Local_Man

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  1. Remove Tornado? That is one of your best damage powers. An Earth/Storm has the ability to apply -Knockback with Stone Prison, Stone Cages or Fossilize. Tornado then applies a good amount of damage over its life. And one of the most important aspects of Tornado -- it is AUTOHIT. Even if a foe has high defense, Tornado will do its damage. Tornado's problem is that it skips around if you have multiple targets, but for taking down a single tough target, Tornado is awesome. I view Tornado as Storm's version of -Regen for AVs. Since Storm has no -Regen powers, the damage over time from Tornado makes up for the lack of -Regen. If you take out all the lower level foes around the AV, the 'Nado can focus on the AV.

    Using Steamy Mist and another stealth power is great for this combo. Leading Rocky around to tank for you is a great survival and damage tool. Rather than using a power pick for Stealth, consider either (a) using Super Speed as your travel power, or (b) getting a Stealth IO to put in your existing travel power or Sprint or a prestige sprint power. That will free up a power pick for you. You can put either a Celerity (Run) Stealth or an Unbounded Leap (Jump) Stealth in Sprint if you don't want to use your travel power (or don't have one).

    Personally, I strongly dislike World of Confusion. The radius is too small to make it useful. I prefer to keep my Earth/Storm at range, controlling the foes and, if needed, debuffing their ToHit with Hurricane. You can get far, far more damage out of Tornado.

    To get some added damage, I like to proc-up Freezing Rain: 2 Rech, 1 Achilles Heal -Resist proc, 1 Posi Blast Energy proc, 1 Lady Grey Negative Energy proc, 1 Impeded Swiftness Lethal Damage Proc.

    As for staying alive? Earth control has three fantastic AoE controls -- Stalagmites+Stone Cages, Earthquake and Volcanic Gasses. Stalagmites+Stone Cages is the best at stopping the Alpha strike, but you can handle the others, too. Just let Rocky run in to tank first for Earthquake and Volcanic Gasses to draw the aggro so the foes don't take a shot at you at first.

    I agree you can increase your single target damage by adding Stone Prison slotted up for damage. You can also add a Pool attack in lower levels, but an APP blast in upper levels really helps (and you can stay at range).

    Did you slot both of the +Resistance procs in Rocky? Those procs really add to his survivability because Rocky already has high Resistance. Consider 4 Expediant Reinforcement (including the +10% Resistance proc), the Sovereign Right +10% Resistance proc, and then an Acc/Dam Hami-O to cap Rocky's damage and add accuracy. You won't need to heal or recast him nearly as often.
  2. I mostly solo'ed my Grav/Storm to 50. He is one of my favorite controllers to solo, but on teams I have to limit the chaos. Solo, he's not fast, but I can solo fairly safely with the right strategy.

    I see Gravity as a single-target damage control set. It is weak on AoE control and relies heavily upon the pet to make up for its weaknesses. One huge advantage Grav/Storm has is the Freezing Rain+Crushing Field combo in low levels. Since Crushing Field does not prevent knockdown, that combo provides some AoE control in lower levels. Then I found that Hurricane was a huge help . . . the ability to keep foes out of melee and keep their ToHit Debuffed while I clobbered foes one-by-one was key to my Grav/Storm's survival. I haven't yet respec'ed him to the changes in Gravity. My attack chain was GD-Crush-Propel, but now Lift does more damage than Crush.

    Instead of Hover, I used Super Speed. Super Speed + Steamy Mist = full invisibility. Super Speed lets you get around the battle area fast to get in just the right position to use powers like Wormhole, Hurricane and Lightning Storm, where position is key to their effective use. And Super Speed only needs an EndRdx in the default slot. (Any time I need to fly, I use a Raptor Pack.)

    Slotting up Singularity for additional Resistance is key. I included both +10% Resistance procs. My slotting is Acc/Dam, Acc/Dam/Rech, Dam/End/Rech and the Resist proc from Expediant Reinforcement, the Sovereign Right Resistance proc and, at level 50, a Dam/Mez Hami-O. (Singy has mez powers, and it's really nice to buff them some.) With both Resistance procs, and a buff from Steamy Mist, Singy's Resistance becomes huge and only AVs seem to be able to kill him. This makes him a perfect tank.

    With full invisibility, you can lead Singy into a group to grab the aggro. Give him a second to draw their attention, and then you are free to pick off foes one by one with your single target attacks. The key is to let Singy keep the aggro . . . I usually attack foes that he has mezzed. If a foe turns towards me, I will usually either hold him if possible, or use Hurricane to push him towards Singy (while debuffing his ToHit).

    For larger groups, I try to set up the "corner of doom." Find a nice spot, then go target a group with Wormhole. Before using Wormhold, cast Lightning Storm and Tornado in the corner. Turn on Hurricane. Then Wormhole the group into the corner and hit them with Crushing Field and Freezing Rain. Work on taking out the tougher foes while Wormhole's Stun and CF and Hurricane keep them bunched. If needed, Thunderclap can either stack more stun or extend the stun on minions. Lightning Storm, Tornado and Singy will chew up the foes pretty quickly with Freezing Rain's help.

    And lately I have been slotting Freezing Rain up with a nice mix of procs: 2 Recharge, Achilles Heal proc, Impeded Swiftness proc, Posi Blast proc, Lady Grey Proc. It really adds a lot of damage along with the debuffs.

    Solo, I use Tornado a fair amount even without an AoE Immob that has -Knockback. It throws foes around, but that acts as a control power. Since my attacks are mostly single target, the chaos is not a problem. However, on teams I rarely use Tornado as teams generally don't appreciate the chaos.

    There are several ways to build a "final build" Grav/Storm. You chould build for Recharge to have Wormhole, Tornado and Lightning Storm up as much as possible. I would suggest having some kind of self-heal in that case. Or you could build a high defense build where a self-heal probably won't be needed much.

    I skipped O2 Boost, as it is useless solo since you can't heal Singy. It can be nice to have on teams. I also skipped Snow Storm since Gravity's secondary effect is Slow and you have an AoE Immob. Dimension Shift used to be horrible, but with the changes . . . I'm still not convinced that it is worth taking.

    Here is a level 50 build, but notice that there are no purple sets. The only sets you would not be able to take at 42 are the Hami-O's, and those aren't essential.

    Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.956
    http://www.cohplanner.com/
    Click this DataLink to open the build!
    French Myth-take: Level 50 Technology Controller
    Primary Power Set: Gravity Control
    Secondary Power Set: Storm Summoning
    Power Pool: Speed
    Power Pool: Fighting
    Power Pool: Leaping
    Power Pool: Leadership
    Ancillary Pool: Mace Mastery
    Hero Profile:
    Level 1: Lift -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(3), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(5), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(31), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(43), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(43)
    Level 1: Gale -- Acc-I(A)
    Level 2: Gravity Distortion -- BasGaze-Acc/Hold(A), BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(3), BasGaze-Rchg/Hold(5), BasGaze-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(34), HO:Nucle(43)
    Level 4: Super Speed -- EndRdx-I(A)
    Level 6: Propel -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(7), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(7), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(37), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(37), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(40)
    Level 8: Crushing Field -- Enf'dOp-Acc/Rchg(A), Enf'dOp-EndRdx/Immob(9), Enf'dOp-Acc/EndRdx(9), Enf'dOp-Acc/Immob/Rchg(19)
    Level 10: Steamy Mist -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def(11), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(11), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(45)
    Level 12: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(13), RechRdx-I(13)
    Level 14: Boxing -- Empty(A)
    Level 16: Freezing Rain -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(17), Posi-Dam%(17), ImpSwft-Dam%(21), Achilles-ResDeb%(23), LdyGrey-%Dam(23)
    Level 18: Gravity Distortion Field -- BasGaze-Acc/Hold(A), BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(19), BasGaze-Rchg/Hold(46), BasGaze-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(46)
    Level 20: Hurricane -- HO:Enzym(A), HO:Enzym(21)
    Level 22: Tough -- S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), S'fstPrt-ResKB(46)
    Level 24: Weave -- LkGmblr-Def(A), LkGmblr-Rchg+(25), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(25), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(50)
    Level 26: Wormhole -- WotController-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear(A), WotController-Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/Rchg(27), WotController-EndRdx/Rchg(27), WotController-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/EndRdx(37), WotController-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/EndRdx/Rchg(50), WotController-Rchg/Dam%(50)
    Level 28: Thunder Clap -- Stpfy-Acc/Stun/Rchg(A), Rope-Acc/Stun/Rchg(29), Stpfy-Acc/Rchg(29)
    Level 30: Combat Jumping -- LkGmblr-Def(A)
    Level 32: Singularity -- ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg(A), ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(33), ExRmnt-Dmg/EndRdx(33), ExRmnt-+Res(Pets)(33), SvgnRt-PetResDam(34), HO:Perox(34)
    Level 35: Tornado -- ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg(A), ExRmnt-Dmg/EndRdx(36), ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(36), ExRmnt-EndRdx/Dmg/Rchg(36)
    Level 38: Lightning Storm -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(39), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(39), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(39), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(40), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(40)
    Level 41: Scorpion Shield -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def(42), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(42), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(42)
    Level 44: Disruptor Blast -- HO:Nucle(A), HO:Nucle(45), HO:Centri(45)
    Level 47: Summon Tarantula -- ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg(A), ExRmnt-Dmg/EndRdx(48), ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(48), ExRmnt-EndRdx/Dmg/Rchg(48)
    Level 49: Maneuvers -- LkGmblr-Def(A)
    Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
    Level 1: Containment
    Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)
    Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Empty(A)
    Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)
    Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)
    Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)
    Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
    Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
    Level 4: Ninja Run
    Level 4: Swift -- Run-I(A)
    Level 4: Health -- Mrcl-Rcvry+(A), Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(31), Mrcl-Heal(31)
    Level 4: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
    Level 4: Stamina -- P'Shift-End%(A), P'Shift-EndMod(15), EndMod-I(15)
    Level 50: Cardiac Core Paragon
    ------------

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  3. A "novelty?" Uh . . . no. Mass Confusion is a great control power that can add to your overall damage as long as you know how to leverage it. Have a big group with bosses? Mass Confuse, and then Confuse the bosses. Then you still have Total Dom + Dom for the next group.

    Another great use of Mass Confuse is when you have two groups near each other. You can Mass Confuse the first group (NO AGGRO) and then Hold (or Terrorize) the next group. The Confused group will often come over to the other group, making it easy for teammates to wipe them out.

    Would I rather have a pet? Yes. But Mass Confusion is a great power. The Recharge is too long, but the power is very effective.
  4. I have been on a few Super Teams and designed teams . . . Ill/Rad was great, a team of Fire/Dark corrupters was the second best, but nothing, NOTHING comes close to a full team of 8 Fire/Rad Controllers.

    8 x AM caps damage, recharge, Recovery. 8 x Choking Cloud means everything is held instantly. 8 x Hot Feet puts out a huge amount of damage, and all you have to do is pop AM whenever it is up and walk around together.

    That's what makes Fire/Rad so powerful . . . most of the time, you don't have to cast anything other than leave AM on Auto. Just run around as a group, and everything is quickly held and dies. AVs might last a few seconds, and may need an application of Char and then EF. Stacked CC + stacked Char is enough to hold the AVs.
  5. Opinions differ, but if you get perma-PA, and then stay a little way away from the PA once they engage, then you don't have to worry about either ranged or AoE defense. My Ill/Rad and Ill/TA have no defense at all, while my Ill/Storm and Ill/Cold have a little bit from Steamy Mist/Arctic Mist and the Ice Shield. I build for Recharge and then keep a safe distance from PA to avoid the AoE which will usually be focused on them.

    That's my playstyle, so I don't really need defense. Some people want defense, but they tend to be more aggressive and rely upon Defense rather than avoiding aggro. There's certainly nothing wrong with building for Defense, but I feel Recharge should come first on an Illusion Controller. Admittedly, Chrono Shift adds a good amount of Recharge, making it easier to build for some Defense.
  6. Controllers are more varied than any other AT in the game. Each powerset combo has different strategy. (Compare that to melee fighters, who are mostly the same -- run in and beat on the foes.) Unlike all of the other ATs, Controllers do not have a powerset devoted to damage. Some control sets do more damage than others, while others provide more control. The secondaries offer a wide range of options -- some with heals, some with massive debuffs, some with great buffs, some with controls. You may dislike one, and then like a different powerset combo that plays completely differently.

    My personal preference? I love Illusion. I have 5 level 50 Illusion controllers. (Rad, Storm, TA, Cold, Time.) While some of the strategy is similar, the different secondaries make each Illusion character substantially different.

    Mind Control is one of my least favorite. However, I have a Mind/Storm controller at 50, a Mind/FF at 44, and a Mind/Energy Dom, so I have plenty of experience with the set. It has good single target damage early. It has great AoE "click" control later in the build, but falls behind other controllers on damage and distraction because of the absence of a pet. Mind Control has a huge amount of control options with Hold, Sleep, Confuse, knock-up and Fear. I suppose one thing I'm not crazy about is the lack of "persistant" controls -- all (but one skippable one) of Mind's control powers are "click once and they're gone" controls. Now, lots of people love Mind Control (and dislike Illusion), so what I like or dislike may not match your preferences.

    I must admit that I haven't used Poision as a secondary. I have a Demons/Poison Mastermind, and I find I dislike the Poison Secondary on a Mastermind. I know it is a bit different for Controllers, but I don't have a desire to try it on a controller.

    So . . . you have, as your first controller my least favorite control primary with a secondary that I don't want to even try.

    I would suggest that before you make a judgment on controllers, you try some other combinations. My personal favorite is my Illusion/Rad, followed closely by Ill/Cold and Earth/Storm. If you like AoE damage, then Fire and Plant are best but they are limited in control. Earth, Electric and Ice are good at AoE control, but lack damage. Dark Control is a nice AoE control set with some damage, buffs and debuffs. Gravity has good single target damage and some interesting positioning powers, but is weak in AoE control. All sets other than Mind have one or more pets.
  7. Maybe I missed it, but do you have any -Knockback in the build? You have several places you could add a Karma or Steadfast -knockback.

