Great_Scott

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With the ability to fix the weaknesses in the set with just one powerpool I'd say its a fairly good trade to the number 1 killer of all brutes. A complete lack of endurance.


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Which one power pool would that be?

Remember, we're not just talking about a lack of knockback protection here. We're talking about a lock of knockback protection AND a lack of immobilization protection AND a lack of a self heal. That's a tricky combination of weaknesses to counter, and I don't see one pool that will do it.

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I'm not sure that I understand the set yet, having not played it past 12th.

Don't get me wrong - I complain about power-set inequalities better than anyone. However, I think that the current complaints are a little premature.

While it's annoying that the set doesn't have Immobilization protection, I consider KB to be a non-issue, since this set is arranged similarly to /Fire, and inherits /Fire's lack of protection.

Also, a self-heal, while nice, isn't really required.

The set DOES have Grounded, which is extremely nice, and the Endurance Drain protection along with the Endurance Drain powers is a nice combination.

While from a Tank's perspective the set may be sub-par (not sure), the Brute's premium on run-speed and endurance-use makes this look like a winner, overall... so far.

Once I get to SO's and have more of the higher-tier powers I'll be in better shape to give the final analysis.

Does anyone have a PvE-centric Level 20+ Elec/Elec Brute? If so, what are your findings?

Thanks,
-> Scott.

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TA is going in the right direction, but it still needs a little more work.

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I disagree. Trying to shoehorn a Controller Primary into a Defender Primary is very difficult, if not outright insanity.

While I appreciate that the "pairing" of Trick Arrow and Archery neccessitated making it a Defender power-set, that doesn't mean that the core set design (which is good) "fits" the Defender AT.

The best solution that I can see is to buff the set more, and then deny it to Controllers... sort of how Dark Miasma works now.

The whole concept of "Blast Set must be paired with Control set" is the source of the evil, though, and until that idea is exposed as problem-causing, everything else is a band-aid.

Ideally, Trick Arrow would be re-named and the powers recycled into a Controller Primary set, and the current animations would be re-used for an entirely new Defender set. I don't see that as likely, though.

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This changes one of my rules of thumb for PvE which is that the first time I see a mastermind pull out a weapon of their own, I want to kick them from the team. It means that they're drawing more aggro than any corruptor can keep up with on their fragile selves, and time they spend making their own attacks is time that they're not managing their minions.

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I guess you would be kicking me, then! It took me about five minutes of not-much thought when I first rolled my MM, but I figured out that if I Aid Another my toughest pet I do additional damage while they keep aggro. Since my MM isn't hurting for Endurance (yet) I do a lot of extra damage-over-time that way, and I don't get killed while dealing it.

This might be an advanced concept, though - I don't see a lot of MMs using their attacks...

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I think I suddenly see why you thought it wasn't painfully stupid to give masterminds three personal attacks in their patron power pools. I still don't think I agree. I would rather that at least one patron offered a status defense, and that at least one patron offered combat invisibility, and that at least one patron offered some kind of minion travel-power buff, and the fourth some kind of click-power long-recharge self heal or hit point buff like Dull Pain.

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Those would be overpowered abilities, wouldn't they? Besides - the entire point of the EPPs is to give an AT tools that belong to another one. This is why Blasters get armors, and Controllers get Blasts. AoE attacks are precisely what MM's don't get in their own power sets. It's about diversity, not power...

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Could you at least consider replacing the totally useless Follow Aggressive command with a Bodyguards button that does /petcom_all follow defensive?

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I hope not! I use Follow Aggressive all the time - it reduces personal aggro, especially where there is a spawn nearby that I didn't see.

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The only thing I disagree with is the part about not saying anything to the enemy - ever bit. I have some wonderful conversations about anything under the sun with my opponent(s) when I'm on my Brute or Scrapper.

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Actually, PVP play is somewhat frustrating.

When I play my Defenders, I'm invincible... and when I'm playing normally, it's death-o-rama. Neither never-dying nor always-dying is a lot of fun, and there doesn't seem to be a lot of middle-ground.

