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II. Blood of the Black Stream - This Epic AT made it's debut on CoV as well in a story arc from Mr. Bocor. It's mentioned briefly,.....
Also, Statesman has confirmed in a live interview that they will be Shapeshifters.
Note: There was a mention of the Black Stream being the Nile River. Manticore (the dev) was quite pleased when someone finally figured it out. Wether or not the find was true or false remains unanswered.
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Hmm... isnt Shadowstar, the WS contact, a kheldian from ancient Egypt...? And those are shapeshifters too no?
I predict BotBS is just the name for a group of Nictus (or Kheldians anyways)
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What?? Controllers can summon pets, but that doesn't make them Masterminds.
Kheldians are totally seperate beings from Blood of the Black Stream. End of story.
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Sates has stated that incarnates are going to be an epic alone, not an addon powers epic.just think of it, an incarnate avilan,coralax, or BotBS? an epic epic? Oh im a to lazy to find states post about incarnates.
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The last post, according to Statesman says that they don't know what to do with it yet, wether or not it's gonna be a stasnd-alone Epic AT or whatever else it could be.
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Stheno? We weren't even talking about her. And how do we know she is an Incarnate? Maybe she is just an immortal Gorgon of Greek Mythology. I don't know. Is she even in the game? (as an archvillain, I mean.)
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It was declared she/he was. Either from the Web of Arachnos novel or some story arc. I'm too exhausted to explain it all. You can search for them or ask in the Players Question section.
So people, please don't twist the facts around or stray from what I wrote down because what I have listed so far are official news/in-game prducts/dev reports. I wouldn't want other people getting confused and spawning their own stories and assumptions through that confusion.
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Sates has stated that incarnates are going to be an epic alone, not an addon powers epic.just think of it, an incarnate avilan,coralax, or BotBS? an epic epic? Oh im a to lazy to find states post about incarnates.
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The last post, according to Statesman says that they don't know what to do with it yet, wether or not it's gonna be a stasnd-alone Epic AT or whatever else it could be. [ QUOTE ]
Stheno? We weren't even talking about her. And how do we know she is an Incarnate? Maybe she is just an immortal Gorgon of Greek Mythology. I don't know. Is she even in the game? (as an archvillain, I mean.)
[/ QUOTE ] It was declared she/he was. Either from the Web of Arachnos novel or some story arc. I'm too exhausted to explain it all. You can search for them or ask in the Players Question section.
So people, please don't twist the facts around or stray from what I wrote down because what I have listed so far are official news/dev reports. I wouldn't want other people getting confused and spawning their own stories and assumptions through that confusion.
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Oh. My bad. Sorry. ALL HAIL OCEANBORN!!! ALL-KNOWING INCARNATE GOD OF THE FORUMS!!! 
But seriously: sorry. I didn't know. I'm sorry about the confusion. 
Lol, no that wasn't meant for you, I just wanted to say it in general just incase.
Oh, ok. No harm ment.
I thought I remembered seeing somewhere that Lord Recluse (or Mr. Spidey as I calls him in me head) WAS a mastermind before becoming an Incarnate.
And everytime I see a video of State-stick-up-butt vs. Mr. Spidey they get in a melee tussle, don't really see States plowing through the minions while trying to reach Recluse as he shouting "crud! i gots agro!".
Not trying to say I'm right, just throwing my two cents in. I think Incarnates will be SOME form of meleer. I don't think States is a tanker ANYMORE. The reason I think he's called a tanker when it's asked is half "close enough" / half "well he WAS".
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I thought I remembered seeing somewhere that Lord Recluse (or Mr. Spidey as I calls him in me head) WAS a mastermind before becoming an Incarnate.
And everytime I see a video of State-stick-up-butt vs. Mr. Spidey they get in a melee tussle, don't really see States plowing through the minions while trying to reach Recluse as he shouting "crud! i gots agro!".
Not trying to say I'm right, just throwing my two cents in. I think Incarnates will be SOME form of meleer. I don't think States is a tanker ANYMORE. The reason I think he's called a tanker when it's asked is half "close enough" / half "well he WAS".
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LR was/is a Mastermind.. Incarnate too..
States, I think is the same case.
IMO, for LR and States, being half or part incarnate means they're given more powers, that's all.
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I think you're right. That they're not what they are now, because according to LR's bio, he's not a MM anymore.. or something like that..
Ah.. good find. GJ LadySin.
Lord Recluse's bio:
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Leader of all the Rogue Isles, Lord Recluse was once the ultimate Mastermind, able to easily bend others to his will. Driven by ideological zealotry, Recluse seeks total world domination. Believing that he is entitled to this position because of superior intelligence and mastery of advanced technologies, Recluse controls Arachnos with an iron fist. Though now an Incarnate, his ability to control those around him has not diminished. With the help of his seers, he manipulates events to his advantage. In this way, Lord Recluse acts as an unseen puppet master, his machinations extending their tendrils into even the darkest corners of the Rogue Isles and beyond.
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This either means:
(a) He is not a Mastermind anymore
(b) He's an Incarnate but still have some Mastermind in him.
(c) 50/50
Statesman's Info
In this pic of statesman's info it shows that he has a power pool of his own with electrical blast powers, does that mean he's part blaster making him tanker incarnate thingy 
someone explain this plz
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In this pic of statesman's info it shows that he has a power pool of his own with electrical blast powers, does that mean he's part blaster making him tanker incarnate thingy someone explain this plz
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That's from the Statesman's Strike event during end-beta.. that was so fun.. as laggy as it was..
Well, they can't really reveal anything new, so let's just pretend that one's for "game purposes only". But now, we do know that the Incarnate is possibly a higher stage of power.