    Other than that, I would probably increase the slotting in Slowed Response or Chrono Shift. Personally, I would drop Temporal Selection to add a travel power like Fly, but that's me.
  8. Early, Mind does good single target damage. It has a good built-in attack chain of Dominate-Mezmerize-Levitate that you can have in place by level 6. The problem is that you only get one more damage power later in the build. Terrify is a cone that does damage when it scares the heck out of the foes. Solo, Mass Hypnosis can set Containment pretty well. But on teams, teammates usually will disrupt the Sleep before you can get full benefit from Containment.

    Other control sets (with pets) get an increase in damage when they get their pets. Mind, instead, gets an AoE confuse power on a long timer. If you know how to use Confuse powers, they can increase your overall XP per hour, but overall, Mind lags behind most other control sets for damage after level 32.

    Another issue with Mind Control: All of the controls (except for one skippable exception) are "click controls" instead of persistant. (Persistant controls are things like Earthquake, Volcanic Gasses, Static Field, Arctic Air -- control powers that hang around for a while and will control new foes who enter the area.) Once you fire off a power, you have to wait for it to recharge. If you get adds, you had better hope you have another control power up. Mind Control has more control powers, as every power has a control component, but the only one that is persistant is a very situational one (Telekinesis).

    Personally, I think Mind makes a better Dominator set. Almost all the powers benefit from Domination.

    The best AoE damage from controller sets are Fire and then Plant. Illusion does well with single target damage and 4 pets. Dark also has three pets.
  9. I have a tendency to try to find uses for powers, simply because I like to explore powersets and find ways to use the tools. As a result, I sometimes like powers that others don't because I find it a challenge to fine ways to use powers.

    On my DP/Dev blaster, I like to find ways to use Time Bomb . . . but it is only useful solo. And if I wasn't the kind of person who likes to find ways to use stuff, I probably wouldn't take it. Time Bomb is just too slow, and it is very situational. It is kind of fun to use solo, but I almost never use it on teams. And I wouldn't mind at all if it was changed substantially.
  10. Controllers have a huge range of builds. Some are strong on Control and team support, while others are damage machines. Any and every build in this game can be improved by an IO build, so you can't really say "why it doesn't need anything more than that." The real question is what builds will perform best with an "only SO" build?

    Fire/Kins can actually do pretty well on an SO-only build. But you have to be quick on the healing. Fire/Rads in a group are amazingly powerful even on SOs. In a pack, Fire/Rads could destroy anything in the game back in the pre-IO days. And stacking AM 8 times makes up for the lack of IOs easily.

    For a Control-oriented, team support character on SOs, I would go for Earth/Rad or maybe Earth/TA. Earth has three main ranged AoE controls, so one of them will be up at all times. Earth provides a variety of control, so even if the Immob won't stop Wolves, the knockdown in Earthquake will. Rad is just a great all-purpose secondary that combines very well with Earth Control. TA is a Control-and-debuff-only secondary, but and Earth/TA has the highest amount of control in the game.

    Mind also does pretty well on an SO-only build.

    And my favorite, Ill/Rad works great as an SO only build, as long as you play it smart. You have to use Deceive a lot and pick and choose when to use Phantom Army. For smaller groups (2-3) you can use Phantasm's Decoy as your tank.
  11. Quote:
    Originally Posted by Fireheart View Post
    So, I ported Captain Eeep! over to Beta and built him up on the ladder I posted. I learned a few tweaks and tricks from various builds, but this is still only bare slotting, trying to find the very best balance.

    And, as Local Man suggested, Dimension Shift is still a wholly skippable power - the duration is just too Short! Distortion Field works very nicely. Time Stop does no damage, but it's a great way to put another enemy 'on hold' - for all of those times when Gravity Distortion just isn't coming back fast enough.

    Between Containment and Impact, Gravity is still awesome at juggling 1, 2, sometimes 3 enemies, but when there's more, you'll want a partner to help clean them up. Wormhole is still strange and quirky, but useful when it works right. When I tried it, the enemy was Thoroughly stunned, but scattered, not clumped in the corner, where I wanted them.

    Super Speed was almost too fast, but combined with a +Stealth in Sprint, it was quite effective at keeping me unnoticed. I switched to Power Slide when stealthiness was not needed.

    So, I'm looking at switching out Dimension Shift for a bit more protection and debuff, in the form of Time's Juncture. The resulting build would look like this:

    Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.956
    http://www.cohplanner.com/

    Click this DataLink to open the build!

    Captain Eeep!: Level 49 Magic Controller
    Primary Power Set: Gravity Control
    Secondary Power Set: Time Manipulation
    Power Pool: Leaping
    Power Pool: Speed

    Hero Profile:
    Level 1: Crush -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(3), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(7)
    Level 1: Time Crawl -- TmpRdns-Acc/EndRdx(A), P'ngTtl-Acc/EndRdx(5)
    Level 2: Lift -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(3), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(13)
    Level 4: Gravity Distortion -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(5), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(13)
    Level 6: Propel -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(7), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(15)
    Level 8: Crushing Field -- Det'tn-Acc/Dmg(A), Det'tn-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(9), Posi-Acc/Dmg(9), Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(15)
    Level 10: Temporal Mending -- Mrcl-Heal/Rchg(A), Mrcl-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(11), Mrcl-EndRdx/Rchg(11)
    Level 12: Combat Jumping -- DefBuff-I(A)
    Level 14: Super Speed -- QckFt-EndRdx/RunSpd(A)
    Level 16: Temporal Selection -- Mrcl-EndRdx/Rchg(A), Mrcl-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(17)
    Level 18: Distortion Field -- TmpRdns-EndRdx/Rchg/Slow(A), P'ngTtl-EndRdx/Rchg/Slow(19), Range-I(19)
    Level 20: Gravity Distortion Field -- WotController-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear(A), WotController-EndRdx/Rchg(21), WotController-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/EndRdx(21), WotController-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/EndRdx/Rchg(23)
    Level 22: Time's Juncture -- DampS-ToHitDeb/Rchg/EndRdx(A), DampS-ToHitDeb/EndRdx(23)
    Level 24: Time Stop -- EoCur-Acc/EndRdx(A), EoCur-Acc/Hold(25), EoCur-Acc/Hold/Rchg(25)
    Level 26: Wormhole -- Rope-Acc/EndRdx(A), Rope-Acc/Stun/Rchg(27), Rope-Acc/Stun(27)
    Level 28: [Empty]
    Level 30: [Empty]
    Level 32: [Empty]
    Level 35: [Empty]
    Level 38: [Empty]
    Level 41: [Empty]
    Level 44: [Empty]
    Level 47: [Empty]
    Level 49: [Empty]
    Level 1: Brawl -- Acc-I(A)
    Level 1: Containment
    Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)
    Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- EndRdx-I(A)
    Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)
    Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)
    Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)
    Level 1: Sprint -- Clrty-Stlth(A)
    Level 2: Rest -- RechRdx-I(A)
    Level 4: Ninja Run
    Level 4: Swift -- Run-I(A)
    Level 4: Health -- Heal-I(A)
    Level 4: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
    Level 4: Stamina -- P'Shift-EndMod(A), P'Shift-End%(17)
    ------------



    Code:
    | Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Hero Designer to view the build |
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    Be Well!
    Firehear
    I took your build above and made a few changes:

    Better control and more damage (on average) from GD. Less Endurance and more than double the damage (on average) from Crushing Field. More Recovery overall. -Knockback from the Karma in CJ.