The chats that Stalkers and I share while combat rages around us are cool, though.

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That's why I always felt guilty about taking Aid Self, back before everyone knew how awesome it is. >_>


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Strictly speaking, there is no such thing as "back before everyone knew how awesome it was".

As a pool power that was under the radar for 5 full Issues, Aid Self was never "awesome". It still isn't "awesome" today.

The effect you are noting is actually "this power was never rebalanced to suck like the Primary/Secondary Defensive powers were".

Really, it should be nerfed. Since Fire Armor isn't going to be overpowered any time soon, all that Aid Self is really accomplishing is a delay in the "day or reckoning" that all the Defese sets so desperately need.

Or to say it more simply; We need to remove the crutches so the sets fall down, go boom, and get improved. Aid Self is a garden-variety crutch.

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Here's a rather shocking outcome. It does look like bubble defenders might return to their old glory days.

I'm going off hero builder numbers here, so if these are wrong, someone please correct me.

Deflection/Insulation Shield: 14% defense
Dispersion Bubble: 9.25% defense

3 even-level Schedule B SOs is a modifier of 1.573, for a total of (0.140+0.925)*1.573 = 36.57% defense.

A +3 Archvillain has a 97.5% accuracy (capped, of course, at 95%). This is obtained through a rank modifier of 1.5 and a level modifier of 1.3.

1.3 * 1.5 * 0.5 = 0.975

Now, defense is directly subtracted from the base toHit.

1.3 * 1.5 * (0.5-.366) = 0.262

1 - 0.262/0.95 = <b>72% reduction</b> in hit rate. This is an amazing reduction.

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Whee. It sure is. Sorry, UberGuy, but I'm not "feeling the power".

Do you know what that "impressive" number means? It means that people I protect have a final 28% chance to be hit.

That seems great until you realize that Battle Maiden, say, only needs to hit a 'squishy' twice to kill them. "One death per seven swings, on average, might be less" sounds a lot less impressive, but is another way to express that exact same number.

In-game, this is not the same thing as "taking 28% damage"! Play with FF Defenders against a serious +Con mob sometime, and you will get to experience the same "Hey, I'm invincible! *BAM* Oops, burst damage! Whoa, I'm dead!" gameplay that /Regen Characters currently enjoy.

+Defense is only helpful in large amounts.

Anything else and either you're playing Russian roulette or you don't need the +Defense to begin with. There's a reason that all my FF Defenders have the medicine pool, and it's got nothing to do with RP'ing or Character themes...

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Maybe the corruptor shouldn't stand there like a moron and eat the damage.

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Actually, my Defenders do.

Mobility is, sadly, not the key to PvP defenses. Due to travel suppression, active offense precludes defense, and the problem becomes worse when your offense is ranged.

Impunity is the key to PvP defenses, as it takes mobility (and everything else) out of the equation.

The key to impunity is buffs, as most debuffs become unreliable in PvP play, due to enemy action (retreating, using inspirations, etc).

The only sure defense is status protection and two or more of the following:

1. +Resists
2. Healing
3. +Defense


In that order of importance.

When my friend and I play our Sonic/Sonic Defenders, I don't really care what an PvP opponent does to me, since the -ACC debuffs don't bother me (I can outwait them, or use Amplify(Aim)), Slows don't bother me (I can outlive them, or use a high-damage attack and not worry about recharge), and any -Damage that heads my way is offset by the -Resist effects in my attacks.

Other status effects are what Clarity is for (stacked five times, natch).

With four or six +Resist "bubbles" on each Character and two/three-stacked Leadership (all three toggles), and the Medicine pool available to each character, it's largely irrelevant what tactics any opponents use.

Which is important - I can't second-guess what will happen in a free-for-all PvP zone, so I simply plan to make any and all opposition impotent.

You might ask "is that fair?". That's an excellent question! Let's look at the uses of a PvP zone:

1. PvE missions. Getting into a fair fight on the way to/from a PvP mission is uninteresting to me, personally. If I wanted to experience the "joy" of being defeated by my peers, I'd be running around the zone like a chicken with its head cut off, not running a mission.

