Official Thread for Issue 7 Badges
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First off, as to why the devs chose to make prestige and infamy mutually exclusive is simple. In all comics where a superhero or villian was a member of a group, that individual would still go off and do things on their own. I mean from purely a comic book standpoint, ever hero has their own comic 4 times a month (or so) and then they appear with the SG once or twice a month.
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Several heroes don't have solo comics. Very few have weekly ones anymore (I think Spider-Man might be the last one with DC moving over to biweekly schedules for Superman and Batman).
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OK. So the several heroes who dont have solo comics are those individuals choosing not to leave SG mode. I was guessing on the number of comics per week, so if what you say is true, I stand corrected. It still shows the separation of SG vs. Solo play and why you earn prestige and influence separately
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Thus why you must choose to help your SG or fight on your own. If you help your SG, the SG as a whole gets the credit, and thus you get no real individual 'acknowledgement' of your actions, thus no influence.
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Admittedly, this example's going to be from a terrible comic, but The Death of Superman proves this wrong. Superman led the league at the time, was only one of several casualties, and got most of the credit.
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While Superman led the JLA, he was NOT in SG mode at the time of this. In Justice League of America # 69, Superman only appears on the scene in the final page. Immediately following was Superman #74, thus a solo comic. Now in #74, it stars what is left of the JLA, and by mid book, really the JLA isnt in the battle, and Superman is fighting by himself. He really isnt gaining prestige for the JLA anymore. Hes gaining prestige for himself. Thus why hes given the credit. He wasnt in SG mode. He fought for nearly 4+ comics and 60+ miles with him. Sure he had a few helpers (lvl 50 Scrapper, called Supergirl LFT), but anyone who helped quickly was killed. Even Superman realized that PUGs suck.
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Now why should contacts require infamy badges? Individual contacts are looking at YOU, and how well YOU have done things. They really aren't interested in how your VG works together, as they want to hire YOU! A TV wants to do a report on YOU. Thus YOU need enough infamy, aka personal prestige, to warrant a TV show about YOU. Thus why it makes sense to require infamy for contacts. In fact these contacts are specifically looking to be sure YOU have done something along similar lines to help them.
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Since the VG doesn't get the other badges, either, I don't see why infamy's involved, particularly not to the degree that it requires Midas Touch rather than Mr. Big.
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I personally dont understand the first second up to
infamys involved. What other badges? As for the degree of Mr. Big vs Midas Touch, Im sorry thats just a whine. You dont want to work for Midas Touch so you want the requirements easier. Story-wise, the TV is looking for a sensational star, and they believe the lowest level to accept are those with the infamy level of Midas Touch. I understand your opinion that its too hard, but my opinion is, you are whining about it.
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Is it unfair? Of course, but then again no superhero or villian ever had a fair life. They are ALWAYS torn between tasks and who or what they should do. You want that TV spot, you best make a name for yourself or you are not getting it. You want that badge of honor, you will need to sacrifice other things to get it. A main part of being super are that scarifices, both personal and in the field, you must make to survive and get what you want. If there were no sacrifices or choices, comics would be boring.
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The same's true if comics spend an unduly lengthy amount of time just to advance the plot. Grinds aren't any more interesting in the game than they are in the comics.
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And I agree grind badges are horrible.
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Now last point, why make it unfair from a gameplay perspective? They are not. You want that special power, you will need to work for it. Nothing is earned for free, and personally, the harder and more challenging a badge is to earn, the happier I am. 1000 pillboxes? Holey Toledo Batman! but I will earn it, and feel really good when I do. You want a special accolade, you best be prepared to work for it. Don't want to be humble and die a few times for an accolade. Don't. But stop complaining that you don't want to earn THAT badge to earn THAT power. The Devs reasons are sound, both in game and out, and just be thankful you are getting powers above and beyond the ones you get normally!
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...okay, ewok, I respect you and all, but I don't agree with any of this, at all.
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If you dont agree with any of this you must agree with:
<ul type="square">[*] You want that special power and dont believe you should work for it OR you dont want that special powers, and wont work for it.[*] There is something earned for free (I cant think of anything, can you?)[*] When you earn a badge, you dont feel really good. (I dont know how you feel, but not really good.)[*] You want that special accolade, but dont expect to work for it OR you dont want that special accolade.[*] The Devs reasons are not sound, either both in and out of game, or both.[*] You should not be thankful for getting powers above and beyond those you normally get.[/list]
I cant see any other options if you dont agree with the above paragraph. And if you do believe the above, thats fine. Your opinion is just as valid as my opinion.
