Tonality

I've been meaning to get back into this topic. (really?!!)

The problem in AE is not farming. It is the rampant powerleveling going on that has changed the typical gameplay experience. This is what needs to be addressed, not farming.

I am concerned that players aren't experiencing the incredible variety available to the game. I wonder if those players going 1-50 in AE ever got the chance feel the rush of leading a team on that brute they rolled that doesn't have set IOs yet. I wonder if that level 30 broadcasting in cap even bothered getting enhancements. It's not like that lvl 50 running the team can't solo it.

As a farmer, I am concerned about AE's impact on the game. The game is not all about dinging to 50 as fast as possible. Sure, PvPers like having this ability so they can get the new FOTM out there. Sure, some people like to skip to SOs. There isn't really any problem with this. There is, however, a problem when a good portion of the playerbase is spending the majority of their time sitting on lowbies in on farms. As I said, it is rampant powerleveling that has me concerned.

Is this game really bad enough 1-50 that we have to rush through it? I know I get spoiled playing my best 50's.

+rep to you for the Douglas Adams quote. Hitchhiker's was a great book, and that quote was one of my favorites.

Yes, I did mean tankers. When it comes to the reason for the behavior on each AT, there are stark differences. Both brutes and tanks often want to grab aggro. A tank blueside is usually doing it for 'noble' reasons, in that they are protecting the squishies. The brute is after fury, knowing that the aggro is fueling the damage output.

I get tired of these types of debates. It has a lot to do with the player. For example, my rad/kin corruptor has out-tanked brutes at times because they weren't aggressive at grabbing the aggro and I wanted it for fulcrum. Granted, my rad/kin is softcapped for S/L/E and I carry a tray of breakfrees and have a great heal available, so it isn't exactly hard for me to tank.

That was a very poor sidestep. A farm map in AE is intentionally designed to maximize rewards and minimizing risks for the mission creator. Furthermore, a farm map will typically ensure that every spawn point is used. If it is used for leveling, the SK system will likely also be designed to provide the maximum XP/time for the lowbies on the team.

I am well aware of how to design missions to maximize rewards in AE. Considering I have leveled toons 1-30 in a single run in about 30 minutes, I think I know what I'm talking about. Before anyone asks, the methods I used were not exploits, as far as I am aware of. Oddly, once you do it enough, leveling loses its luster.

Now, if you'd like to tell me that the devs designed the powersets I'm using, go ahead.

Don't worry, I've never been one for petting zoos or goats. You also seem to have missed when I said I was a farmer. It would be hypocritical of me to criticize your playstyle when just this evening I ran Grillo's snake mission 3 times before I grew tired of it. I'm on infinity's farming global channels. Half of my active globals are farmers.

That sounds a lot like "He started it!".

Disclosure: I enjoy farming. I am also not accusing anyone of these positions.

Extremist Farmer Views:

1) My behavior harms nobody.
- Except those cases when a farmer encourages powerleveling. When this happens to a new player and the player learns nothing about the game, there is potential for lost revenue when the player wonders exactly what the point of this game is.
- Except if you are farming for inf/drops as a RMTer. But, you don't hear from these guys on the forums for obvious reasons. They are also nearly universally hated by farmer and non-farmer alike.

2) I don't care what Positron or the EULA says. I do what I want.
- This is not to be confused with trying to understand the degree of what Positron meant in his post. Rather, this is open defiance.
- This position is going to be taken by someone who has no problem seeking ways to exploit the game, such as the hamidon map.

3) There is no such thing as a farm map.
- Just as somebody can design a character suited for farming, so can someone now design a map suited for farming.
- Puleease. I have made maps with the intentions of maximizing reward/time.

4) Anti-Farmers want to force their playstyle on me
- Anti-farmers are typically more concerned with the community environment, which is why they have brought their complaints.

5) Anti-farmers are horrible people
- This is the undercurrent of a lot of posts on AE threads. By dehumanizing players, calling them the purity police or content cops, we're discounting the reasons why they feel threatened. This in turn leads to more division in the game. Until the AE firestorm, the morality farming wasn't frequently and openly debated like this. It's a divisive issue.

Extremist Anti-Farming Positions:

1) Farming is an Exploit:
- No, using an exploit map is an exploit. The you-know-it-when-you-see-it may be a weak position, but I'm fairly certain just about anyone would consider the lvl 49 hamidon of times past an exploit.
- As always, there are shades of gray.

2) The Devs hate farmers:
- I'm fairly certain Positron bears no ill toward someone like Perfect Pain.
- I haven't gotten any hatemail from Positron yet.

3) Farmers are RMTers
- This one annoys me. I hate them too.
- Most farmers have nothing to do with this, and in fact often have a negative impact on RMTers.

4) Farming is ruining the game:
- No, rampant powerleveling and lax SK rules has changed the environment of the game. My opinion would be that it has not been for the better.

5) Farmers are why we pay ridiculous prices on the market
- Farmers increase availability of items. Yes, there is inflation as they also generate inf in the process. Finding new inf sinks would help a lot more than anything else.
- Farmers also tend to use the inf sinks more than other players, often tweaking difficulty settings for each map, selling more items on the market with their fees, etc.
- Neither is it the fault of marketeers. If influence was harder to come by, prices would be lower.