2. Grandstanding. "Look what I can do" loses its appeal if you die instantly after saying that (ask a Blaster if you don't know what I mean). However, challenging any and all comers, and then "training" 10-15 opposing Characters around the zone can be great fun...for both sides. Sometimes, Stalkers will become obsessed with defeating me, and then everyone can have a good time.

Occasionally, a Dominator will get Domination and actually hold one of us through stacked Clarity, but that's not a problem - Dominators need to feel powerful sometimes, too.

3. PvP play. In the odd occasion that I feel like defeating other players (typically when asked to help by a friend getting beaten severely), I don't play to lose. Particularly when helping a friend out, I play to annihilate all opposition. While something can be said for fair-play, a game that allows the Stalker AT to exist isn't really geared toward one-on-one balance. If I'm going to be doing something that I don't really enjoy, I'd rather not be bad at it as well.

In neither of the three cases I'd be traipsing around Warburg does "fairness" concern me.


I'd submit that PvP games are all about who has the advantage, and anyone that thinks differently simply hasn't played WoW or EQ2 or AC2 or... well, any other MMO that allows for PvP. While it's nice that PvP play has no penalty in CoX (which is the only reason I'd be caught dead in a PvP zone - ha ha), that also means that there really isn't any point, either.

Oddly, this seems to be a good plan (Crypic is always genius on the initial implementation of something, nice), since only people that really care about PvP play even bother, and there isn't any "loot" to be had that would "force" people into PvP zones.

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That is totally bogus.... It will make Stalkers even more uber as the unseen killers in PvP, now it will make it funner to be sneaky myself and smack em while they line up a sniper shot, but being pounded by them doesn't sound fun....

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I don't generally have problems with Stalkers.... but then again, I don't enter PvP zones to fight fair, either.

Typically, two /FF or /Sonic Defenders helps out a lot... I haven't been able to get an all-Controller team together, but that might work better than all-Defender teams; I'm not sure.

Heroes don't have anything to worry about even in a fair fight, though - specialization always wins, since you can start out good at something and further tweak it.

The Villain ATs are too diversified, and diversity doesn't help much in PvP. You need to be better than the other guy at something, but, for example, Dominators and Corruptors aren't better than any AT at anything.

Allright, Gabe, now I'm jealous.

When Issue 6 hit, I posted this kind of post.

The devs stepped on it so hard I'm not sure that anyone read it.

I did really like how it turned out, though - I was fresh out of "uber" and hopping mad; the post was about as harsh as anything I've seen, but technically contained no profanity.

Good luck with your post!
-> Scott.

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Most of the posts regarding ED I have seen are at least 60% against it, if not more. Is there anything being done about it?

James

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Actually, ED on it's own isn't so bad.

Do I think it was needed? No.
Do I think that it helped as much as it hurt? No.
Am I willing to put up with it for the sake of other players? Sure.

The real "problem" with ED isn't a problem at all. It's the Issue 5 defense nerfing combined with ED that is a problem.

While it's nice that the Devs proposed two solutions and used both (lowered mob to-hit, and soon will release a new +Defense model in I7), the simple facts are:

1. Removing the Issue 5 changes is WAY simpler than rewriting your Defense code.

2. Removing the Issue 5 changes means that you don't need to tweak the mob's to-hit values, get them wrong, and tweak them some more.

3. Removing the Issue 5 changes means that +Resist passive powers work, and while I'm sure that they will get buffed eventually, we don't really want that to take 8+ months (or Issue 8) to happen.

4. All of the above reworking has taken Dev time away from developing new content. While it's great if the new changes work properly (which will need testing), that doesn't suddenly give all the time wasted on reworking Defenses back to the Devs.

Sadly, since they've blown 7 months of their time fixing something they could have rolled back, we won't see them do that now. The best we can hope for it that some of the Invuln and Fire +Resists get buffed, but, as any other change, that also will take more developer time away from new content.

It's really depressing and sad to write this, but once again, here we are, campaigning to fix something that didn't need to be broken... and will get fixed... someday.