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It's one thing to say that badges require some element of effort. It's quite another to say 1000 pill boxes that give no credit to anyone else on the team is reasonable, and that since you like it, we should either like it, too, or just shut up about it. By that logic, you might as well make TV about the Empathy badge.
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Never did I say I LIKE 1000 pillboxes. I think it is way too much to get solo for a team effort. I think 1000 would be a grind, and will take at best 50+ hours of playing in RV to get, if you got a pillbox a minute. And thats IF you get them. More like 500+ hours to me. And they should count for the team, since a team is needed to take them over. Of course if the TV were linked to Empathy, I wouldnt mind
already Empath :P
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The problem that I have with TV is that it's almost everything I see wrong with the game, rolled up into one package. We've got a grind badge with no bar to unlock content and an accolade that heroes get 10-15 levels earlier, with most of the proponents admitting that it's probably a contact most people will only unlock at level 50. Despite this, we still have about five levels of the game pre-40 where it's very common to run out of contact missions. I doubt anyone would have problems with it if there were no content shortages earlier in levels, or if the accolade were not tied to it.
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Infamy is a grind badge? Since when is playing the game a grind??? You gain infamy by playing the game, no more, no less. So you are complaining that in order to do the TV contacts you must play the game? Oh please, the horror of it all!!!! To play the TV you must sacrifice time playing with your VG to play solo. Welcome to the wonderful life of a super-powered individual.
As for timing of Accolades, that is up to the devs. I have no opinion on it. They supplied 2 hidden contacts per 5 levels. If you run out of contact missions, go do paper missions and PVP missions or get a PUG. My opinion is the devs didnt want to put so much content in that a single toon couldnt experience it all. Too much and people will complain in that way so its a very fine line. Also, as you stated before, this is a multi-player game. You gain levels a lot quicker by teaming up, and so if you ran out of missions while soloing, you just didnt team up.
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As it is? You may thoroughly enjoy grinds, but I loathe them. If I feel the devs are doing something unreasonably grinding in nature, I'll speak up. I don't think it's fair or logical for the devs to put the TV in as is, since they've got gaping holes elsewhere that need filling. Likewise, I don't think the devs should put in overlong grind badges, not only because the devs have said time and again that they don't want to reward unfun behavior, but because this game's got enough unenjoyable elements as it is (particularly in PvP zones).
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Please do not put words into my mouth. I dont like grinds anymore than you or others (and never said I did), but I dont look gift horses in the mouth. I agree with the pillbox issue as well as the heavies being grind badges, but all badges are meant to be earned through normal game play. We scream because we want to earn them quick, and circumvent normal game play. I wont really complain on the amount, as normal game play is the way to they were meant to be earned. It may take 2 years, but they can be earned that way.
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Please do not put words into my mouth. I dont like grinds anymore than you or others (and never said I did)
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You're a self admitted badge wh0re. A LOT of the badges require very extensive grinds. Therefore it is not unreasonable to make the assumption that either you like grinding or you dislike it a lot less than most people. It may not be necessarily accurate, but it's not unreasonable for people to make that assumption.
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You're a self admitted badge wh0re.
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Thank you.
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A LOT of the badges require very extensive grinds. Therefore it is not unreasonable to make the assumption that either you like grinding or you dislike it a lot less than most people. It may not be necessarily accurate, but it's not unreasonable for people to make that assumption.
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You are correct. I do not mind grind badges as much as most people. To assume to that I like them, however, is still to assume (you know how that saying goes).
Again the only reason some people can tolerate 'grind' badges more than others is that the tolerant ones are either 1) Way OCD, or 2) realize that badges were not meant to be hunted for. They were meant to be earned through normal play. It's our decision to hunt for them and that makes them a 'grind'
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You're a self admitted badge wh0re.
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Thank you.
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A LOT of the badges require very extensive grinds. Therefore it is not unreasonable to make the assumption that either you like grinding or you dislike it a lot less than most people. It may not be necessarily accurate, but it's not unreasonable for people to make that assumption.
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You are correct. I do not mind grind badges as much as most people. To assume to that I like them, however, is still to assume (you know how that saying goes).
