MayorOfAngrytown

No. It is a primary for defenders, and a secondary for corrs, controllers, and MMs. You cannot respec into it. It is NOT a "pool" power like Teleportation, Super Speed, Leaping, Leadership, et al.

Re-read These:

1. Dead/ Not Dead are mututally exclusive states for everyone. Everyone is either dead or not dead. Sorry, couldn't resist that one.

2. Your assertion about IH is just not the case. If you are treating IH as your only survival tool on /regen, then you are doing it wrong. If you are dying the instant that IH wears off, you are doing it wrong.

3. Replace "damn good" with "attentive and tactically minded." "Damn Good" assumes that people who can't/won't shine with /regen are "bad" players, which they are not. Like I said before, much of the perception that /regen sucks comes from players who don't like the playstyle. A small portion of it comes from some legit complaints. (No -rech resistance, No -regen resist are my two biggies, and IMHO all it really needs)

4. Agreed, insps are for everyone and shouldn't be taken into account when balancing a secondary. Frankly, I find myself using my sm. purp only when really needed - you know, when any other 32.5% s/l defense build would be popping them to soft-cap anyway. I'll tell you two things I never need. Greens and Blues. Oh, and my Wakes seem to languish on the shelf too. :P

I mean sure, if you guys want to hammer out a way to buff regen to where you would be happy with it's performance - without changing the playstyle - then by all means, run with it. In the meantime I'll be playing mine. I've admitted upthread where the faults are in the set (my opinion), but I guess I disagree about how big of a deal those faults are.

At least until TW/ gets released; I am WAY more excited about that than I am regen brutes, but there are already threads.

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It's less that I think one can't find a challenge with other sets (untrue), and more that after a point they basically all play exactly the same. Activate Toggles, Use Primary, Insert Tricks as Needed. Regen is the only set that plays dramatically different from, well, basically every other armor set.

I have a pretty amazing sp/da scrapper than ran x8 all the time (between 0 and +3 depending on how fast I wanted to get through something). Except for PPD Squids. Seriously. Anything but those. For my /SD brute, well I never found anything that I couldn't handle at some variation of x8. Sure, I could keep tweaking those two builds and working out tactics until I've maxed their potential, but after a fashion I get bored with that and want to move on to another toon.

Maybe if I had more interest/time/FakeMoneyUnits, I'd go purple out one of my existing 50s and see what it can do, but in all honesty my 2 50s have hit an expense wall that I'll probably not bother climbing in order to respec or tweak them any futher. With proliferation, /time, and TW/ coming down the pike, there'll be more reason not too, heh.

For the record, both of those toons solo'd Gaussian's at x8. And yeah, that one is 9 @#$#es in a @!#$@# boat. Tough, but still doable.

I love the RWZ arcs and play through them on any toon that reaches that level. DW's arc (not for difficulty) is one of my favorites in the entire game, story-wise. For the other record, I've been running regen at a variety of difficulties. 0/x8 on simpler stuff. Did some +4/x2 just to see what would happen. And so on. That toon is only 45 and not yet fully built.

Maybe it is because I don't play MMOs much at all. Literally this is the only MMO I've ever played for more than a few days. But I really need the game to be more difficult, more active, in order to retain my attention. Sure, I could take an SS/FA brute and build it out and run the highest diff on some content, but man. What a freaking yawn fest. Not in gameplay or challenge, but in "Sheesh, who the @#%^ wants to do what everyone else is doing?" No offense to you guys with awesome SS/FA brutes, but I just can't go with the flow. Wish I could, life would be easier, but I'm just not made that way. If I already know the outcome (what an ss/fa brute can do), then what's the fun?

Seriously. There will always be the best gun, or sword, or armor, or car, or powerset combo in any given game. Can't be bothered to care. I'm more interested in what I can do with the underdog tools, especially in this game where there is just no such thing as a bad Brute or Scrapper combo. Seriously. None at all.

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TLDR: Yeah, I do that too. I don't see how that obviates playing /regen because I enjoy the way it plays and welcome the challenge of making it work. Also, I'm having to tweak the slider with my /regen in order to keep things interesting.

Definitely intriqued by this idea, though it adds a toggle (iirc) rather than a 2nd click godmode. Admittedly a minor change, but an interesting one. Always wanted to run DN on a brute, but never had the occasion to get it into a build.

It's much better these days. At this point it's basically possible at this point to reach >70 or something % fury with just your own attacks. A few folks have demonstrated it on RWZ dummies, but I don't recall the exact numbers.

/sd is great fun with mace, admittedly less Pretty. I imagine /fire would be hot (heh), but haven't tried it. BU+FE+(Fury)+Clobber would be a sight to behold.