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Thanks Posi, you just saved me a boat load of Amy farming...lol

Its nice to know that we will have a future way of getting this badge.

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I must have skipped the part where this is a bad thing?

Is there something "unfun" about getting a weird badge and showing it to other Villains?

Help me, I'm not getting it...

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Glad that's your opinion. My Invuln tank can handle 17 +3 foes no sweat. even non smashing leathal ones, as aid self is a great tool. Maybe your play style needs some altering?

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Go hawk your wares elsewhere snake oil peddler!

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Sigh. He's not peddling anything, he's just playing a /Regen Tank. It really doesn't matter what his non-stone power set even is: Dull Pain + Health +Aid Self = Most of the capabilities of /Regen.

And, of course, as long as your +Defense powers and +Resist powers are good for something (doesn't need to be much), a high healing rate solves most problems.

Of course, there are those Tanks that choose not to take the Medicine pool.

Their performance is somewhat less...

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I'm most familiar with SR, so I'll use that as an example: After I5, we were able to offset the major reduction in our Defense Buffs by 6-slotting the auto and toggle powers. But since these powers only take one type of enhancment (Defense Buffs), with one stroke (update) ED made SR one of the weakest powersets... Yes, they added some Damage Resistance to the "auto" powers, that takes effect the more health you lose, but after playing this way for months, this small addition, although slightly more helpful, is simply not enough.

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The "job" of a +Defense set, if every power is taken and fully slotted, is to floor white-con to-hit.

5% damage taken (on average), just like capped resists in most Tank sets. The original reason that this wasn't a problem for Tanks and Scrappers to both have equivalent +Defense mitigation is Tanks have more HPs and defense options than just +Defense, and the SR set didn't.

I understand the reductions to /SR, they were reduced to match reductions in other sets.

I don't understand the +Resists the passive powers were given. Why buff the set in this way? Why buff it at all? Oh, that's right, the +Defense values were too low.

I don't want /SR to play like a reversed version of /Invuln. They simply need to raise the base bonus of the powers by 3-5%...

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I keep a large database of Statesman's posts. Never once have I found anything I can class as a lie. Never once has anyone been able to provide proof of a lie.

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The /Regen testing post is a gross mistruth, if not a direct lie.

As was the "Deal with the Issue 5 changes by 6-slotting your powers".

You clearly have both these posts archived, so I won't link to them...

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Heh, seems like calling a power "situational" is the kiss of death.

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Seems like? A "situational" power, by definition, is a power that is of NO help some of the time.

I'd rather take powers I can use in most any situation, Thanks.

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Isn't winning a difficult fight cool? I think it is.

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I think so, too!

Bummer that what I consider to be "difficult", depends on the following:

1. Team or Solo?
2. Which AT?
3. While Power set/Build?
4. My mood?
5. Am I playing seriously or killing time?

... but that's just me. 1-5 aren't just different every time I play, but they are different for other people, too.

This is yet another reason why the game needs to be "too easy"... you can always fight a tougher villain group on a higher setting, but how do you make it easier?

The reason that Defenders have not been nerfed yet is that most player, most of the time, don't play them.

Once everyone is playing Defenders (look for this soon), then they will be adjusted.

Only the "Known" powers get nerfed. I have no idea if this is because not enough time is spent on Balancing (really, this is a bad thing), or if the Players are really THAT inventive.

I can say from personal experience that 2 hours with Hero Planner and good knowledge of the game will reveal many, many "exploits".

I don't understand how someone whose 40-hour-a-week job is "CoX", even if power balance isn't a major component of their job, doesn't know more than many players.

Let me guess, does WW still pre-emp power animation rooting? A major "balance" feature to blast sets?

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Also, someone earlier mentioned team tp is a useless power. I use it all the time on one of my characters and no I won't say how or why. But it is FAR from useless.

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I love this. Nothing says "Over-nerfing" like "not going to post my strategy because it will get removed".

This is yet another red-flag, but it either isn't seen or isn't important. Maybe we should use another flag color, for a change of pace?