But don't confuse yourself, though I'm sorry too if I have caused some of that confusion, it's my fault (hey I'm only human) - but I somewhat straightened out what the concept might really be in my previous post.
As for the powers, just ignore it for now.
Wait! Having a thought!
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States is a tanker with the power of a scrapper
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maybe incanrate improves a specific AT to make the secondary powers just as powerful as the primaries?!
not sure about states' elecrtical blast powers tho
No.. no.. let's start with the word.
What is the defenition of Incarnate.
Definition: Embodied in human form; personified
In Statesman's case, (if I got my stories right) he became the personification of Zeus by drinking from the Well of Furies. So to him, that's what it means to be an Incarnate
Just speculation
Understood
Sounds like, then, you'd be able to choose what you are incarnate of. Zeuss was a nigh-invincible, superstrong god with lighting bolts... sounds like States (invuln/SS with lightning). You pick an ancient god/goddess, maybe something else, and ur powersets personify that avatar. Ares incarnate would be neat. Once again, speculation.
They're likely to hit us with something we'd never expect.
While that would be nice (really, that would be awesome), it would turn everyone into demigods, which would turn City of Heroes/Villains into City of Gods and Goddessess.
Like what I mentioned in my original post, the devs still don't know what to do with it yet, most likely implying that we won't get to be like Statesman and Lord Recluse - we shouldn't be as powerful as them anyway, lol.
Good point. But then again, as an epic AT khelds arent overused despite the cool concept... they're just a different playing style. Incarnates will likeley be the same way, if they aren't TOO crazy powerful. Think were gonna see a LOT of Avilans tho, for the wings. Besides, there are always those that prefer their good old defender or scrapper to a PB or WS.
Yeah, well, people like playing powerful ATs.
The Kheldian is just like any normal AT, but unique due to it's powers (both quantity and quality). People expect them to be god-mode ATs that can overpower any AT, but really, they're just like any other AT. Another thing to point out is that some Kheldians get discriminated against (for some odd reason) when teaming or in PuGs, declaring that other ATs can do their job better. But if that's how people feel, oh well. The Kheldian concept is awesome, but I do think they're just the tip of the iceburg. The more the devs release EATs, the better they become IMO.
But anyway, yes, I too think we're going to see alot of Avilans, but it really would depend on what role they play in a team and how powerful they are to determine wether or not it will be a long-played EAT. But come on.. wings.. I don't think people will care if it's weak.. which, IMO, it probably will be.
Hopefully one of the epics will have heals/buffs. Epic heals and buffs/debuffs? woot!
Unless khelds aren't considered epic ATs, i would hope that we continue to get a mix of ALL classes though. Undobtably, the first week-month of epic ATs will be Planet of EATs... forget City of. Will hopefully settle down into diversity again after a while. besides... not everyone can have unlocked the EATs >
Well, mixing classes isn't all that great IMO. At times, it is, but I would prefer new classes. New roles instead of the normal healer, scrapper, blaster, controller, tanker, debuffer, buffer, etc. New roles for EATs would be great.
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besides... not everyone can have unlocked the EATs
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Well, the devs are probably going to try and make it so that almost anyone who sticks around long enough can, because there are still people who have been here for years and still haven't reached 50. So that requirement is no longer gonna be used.
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Well, mixing classes isn't all that great IMO. At times, it is, but I would prefer new classes. New roles instead of the normal healer, scrapper, blaster, controller, tanker, debuffer, buffer, etc. New roles for EATs would be great.
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besides... not everyone can have unlocked the EATs
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Well, the devs are probably going to try and make it so that almost anyone who sticks around long enough can, because there are still people who have been here for years and still haven't reached 50. So that requirement is no longer gonna be used.
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once again, good point. we have any ideas/info about how we WILL unlock epics?
Be back to continue this excellent discussion tomorrow... gtg for now.
Read the guide
I want a archetype thats:
Primary:
Energy Melee
Electrical Melee
Fire Melee
Ice melee
2ndary:
Rad Emisson
Kinetics
Empath
Force Fields
Haha, looks overpowered.
Nice idea though.
But let's not forget what makes them epic: their story.
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I want a archetype thats:
Primary:
Energy Melee
Electrical Melee
Fire Melee
Ice melee
2ndary:
Rad Emisson
Kinetics
Empath
Force Fields
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gotta agree with Ocean that something ORIGINAL would be preferred...
about alternate unlocking ways, i was hoping we might have learned more about em in the past 12 days since the guide's release. this is a hard thing to find info on, so i have to congratulate you on such a thorough guide.... very well done.
Thanks
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IV. Incarnates - they're hybrids.
[/ QUOTE ] Hybrids of certain ATs?im confused, please expand
[/ QUOTE ] Think about it. What is Lord Recluse? A mastermind. But is he a complete weakling without his arachnos soldiers around? No. He can both take and dish out enough damage to make him not completely relient on his minions. And what about Statesman? We all know he's a TANKER (sheesh, sorry), but he can deal out as much damage as a scrapper. Therefore, both are hybrids of archetypes, in meaning that they are still one archetype but have characteristics of others.
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Well, being an Incarnate doesn't mean you're fused with another existing AT, it just means, currently, that they're given more power than usual. What the Incarnate half of them do is still yet unknown. I just wanted to clear that up.
Lord Recluse is a MM Incarnate.
Statesman is a Tanker Incarnate.
Stheno, the snake god, is an Incarnate (probably a hybrid with something else as well.)
What does their Incarnate half make them or do? we don't know yet, but we just know it makes them way more powerful than usual. I think my comment on the main post makes that clear enough.
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Stheno? We weren't even talking about her. And how do we know she is an Incarnate? Maybe she is just an immortal Gorgon of Greek Mythology. I don't know. Is she even in the game? (as an archvillain, I mean.)