    Putting the Celerity into Super Speed and not using Sprint actually reduces the overall endurance cost. And it makes more sense . . . I assume you will not be using Super Speed during "lead out" missions. Later you can put an EndRdx in Super Speed if you feel you need to, or just turn it off during combat.

    You will want to put a 4th Baz Gaze into Time Stop for the nice Recharge. You will want 4 Dark Watcher in Time's Junction.

    Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.956
    http://www.cohplanner.com/
    Click this DataLink to open the build!
    Captain Eeep!: Level 28 Magic Controller
    Primary Power Set: Gravity Control
    Secondary Power Set: Time Manipulation
    Power Pool: Leaping
    Power Pool: Speed
    Hero Profile:
    Level 1: Lift -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(3), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(7)
    Level 1: Time Crawl -- Acc-I(A)
    Level 2: Gravity Distortion -- BasGaze-Acc/Hold(A), BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(3), BasGaze-Rchg/Hold(5), BasGaze-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(13), WotController-Rchg/Dam%(19)
    Level 4: Crush -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(5), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(13)
    Level 6: Propel -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(7), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(15)
    Level 8: Crushing Field -- TotHntr-Acc/EndRdx(A), Enf'dOp-Acc/EndRdx(9), TotHntr-Dam%(9), Posi-Dam%(15)
    Level 10: Temporal Mending -- Mrcl-Heal/Rchg(A), Mrcl-Heal(11)
    Level 12: Combat Jumping -- Krma-ResKB(A)
    Level 14: Super Speed -- Clrty-Stlth(A)
    Level 16: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(17)
    Level 18: Distortion Field -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(19)
    Level 20: Gravity Distortion Field -- WotController-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear(A), WotController-EndRdx/Rchg(21), WotController-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/EndRdx(21), WotController-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/EndRdx/Rchg(23)
    Level 22: Time's Juncture -- DarkWD-ToHitDeb/EndRdx(A), DarkWD-ToHitdeb/Rchg/EndRdx(23)
    Level 24: Time Stop -- BasGaze-Acc/Hold(A), BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(25), BasGaze-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(25)
    Level 26: Wormhole -- Stpfy-Acc/Rchg(A), Stpfy-Acc/Stun/Rchg(27), Stpfy-Stun/Rng(27)
    Level 28: [Empty]
    Level 30: [Empty]
    Level 32: [Empty]
    Level 35: [Empty]
    Level 38: [Empty]
    Level 41: [Empty]
    Level 44: [Empty]
    Level 47: [Empty]
    Level 49: [Empty]
    Level 1: Brawl -- Acc-I(A)
    Level 1: Containment
    Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)
    Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- EndRdx-I(A)
    Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)
    Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)
    Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)
    Level 1: Sprint -- EndRdx-I(A)
    Level 2: Rest -- RechRdx-I(A)
    Level 4: Ninja Run
    Level 4: Swift -- Run-I(A)
    Level 4: Health -- Mrcl-Rcvry+(A)
    Level 4: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
    Level 4: Stamina -- P'Shift-EndMod(A), EndMod-I(11), P'Shift-End%(17)
    ------------

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  12. Quote:
    Originally Posted by Hyperstrike View Post
    One thing. At that level, with as few defenses as you have, I'd put an EndRed into Combat Jumping. You lose less than half a percent of defense and you're mitigating resting end consumption.
    I disagree. Combat Jumping only uses 0.07 End per second, which may be the lowest cost toggle in the game (other than no-cost toggles). In low levels and all levels, you can get a much greater benefit from a slot used for something else.

    Resting End Consumption is not a problem . . . use during battle is the problem. If you are having endurance issues, slot a Miracle proc, a Numina Proc and slot your most used powers for EndRdx.
  13. Quote:
    Originally Posted by SacredMay View Post
    However, I decided to leave Possess out of the build. I'm just not big on single target confuses.
    That's too bad. A single target Confuse that does not draw aggro is a very powerful tool. Invisibility + a no aggro single target confuse makes it fairly easy to get glowies without getting aggro for stealthing missions. You can cut down the odds before a fight begins. You can take out mezzing foes and turn them into your own mezzers. You can turn foe buffers into team buffers. (I love sneaking up to Rikti Guardians and confusing them to get the AM buff. I have been able to stack 6 at one time.)

    Yes, it is not all that useful on large, fast moving teams, but it has so many good uses that I have always felt that it is a mistake to skip it.

    Take a look at the discussion about Deceive in my Ill/Rad guide.

    My Dark/Dark has procced out Living Shadows with 4 procs. It provides a substantial amount of damage.
  14. Any thread that starts, "World of Confusion . . . " should be concluded with ". . . sucks."

    Take a look at all the numbers. The radius is pitifully small, the pulse rate is too slow. I thought it might be a good match for my Ice/Storm, since I already had a confuse aura in Arctic Air. When I tried it, I hated it pretty quickly and respec'ed out. Just about everyone else I know who has tried it has also hated it. Most people have said that even with the Contagious Confusion proc, it sucks. (I already had that proc in Arctic Air.)

    I have seen a few people post that they like the power as a mule for the comparably cheap Confuse purple set, but they never actually use the power. I would bet that if you added T4 Cognitive, it would still suck.
  15. Here's a few thoughts for you:

    Gravity is a single target damage specialist. Time has a nice mix of powers, including the PB AoE ToHit Debuff. In Gravity, I'm not convinced that Dimension Shift is worth taking even with the huge improvements -- in any event, it is a situational power and can be delayed. (Maybe you should try it out, with an idea to respec it out if you don't like it -- the mechanics of it are pretty odd.) Crush is also optional -- it used to be that Crush actually did more damage than Lift, but the recent changes made Lift better. Again, it is not a bad power, but it is skippable. In Time, Temporal Selection is a nice buff for a teammate, but this kind of single target buff can be skipped. Also, Time Stop is a nice single target hold, again nice to have but not essential. Of the four skippable powers, I would try to keep Time Stop, then Crush.