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You think Stone is bad NOW? At least you're no longer a walking poo.

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I remember that too...



**shudder**

Fair enough.

Would still like to be able to personalize my power effects though

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This change actually ruined a Hero of mine.

The "Flaming Excremental" was a Stone/Fire Tank that had a bind list a mile long. I miss him.

"THIS POO BURNS FOR JUSTICE!" is still the best battle cry I've ever come up with.

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heres an interesting question.. instead of complaining about ED, and getting nothing done, why
not accept that ED is in the past, and will likely NEVER be removed as a whole. instead of using
your time, effort, and resoruces to complain about what has happened to you, and why your
min/max toons have seen this GIANT hit in recent days, why not Look to the future, and tell the
devs what you would like to see them add...

Quit fighting the past. if you want to complain about somthing, so it while the patch/update is
still on test, and the decision hasn't been set in stone. giving up on something has no purpose,
but accepting change, and offering suggestions to make the game AS IT IS NOW better would likely
get far better results.


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Cool. Let's do that. I've got a Concept Hero that was great in Issues 1, 2, 3, and 4, but lost solo-ability in Issue 5 and the reason to exist in Issue 6.

While Issue 5 isn't going away (although it should), the ED changes that affect Sprint, Swift, Hurdle, and Hover shold be looked at.

Here's an example of one of my toons on Protector, currently level 20. I had a concept of a Hero that was really, really fast... but didn't have a "super-speed" power. This Hero would have a cybernetic body, which would be tough, but not "tank"-level, and have no glowing power effects, other than Quick (which looks neat) and possibly glowing attacks.

So I picked Tank AT, Invuln/EM, and tried to make a "Scrapper" out of it.

Weird? Sure. Downright bizarre build. Who roleplays a "6-million-dollar Elf"? I did... until I6.

The only reason that this Hero is still on the server is that I haven't gotten around to deleting her yet. Beating base SuperSpeed with Sprint was great fun, however - as was finding Tech Run-Speed DO's without a tech contact.

This was a viable "Scrank" build, circa issue 4 - able to aid a team and solo a bit:

---------------------------------------------
Exported from Ver: 1.7.5.0 of the CoH_CoV Character Builder
---------------------------------------------
Name: Traffic
Level: 50
Archetype: Tanker
Primary: Invulnerability
Secondary: Energy Melee
---------------------------------------------
01) --> Resist Physical Damage==> DmgRes(1)DmgRes(3)DmgRes(3)DmgRes(11)
01) --> Barrage==> Acc(1)
02) --> Energy Punch==> Acc(2)Dmg(46)Dmg(46)
04) --> Dull Pain==> Heal(4)
06) --> Resist Elements==> DmgRes(6)DmgRes(7)DmgRes(7)DmgRes(19)
08) --> Flurry==> Acc(8)Dmg(37)Dmg(37)Dmg(37)Dmg(43)Dmg(43)
10) --> Combat Jumping==> Jump(10)
12) --> Resist Energies==> DmgRes(12)DmgRes(13)DmgRes(13)DmgRes(23)
14) --> Swift==> Run(14)Run(15)Run(15)Run(17)Run(17)Run(19)
16) --> Hurdle==> Jump(16)
18) --> Health==> Heal(18)Heal(23)Heal(25)Heal(25)Heal(27)Heal(27)
20) --> Stamina==> EndMod(20)EndMod(21)EndMod(21)EndMod(29)EndMod(29)EndMod(31)
22) --> Jump Kick==> Acc(22)Dmg(45)Dmg(46)
24) --> Acrobatics==> EndRdx(24)
26) --> Bone Smasher==> Acc(26)Dmg(45)Dmg(45)
28) --> Aid Other==> IntRdx(28)Rechg(31)Heal(33)Heal(33)Heal(34)Heal(34)
30) --> Aid Self==> IntRdx(30)Rechg(31)Heal(34)Heal(36)Heal(36)Heal(36)
32) --> Resuscitate==> IntRdx(32)Rechg(33)
35) --> Energy Transfer==> Acc(35)Dmg(39)Dmg(39)Dmg(39)Dmg(40)Dmg(40)
38) --> Total Focus==> Acc(38)Dmg(40)Dmg(42)Dmg(42)Dmg(42)Dmg(43)
41) --> Build Up==> Rechg(41)
44) --> Whirling Hands==> Acc(44)
47) --> Hasten==> Rechg(47)Rechg(48)Rechg(48)Rechg(48)Rechg(50)Rechg(50)
49) --> Whirlwind==> EndRdx(49)EndRdx(50)
---------------------------------------------
01) --> Power Quick==> Run(1)Run(5)Run(5)Run(9)Run(9)Run(11)
01) --> Sprint==> Jump(1)
01) --> Brawl==> Acc(1)
02) --> Rest==> Rechg(2)
01) --> Gauntlet==> Empty(1)
---------------------------------------------


