Prestige, SG Mode and Bases
By
Atomic_Knight,
Posted on: 2005-09-14 17:05 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
Interesting...
Now can we "trade" influence for prestige?
Does the prestige we get add-up in a personal "account" like influence does or does it go directly to the SG prestige "account"?
If we exemplar in SG mode, do we get more prestige?
I dont clearly understand the last comment, do we get both influence and prestige from mobs when we are in SG mode or is it prestige in SG mode and influence in "personal" mode?
"Nothing is impossible for the man who doesn't have to do it himself." ~Midnight Flux's former boss.
There are usually two sides to every argument but no end.
Everything placed above this line is always IMHO, YMMV and quite certainly not to be taken too seriously....
I would like to point out something I strongly believe.
IMO, they will not datamine and award pestige for being in SG mode before CoV.
I believe as the badges were too much of an undertaking for this staff, this would be also.
The Kronos has a hold n00b!
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I dont clearly understand the last comment, do we get both influence and prestige from mobs when we are in SG mode or is it prestige in SG mode and influence in "personal" mode?
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I took it to mean that if you're high level and go into SG mode, you'll get Prestige instead of Influence, or at least a lot more Prestige than Influence.
Which I suppose means that SG mode would split your ordinary Influence gain into Prestige and Influence, with higher levels getting a 90/10 or even a 100/0 split instead of 50/50.
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Which I suppose means that SG mode would split your ordinary Influence gain into Prestige and Influence, with higher levels getting a 90/10 or even a 100/0 split instead of 50/50.
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Good point...
Now time for my usual "rant", give us a choice in this, put a slider we can change from 0/100 to 100/0 as we want?
But anyway, high levels have so much influence, if it was an actual material item, we wouldnt have to bother with prestige we would just make SG bases out of influence...
Looking at it, uninformed as I am, I'd say I'll play 1 level in personal mode then 1-2 levels in SG mode to rake the prestige and still keep enough influence to get my enhancers...
And do the old TFs in SG mode too.
"Nothing is impossible for the man who doesn't have to do it himself." ~Midnight Flux's former boss.
There are usually two sides to every argument but no end.
Everything placed above this line is always IMHO, YMMV and quite certainly not to be taken too seriously....
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I would like to point out something I strongly believe.
IMO, they will not datamine and award pestige for being in SG mode before CoV.
I believe as the badges were too much of an undertaking for this staff, this would be also.
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It's already been confirmed that they have been actively recording SG mode usage and prestige aquisitions, since probably Issue 4.
Never surrender! Never give up!
Help keep Paragon City alive with the unofficial City of Heroes Tabletop Role Playing Game!
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<[CS]Zeb> And yes, we're looking at allowing you to turn off your SG emblem for those folks who don't want to ruin a costume.
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Thank [censored] God! I love this man! First he raises the character limit for names by five and now this? If he weren't so hairy and evil I could kiss him! 
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I would like to point out something I strongly believe.
IMO, they will not datamine and award pestige for being in SG mode before CoV.
I believe as the badges were too much of an undertaking for this staff, this would be also.
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It's already been confirmed that they have been actively recording SG mode usage and prestige aquisitions, since probably Issue 4.
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link?
The Kronos has a hold n00b!
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From the Stratics chat:
<Brannoc> *Dinshu* What exactly is Prestige and how can you earn it?
<[CS]Zeb> Prestige is what your SG needs to build and pay for a base. You earn it by defeating foes similar to earning influence. However, you have to be in SG mode to gain it.
<[CS]Zeb> And yes, we're looking at allowing you to turn off your SG emblem for those folks who don't want to ruin a costume.
<[CS]Zeb> One thing about Prestige is as you get higher, it becomes a trade-off betwee Prestige or Influence. As you get more of the first, you get less of the second. So there are times you'll want to change to or from SG mode instead of being in it all the time.
Which answers the issue of why you would ever NOT want to be in SG mode. Great news on the emblems too. 
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Hmmm....
I think I see a serious problem here. Up until 30-40 Influence is not easy to get and not *everyone* has a sugar-daddy for INF later on.
The balance numbers to allow you to get your enhancements without ruining getting a base are going to be important.
Still here, even after all this time!
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It's already been confirmed that they have been actively recording SG mode usage and prestige aquisitions, since probably Issue 4.
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They have been? Sez who?
Admittedly, I can only offer what someone said that someone said but I was told Poz has flat out stated that datamining the history of every character in an SG is too difficult and has never been considered as a means of determining initial Prestige.
They are obviously going to have to do some sort of checking current SGs, unless the plan is to assign random amounts. But the wild threads that go on about datamining for how long everyone has or has not been in SG mode are without purpose.
My own guess? They will just check how long an SG has been around. Your starting Prestige will be based on a number multiplies by how many months your SG has existed.
YMMV.
"SARS, Bird Flue, 9/11, Anthrax in the Mail, Mad Cow Disease. Pope John Paul didn't die, he preboarded." - Christopher Titus "5th Annual End of the World Tour"
Darn, was hoping this was not gonna happen 
This is actually a con for buying CoV.