    I consider invisibility to be very important to a Gravity controller. Why? Singularity makes a GREAT tank, and if you are invisible, you can lead Singy into battle without being bothered yourself. There are lots of other advantages to invisibility, too. However, I think that the Stealth Pool is a waste. I prefer choosing Super Speed with a Stealth IO. (Use Allignment merits to make a low-level Celerity Stealth.) You get a travel power and a stealth power in one power choice. Plus, Hasten is always a benefit to controllers. Adding Combat Jumping later for Immob protection and a place for a Luck of the Gambler Recharge and/or a Karma -Knockback is also helpful. (By the way, I saw EndRdx slotted into Combat Jumping in some of the previous builds -- that's a wasted slot as CJ only uses .07 endurance. You will do better using that slot somewhere else.)
  16. Local_Man

    Local Man Help!

    I know I spend way too much time around here, but there actually are other people who are pretty good with Controllers other than me . . . even "some" of the ones who disagree with me.

    As for your build . . . it needs a lot of work in my opinion. I'll post my current build for my Earth/Storm at the end.

    As for your build:
    Fossilize: This power does a fair amount of damage, so I would much rather move those purple Unbreakables to Volcanic Gasses, move the Baz Gaze set to Fossilize so you have room to slot some damage.

    Gale: This is a nearly worthless power which is only useful in rare situations. I don't feel it is worth slotting. I put an Accuracy in the default slot and almost never use it. Hurricane is much, much better.

    Stone Cages: Using the purple set is great, but include the wonderful Chance for Hold proc over the pure Immobilize. Then put a damage proc in the last slot.

    Quicksand and Snowstorm: I love Quicksand and use it constantly. It provides a great slow patch with a huge Defense Debuff of 25%. It casts quickly and recharges quickly. I use it underneath all of my other controls. It only needs some Recharge. You don't need to slot for Slow because there is a cap of 90%, and Quicksand provides -90% Slow. Yeah, slotting for Slow will have some effect on higher level foes, but it isn't worth spending slots on. Plus the Slow IO sets aren't very good. So I put two Recharge leveling up, and then cut that down to one Recharge when I get enough global Recharge. An Impeded Swiftness proc is nice if you can fit it in.

    Snow Storm is an optional power that can be taken later, if at all. Its biggest benefit is that it adds -Recharge, something missing from Quicksand. But I find it situational . . . I usually put it on a tough boss, EB or AV. It only needs 1 or 2 EndRdx. Again, you could add the Impeded Swiftness proc, but I would use one in Quicksand first.

    Steamy Mist: OK

    Stalagmites: any Earth control build that does not take Stalagmites at 12 is an automatic fail. It is a key control power. You took it at 20 and only slotted a Recharge? Uh, no. It needs Accuracy, Stun and Recharge. The purple Absolute Amazement set is good here, not in Fissure.

    Earth control has three key AoE controls: Stalagmites+Stone Cages, Earthquake, Volcanic Gasses. Quicksand can be cast underneath all of them.

    Fighting Pool: I'm not a big fan of the Fighting Pool on Controllers. You get only a small benefit for three power choices, and it only benefits the Controller himself instead of the entire team. My personal style is that Controllers who control don't need capped defenses. It is nice if you can get it, but I would rather have more Control and/or buff or debuff powers. If you really want to add some defense, I would rather take Maneuvers in one power choice. And I certainly would not put off other useful powers the way you did.

    Freezing Rain: Take it at 16. I consider this the best single power in Storm, as it privides great debuffs and control. I slot it for Recharge first, then procs. With any Earth Control build you NEVER need to slot for Defense Debuff as the set already has huge amounts of Defense Debuff. (25% in Quicksand, 20% in several other powers.)

    Earthquake: Take it at 18, slot for Recharge, maybe a proc. If you really want to slot it for a debuff, then choose ToHit Debuff instead of Defense Debuff.

    Hurricane is a great protective and positioning power, and should be taken at 20 or near there. I like 4 Dark Watcher.

    I like Super Speed, as Steamy Mist + Super Speed = full invis, which lets you lead Rocky into the fight to tank for you while you are not seen. Why slot a Celerity? a single IO provides no bonus.

    Maneuvers is OK. Tactics is not needed. Earth Control has a huge amount of Defense Debuff, so you shouldn't have any problem hitting anything.

    You skipped Thunderclap. But because Earth has a great stun power (Stalagmites), you can use Thunderclap to stack stuns and stun bosses. Earth/Storm, Fire/Storm, Grav/Storm and Dark/Storm can all make good use of Thunderclap because they have another stun power.

    Volcanic Gasses is another power you take as soon as it becomes available, at 26. the purple set including the damage proc, as the mechanics of VG let it proc more often. The Lockdown proc is nice here, too, for stacking mag faster.

    Animate Stone: Rocky has high Resistance, so adding those pet Resistance procs have a huge benefit. Having O2 Boost lets you heal the little bit of damage he does receive.

    Tornado and Lightning Storm both need to be slotted up for Damage. They can provide a lot of damage to this build.

    Combat Jumping is not worth putting three slots into. Why put three slots in Combat Jumping when you only have one in Rock Armor, which gives a much higher return?

    Fissure, if that's what you want, should be slotted for Damage, not stun.

    Here is my build. It doesn't have capped Defense, but it has almost Perma Hasten. Hurricane's ToHit Debuff and invisibility can make up for lower defense. I rely upon Rocky to draw a lot of the aggro. I find this build to be very, very effective.

    Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.956
    http://www.cohplanner.com/
    Click this DataLink to open the build!
    Ella M. Ental: Level 50 Technology Controller
    Primary Power Set: Earth Control
    Secondary Power Set: Storm Summoning
    Power Pool: Speed
    Power Pool: Leaping
    Power Pool: Leadership
    Ancillary Pool: Ice Mastery
    Hero Profile:
    Level 1: Fossilize -- BasGaze-Acc/Hold(A), BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(3), BasGaze-Rchg/Hold(3), BasGaze-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(5), HO:Nucle(5), Dmg-I(7)
    Level 1: Gale -- Acc-I(A)
    Level 2: Stone Cages -- GravAnch-Immob/Rchg(A), GravAnch-Acc/Immob/Rchg(7), GravAnch-Acc/Rchg(9), GravAnch-Immob/EndRdx(9), GravAnch-Hold%(11), Posi-Dam%(11)
    Level 4: O2 Boost -- Mrcl-Heal/EndRdx(A), Mrcl-Heal(13)
    Level 6: Quicksand -- RechRdx-I(A), ImpSwft-Dam%(42)
    Level 8: Super Speed -- EndRdx-I(A)
    Level 10: Steamy Mist -- LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(13), LkGmblr-Def(15), LkGmblr-Rchg+(15)
    Level 12: Stalagmites -- Amaze-Stun/Rchg(A), Amaze-Acc/Stun/Rchg(19), Amaze-Acc/Rchg(19), Amaze-EndRdx/Stun(21), Amaze-ToHitDeb%(21)
    Level 14: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(17), RechRdx-I(23)
    Level 16: Freezing Rain -- RechRdx-I(A), ImpSwft-Dam%(17), RechRdx-I(25), Posi-Dam%(27), Achilles-ResDeb%(27), LdyGrey-%Dam(29)
    Level 18: Earthquake -- RechRdx-I(A)
    Level 20: Hurricane -- DarkWD-ToHitDeb(A), DarkWD-ToHitdeb/Rchg/EndRdx(31), DarkWD-Rchg/EndRdx(31), DarkWD-ToHitDeb/EndRdx(31)
    Level 22: Snow Storm -- EndRdx-I(A)
    Level 24: Combat Jumping -- Krma-ResKB(A), LkGmblr-Rchg+(25)
    Level 26: Volcanic Gasses -- UbrkCons-Hold(A), UbrkCons-Hold/Rchg(33), UbrkCons-Acc/Hold/Rchg(33), UbrkCons-Dam%(33), UbrkCons-Acc/Rchg(34), Lock-%Hold(34)
    Level 28: Thunder Clap -- Stpfy-Acc/Rchg(A), Stpfy-EndRdx/Stun(34), Stpfy-Acc/EndRdx(36), Stpfy-Stun/Rng(36), Stpfy-Acc/Stun/Rchg(36)
    Level 30: Maneuvers -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(37)
    Level 32: Animate Stone -- ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(A), ExRmnt-Dmg/EndRdx(37), ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg(37), ExRmnt-EndRdx/Dmg/Rchg(39), SvgnRt-PetResDam(39), ExRmnt-+Res(Pets)(39)
    Level 35: Tornado -- ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg(A), ExRmnt-Dmg/EndRdx(40), ExRmnt-EndRdx/Dmg/Rchg(40), ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(40), S'bndAl-Dmg/EndRdx(42)
    Level 38: Lightning Storm -- Dev'n-Dmg/EndRdx(A), Dev'n-Dmg/Rchg(42), Dev'n-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(43), Dev'n-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(43), Dev'n-Hold%(43)
    Level 41: Ice Blast -- Decim-Acc/Dmg(A), Decim-Dmg/EndRdx(45), Decim-Dmg/Rchg(45), Decim-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(45), Decim-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(46)
    Level 44: Frost Breath -- Posi-Acc/Dmg(A), Posi-Dmg/EndRdx(46), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(46), Posi-Dmg/Rng(48), Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(48)
    Level 47: Frozen Armor -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(50), LkGmblr-Def(50)
    Level 49: Hibernate -- RechRdx-I(A)
    Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
    Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Empty(A)
    Level 1: Sprint -- Jump-I(A)
    Level 2: Rest -- RechRdx-I(A)
    Level 2: Swift -- Run-I(A)
    Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
    Level 2: Health -- Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(A), Numna-Heal(23), Mrcl-Rcvry+(48)
    Level 2: Stamina -- EndMod-I(A), P'Shift-End%(29), P'Shift-EndMod(50)
    Level 1: Containment
    Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)
    Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)
    Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)
    Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)
    Level 4: Ninja Run
    Level 50: Cardiac Core Paragon
    ------------

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  17. Local_Man

    Plant or Fire

    Plant/Storm is an awesome controller. I much prefer it over Fire/Storm, which is one of the most endurance hungry controllers there is.
    • Positioning is very important to Plant Controllers, as the Seeds Cone is your main control. Storm is the best secondary for positioning.
    • Plant is strong at AoE Damage but weak at single target damage, and Storm adds good damage from Tornado and Lightning Storm to fill that hole.
    • Once a Plant Controller has thrown Seeds, his control options are limited. Storm's Hurricane does a great job at controlling adds. Storm's Freezing Rain makes a knockdown zone. Thunderclap provides Stun for minions. And Tornado can be a source of chaos, and even Gale and Lightning Storm's knockback, plus the slow and -Recharge of Snow Storm can give you a few extra seconds.
    • Roots has -Knockback, which makes Tornado into a great damage power.
    • Storm lacks a self-heal, but Spirit Tree can make up for that to some degree.

    Ask anyone who has played Plant/Storm for a while . . . it is a great controller combo. Good damage, good control. Can be good on teams but is very good solo.

    Fire/Storm has some nice advantages too, but that endurance cost is really tough. Flashfire+Thunderclap stack nicely.
  18. If you are looking to design a character intended to support your kids' characters, then it really matters what your kids are playing. You mentioned that your son is playing a Bots/Storm. You said your daughter is playing a tank, but you didn't mention the powersets. (I have some experience in making a team to play with kids, so I understand what you are doing.)

    The reason I think it would be useful is that you can choose your character to supplement their strengths. Some Tanks are Resistance-based (Fire, Dark), others are Defense based (Ice, Shield), and others are a combo (WP, Invul). If you have defense, is it positional (like Shield or SR) or typed (like Ice or Invul)? Does the tank need some help with her defenses/resistances? Certainly the Bots/Storm could use more Defense to go with the bubbles that the Bots give out, but Resistance could help, too. How much will the kids, with the way they play, need to be healed?

    What is your goal when teaming with the kids? Do you lead, or let them lead and follow them to support and buff them? Do you need heals? Do you need Defense or Resistance shields? Do they run out of endurance? Do you need a Rez power?

    How is their damage? Do you need to add damage from your own attacks (maybe a Fire/Dark?), or do you need to buff damage (Dark/Kin, which should be a pretty nice combo), or can you let the kids do most of the damage? That might determine if you need Damage buffs or Resistance Debuffs, or if you need attacks yourself.

    Robots have Forcefield defenses, but Storm does not have a defense buff. If your Tank could also use a Defense boost, then you may want to look at secondaries that can buff Defense -- but keep in mind whether the defense is positional or typed. Cold might be a good secondary since it has great debuffs and a fantastic Recovery/Endurance buff, too. Time and Dark have some nice powers in these areas, but keep in mind how late in the set these powers might be (as kids often lose interest in things after a while). There is always FF if the kids need defensive shields in the low levels, but it is not a great secondary otherwise.

    If you need a combination of heals and Resistance buffs, you could consider Thermal as a secondary. If the Tank has plenty of Defense, then Resistance might be a better choice. Or if the Tank is Resistance based, then more Resistance is usually a great idea. So Dark/Therm might be a choice.

    How good are the kids at developing and staying with a strategy? If they play chaotically, then Storm is a pretty good secondary, but more than one stormy adds a LOT of chaos. If your kids are pretty good at playing with strategy, then a second Stormy may not be a good idea. (I have rolled up a Dark/Storm simply because I love the concept. Have you ever heard of the classic Bulwer-Litton sentence used as an example of bad writing, "It was a dark and stormy night."? I made "Dark Stormy Knight." I haven't played him yet, though.)

    I would suggest that before you choose your character's powersets, think about what the kids need to be better. I presume that the main goal of this character is to help the kids have more fun playing, rather than to be an optimal character for yourself. There are a lot of combos I would play as a pure support character over a standard character that I planned to level up with the usual mix of teaming and solo.
  19. Quote:
    Originally Posted by Laevateinn View Post
    I have a low opinion of forum theorycrafting and convoluted make-believe simulations that somehow always manage to play out in favor of the poster's argument. I tend to put more weight on quantifiable advantages that can reasonably be guaranteed, in this case, the fact that if you doublestack Tar Patch you will get -60% res, and if you cannot you will get -30%, compared to Rad's lower -22.5%, while noting that EF has some unique advantages of its own. Beyond that, I can't say anything else.
    My opinion is that in most of the game, teams plow through content very fast and there isn't time to double stack Tar Patch, Freezing Rain, Sleet and similar powers. Most regular content dies too fast even in TFs and incarnate trials. On the fast-moving stuff, 22.5% up all the time vs. 30% most of the time doesn't really make much difference, and EF might be better since it is up more often. The double stacking tactics only become useful on AVs and EBs -- and granted, that's when you need it most.