Silly name for Strong and Pretty scrapper just reserved. If only for the lulz.

Actually, that's probably a big reason why I like /regen. No claims to being a "good player," but I'm not too shabby either. I get bored playing the "just don't fall asleep" toons. Liking a challenge might be a poor mechanical reason, but it's a great game-play reason, imho.

I think the thing is that playstyle is that "other" that /regen offers which can't necessarily be found in other armors. I can't speak to the SO game. Like I said, I have a ton of lowbies, and really only concentrate my efforts/builds on a small group of (4) post-40s. At that point, there are so many other things happening that build nicely on /regen's specialties - high hp, big regen, reactive heals/god-mode(s)* - that I think the issue is as much playstyle as it is aspects of performance. The effort that it takes is just part of using the powers tactically. Without putting in the effort (not directing that at you Nihilii, just making the point in general) then the set will definitely seem sub-par. You know, like in the old days when we all had to micro-manage armor toggles because there was no such thing as inherent stamina or performance shifters.

* - Scrappers get the option of 2, Brutes won't have that. I guess we have to "settle" for gloom.

Alright, if the discussion is "does X power set need help, and if so in what form" then yeah, outlier/extreme builds shouldn't be the metric. But that thread already happened over in the scrapper forums, big lengthy discussion on how much, and to what (if any) debuff resistance should be added to the set. Meh. Those discussions rarely go anywhere, and I'm more interested in what I can do with a given set as it stands than what I wish it had.

Outside of the vague comment I read in one of the u-stream summaries about "retaining scrapper numbers," we don't really have much to go on. They published the changes for /EA that came along with the port, so I'm sure we'll hear if anything aside from the addition of a taunt aura (if even that) is happening eventually.

But in all honesty man, outside of another massive rewrite of the set, no amount of numerical changes are going to make you suddenly enjoy the clicky playstyle. On the other hand, I do. It's a refreshing change after so many "Please wait while I turn my 16 toggles back on!" toons. Nothing against toggles, love 'em - but there's enough repetition in this game and after a certain point one toggle defense (resist) toon plays a great deal similar to any other.

I'm with you on the redraw, but I count that as a downside for any weapon set. Not necessarily for some percieved mechanical slow down or whatever, but simply because it looks freaking goofy. It's bad enough on a /sd toon, and that's not even all that bad. Heh.


And Delerious, um, yeah. MoG on a fixed recharge? Are you delerio..... er nevermind.

IH as a toggle with the same healing values? Have you the brain worms? That would be rediculously OP.

Speaking of Titan weapons; unlockable weapon: Two Words.

Rikti.

Pylon.

(please?)

Nice summary. Very interesting set indeed.

*sigh* Not really sure why I am bothering with this but here goes:

Which is it Ryu? Soloing 8 man spawns or built exclusively in SOs. Make up your mind as to which level of gameplay you want to use as your "metric." Also, my "trip to 50" doesn't even ever include an SOs only build phase, as previously stated if I'm running to the point where I can use SOs, I have a plan for 50 and start slotting up. (lotgs start at lvl 25, for example). I just don't see the point in playing toons to 50 that I'm not interested in making awesome. Ok, so I min/max to an extent. I'm no powerset elitest (clearly, lol), but if I'm going to invest my time playing a toon past a certain point, then it gets pimped out and I start fiddling with what will work best. Or at least best in theory.

The idea that (outside of a couple of very skilled players like Billz) someone is soloing x8 and running nothing but SOs on any powerset combo is laughable at best. And really, let's give up this illusion that "the game isn't balanced around IOs." It's a nice party line, but at this point I think we can all quietly just chuckle while reconciling that statement with the current wave of new content.

Beyond that. The way I play my scrappers is basically the way I play my brutes. Mad spawn-diving monstrosities, regardless of their power set. I do with with sp/da, I do with with my km/regen. To me a brute is simply a scrapper with more hp and a funky dmg mechanic, while a scrapper is just a brute that hits harder most of the time but dies just a touch easier. Furthermore, since you brought up fury, I basically play Power Siphon like it is Fury. On whenever it is up, cycling fast attacks into the chain to keep the buff high, charging from one spawn to the next. Just because my AT says "scrapper" doesn't mean I am going to be waiting around for someone else to hit that spawn.

Actually, your only real valid point is that we haven't seen what happens when /regen combines with taunt mechanics. That will be an interesting challenge. One I look forward to greatly.

Regen for brutes will be exactly as it is for scrappers - Tons of haters, a few die-hard fans who love the set despite it's failings, and the occasional "Wow, that was impressive!" when the unitiated team with us and watch us be the last man standing.

