Galactor

Originally Posted by macskull

Welcome to the US servers... we really do need more good players here, hope you have fun.

Originally Posted by SmegHead

Macskull has a good fire/ss build posted here.

Ignore soultouch. Hes bad.

Originally Posted by NovaThunder

Yak, yak, yak. That how I hear from you guys

Originally Posted by Pwn Masta General

like i said, freedumb is filled with noobs ever since the AE epidemic, plus all the good players are in justice

Originally Posted by Sharker_Quint

leave it to sentry to turn another "for fun" thread in the PvP section into a garbage disposal for his mouth. seriously dude, STFU. just because you can't understand that zone PvP is where duels do not belong doesn't give you the right to come to the forums and ruin a section where PvP'ers have fun. if it wouldn't be a waste of $10 to transfer a toon to your server to make you my ***** i do it in a heart beat. do us all a favor and stay out of the PvP threads. kthxbai.

Originally Posted by macskull

Put two balanced and roughly comparable 8-man teams into the arena. Put one team on Vent, and let the other rely on team chat for communication. All else being equal, the team on Vent will win every time because they can communicate in real time and everyone can be speaking up without having to stop to type or fumble for keybinds.

Originally Posted by Shadowjack

Could someone with knowledge of the range DR curve respond to this? I slot my psi/em blaster's main attacks with 3 rng/dam HOs, 2 Acc IOs, and a proc. Adding in Boost Range, is this just overkill after DR is applied?

PS, sorry to derail your thread, OP.

Originally Posted by FourSpeed

All the hormones aside I'm gonna comment on the original "budget"
topic.

First and foremost I'd think about these points:

1> PvP is a knowledge-based skill proposition. By this, I mean simply:
Player > Build... I know guys that are viciously effective with nothing
more than SO's, and a few that can't fight their way out of a paper bag
with signs pointing to the exit. I've been surprised in some of those latter
cases to Info their build and see Accolades and "Ultimate" bonuses listed in
some of them. Go Figure.

2> That said, Build can matter and impact your success. In general, a
great build (read expensive) is more forgiving of your mistakes and will
also typically give you more survival/win options than a build with just SO's.

Personally, cheaper builds, to some degree, teach you how to play better,
although it is definitely the School of Hard Knocks diploma you'll be earning
if you go that route. That's not necessarily a bad thing.

3> Who are you? How do you play? Do you care if you get killed, or would
you avoid PvP entirely if you get killed? I can guarantee you two things in
PvP: 1> You *will* get killed 2> Unless you're a complete tardaloo, you
*will* get some kills too... No matter what you build.

How you want that ratio to go, should be a big factor in what you build
and how expensive you want to go with it considering points 2 & 3.

With SO's, you can literally build on a bare-bones, shoestring budget of 10
million or so. Decent sets, a few Procs (Kismet, Karma, Stealth etc.), and
a fully IO'd build (even if some are Commons) will run roughly 100-500 million
depending on what you're building. Purples, PvP sets, along with all the
bells and whistles can set you back 1-5 Billion or more.

The final thought I'll leave you with: It isn't the price of the build that dictates
your success or failure in PvP. It's what you learn and how you apply it.

However, your build will have a bearing on how easy/hard it is to gain that
knowledge and typically, how many hospital trips it takes to get to a ratio
you're happy with.

GL & Happy Hunting.


4


PS> While you can go ultra expensive on any build, Stalkers, Blasters, and Corrs
are a few that you can go pretty cheap on and still be effective... Doms, Trollers,
less so.

Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect

I was replying specifically to black_barrier, because I have noted his habit of berating anyone...

Originally Posted by black_barrier

defenders are trash.
there is nothing a defender can do that corruptor or controller can't do better.

Originally Posted by JonnyDeadSide

I have always been irritated about how useless bounty is once you become even mediocre on a toon. I very recently re-upped my account and FINALLY got my brother and his RL friend to come into pvp with me. I took them to sirens, gave them a brief rundown of the zone, we took a quick tour of the boundaries and we were off and running. They actually enjoyed themselves so much it has re-kindled their interest in, not only the game itself, but to take their builds much more seriously.
Needless to say they burned through their inspires fairly quickly the first 30 mins we were in there, but they were managing their inspire use just fine, making a tray-full last for almost 2 hours, after being there a while.(maybe a "little" less than 2 hours, as I was feeding them the ones i wasn't using and some that I had spent my bounty rewards on for them so they didnt have to leave the zone.)
But......by nights end(some 4-5 hours later), my brother and his friend both asked me "why is the bounty we collected only good for medium inspires and cheap to get SO's, why does my bounty total go away if I leave the zone or log out, and why would a PvP player even want the SO's?"
I couldnt give them a good answer.....

So...I'm asking, why can't the bounty actually mean something more than inspires and SO's? I rarely burn through more than a tray of inspires in a few hour session. The SO's are truely useless to me and I suspect most feel the same way?
What would be so terrible about allowing the bounty to NOT disappear everytime we leave the zone and/or log out, but rather allowing it to accumulate so that the bounty collected can be turned into actually be put towards purchasing something that will improve my build or other toons I'm building, like merits/tickets and such?
It honestly makes no sense to me and apparently not to pvp new-comers either.