Again the only reason some people can tolerate 'grind' badges more than others is that the tolerant ones are either 1) Way OCD, or 2) realize that badges were not meant to be hunted for. They were meant to be earned through normal play. It's our decision to hunt for them and that makes them a 'grind'
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Yeah, I know. And that's why I had the "or dislike them less" clause in there. Personally, I gather badges, but I don't go for the ones that require grinding. What is important to me, though, is content. Having content based on badges that require OR encourage grinding is in my opinion bad.
For example, Doc Buzzsaw/the TV, with their Inf badges. I missed out on Doc Buzzsaw because I didn't find out about the requirement until I was already in the thirties. I got the Bling badge at 32. I technically can't miss out on the TV contact but only doing that contact at 50 kind of defeats the purpose in my opinion.
Another example would be the Slot Machine with the Marcone badge. I grinded for that badge with two others in Port Oakes. It took us around four hours and I really hated it. I liked the contact, but not enough to do that grind again so I basically said that once was enough. Then it turns out that Gangbuster is required for an Accolade. So if any other of my characters want that accolade that gives gameplay effects, I have to do that grind again.
I consider Accolades to essentially be content in a lot of ways because they give actual gameplay effects. Whether it's a passive boost to HP or End or a power on a slow recharge, it still affects my gameplay.
I'm rambling now and I'm not entirely sure where I was going with this post (mostly because I got heavily distracted by work for half an hour or so), so I'm gonna stop here with one final comment. Because you are a badge-wh0re, and because you are willing to tolerate grind doesn't mean that grind is good or even Ok. You're looking at it from one end of the spectrum, other people are looking at it from the other end. One of the best things about CoX in my opinion is there is less grind than other MMO's, or less that feels like grind in it.
Very good points. I definitely can understand your issues with how it is set-up. From that point of view I can understand how if you don't grind for the badges you miss content.
But then again, all of the content you are talking about is secret contacts. There are special contacts, in that you have to find them, and then satisfy a badge requirement to activate their missions. Personally I wish we would never outlevel the ability to take the mission, although you might outlevel the minions inside the mish. That way you still get the content, even though it's not worth much but the souvenir. (I also missed henri on my way up, as I didn't know of him, so I feel your pain there). But for now, those who find the secret contacts and who have the drive and determination to make that contact want to talk to them, get the content. It is still all a matter of sacrificing something to get something else, and the choices you make. I chose to stay in debt from lvl 10-33 just to get all the content at every level range. Others choose to make alts to get the content they missed, others don't care. The choices we make shape our characters, as they should.
Mind if I interject here for a sec?
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If you dont agree with any of this you must agree with:
<ul type="square">[*] You want that special power and dont believe you should work for it OR you dont want that special powers, and wont work for it.[*] There is something earned for free (I cant think of anything, can you?)[*] When you earn a badge, you dont feel really good. (I dont know how you feel, but not really good.)[*] You want that special accolade, but dont expect to work for it OR you dont want that special accolade.[*] The Devs reasons are not sound, either both in and out of game, or both.[*] You should not be thankful for getting powers above and beyond those you normally get.[/list]
I cant see any other options if you dont agree with the above paragraph. And if you do believe the above, thats fine. Your opinion is just as valid as my opinion.
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This is a strawman argument. There can be middle ground between getting something for free and an utterly unreasonable effort required to obtain something that is far from game-breaking. And yes, completely forgoing gaining prestige your supergroup for your entire level 25+ career (or being expected to locate somebody else who does and tag along with them, or spending some unholy amount of time as a malefactor) is NOT reasonable in the face of what heros are required to do to get an equivalent reward.
I agree that some of the better rewards (either in terms of effect on gameplay or in terms of "Look at what I can do!") should require some effort on the part of the player to obtain. The problem is that some of us are prepared to work, but feel that what is required for this contact is not reasonable. While you may think that what is needed to unlock the TV is a fair price to pay for the payoff, I'd wager that a lot of folks do not, including some badge collectors like myself.
Going to skip around here, sorry. Initial post I'd written up was very choppy and repetitive...
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I personally dont understand the first second up to
infamys involved. What other badges?
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Many badges aren't awarded to all members of a group when one achieves its requirements - exploration, history, many achievements. One or several of those, IMO, might be better.
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As for the degree of Mr. Big vs Midas Touch, Im sorry thats just a whine. You dont want to work for Midas Touch so you want the requirements easier. Story-wise, the TV is looking for a sensational star, and they believe the lowest level to accept are those with the infamy level of Midas Touch. I understand your opinion that its too hard, but my opinion is, you are whining about it.
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Okay, I'm going to cut to the chase with another comment you made here...