Forcing a player to be part of a SG to utilize a BIG portion of the new content is not good. Pretty sure that creating a 1-man SG will not generate enough prestige to finance a base. This is actually forced grouping which I believe several of the devs had said would not be implemented.
So casual players who was looking forward to building a base, you just got Pwnd!!111!!!
It is not forced grouping.
I know there are several solo SGs out there.
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Negaduck: I see you found the crumb. I knew you'd never notice the huge flag.
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It is not forced grouping.
I know there are several solo SGs out there.
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Yes, but do you really think that solo SG will get enough prestige to finance a base???
Depends on what a base costs. I mean, if they just give all SGs a simple, one-room base, and anything more costs, then solo SGs can get their base, and put some decorations in it.
If they are solo, they certainly are not going to be into raiding and stuff, so their base is just a "neat place to visit".
And even if it costs prestige to get a base at all, how much prestige? I mean, it can't be insane amounts, or the newly created level 10 SGs (which is what many new players will start) will like a base as soon as possible. For them to have to rack up prestige well into their 30s or 40s is a bit much to ask...
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Being in a SG doesn't mean you have to team up for every mission... it's just nice to be able to say "hey anyone wanna gimme a hand with this mission? It gives a badge" or something.
What I'm worried/confused about is, does each member accumulate his own prestige or is it just one big "pool" for the entire SG? Meaning could someone concievably start with a full SG, build up beaucoup prestige, boot everyone but him and then erect himself a ultra cool uber base?
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I would like to point out something I strongly believe.
IMO, they will not datamine and award pestige for being in SG mode before CoV.
I believe as the badges were too much of an undertaking for this staff, this would be also.
[/ QUOTE ]
It's already been confirmed that they have been actively recording SG mode usage and prestige aquisitions, since probably Issue 4.
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link?
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There's no solid link that I know of. The info came from someone who posted what they heard from the Devs at GenCon in August.
Here's a link to that post. It's not proof because it's a my friend said that the Devs said kina' thing. But Recluse does post somewhere in the middle correcting something else, and he didn't feel the need to correct the original post.
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It is not forced grouping.
I know there are several solo SGs out there.
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Yes, but do you really think that solo SG will get enough prestige to finance a base???
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Hamidon forces grouping!
TF minimums force grouping!
Arch villains force grouping!
Forced grouping kills puppies!
Okay, the last point was a lie, but I hope the point comes across that we have plenty of examples of game content that is, by design, inaccessible to the devout soloer. The overwhelming majority of storyarcs should still be competable (if slowly) by just about any AT, given the patience and wherewithal to slog through.
It's also tautologic, so I'm not sure where the argument lies.
SG bases may require an SG with multiple members.
I suspect that there may be instances of individual player SGs able to build bases -- just exceptionally teeny ones, perhaps.
My question is this, why the interest in base raiding or having a base if a player isn't inclined to belong to an SG with other persons?
Isn't this a veiled demand for player housing, which is dubious at best, considering the near total lack of loot and items in this game?
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Now can we "trade" influence for prestige?
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Not "trade", "trade-off".
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I would like to point out something I strongly believe.
IMO, they will not datamine and award pestige for being in SG mode before CoV.
I believe as the badges were too much of an undertaking for this staff, this would be also.
[/ QUOTE ]
It's already been confirmed that they have been actively recording SG mode usage and prestige aquisitions, since probably Issue 4.
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link?
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Apparently I was wrong. Whatever.
Never surrender! Never give up!
Help keep Paragon City alive with the unofficial City of Heroes Tabletop Role Playing Game!
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My question is this, why the interest in base raiding or having a base if a player isn't inclined to belong to an SG with other persons?
Isn't this a veiled demand for player housing, which is dubious at best, considering the near total lack of loot and items in this game?
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Uhhm, have you noticed that the customization of your hero is feature that CoH has gotten a lot of praise for. Building your own base is just as meaningfull as running to Icon and changing your costume.
It is fun to build / design something for your own. I think there are many (including SG:s) that wants to build a base but never wants to take part in any raiding or PvP.
Base building is a BIG part of CoV (and I6 for CoH+CoV). Hamidon TF:s and such are just small events in the game.
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Uhhm, have you noticed that the customization of your hero is feature that CoH has gotten a lot of praise for. Building your own base is just as meaningfull as running to Icon and changing your costume.
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Forced grouping over an issue of vanity, then?
I won't dispute the point that character customization is a strong point of CoH, relative to other MMOs. Frankly, I don't see player housing (which your suggestion essentially is) has much of any game mechanic purpose in the game, if not for the purpose of base raiding.
Is base raiding the only thing to do in a base? No. But then, I rather doubt that Atlas Park City Hall was designed to optimally maximize the efficacy of boomboxing.
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It is fun to build / design something for your own. I think there are many (including SG:s) that wants to build a base but never wants to take part in any raiding or PvP.