    But it is always a mistake to focus on only one aspect of a secondary. Rad provides such a well-rounded and flexible set of tools that I find it fits every situation. While the -Resistance may be lower against those tough targets, the -Regen from LR and EM Pulse is outstanding. AM provides a damage boost (which may make up for the lower -Resistance for anything other than Phantom Army), a Recharge boost and a Recovery boost (helping you attack more often).

    Quote:
    I also assume that all characters are +3 full VR incarnates with unlimited budget builds and all accolades. If people don't play such characters, they're welcome to say so and I'll tailor my advice accordingly.
    Well, I assume that by the time someone has gotten to +3 and a full IO'ed out build, they should know their character pretty well and will not need to come to the Forums asking a core question about what powerset to choose. I assume that someone who asks that kind of question is fairly new to the game or at least new to controllers. As a result, I think it is appropriate to take into account the experience of leveling up the character.

    and the original poster said that he was making a new character.
  20. The one big exception is Plant Control's Roots. It does twice the damage of other AoE Immobs, which is doubled again by Containment for Controllers, so it is worth slotting for damage. However, once you have capped or nearly capped damage slotted, you can add a proc or two.

    In general, the AoE Immobs have an accuracy penalty, so you want to make sure you have enough accuracy slotted. And depending upon your build, you may want to slot some EndRdx. After that for any AoE Immob other than Roots, load up on procs. (And some procs may do more damage even in Roots than slotting for damage. Just take a look in Mids, but remember that the damage is not "steady.")
  21. Quote:
    Originally Posted by Laevateinn View Post
    I can tell I've touched a nerve. Lemme guess, your main is a /Rad controller? People always get emotional when discussing those.



    The above post somewhat overstates the difficulty of doublestacking -Res patches. Only tar patch is difficult to doublestack, and a standard permahasten build will still have something like 45s duration 25s recharge on it, which is enough to doublestack it a considerable fraction of the time. If you are illusion, then in the first place you will be getting the huge +Rech needed since you will have perma-PA as a build goal.

    Rad vs. other -res sets is complex and you'll have to weigh the benefits of EF being autohit, guaranteed to be up every spawn and costing less casting time vs. the disadvantages of detoggling on mez, anchors dying and no doublestacking. The only thing that can be said for sure is that rad has the lowest peak -res of all sets with -res as every-spawn powers. However one spins it, it's still the only deficiency of an otherwise excellent set. If you want a lot of -res rather than a smaller amount of reliable -res, try another set.
    It is not that you "hit a nerve" so much as I think that folks on the forums often focus so much on the maxed-out numbers in an ideal situation and don't take into account the actual application of the powers in much of the game. Leveling up, folks generally don't have that huge amount of Recharge needed for Perma-Hasten and Perma-PA. I have always felt that if I didn't enjoy playing my character leveling up, I'm not going to bother playing him much at and after level 50. Yet most of the posts on these forums assume that everyone is a +3 Incarnate with a fully maxed out build. Sometimes, other factors need to be considered.

    I agree with your analysis, mostly. There are times that a patch power will be better. There are also times when a foe-anchored, toggled auto-hit debuff will be better. I just think that the "the other sets have higher numbers and can be double-stacked, so they are better" mindset fails to take into account actual uses in the game. For example, try double-stacking that resistance patch on foes like Wolves who ignore Slow and Immobilize. They run around too much. Or . . . if the crowd is bigger than your patch or too spread out, then once your patch is cast, you are stuck until you can re-cast.

    I have always found that Enervating Field is easy to use and almost always available when needed. It can be used starting in low levels and all the way up as you level. If you have one or two foes in one spot, and three or four over there, you don't have to choose to forego the power on this group so you have it available for that group -- which is a choice you have to make sometimes with powers like Freezing Rain, Sleet, Acid Arrow+Disruption Arrow, Tar Patch, etc. I think it is hard to compare EF to the benefits of other sets where the numbers may be higher and there's a chance to double stack under the right conditions. It really depends on Playstyle and circumstances.
  22. Quote:
    Originally Posted by PunkRolex View Post
    I'm really thinking about how ridiculously expensive it can be to pursue IO sets with Defense and Recharge bonuses versus the end result of having a reasonable level of utility. As a /Cold, it's relatively simple to find a place to put groups of 5 Red Fortunes and an LotG, but I'm not sure the overall impact of that investment is going to be seen in the performance of that character. It's very hard to quantify the performance of a relatively low-DPS Controller and while I have several billion inf available to me, I'm not sure spending it on this one is the best investment, even on this toon I'm sure is going to make a quick trip to 50.

    I did buy a Miracle Unique with my first two Hero merits. That seems to have made all the difference in the world as far as my End issues went.
    There is a trend from many posters on these Controller Forums to push for extreme max builds with capped Defense, Recharge and almost everything else. Usually those builds have to sacrifice utility powers or some effective slotting to achieve those build goals.

    It really isn't necessary for every build. For example, my Illusion/Cold has lots of Recharge to get Perma-PA, but his Defense is only what is provided by Ice Armor, Arctic Mist and some incidental Defense from sets chosen for other reasons. With Perma-PA pulling the aggro, invisibility and Deceive, he really doesn't need high defense.

    I have a bunch of level 50 controllers who don't have final fully IO'ed out builds, and yet they are still a lot of fun to play. (I don't have the Influence to fully IO out all of my 35 level 50 characters.) Yeah, they may get an occasional faceplant . . . but debt is so inconsequential in the game today that it really doesn't matter. Besides, playing a squishy who is actually squishy is more of a challenge. Invulnerable characters get boring sometimes. I find it fun to have to use my controls and strategy to keep alive.
  23. Quote:
    Originally Posted by Carnifax_NA View Post
    Dark has one more advantage over Rad, an always-up source of more containment inducing powers via the Dark Servant. Fluffy will immobilize things for you giving you some extra AOE containment options.

    It won't be a replacement for your own AOE immob at all, Fluffy isn't smart enough to do that, but it's something.
    However, Illusion has no AoE damage powers, so it really can't take advantage of AoE containment until it gets an AoE damage power from the Epic power sets. AoE containment really isn't a big issue for an Illusion controller. It gets its "AoE damage" from its pets (who get no benefit of Containment).
  24. Quote:
    Originally Posted by Laevateinn View Post
    Controller damage is as dependent on the primary and APP as it is on the secondary. Illusion lacks an aoe immobilize so it will never have decent aoe damage, however, you can still muster considerable ST dps.