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Please do not put words into my mouth. I dont like grinds anymore than you or others (and never said I did), but I dont look gift horses in the mouth.
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I'd previously made the mistake of believing that you liked the grinds, due to the following passage in your previous message:
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Nothing is earned for free, and personally, the harder and more challenging a badge is to earn, the happier I am. 1000 pillboxes? Holey Toledo Batman! but I will earn it, and feel really good when I do.
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This is where I made my mistake - I thought this was you stating how much you like the current system, as-is.
Your mistake, however, was in assuming that I just wanted this easier, just so I could get it. This is not the case - I feel that the system is already set up badly enough that almost any change that supports SG/VG mode over individual is for the better, and this is a change directly opposed to that. If this were an accolade requiring, say, all the strike forces completed, I'd have much less of a problem. Similarly, if the infamy badges had progress bars, I'd feel a lot better about it - that way, people can check their progress relative to their leveling, and make a much more informed choice in how they play. Similarly, if there were no badges and only one arc tied in here, I'd not care too much.
Since this is an accolade and a lot of content in a content-deprived game, however, this is going to detract from an already unhealthy set-up for SG/VG play, and it's going to put people on a grind given that they've got to spend an extended amount of time seeking out this badge, without knowing how close they are until they get it.
It's just bad design, IMO.
Badges are not THE game.
They are a nice addition, but they are not THE game.
I like having badges on my toons, because I can judge, just from looking, as to how long i have been on with my various toons.
My lvl 50 Emp does not have isolator, but he has one (and only one) of the Halloween badges.
My lvl 50 scrapper has isolator, but none of the halloween badges as he started on Thanksgiving Day after the event. But he has both versions of the Winter badges (and there is no difference in the name or view of the badge).
There is NO ONE in this enviroment that will ever get 100% of the badges, there is just no way to get them all. Grinding, Lava Pools, Arena, etc.
You want Isolator, but did not know or get it when it came out? harvest the Recluse Victory's single spawn until your fingers bleed.
I have Military Decorations that no one else will ever get.....that's life.
Sometimes, I impress my boss. Sometimes, I impress myself. The rest of the time, I scare people. I can live with that.
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There can be middle ground between getting something for free and an utterly unreasonable effort required to obtain something that is far from game-breaking. And yes, completely forgoing gaining prestige your supergroup for your entire level 25+ career (or being expected to locate somebody else who does and tag along with them, or spending some unholy amount of time as a malefactor) is NOT reasonable in the face of what heros are required to do to get an equivalent reward.
I agree that some of the better rewards (either in terms of effect on gameplay or in terms of "Look at what I can do!") should require some effort on the part of the player to obtain. The problem is that some of us are prepared to work, but feel that what is required for this contact is not reasonable. While you may think that what is needed to unlock the TV is a fair price to pay for the payoff, I'd wager that a lot of folks do not, including some badge collectors like myself.
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Utterly unreasonable effort? It's 20 million infamy. We are not talking about the 1 billion for the Popular badge or anything like that. Hardly unreasonable. It is YOUR choice to stay in SG mode. Nobody is forcing you to do so. You want the immobilize power so much? You gotta get famous on your own. Getting on TV is no less difficult IRL. I think the problem is I'm looking at it from a roleplaying perspective, and you are looking at it from a gameplay perspective. I assume this as you are talking about fair price for the payoff, and I'm talking about it working itself into the story. It seems when it came to contacts they pushed for the badges to be story related, not game play related. Good for them.
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Since this is an accolade and a lot of content in a content-deprived game, however, this is going to detract from an already unhealthy set-up for SG/VG play, and it's going to put people on a grind given that they've got to spend an extended amount of time seeking out this badge, without knowing how close they are until they get it.
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I would love progress bars for every badge. But it seems some badges don't get them. Maybe it's because it's difficult to 'measure' fame so why should you know when you hit the next level of it? Sounds plausible for an in game reason. I'd still like the bar, but if there is an in game reason for it, so be it.
Again, your choice to stay in SG mode, mine not to. I intend on donating infamy to the SG by exchange, to help support. I WILL be putting the effort in to earn the badge and support my SG/VG.
In fact, plenty of people already have Midas Touch even now, so it's not unreasonable or unattainable.
It really comes down to a simple opinion, which badge is best suited for a TV? INHO, it's an infamy badge as infamy = fame.
