact copy of empathy PLAYSTYLEWISE. Only difference is that the "defense" portion of fortitude is resistance and can stay on all teammates. Forge is the same as fortitude -defense (which got spread out as the shields) And yes, you can boost forge with powerboost (to hit) perhaps you should rethink before you post.
Aborb pain, well since its a cotnroller secondary, i don't even really count it as for any GOOD controller they skip this power most of the time anyways. Ally rez, thermal version is better but again, plays the same exact role. Thaw, almost the same as clear mind, only instead of perception it has resist to slow and cold, very fair tradeoff. Again, exact same role it plays.
The only really different kind of power are heat exhaustion and melt armor. But for the rest of the set playing nearly identical, and how late those last two powers come for the most of the characters life, yes i can say that it is the most redundant set that trollers could have gotten. Not to mention that Heat exhaustion is a debuff but plays the same role of having enemies hurt the team less. And melt armor is on a 2.5 minute timer so its not like it is a constant power to use to change playstyle that much.
And news flash, not EVERY character you have can fit in that tiny sig. For some reason that's all that it allows me to place.
Plasmic's Guide to Sonic/Mental
Plasmic's Guide to Regeneration
Plasmic Fire - 50 Fire/Rad Victory Server
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I feel.... somewhat...
jipped...
As a scrapper lover anyway. I mean fire/fire?! you coudl j ust have gotten a tank. It honestly isnt that big of a leap. I was really hoping for Energy Aura to go with the already present Energy Melee.
Also I am dieing for Ninjitsu scrapper!
Tanks... okay dark/dark is nice but how about Electric/Electric?!!
Arg
Sigh...
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Yeah, thats about the EXACT sentiments of about 90% of the playerbase. /agree, and have no freaking idea how the devs messed up so badly on these ones. 
I would have liked energy or electric armor. But personally the best primary for scrappers would have been mace IMO. Fire has nothing that helps the scrapper survive, which is what kinda defines the scrapper primaries by having some kind of mitigation as a secondary effect. Be it knockdown, to hit debuff, stun, hold, end drain, something. Fire has nothing :/. And as far as damage, its not that much better than spines, and spines has nice slows and knockdowns. /FTL
Plasmic's Guide to Sonic/Mental
Plasmic's Guide to Regeneration
Plasmic Fire - 50 Fire/Rad Victory Server
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Alright, I have just a few things to add to this thread...
From here on out, and complaints made about whos not getting what, or, i wanted a blue one mommy! Are all considered shreiks from a little girl.
The only thing anyone can complaine about is that the devs are slow in releasing content, other than that, we all will be satisfied.....eventually.
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True and not true. Its a BIG part of what is released now vs later. Because it makes a huge difference in knowing what toons to make now vs what combinations we will get. Especially for those who dont want to redo sets it really affects which kinds we make. And for the sets we didnt get yet it makes it hard to pair up what we got now and plan out toons.
IT would be ok, if they at least told us exactly what will be coming over and when so we can actually PLAN out characters out. (as far as what we didnt get goes yet that is). For instance, i have a very hopeful idea for an earth/poison controller. But beforehand i had one for an earth/sonic. Now that i know we wont get poison, i want to do the earth sonic. But honestly, knowing we "might" get poison, im forced to hold off playing the earth/sonic till i know for sure. Because if we do get poison, ill then be VERY pissed off that i already have my earth controller, as i can find another primary i'd want with sonic, but earth is the main primary i'd want with poison. But if we dont get poison, then earth is the main primary i want with sonic right now as well. So you see not knowing REALLY screws up me and many others with planning what kinds of toons to make. And nothing worse than being "forced" into a combo that you dont like because its the only options left without replaying sets for the most part.
Just think about when dual blades and willpower came out. Most everyone made a db/wp or wp/db, not just to try the new sets, but mostly because they have already played every other primary and secondary available to scraps/tanks so they were pretty much forced to. At least if we knew what was coming in the future NOW, we could at least plan for it when it gets here.
Plasmic's Guide to Sonic/Mental
Plasmic's Guide to Regeneration
Plasmic Fire - 50 Fire/Rad Victory Server
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lol if you think i don't know what I'm talking about. We can meet in the arena anytime buddy, care to test your game knowledge and experience in a 10 minute match?
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If your argument is that villains are underpowered in PVP, then beating a hero in PVP is a lousy way to make your point.
Just sayin'.
J
I really want to know if any of the Devs actually play Villains? Do they realize that PVP will be finished now and that heroes will just have to fight against each other.. Don't get me wrong I love that they are giving us new power sets but really did the Devs not look at this on paper and say weight why give Heroes Therm and lets not give Villains Emp. It just does not make sense. I will still play the game but Devs really need to take a long look at what they are doing to the villain community.