Now it can't solo on Heroic... at least, not in the early 20's against Tsoo.

What would fix this situation?

I'm not sure. The passive +Resists in Invulnerability are too low, for starters, and Health can't be 6-slotted any more. 6-slot damage, and play like a "Scrapper"?

No longer possible, and I'm missing the slots to do a lot of single-target damage at my level anyway.

I could, of course, respec into a regular Invuln/EM Tank. This would be completely pointless, as I have five other Tanks that are higher level, two of which are also Invuln/EM.

As far as "Balance" concerns go, I have an observation, and a question.

My observation is: The reason that sets like "Invulnerability" can't be played in different ways, is that there is no reason NOT to take every power. If /Invuln offered decent +Resists and decent +Defenses, then a player taking every power would be too strong, according to people who care about such things.

My Question: How can power-sets be played differently without becoming overpowered if every power is taken? If that question could be answered, then a lot of powers would be allowed to be better, and a lot of "build creativity" would return.

Of course, my personal opinion, as always, is that recent balance changes are akin to killing your pet gerbil with a flamethrower... senseless, yet overdone.

Thanks for reading.
-> Scott.

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My intent was to show that 6 slotting of stamina prior to ED had a much greater return than it does 6 slotting it now.

According to some of the number crunchers on the forums 6 slotting Stamina pre-ED and Post-ED combined with the Global Endurance Reduction are equivalent.

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Not true. You're correct that the END use stayed the same (the 13% reduction pretty much equals the 3 lost slots in Stamina). Isn't it great to be correct?

Too bad you "forgot" to acknowledge that ED = less damage = more attacks used = more endurance spent.

So, yes, Stamina was "balanced against". Bummer your END-usage equation is totally wrong, though.

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And that is the entire problem with pre-ED COH. The fact was, in the old days, 6 slotting hasten and 6 slotting stamina gave BETTER returns per slot than 6 slotting other powers. That made those 12 slots more 'valuable' than 6 slotting powers in primaries and secondaries. In other words, everyone 6 slotted hasten and stamina, because 6 slotting an attack didn't have the same game payout, slot per slot, than those two powers had. That is why I have always been supportive of ED.

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Yes, Yes. And 4 slots in Leadership->Tactics (1 ENDRED, 3 To-Hit) replaces any need for Accuracy (or, at the least, saves one Accuracy slot) for any Defender, Controller, Corruptor, or Mastermind who takes it. If two team members have it, it can even replace Accuracy for any AT.

I hate to break this to you, but "toon building" is basically a euphemism for "slot efficiency", so any power that covers for any other power is a balance issue.

I don't understand your attitude at all. Are you honestly trying to claim that player knowledge should be punished? Are you stating that "playing well" does not, and should not, include planning out your Character?

Either you are, which involves depriciating other's effort...
Or you aren't, which means you have a weak argument.

I await your response.

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Does anyone else here think that Street Fighting is useless and they should just remake MA to include both punches and kicks together??

Because just like how an all kicking power set is annoying, wouldnt an all punching set be just as dumb??

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No. Both Kick and Jump Kick (from the pools) are decent attacks. Just as I take both Air Superiority and Boxing for my /MA toons, I would likely take Kick/Jump Kick for my "Street fighting" toons.