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Considering the reportedly purely consensual design of base raiding, I don't doubt that there are plenty of players/SGs who have very little intention of raiding. My point being that such alternative uses are a happy byproduct of the design of the fundamental game mechanic.
Design a lamp for people who are going to use it as a lamp, not for people who are going to use it as a coatrack or a doorstop.
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Base building is a BIG part of CoV (and I6 for CoH+CoV). Hamidon TF:s and such are just small events in the game.
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Assuming you're not violating NDA, I don't see how you claim to have authoritative knowledge of the relative balance of PvP versus PvE content in CoV. Link?
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Couldn't tell you, I'm afraid.
At least one of the many GenCon reports quoted Zeb as saying that prestige was already being recorded since X time.
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Okay, I would like to go on record as saying that anything said at a convention should be taken as rumor. Solidly backed rumor, but rumor nonetheless. What they want to do and what they think they can do and what they try to do and what actually gets done can all be very different things.
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It's not datamining. They've simply been actively recording it since Issue 4, or whenever it was.
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Case in point. I have been told by someone I trust a good deal that Positron has come out and said exactly the opposite. That no ones past performance in or out of SG mode was going to be used to determine how much Prestige already existent SGs started with. Are either of them wrong? Possibly. Are either of them lying, I highly doubt it. What one person wants to see in the game or thinks might work for the game might be over ruled by trying out on the test server and getting player reaction as well as what they are actually capable of doing when everything is said and done.
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At least once on the Test server, somebody noticed in their global window that they had earned "prestige".
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So they are testing the ability of a person to earn Prestige. This in no way has any impact at all on what is going on in the live servers. I tested out six slotting hover for fly on my electicity/devices blaster on the Test Server. It didnt change my character on Liberty at all. Not until I implemented it.
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Several(?) SGs have begun asking members to play in SG mode if possible, so they can build up prestige.
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A truthful statement, but again it is completely unrelated to what is going on. Due to the rumors going around I asked my SG to run in SG mode. Not that I had to, we tend to run in SG mode if there are at least two of us together in a group. But I did it based on complete rumor, not on any known fact. Lots of folks were getting angry over the thought of datamining. My thought was, well it wont hurt us to make a conscious effort to use SG mode more often. If the rumor is true, we get a leg up on our Prestige. If its false, we played in our colors a little more than we had to, but we still got the same Influence and Experience. No blood, no foul.
So until you can provide a link to an actual statement saying things one way or the other, it is just a rumor. Does it hurt to hedge your bets and run in SG Mode? No. Will it help? Maybe. Until I see something to make it certain, I am going to continue to encourage my SG to use their colors. But I certainly wont consider kicking those who do not. Its just rumors for now.
"SARS, Bird Flue, 9/11, Anthrax in the Mail, Mad Cow Disease. Pope John Paul didn't die, he preboarded." - Christopher Titus "5th Annual End of the World Tour"
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Interesting...
Now can we "trade" influence for prestige?
Does the prestige we get add-up in a personal "account" like influence does or does it go directly to the SG prestige "account"?
If we exemplar in SG mode, do we get more prestige?
I dont clearly understand the last comment, do we get both influence and prestige from mobs when we are in SG mode or is it prestige in SG mode and influence in "personal" mode?
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Thats not what Zeb was saying.. he was saying that you earn both.. but as you get higher in level... its a trade off as to which you earn. Influence for yourself OR enter SG mode and prestige.
I've said it before and I'll say it again.. this is a terrible idea.
What brainchild figured it'd be a good idea to implement a second monetary system when there's already a problem using the first. The average non-pl'd 50 ends up with MILLIONS.. 10s of Millions of influence and has nothing to do with it but give it to alts/friends and buy costumes.
w00t Radio
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It's not datamining. They've simply been actively recording it since Issue 4, or whenever it was.
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Hang on though. If you're not supposed to get Inf and Prestige at the same rate, then they can't possibly datamine for it. Because people have already gained full Inf. They can't take away Inf already earned, so they can't be planning to award Prestige retroactively, right?
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The average non-pl'd 50 ends up with MILLIONS.. 10s of Millions of influence and has nothing to do with it but give it to alts/friends and buy costumes.
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Yep, but within a SG, if members are busily earning Prestige instead of Inf, the reserves of Inf from the high level members could well get drained quicker than we are expecting.
From the Stratics chat:
<Brannoc> *Dinshu* What exactly is Prestige and how can you earn it?
<[CS]Zeb> Prestige is what your SG needs to build and pay for a base. You earn it by defeating foes similar to earning influence. However, you have to be in SG mode to gain it.
<[CS]Zeb> And yes, we're looking at allowing you to turn off your SG emblem for those folks who don't want to ruin a costume.
<[CS]Zeb> One thing about Prestige is as you get higher, it becomes a trade-off betwee Prestige or Influence. As you get more of the first, you get less of the second. So there are times you'll want to change to or from SG mode instead of being in it all the time.
Which answers the issue of why you would ever NOT want to be in SG mode. Great news on the emblems too.