6) Farmers are horrible people.
- You don't usually hear this outright, but you run across this sentiment if you are in an AE thread long enough.
- For example, one person posted about one of their story arcs getting banned on the forum, and asked a question about the review process. Almost immediately, you begin seeing posts like "serves you right" and "TY POSI". This is anything but productive. We tend to forget that there is a person at the other end of the internet.

Now, depending on your bias, you might look at one of those positions and think it isn't that big of a deal. However it becomes painfully clear when you have both positions on the forum actively posting, especially in the same topic. In a lot of these points, there can be found a grain of truth to them, but they have all been exaggerated, hence my point about extremism happening on both sides.

I grinned when I saw this post.

To begin with, DPS is commonly used on the scrapper boards for single target calculations. However, when you take a brute with good AoE and start tracking your damage output, your DPS skyrockets.

I run herostats, and here is a sample run for some proof that I'm serious about my claims. This run isn't quite 400 dps, because I was tired. As it takes about 5 minutes to load each saved hero-stats file, I'm not eager to dig around for an ideal one.

Recorded Duration: 10:28
Total Damage Output 245,474.48 (23,418.00 per minute)
That's a consistent 390.3 dps.

It has nothing to do with right and wrong. I don't think you're doing anything wrong.

It has to do with what is the better action. For example, let's say you run across a tank without toggles. You have two options:

1) Hey, you're a nub. Toggles make you not suck.
2) Hey, I noticed you had some interesting ideas in your build. I usually take this toggle because it makes me stronger. How is it working for you?

If you don't like playing with bad players, which would you consider the best outcome for you over the long term?
1) Avoiding and kicking anyone that you consider a bad player.
2) Educating new players.

If someone hadn't have taken the time to show me how amazing tar patch and darkest night was, I still would think they were lousy powers. I know better now. My first character was a dark/dark corruptor. I wound up deleting it because I thought it was just awful. Had I known back then just how good it could be, I would have been a lot happier with that character.

Luckily, there were (and are) people that will put up with newer players in order to teach them the game. Two years ago I was a newbie. Thanks to a lot of people on the way, I'm not.

Thanks for clarifying. I was one of those 'enemies' glaring at you, even though on my electric brutes, I wasn't sapped...

One of the key issues with end drain is that it is less effective when you up the difficulty slider - especially when you run into +3s and +4s. I find that under these circumstances, that end drain is not an effective means of mitigation.

As for Lightning Field, my default slotting is:

-Scirocco's Acc/Dam/End, Dam/End
-Multistrike Acc/Dam/End, Dam/End
-End Mod IO if I want end drain

It's effective at draining, but in my data gathering, I've found that lightning field significantly contributes to my AoE dps. Furthermore, lightning field is better used as a means to ensure the mobs stay drained of endurance, rather than actively drain them of endurance.

As you seem like someone who enjoys electric armor, perhaps looking at it as a means to encourage other people to enjoy the set as much as you do is a good thing. A lot of people feel that electric armor cannot perform as well as willpower or fire armor. Some of those people are right.

For example, try taking your electric brute on the classic TV farm map against nemesis. You'll quickly see that electric armor pales in comparison to both willpower and fire in this situation. Now fire armor is laughably weak against Rikti, but on several teaming situations, I often feel left out, due to my unique strengths. What I find effortless (malta) is usually avoided like the plague by most other players.

Sure, that is just one case out of potentially thousands. However, I believe there is merit to examining how the set performs in the end game - particularly with missions and strike forces that are typically repeated. Those would be:

-ITF: Electric Armor is mediocre. You aren't going to be as good as an inv, fire, wp, SR, or stone. Hence, why a lot of people think it's underperforming.
-LGTF: Now we're talking. You're golden.
-LRSF: Oh, how I hate longbow and their S/L damage. Their rifles chew through my melee defense, and their wardens hit like a truck. Stoners are great here, so is SS/WP usually. You aren't going to be happy being the alpha tank on this. Sure you can do the MoLRSF, but it sure isn't as easy as other sets.
-BSF: I don't want to take my SS/elec on this SF again. Ever.
-RWZ Raid: Sure, why not. The only thing that really hurts is when a few magus or mentalists start noticing me.


Typically Repeated Villain 50 Content:
-TVs DE/Freak Map: Oh, this one is kinda fun. I can solo it set at relent to 6 without relying on inspies. 8 spawns 2 bosses, which I can't handle.
-TV's Nemesis Map: This is just a venture in pain. I have no real means to fill up my HP bar again. If I don't have a *egads* healer, I run out of inspirations very quickly.
-Demon Map: Fire Damage? No thank you.
-Papers: Yay malta. Boo CoT. Carnies? Sure, I guess.
-Eldersnakes: That toxic DoT guarantees aid self is out of the question. Grab some friends and tons of knockback. It is loads of fun playing with fire. Here is a great example of where energize will help (and a good example of the only reason why I'd even consider powersurge)
-Patron Missions: Hey, some of these are fun. Mu aren't much of a threat to me. However, I'm not sure how much I would enjoy Black Scorpion's, or Ghost Widow's. I've never tried Mako's.