Actually, the power pool kicks fit "Street fighting" much better than the power pool punches fit the "MA" set, in my opinion...

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K, Xero, let's talk about "fun". I'm going to describe an in-game event that happened to me recently.

I was playing two Sonic/Sonic Defenders in Warburg.

Player X was playing a Claws/Energy Stalker in Warburg.

I was standing around in the middle (water area) of the zone, looking up my contact info... and "STAB!", Barrier Double loses half her health. Thank goodness for double Dispersion field! That would have been a one-shot!

I wonder why I didn't see him, since I have two Tactics up... triple-Stealthed? Weird.

I see the Stalker, so I target him with one of my toons and shoot back. Weird, the other toon isn't firing... ah, Aid Another doesn't work in PvP - forgot.

He SuperSpeeds away. I heal myself to full (medicine pool power) and get back to my Contacts screen.

At this point I keep an eye on my second monitor, and make sure that no one else is getting too close. I see some Brutes get close, and then leave. I guess they didn't feel like soloing against 2 Sonics?

"Stab!" Double Barrier loses half her health. Same Stalker as before. I target him with Shout, but he's too far away to hit, and I only tag him once. He SuperSpeeds off. Allright, now I'm annoyed.

I start hunting for this Stalker, using one of my Heroes by herself as bait. As soon as I start to see him, I jumped down from the building I was standing on, and manage to target him with both toons.

He sticks around until he's at half-health, and keeps attacking for minimal damage. Maybe he had to stay due to SS suppression? In any event, he Speeds away again.

I go to my mission, and come out. "STAB!" there he is again. I try to follow him, but he's just impossible to see. As I'm somewhat irritated, I hang around for him to attack again.

I try 6-stacking Clarity on myselves. No effect. Finally, after about 4 more attacks, I get a /Tell: "Die Already!"... to which I respond "Stop Hiding Already!".

Five minutes later I leave the zone.

Kills (Me): 0
Kills (Him): 0
Time spent (Me and Him): 45+ minutes.
Fun (Me and Him): None. A complete and total waste of time.

Games where neither side can win are no just un-fun, but a complete waste of time. I won't be bothering to hang around Warburg on Protector again any time soon.

I do have a question: why did my self-buffs work? I was under the impression that there was penetrating damage in PvP?

I hope this helps,
-> Scott.

[/ QUOTE ]

Glad you are speaking for someone else.

So, you were reading your contacts list in a pvp zone? Smart.

Why didn't you see him? Uhm, cause you were reading your contacts list, in a PVP zone.

If you don't like PVP then don't go in a PVP zone.

And last time I checked you can check your contacts info in any zone.......

[/ QUOTE ]

Speaking for someone else? He TOLD me that this was, and I quote, "boring and unfun". I agreed.

I can read my contacts in the middle of a PvP if I want. Why not? That's what capped +Resists are for - ignoring the downsides of PvE missions in PvP zones...

I don't know why I didn't see him until his attack sequence went off. I wish someone could answer that for me. From Castle's posts, +Perception shrinks the reduced view distance that +Stealth powers give.

I can only conclude that Tactics x 2 and Clarity X 6 is still "range 0" for Hide + Stealth + Super Speed. If true, that's a balance problem.

I had no choice but to enter the PvP zone - one of my missions is very old and I'm saving for SG members (each toon has a badge mission, L12-ish), and the second mission was an old Hunt mission I had finished, and hadn't visited the contact in FF to clear. The Warburg missions were all I had up.

You managed to totally miss the point, though, which was that I had no possiblity of defeating him, and he has very little possibility of defeating me.

Zero sum combats, are, for a lot of people, slow, boring, and painful.

[ QUOTE ]
Even if everyone
who ever used the tactic in question only ever played solo, its use would spread and trivialize
the game for more and more people.

[/ QUOTE ]

You haven't yet adequately explained why trivializing the game is bad. I'm sure it is, although I only bother playing CoH to trivialize it (for good reasons, mind you)

I'd post that argument here, but I don't want to overload you, since you haven't responded to my first post, yet.