Not because of /regen, because we are intellectually vested enough in the toon to play the set well. I'll take a team of players dedicated to kicking *** with their "underdog" toons over a team of folks absent mindedly mashing buttons on their uberWTFFOTM toons any day, any week, any time.

And I can't believe I forgot about DN for brutes. Less concerned about Smeld missing now.

In other news:

@BrandX - I have a km/regen at 44 with an almost done "No Purples, No PvPs" build that will be at the "sm insp to soft cap" on s/l, respectable e/ne (somewhere in the 20s iirc), around 50-60% global recharge before hasten (4x DW sets, 5x LOTG - 4 if I decide not to take manuvers). Even before Alpha slotting and finishing his defense sets he's beastly. Ok, so a km/regen *pve* build is a little wacky sounding, but meh - PvP. Can't get into it. Heh. Yeah, maybe not as awesome as kat/ or bs/ with their in-built defense boost, but it can work with other primaries too.

@Nihilii - you touched on the exact reason I quietly think /regen is under-rated in the modern game. I personally can't wait to stand there in the blue patches (while sitting at capped regen thanks to destiny) laughing at BM while I smash her face. Or standing there waiting for Nova Fist with a well timed DP/Recon riposte. Before anyone laughs, if /DA can pull off this move with DR once or twice, then /regen should shine at it. And Keyes, lovely keyes. Disint will still suck - but pulses? Whatever.

Poppycock.

A: Talk about SO builds all you want, but any character I bother to get to 22 is probably going all the way to 50. Any toon I take to 50 is getting an IO build, period. Even leveling from 25 (sometimes as low as 10) on up I'm running common IOs at worst. (Bear in mind I don't have a ton of toons, and tend to obsess over one or two at a time) Call me a snob or whatever, but there it is. Let's be honest though, outside of a few builds here and there I imagine the numbers mavens aren't really living exclusively in the SO world.

B: Click timing is really important with /regen, if they are all down at once something isn't right. I already mentioned that brutes won't get the benefit of smeld, but I don' think that's a deal breaker.

C: Who cares if it's not old school uber-rediculous regen of yore? I've already had /regen scrappers described as "tanky" so I don't see how my brutes will be any different.

D: "People need to wake up?" :lol: It's a game Francis, settle down. Maybe you missed the part where I declared I don't care if X Y or Z is "better." Or the part where I pointed out some obvious disadvantages. I'm just stoked to finally have it ported.

I noticed that as I was reading through the /ea changes. Perhaps there will be one in there somewhere then.

And :P to all your (collective) /wp snobbery. Don't care. Boring set is boring and if I was after nothing but numbers I'd just roll ss/fa brutes, lol.

This.

Given the amount of overkill that DP has on an io'd scrapper with spiritual alpha, I'm betting that hitting HP cap will be the hallmark of /regen brutes.

/regen is definitely micromanagement, and loosing Smeld breaks a bit of that uber survivability cycle you can get with a scrapper. Even still could be quite beastly.

It's expensive, but not difficult to get to the 32.5% s/l defense mark (at least with km/regen I am almost done buying the bits to make that happen). Of course there will be the standard drawbacks, no ddr, no -rech resist, no -regen resist (unless that gets fixed during the port).

Still stoked. I haven't really done much with SS, and will probably do swords with something less clicky (less redraw, I know, I'm silly) - this might just be it.

I'm not sure they would want to combine RttC and Integration (unless they dropped the +regen portion and just made it a mez toggle) in a set that also has IH. /energy doesn't have a taunt aura and iirc /sr doesn't either. I guess regen could go either way at this point. Ideally either skip it or add it to Integration. Can't think of a reason to go changing the powers around.

Someone may have already answered this, but I run this combo on my brute and I love it.

Stamina, SC, and PP all get the Perf shifter proc and the 1 +end piece from the set. Generally with accolades and other +rec or +end bonuses from sets this is plenty for me to not worry about the blue bar. I'd skip 4 sloting stamina.

Wait .. what?


The Brute Squad has the wisdom you seek. Besides why would you be happier with /wp on scrapper that has even lower base/cap hps than a brute?



(nothing against /wp scrappys, just, well, ya, the above confused me.)

That's odd. I generally hovered in the 70-80 territory on mine without much effort at all. Deus is right, it's not going to be a top end dps monster, but it's not exactly shabby either.

Except that the top dps chain for DB doesn't run combos. Granted that needs a boat-load of recharge, so yeah, out of the box there is some level of combo reliance.

Back on topic though, are we confirmed in the mechanical effect of momentum (I see people declaring an "animation speed" increase as though it had been verified by a redname), or still working from the vague notion that it makes you "gradually faster" whatever that means?

Win.