I could probably go on with these. Electric armor does have some situations where it shines, but often these are the very missions that most people do not want to do. Many non-elecs look at Scirocco's and shudder thinking of all the Mu they have to deal with. Most don't revel over the thought of Malta.

Electric armor could stand to get this buff. It isn't a huge buff, but it is worthwhile.

This would only work if all of ElA's end drain capabilities were doubled, and power sink's recharge was halved. End drain can be used as a good means of mitigation, but it takes 2 applications of powersink to drain +3 lieutenants, even on a elec/elec/mu. That means I have to survive about 20 seconds before I get to fire it again. An Electric Armor SO build can be dropped in 5 seconds if you don't pop inspirations. 2 seconds if it is eldersnake bosses outside of powersurge (which I never take).

As I farm with several electric armor brutes, I am well familiar with how the set performs. Oddly enough, I still am in the 'buff ElA camp'. I've learned how to play ElA well, to the point where I can consistently fire aid self in the middle of a saturated mob that is constantly firing at me (and no I don't even need to slot for interrupt reduction).

It's a difference in playstyle. My SS/Elec does about 400 dps with the AoE in footstomp, lightning field, and ball lightning (actually lightning field does as much damage as ball lightning!).

Now, the best single-target builds for brutes can probably achieve about 250 dps (dark/shield). Until I finish my dark/shield (which I'm not eager to do yet), I'll hover around 170 dps on my broken chain.

If I'm looking to wipe entire maps clean of enemies in a hurry, I grab something like a SS/elec. If I'm looking to solo an AV, I'll grab my dark shield and curse every once in a while knowing I'm three LOTG 7.5's, 2 GOTAs, and a miracle unique from having eliminated the need for any blues.

Since I know you have the inf to invest in an impressive ST machine, I'd give it a try. I do feel a little gimped at times when I don't have an AoE arsenal at my disposal, but there is fun to be had in other ways:

-Learning how to efficiently choose your attacks based on the health of your enemy. This will not be the efficient DPS chain, but knowing that firing Midnight Grasp on a minion at a sliver of health is a waste when smite will do.
-How fast can you individually kill things or cycle through things to maintain aggro? AoE machines have an easier time holding aggro (we're assuming you're punchvoking, not taunting)
-And of course, secretly hoping the team you are on wipes on the AV so you can solo him with the team cheering you on.

It's an entirely different world. Personally, I enjoy wiping entire maps quickly.

Leveling up, I suggest carrying around a few lucks. Once you hit SO range and have adequately slotted your secondary, you should be able to hit 45% defense with a single luck on top of your toggles. Good lucks often are for sale on the markets, and you can place reasonable bids on them as well overnight and keep yourself stocked.

You will find it much more enjoyable. Now, your endurance is still going to scream at you from the likely rage and hasten crashes, but well, I suppose you could carry a few blues too.

I have to do the obligatory 'Can I has ur stuff' now. Wait...

Wow. I'm impressed, I guess. RP never was a big interest of mine growing up. I did DnD once and well, I sorta decided the best thing I could do was wander off to the troll and get myself killed on purpose. I sat there fascinated as everyone else was now discussing how in the world I was supposed to be rescued. Now, that was fun. Thank goodness I don't leroy jenkins in CoH.

But I respect any outlet for creative minds, and it looks like you have one.

I guess onto your regularly scheduled AE thread.

There are extremists in both camps. I find flaws in both positions.

Agreed. However, we have some issues:

1) If Dark Respite is hired, I'm sure the devs would have to make The Course of Superhero Romance official lore, and certainly I wouldn't mind having this be a story arc (which already reminds me of the LGTF).

2) Dark Respite's videos would generally be well received by the public. Are we really sure we have the ability to handle any more new people in the game? Why, hiring Dark Respite might just cause more lag. We can't have that can we?

3) If Dark Respite was hired, she would become a redname. But we have a problem. The color red is by far, not dark. Hence, she would have to change her name to Red Respite. This would confuse everyone, and give new meaning to needing some R&R.

Electric armor can perform quite well at times. However it has quite a few issues performing the alpha role at times, especially against enemies it isn't suited for. Circle of Thorns and Cimerorans can be particularly painful. I suppose many sets have their weaknesses, but electric's weakness just happens to be against some of the more common enemies in the game.

Yes, that was too much.

Again, you're showing that electic performs well against specific enemy groups that focus on the strengths of electric armor. Rikti deal quite a bit of energy damage, which you will shrug off. It's why dark/elec is absolutely sick in the RWZ.

I do tend to play to my advantages. I'm not going to intentially subject my shield brute to kheld ppd, nor am I going to run the demon map on my elec brutes. However, given that electric's primary means of mitigation is resistance, and the secondary means is less than effective at the higher difficulty levels, adding in the extra regen and heal will certainly help the set.