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Actually, what they should have done was just put up the list of ported sets when they announced proliferation. A lot of folks were speculating on what was going where and getting their hopes up, which naturally led to disappointment when a wanted set turned out to not be on the port list. Just telling us that a surprise was coming would have just had people speculating on what the surprise could be and would have it's own buildup of hoped for additions and accompanying letdown when the truth came out.
What they really need to do is just stop trying to be all cryptic and 'nudge nudge wink wink' when they make announcements. I believe the majority of us are most likely adults capable of being dealt with in a straightforward manner. Just dropping hints and letting peoples' imaginations run rampant with speculation is just setup for a lot of folks to be disappointed and a backlash of complaints from that disappointment should not be a surprise.
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Someone (Lighthouse or Ex Libris) should force all the marketing people (assuming more than one) into a meeting, and have them write these paragraphs out a few dozen times for their complete PR nightmare (which is what this is).
[u]None[u] of this needed to happen. This time the attempt at marketing hype backfired big time.
Triumph: White Succubus: 50 Ill/Emp/PF Snow Globe: 50 Ice/FF/Ice Strobe: 50 PB Shi Otomi: 50 Ninja/Ninjistu/GW Stalker My other characters
Couple points:
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IT would be ok, if they at least told us exactly what will be coming over and when so we can actually PLAN out characters out. (as far as what we didnt get goes yet that is).
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You can't seriously expect them to tell you that. MMO Game developers never give exact times (unless they are idiots), because they don't have control of funding, manpower, deadlines, QA, etc. The publisher can't tell you that either because something that might be done might get blocked by either lack of resources or manpower, or QA might find a horrible bug that wipes out the database and that would push back any release.
If NCNC could tell you exactly when a powerset would be ported, I would think the team would instead use that ability to win some super lottery instead and leave.
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And nothing worse than being "forced" into a combo that you dont like because its the only options left without replaying sets for the most part.
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Give me a break, "Forced"? Someone goes to your house and breaks your leg (or worse) just because you didn't make a certain combo? If they had the manpower for that, they would have more powersets ready.
Triumph: White Succubus: 50 Ill/Emp/PF Snow Globe: 50 Ice/FF/Ice Strobe: 50 PB Shi Otomi: 50 Ninja/Ninjistu/GW Stalker My other characters
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I really want to know if any of the Devs actually play Villains? Do they realize that PVP will be finished now and that heroes will just have to fight against each other.. Don't get me wrong I love that they are giving us new power sets but really did the Devs not look at this on paper and say weight why give Heroes Therm and lets not give Villains Emp. It just does not make sense. I will still play the game but Devs really need to take a long look at what they are doing to the villain community.
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Positron plays a Dominator, Castle plays several archetypes on both sides, Ex Libris plays villains.
As to taking a look at what they are doing, I can tell you what they are doing: Making more power sets available to all archetypes.
People need to take a step back and see this is only the first round of power set expansions.
As a side note, I doubt that certain power sets will ever cross over. Empathy and Poison for instance. Both are thematically tied to their faction.
Triumph: White Succubus: 50 Ill/Emp/PF Snow Globe: 50 Ice/FF/Ice Strobe: 50 PB Shi Otomi: 50 Ninja/Ninjistu/GW Stalker My other characters
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well at least it's obivous that you guys hate the villains now.
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You know after reading this entire thread, and several others, I have to say something:
Villains-only players are the biggest bunch of crybabies I have seen in ANY game forum. If the developers truly hated villains, they would not make sure that the issues had stuff that both "sides" could use. They don't need to.
They could stop all development of everything red side and devote 100% of their resources blue side, but they do not.
Worse, all these calls of "Devs hate CoV" come before a single player has seen Issue 12 as the game is still not even to the closed beta stage.
Whine moar.
The developers might not hate self proclaimed "CoV-Only" players, but after putting up with all the whining in the last 3-4 free issues, I would not blame them one bit.
[/ QUOTE ]Well said!!
Prometheus: ... so what I told you was true, from a certain point of view.
Me: From a certain point of view?
Prometheus: You're going to find that many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on your point of view.
Me: You're right about that. Power Blast is very pretty from a certain point of view. But that point of view is not head-on. <Kaboom> - Arcanaville.
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Players that actually tested ice armor and ice melee proved that the sets were perfectly capable of generating fury.
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Actually no, they sucked for generating fury in COV closed beta. That is why they where replaced before the closed beta ever went open. I know I played with them and they sucked.