Hey, believe me, I play this game for the story. Knowing Shane from previous games he's worked on, I had a lot of fun picking out which storylines I knew had to be his. I build a lot of my heros and villains around a background from the character's POV, rather than just picking whatever powers and slot combinations are "best". I try to do storylines on my characters even when I've done those storylines many times before with other characters, because I like reading them.
That said, this is just terrible design. Simply put, you should not have to forsake helping your supergroup advance in order to open up a storyline. The two should not be mutually exclusive, as this is unfair to SGs in a game where things are already stacked against SG advancement. I have no problem with some solo content being mutually exclusive of other solo content, or making it so that it is very hard (or even impossible) for a player to visit all solo content with a single character. THAT is where the tradeoff should be. The TV forces you to either be unfair to yourself, limiting what content you can see for the benefit of your friends, or being unfair to your friends so you can run a couple more missions and get a widget.
Roleplay should always be something you CAN do to add fun to an existing system. However, getting this badge doesn't involve "roleplaying" in any sense of the word, though it can potentially be the result of an avenue of roleplay. Please don't insuiate that this somehow encourages roleplaying, because it really doesn't.
I just found a Firebase Zulu Security Detail badge, but I cannot find the badge in my list of badges. Is this and I7 Badge, or was it introduced earlier?
EDIT: Found it! Achievement: Logged enough time into the Shard to be part of the security detail. Groovy. (Doesn't say how long)
Cyclone Jack
-= idspispopd =-
[size=1]Arc ID: 3155 - Project Prometheus (Seeking Feedback, now with less invalidation)[/size]
As I said before, choose between your VG or your own needs. Supers do this all the time in comics. The game mimics comics.
Ewok, you might want to edit this post so that the second quote is properly attributed to me, not to the other poster.
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I would love progress bars for every badge. But it seems some badges don't get them. Maybe it's because it's difficult to 'measure' fame so why should you know when you hit the next level of it? Sounds plausible for an in game reason. I'd still like the bar, but if there is an in game reason for it, so be it.
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Then let the devs say so.
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Again, your choice to stay in SG mode, mine not to. I intend on donating infamy to the SG by exchange, to help support. I WILL be putting the effort in to earn the badge and support my SG/VG.
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Yes, but it's not remotely equal to the effort or reward that the VG would've gotten otherwise.
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In fact, plenty of people already have Midas Touch even now, so it's not unreasonable or unattainable.
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I'm not arguing that it's unattainable. I'm arguing that, given that SGs and VGs need more support, not less, the devs should consider options that don't lessen the support of an already weaker system.
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It really comes down to a simple opinion, which badge is best suited for a TV? INHO, it's an infamy badge as infamy = fame.
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And in mine, I don't hesitate to point out that there's another badge between Bling and Midas Touch, and that other badges also represent you being well known.
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As I said before, choose between your VG or your own needs. Supers do this all the time in comics. The game mimics comics.
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And it also ignores comics. My character's personally firebombed over two hundred Longbow bases in PvP zones, yet sidekicks are more than a match for me - even when I've beaten them several times over, over my entire career - when in the comics they'd be teaming up to try to take out just me. This is because of mechanics concerns of the devs - mechanics concerns of ours should at the least be considered when making decisions about access to content, too.
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As I said before, choose between your VG or your own needs. Supers do this all the time in comics. The game mimics comics.
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When "true to source material" is at odds with "fun", I would argue that fun must take precidence.
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And it also ignores comics. My character's personally firebombed over two hundred Longbow bases in PvP zones, yet sidekicks are more than a match for me - even when I've beaten them several times over, over my entire career - when in the comics they'd be teaming up to try to take out just me. This is because of mechanics concerns of the devs - mechanics concerns of ours should at the least be considered when making decisions about access to content, too.
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As it shouldbe. Perhaps it is wrong. If they change the requirement, then I stand by the devs call.
I look at the content and if the contact is available at level 50 what have you lost? The experience points from the missions. The content will still be there when you get the badge, waiting for you.
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I look at the content and if the contact is available at level 50 what have you lost? The experience points from the missions. The content will still be there when you get the badge, waiting for you.
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What I've lost? Not much. What others have lost? Those long stretches of grinding where their contacts ran out of missions, where TV'd have been a welcome addition. The PvPers, who're getting their accolades villain-side much later than hero-side, for no discernible reason. The devs, who've put forth a great deal of effort that was needed elsewhere, put a price tag on it just cause, and set it up such that it underlines a flaw with one of the game's mechanics.