    • Rad does a flat -22.5% res that is not stackable, the lowest of all controller secondaries. It's the only significant shortcoming of an otherwise excellent set. It has the full set of debuffs as well as +rech, +recovery and +dmg that is easily permable (Accelerate Metabolism).

    • Time does -22.5% res that is not stackable, tied with Rad, but using single-target time dilation ups this to -27%. It has the full set of debuffs and +rech, significant +def (all) and +ToHit that is easily permable (Chronoshift/Farsight). The main downside is lack of -Regen, only -150% compared to most sets' -500%.

    • Dark does -60% res from doublestacked tar patches. It has significant +def (all), E/N/Psi resists, +recovery and +regen. Weaknesses include no -Def (fixed by taking tactics) and the -Regen power cannot be made permanent (you have to make up by spamming the targetted heal, which has -50% regen).

    • Storm does -60% res from doublestacked freezing rain. It has minor +def (all) and F/C/E resists. Hurricane, the -ToHit power, knocks back enemies and is difficult to use effectively on a primary without aoe immobilizes that apply -KB. It also lacks a self-heal and -Regen, and gets damaging powers instead.

    • Forcefields and emp do not debuff res, therm and pain cannot have their -res powers up every spawn, sonic, cold and kin have ally shields.
    I'd go with dark personally.
    You said, "Rad does a flat -22.5% res that is not stackable, the lowest of all controller secondaries." Except for the Secondaries that don't have any Resistance Debuff at all, which are FF, Emp and Kinetics. Sonic, Therm and Pain have long Recharges, so their -Resist isn't up all the time.

    Rad's Resistance Debuff is a foe anchored toggle with almost no recharge time. Other sets like Storm, Cold and Dark, have a click patch power which in some cases can be double stacked with a HUGE amount of Recharge. However, on a fast moving team wiping out groups quickly, that clickable Resistance debuff won't be recharged in time to use on every group, while Rad's Enervating Field is always available and is always on until the anchor is killed. If the foes are moving, the debuff area moves with them and you don't have to re-cast it. The toggle nature is really nice on tough foes, since you don't have to interrupt your attack chain every few seconds to re-cast the debuff (and thereby lose out on the damage you would otherwise be doing). The overall effect of all of those benefits may outweigh the higher numbers from some other sets. Yes, there is a problem of having your anchor killed off, but there are some things you can do to reduce that chance (as discussed in my guide).

    I think one should consider the practical aspects of using the power beyond just the numbers.

    Also, you said that the lack of a Defense debuff in Dark can be made up with Tactics? Except that Tactics does not help Phantom Army at all.
  25. Quote:
    Originally Posted by Rigged View Post
    I want to make a new Illusion controller. I plan on doing DFB all the way to 22, so levelling to that point is not particularly a concern. What I want is a secondary that gels very well with Illusion from that point on, preferably to 50 and Incarnate content.

    I've already got a buffer-type controller, so I'm primarily looking for a secondary that debuffs extremely well. I'm not particularly sure how exactly the illusory damage from Phantom Army and Spectral Wounds works. Do -res powers work with them?

    What I would really like is to hit really hard. I primarily solo, and do not want a secondary that is primarily oriented towards shields, because after running kinetics and thermal, I am utterly sick of renewing shields. However, I don't want to be the sort of player who is hugely annoying when I do group with people (so I am somewhat leery of taking /storm, though if I am told it's exactly what I should take, I'll just adjust my playstyle).

    I'm currently leaning towards /rad, but I'm wondering if I can somehow get more -res from another secondary. How well does poison work with an Illuson controller?
    First and foremost, you should read my Illusion/Radiation Guide. See the link in my sig. That will give you an understanding of Spectral (Illusory) Damage and strategies to make best use of it.

    The first thing to consider is whether the secondary will make Phantom Army better. Because PA can't be buffed, you need Defense Debuff, Resistance Debuff and a Recharge buff to get them out faster. Only two secondaries have all three -- Rad and Time. Another advantage of both -- you get a self-heal and a Recovery buff in both sets.

    If you choose to go with a set other than Rad or Time (or Kinetics), then you will need to build for a lot more Recharge if you hope for a Perma-PA build. Kinetics can get a Recharge buff from Siphon Speed (must have foes to siphon off of), but Kinetics lacks Defense and Resistance Debuffs. It also has some synergy problems with Phantasm's knockback, and because Kinetics puts you in melee when Illusion is really better as a ranged set.

    I have played Ill/Rad (x2), Ill/Storm, Ill/TA, Ill/Cold, Ill/Time all to incarnate levels. Storm, TA and Cold all lack a self-heal and a recharge buff, but all three are great sets with Illusion. I rank Rad as the best overall secondary, as it is very flexible, develops early, it is not too clicky, works great solo or on teams. There are 2 clearly skippable powers (Choking Cloud and Fallout), giving you room for other good stuff.

    After Rad, I find it hard to rank Time and Cold, as both work really well with Illusion. I would put Storm 4th, but a really fun build. I would put Trick Arrow 5th, but Ill/Dark might rank above Ill/TA. Ill/Dark might even be comparable to Ill/Storm. Therm is a pretty good set as a mix of Emp, Rad and Sonic, but it has those shields you don't want. Kinetics is a very powerful team buff set, but it has some synergy problems with Illusion. Ill/Emp is a good team healer (which you don't want). Sonic, Poison and FF I would put at the bottom of the list.

    Time is a very good set with Illusion, but it is late developing with two key powers coming at 35 and 38. The Resistance Debuff is lower than Rad's. It has some nice powers and works well with Illusion, but the aura power puts you in melee if you use it. However, if you are the kind of person who wants to build for Defense, Time may be better than Rad for you. (I rely upon the distraction of PA, invisibility and lots of Deceive instead of Defense.)

    Cold has really strong single target debuffs, so it is the best AV killer (but lacks that Recharge buff so you have to get it from sets). Cold has a few of the best powers from Storm, but is a late developing set and has those shields you don't like. Still, a lot of people prefer Cold as the best secondary for Illusion.

    Storm has such a great collection of fun powers, but Ill/Storm is one of the most chaotic builds in the game -- chaos is fine solo, but you have to try to limit the chaos on teams and restrict your use of some powers. Freezing Rain gives you both Resistance and Defense debuffs early, along with some added control. Storm is just a lot of fun, with great visual aspects to the powers, extra damage in the late levels, and a great "protective" power in Hurricane. The lack of a self-heal and the high demand for endurance are its biggest problems.

    I haven't played Ill/Dark -- I'm working on a Dark/Dark. But I can see where there would be a nice synergy between the Illusion and Dark. Dark lacks that Recharge buff, the heal requires a siphon and it lacks Defense debuff . . . but it has a lot of nice powers and an extra pet. The ToHit Debuff is really strong.

    Trick Arrow add some really nice additional control and AoE damage, and it is a pure debuff/control set so you don't have to worry about buffing. But TA really lacks -Regen for AVs. It really works for a different, all ranged playstyle. You can send in PA, then stand at a distance to fire off all your arrows, then attack from range, then fire some more arrows, etc.

    Try Rad after reading my guide. You won't regret it.