But it's MY sadistic mechanical monster and I'm here to make sure it knows it. - Girl Genius
List of Invention Guides
didnt they also have storm for corr in closed beta i remember someone mentioning it?
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didnt they also have storm for corr in closed beta i remember someone mentioning it?
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No there was no storm villain side in the closed beta. The only sets removed and replaced where Ice Melee and Ice Armor.
But it's MY sadistic mechanical monster and I'm here to make sure it knows it. - Girl Genius
List of Invention Guides
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well at least it's obivous that you guys hate the villains now.
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You know after reading this entire thread, and several others, I have to say something:
Villains-only players are the biggest bunch of crybabies I have seen in ANY game forum. If the developers truly hated villains, they would not make sure that the issues had stuff that both "sides" could use. They don't need to.
They could stop all development of everything red side and devote 100% of their resources blue side, but they do not.
Worse, all these calls of "Devs hate CoV" come before a single player has seen Issue 12 as the game is still not even to the closed beta stage.
Whine moar.
The developers might not hate self proclaimed "CoV-Only" players, but after putting up with all the whining in the last 3-4 free issues, I would not blame them one bit.
[/ QUOTE ]Well said!!
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Please don't make generalizations about a community which is only minimally represented by those who post on the forums. Also, please don't lose the forest while focusing on a few trees. In any group, there is bound to be some jerk who runs around and yells for immediate gratification or demands things to be tailored to his specifc needs. Just because he's an idiot doesn't mean the whole group is. And it doesn't mean that the group lacks legitimate concerns.
Hysterical speculation is counterproductive, but thinking out loud and trying to look at how things *might* work is part of the reason we have forums. I've read plenty of well reasoned posts about the possible implications regarding this first wave of proliferation. SOME players may threaten to leave without seeing Day One of Beta. MANY want to test this out before making any solid conclusions. So please don't lump every player with concerns about proliferation into the category of "crybabies." Just because they don't share your opinion doesn't mean they're whining. Anymore than someone who doesn't think the same way I do is an idiot.
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Constructively though - I don't think this is the end of power proliferation.
BaB stated that others were possible but would require more dev time to port. That probably means that more stuff is in the works, but this is all the "easy to get out" stuff. Honestly, if one plans to leave the game because of the initial offering, your probably throwing the baby out with the bathwater.
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hmms throwing baby out with bathwater...what a brilliant idea..can I join your VG?
muhhahahhaahaha
"...well I have wrestled with reality for thirty-five years, Doctor and I am happy to state I finally won out over it." Elwood P Dowd (from the movie Harvey)
Big love for /Storm MMs. I want to make a Thugs/Storm and try to physically vibrate the internet with 6 henchmen, all the Storm powers, and Gang War.
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Makes videos & podcasts about reviewing toys, covering conventions, and more at Vangelus.ca
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Players that actually tested ice armor and ice melee proved that the sets were perfectly capable of generating fury.
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Actually no, they sucked for generating fury in COV closed beta. That is why they where replaced before the closed beta ever went open. I know I played with them and they sucked.
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That sounds more like an issue with the Primary being able to attack enough to sustain fury. Slows have zero effect on the ability of the ability of the Brute to continue to attack to build fury. I mean, Dark Armour has two ways of completely stopping most attacks, but I've never seen people that use Oppressive Gloom on their Brute(very few) and not have any trouble building fury. Infact, I've teamed with a friend on my Mind/Ice Dom and my Fire/Cold Corr with then on their Brute, and my slows had no affect whatsoever on their ability to maintain a normal amount of Fury. Besides, if slows really hurt Brutes, wouldn't Holds be even worse? What about Fears? And Confuses? I've never seen a Brute deny teaming with Dominators cuz "they hurt Fury". 
I'm very disappointed....very....was wanting a ice/elec tank so bad....
No way in hell am I making a dark armor tank....no thank you man....
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So is this the outlook for "new" powers to come?. Crossovers? ... Is it too much to ask to come up with some not many, but some ideas?
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Uh, yeah. It's exactly what they said they were giving us: they were porting powersets from one Archetype to another, crossing some over between Hero and Villain, starting with the ones that required the least artwork re-design. What were you expecting?
And yes, it was too much to come up with "new" ideas, considering that they're already working on Shield characters AND the two new Villain epic archetypes. Is five new powersets not enough for you?
They also said they had a choice: design 1 Mastermind powerset from the ground up, or proliferate 20 powersets. You'd think that giving out TWENTY previously unavailable powersets would have made many more people HAPPY than just giving out ONE.