Just because they can, doesn't mean that they should, or that it's at all right.
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I look at the content and if the contact is available at level 50 what have you lost? The experience points from the missions. The content will still be there when you get the badge, waiting for you.
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What I've lost? Not much. What others have lost? Those long stretches of grinding where their contacts ran out of missions, where TV'd have been a welcome addition. The PvPers, who're getting their accolades villain-side much later than hero-side, for no discernible reason. The devs, who've put forth a great deal of effort that was needed elsewhere, put a price tag on it just cause, and set it up such that it underlines a flaw with one of the game's mechanics.
Just because they can, doesn't mean that they should, or that it's at all right.
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I have a friends that only plays with parties. At lvl 37 on CoV they have yet to run out of missions to play. Hasn't even made it through the first contact from 35-40. In the true spirit of a multiplayer game, plenty of content abound through all levels. even a partial solo, partial team player will still have some missions left.
A solo badge hunter? Welcome to the grind. Would I like to see contact missions that last on easy setting last throughout my levels? If that happens, then for one hero to experience all missions would require solo play exclusively. Would I be happy if this were implemented? No, rather the grind, since I can experience all the content as a solo player, and then team up to get through it. But if we switch to the former, sacrifices will be made.
I do agree that there is an inbalance as to when the power is awarded, and several are awarded much later than when the heros can first get them. Why this is, I have no idea. I would like to see this balanced as well. But remember this fact. When Issue 2 came out, many Heroes were already lvl 50. They all received their accolades at 50, not 40 like the villians can. Doesn't mean it's right for villians to have to wait later in levels for their accolades, but just a thought to consider.
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I have a friends that only plays with parties. At lvl 37 on CoV they have yet to run out of missions to play. Hasn't even made it through the first contact from 35-40. In the true spirit of a multiplayer game, plenty of content abound through all levels. even a partial solo, partial team player will still have some missions left.
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I didn't. Several other players didn't. It's not a global truth, even if you and yours were more fortunate than me and mine - though admittedly, we tend to play odd hours (early mornings, days during the week, with weekends usually being given over to RP). I remember back when the oft-discussed boss patch hit, my friends had to explain to me what was going on - my illusion controller'd just earned enough influence to finally SO up phantom army, and I respecced into the newly-improved superior invisibility.
As before, the devs should place a higher priority on the people who are having trouble, not the ones who aren't. As I said before, if this weren't six arcs and an accolade, I don't think we'd see nearly this much debate. I outleveled Krieger back when Villain was still bugged, and it irritated me, but it was only one arc and no badge. The 200+ Longbow bases I blew up were when I was by far the highest level character in my VG (so team-ups weren't an option there), and when villains of my level were rarely open to teaming and rarely able to play a role on a team. After having tanking brutes wordlessly walk away from the AV to rest, and people who refused to discuss any tactics for defeating the respec AV while you're setting up to attack it, I came to the conclusion that you can't spell repugnant without "P-U-G". From what I can tell, my experiences in that respect aren't exactly uncommon.
Wordy, I know, but the point is that at level 50, this is just content. That'd be fine, but six arcs' worth of XP could be used elsewhere in the game.
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A solo badge hunter? Welcome to the grind. Would I like to see contact missions that last on easy setting last throughout my levels? If that happens, then for one hero to experience all missions would require solo play exclusively. Would I be happy if this were implemented? No, rather the grind, since I can experience all the content as a solo player, and then team up to get through it. But if we switch to the former, sacrifices will be made.
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Here's the thing, though: Statesman's outright stated he doesn't want one character to get all the content, try as we might. This is part of the reason flashback was backburnered. I don't like it. I don't agree with it. If Statesman doesn't change his mind, though, it is his desired goal that this situation happens. Speaking personally, I'd rather TV go where it's needed, not where it's extraneous.
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I do agree that there is an inbalance as to when the power is awarded, and several are awarded much later than when the heros can first get them. Why this is, I have no idea. I would like to see this balanced as well. But remember this fact. When Issue 2 came out, many Heroes were already lvl 50. They all received their accolades at 50, not 40 like the villians can. Doesn't mean it's right for villians to have to wait later in levels for their accolades, but just a thought to consider.
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Oh, sure, but at the same time, these badges are often requiring the defeat of higher-level mobs than the equivalent heroic badges. While I'll grant that we're hardly done compiling badge info on I7, the signs aren't particularly pointing towards any of the power-yielding accolades being reasonably available in the early 20s range when Atlas is, much less scattered all over the 20+ game like they are hero-side. Is it an oversight? A bug? An intentional decision from the devs? We can only guess from the info at hand, but the info at hand does suggest an imbalance that plainly points out that TV's part of the problem.
I think I'm beginning to see to understand your point. It's not specifically the TV that you are arguing about, although at this point it is the point of conversation. It's the concept of a 6-arc, accolade containing secret contact, located in the 45-50 range. I guess I can see how switching the ritki contact and TV would make sense. You lower the requirement to 10 mil infamy, still requiring the fame, and now you have a 40-45 contact that will supply 6 arcs worth of experience and content, that for most toons, will be readily available. during what (presumeably) will be a dead area, or lvl 35-40. I admit, I remember running out of mission on CoH at lvl 36.5 and going, well now what???
You are arguing that the missions and content, along with the power could be best suited elsewhere to help keep the game flowing and balanced, not that the requirements are too steep or not correct.
If this is the case, then I see your point, and have no argument against such a move. Even if it just moves it to 40-45 range, it makes sense.
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Again, your choice to stay in SG mode, mine not to. I intend on donating infamy to the SG by exchange, to help support. I WILL be putting the effort in to earn the badge and support my SG/VG.
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The heart of the matter is simply whether that the choice you describe should include a factor of seeing or not seeing certain content.
Currently on Live, there's a choice when doing any mission. You can either help your SG with Prestige, or help youself with Infamy. (which in turn could help your SG, but I'll keep this simple.)
On the Test server, this has become: Help your SG with Prestige and lose out on the TV content, or help youself with Infamy and be able to do a few more missions.
If content becomes far more important to that decision than anything related to the SG iteself, then the previous balance of the SG-or-no-SG choice is completely gone. People will choose the no-SG option for personal reasons. That seems really wrong in a multiplayer, social game environment.
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It really comes down to a simple opinion, which badge is best suited for a TV? INHO, it's an infamy badge as infamy = fame.
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I don't agree with your interpretation of the story-based reasons here. If I was famous, I would be *on TV*. What I'm doing here, however, is just *watching TV*. The level of my fame or infamy has nothing to do with my ability to stare blankly at a screen.
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Again, your choice to stay in SG mode, mine not to. I intend on donating infamy to the SG by exchange, to help support. I WILL be putting the effort in to earn the badge and support my SG/VG.
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The heart of the matter is simply whether that the choice you describe should include a factor of seeing or not seeing certain content.
Currently on Live, there's a choice when doing any mission. You can either help your SG with Prestige, or help youself with Infamy. (which in turn could help your SG, but I'll keep this simple.)
On the Test server, this has become: Help your SG with Prestige and lose out on the TV content, or help youself with Infamy and be able to do a few more missions.
If content becomes far more important to that decision than anything related to the SG iteself, then the previous balance of the SG-or-no-SG choice is completely gone. People will choose the no-SG option for personal reasons. That seems really wrong in a multiplayer, social game environment.
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And if your SG fails because too many people are persuing their personal issues, so be it. Not all unions work and not everyone was meant to be in an SG. A true group would respect the desires for the individual, while working towards a compromise, which is entirely possible, just takes work, like any organization. You cannot have your cake and eat it too.
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It really comes down to a simple opinion, which badge is best suited for a TV? INHO, it's an infamy badge as infamy = fame.
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I don't agree with your interpretation of the story-based reasons here. If I was famous, I would be *on TV*. What I'm doing here, however, is just *watching TV*. The level of my fame or infamy has nothing to do with my ability to stare blankly at a screen.
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After clarifying with the person I know who ran those missions, I agree. I assumed (wrongly) that the TV would be much like the radio in personality. The infamy badge no longer 'fits' perfectly as I stated before. So if they changed the requirements and such, fine, but I would rather it be changed to spread content around to levels that don't have a lot, rather than change it simply to avoid choosing between infamy and prestige. As Statesman stated, it was the intention that a single hero not be able to experience all content. You must choose, but as the true content will bring you exp, the false will earn you debt. :P
Slightly off topic, but BINGO, I can now confirm 100% that the Freak of Nature exploration badge is required for High Pain Threshold.
Linky
This is not to be confused with the Technofreak History badge, which is another requirement that sounds very similar. If Freak of Nature sounds familiar, that's why.
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You are arguing that the missions and content, along with the power could be best suited elsewhere to help keep the game flowing and balanced, not that the requirements are too steep or not correct.
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Not entirely, but close. I do feel that the requirements are too steep and not the best choices, in that they also further undermine an already shaky SG/VG environment. As I said before, the TV's emblematic of a lot of my problems in the game, and that's definitely one of them. If the requirements were lowered (or removed entirely - it's not like you couldn't argue that, say, Arbiter Daos wouldn't also be a valid choice for the Midas Touch-unlockable), if the arcs were shuffled around to other contacts in problem areas, if the accolade badge weren't tied to this, etc. The TV contact sounds really cool, but its utility's being heavily mitigated by the way it's unlocked.
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If this is the case, then I see your point, and have no argument against such a move. Even if it just moves it to 40-45 range, it makes sense.
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Well, the requirement would definitely have to drop then, but yeah
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First off, as to why the devs chose to make prestige and infamy mutually exclusive is simple. In all comics where a superhero or villian was a member of a group, that individual would still go off and do things on their own. I mean from purely a comic book standpoint, ever hero has their own comic 4 times a month (or so) and then they appear with the SG once or twice a month.
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Several heroes don't have solo comics. Very few have weekly ones anymore (I think Spider-Man might be the last one with DC moving over to biweekly schedules for Superman and Batman).
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Thus why you must choose to help your SG or fight on your own. If you help your SG, the SG as a whole gets the credit, and thus you get no real individual 'acknowledgement' of your actions, thus no influence.
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Admittedly, this example's going to be from a terrible comic, but The Death of Superman proves this wrong. Superman led the league at the time, was only one of several casualties, and got most of the credit.
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Now why should contacts require infamy badges? Individual contacts are looking at YOU, and how well YOU have done things. They really aren't interested in how your VG works together, as they want to hire YOU! A TV wants to do a report on YOU. Thus YOU need enough infamy, aka personal prestige, to warrant a TV show about YOU. Thus why it makes sense to require infamy for contacts. In fact these contacts are specifically looking to be sure YOU have done something along similar lines to help them.
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Since the VG doesn't get the other badges, either, I don't see why infamy's involved, particularly not to the degree that it requires Midas Touch rather than Mr. Big.
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Is it unfair? Of course, but then again no superhero or villian ever had a fair life. They are ALWAYS torn between tasks and who or what they should do. You want that TV spot, you best make a name for yourself or you are not getting it. You want that badge of honor, you will need to sacrifice other things to get it. A main part of being super are that scarifices, both personal and in the field, you must make to survive and get what you want. If there were no sacrifices or choices, comics would be boring.
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The same's true if comics spend an unduly lengthy amount of time just to advance the plot. Grinds aren't any more interesting in the game than they are in the comics.
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Now last point, why make it unfair from a gameplay perspective? They are not. You want that special power, you will need to work for it. Nothing is earned for free, and personally, the harder and more challenging a badge is to earn, the happier I am. 1000 pillboxes? Holey Toledo Batman! but I will earn it, and feel really good when I do. You want a special accolade, you best be prepared to work for it. Don't want to be humble and die a few times for an accolade. Don't. But stop complaining that you don't want to earn THAT badge to earn THAT power. The Devs reasons are sound, both in game and out, and just be thankful you are getting powers above and beyond the ones you get normally!
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...okay, ewok, I respect you and all, but I don't agree with any of this, at all. It's one thing to say that badges require some element of effort. It's quite another to say 1000 pill boxes that give no credit to anyone else on the team is reasonable, and that since you like it, we should either like it, too, or just shut up about it. By that logic, you might as well make TV about the Empathy badge.
The problem that I have with TV is that it's almost everything I see wrong with the game, rolled up into one package. We've got a grind badge with no bar to unlock content and an accolade that heroes get 10-15 levels earlier, with most of the proponents admitting that it's probably a contact most people will only unlock at level 50. Despite this, we still have about five levels of the game pre-40 where it's very common to run out of contact missions. I doubt anyone would have problems with it if there were no content shortages earlier in levels, or if the accolade were not tied to it.
As it is? You may thoroughly enjoy grinds, but I loathe them. If I feel the devs are doing something unreasonably grinding in nature, I'll speak up. I don't think it's fair or logical for the devs to put the TV in as is, since they've got gaping holes elsewhere that need filling. Likewise, I don't think the devs should put in overlong grind badges, not only because the devs have said time and again that they don't want to reward unfun behavior, but because this game's got enough unenjoyable elements as it is (particularly in PvP zones).