Is this ever going to change? I sure would like to rack up 50,000-100,000 in bounty and trade it in for a recipe that I don't want to pay for, or one that I cannot get my hands on because there aren't any available, like a gladiators armor resistance recipe or something like that...(somewhat rare, but hey, it happens)

I know....*ahem*...I mean...I "believe" the pvp recipe drop rates are horribly scarce to drop as it is, and this or something "like" this would really help that out a bunch. I would think it could be implemented into all pvp zones without a poop-ton of work, no?

I can't tell you how many times i've logged out of sirens with a bunch of leftover bounty going to waste because i have a full tray of inspires and....well....who the heck wants SO's anymore.....
Have the devs ever even considered changing this, I'm very curious.

TIA

Originally Posted by Bill Z Bubba

What happens is the same thing that happens now:

Those that have figured out how to afk farm for PvP drops get rich.

Originally Posted by macskull

It's because cages are considered a mez (god knows why, but they are). Still think they need to last like 10 or 12 seconds and be standardized across all ATs, and have the immob removed for PvP, but that's just me.

Originally Posted by Supermax

When I13 came out I predicted that flying sniping blasters would become FotM, so I respecced mine to it, and paved the way for all the bad ones lol.

Originally Posted by Roman_

Very nice, it's funny how most of RV did not believe you heh.

Now, keep PvP'ing with that Stalker until you crit again and ALL the procs fire off lol. Then come back here with a update.

Originally Posted by Galactic_Blaze

LOL Flying/sniping Blasters





The Flying/Sniping Corruptor is where it's at. :P

Originally Posted by macskull

I haven't been in Siren's Call on any server since a few days before I14 launched, and I certainly wouldn't IO a character just for Siren's level, wtf are you talking about?

Are you still trying to badly play that hoversniping Energy/Energy Blaster in RV or did you finally realize you suck and quit PvPing?

Originally Posted by macskull

Currently there's a bug where if someone gets mezzed, their toggle knockback protection will suppress and they'll get KB'd (to test this, just have someone hit you with KO Blow when you're running your melee toggle mez protection). I've filed numerous bug reports on this and have sent PMs to the appropriate rednames, so we can only hope it's been fixed in I16.

Side effect of that is Acrobatics suppresses as well, so even if you get 40 points of KB protection, Acro will still be making up about 10 of that - if someone mezzes you and then hits you with Levitate, you'll still get KB'd even though you should have enough KB protection to stop that.

Originally Posted by _Meldash_

KU, KD, KB, it's all the same. Do you have to buy KU SO's, or KD SO's or sets for KnockUp and KnockDown? No you don't...

So yes...I'd say it is working as intended. If you have the appropriate amount of KB res Levitate and Lift will do nothing to you.

l2p

Originally Posted by Ravens_NA

I have been crying those same tears since i13, to be honest a melee toon can rival a doms or trollers holds and do more damage in the process, sad but true. You don't even need breakfree's, this aspect of pvp is laughable, well all of it is atm but this more so to me. All the carebares who cried about holds were to lazy to just carry and manage breakfree's. Castle viewed holds as a overal problem instead of a few isolated tears, the biggest joke is alot of the carebears that put us here don't even pvp now, and second is alot of them actually used mezzers and are now crying with us to get things back, becareful what you wish for when crying. But anyway kb is king now and mind doms with their op'd levetate force you to take like 40kb protect or better builds to keep the levetate spam to a minimum. the are fatal in sirens and with stalker support fatal in rv, one good levitate and you wont get up, all you'll see is AS over your toon and the option to hospital or go to base.

Originally Posted by SmegHead

I actually just noticed that yesterday and It's about damn time. Those turrets would tear my squshies apart. The first heavy nerf was welcome, this second nerf is win.

Originally Posted by Fury Flechette

tl;dr version:
1. PvP needs a revamp that allows it to take place in the context of the PvE game
2. PvP should be much more objective based, so it appeals to players that are primarily PvE
3. PvP rewards should be given to accomplishing objectives and not for killing opposition players

I've stepped into the post issue 12 PvP setting about four times since it was introduced. Without elaborating on the many reasons why I dislike it, let me just say that having a dominator attack me with flurry was both amusing and appalling at the same time.

I've seen a number of threads talking on how to change the mechanics of PvP, and while some of them make a lot of sense, I think the authors miss the reason why PvP remains so unpopular in this game. The focus shouldn't just be on the mechanics but why PvP is so isolated and divorced from the rest of the game.

PvP right now takes place in the Arena and in PvP zones. The Arena was the devs first implementation of PvP and it shows: limited options, really just one objective (kill the other side as much as possible) and no system that allows people to join matches already in place. One of the biggest problems of the arena is that in order to use it, you had get someone to fight you first.

PvP zones don't have that issue. It operates on the premise that you fight all comers from the other side, and yet it too has numerous problems. First, PvP zones really just don't fit thematically in this game. They make perfect sense in a game like World of Warcraft where you have two competing armies and territory that changes hands. PvP zones in this game don't make sense if you believe that the game world operates on similar standards of diplomacy and territorial sovereignty as the real world. Second, while there are mini games in PvP zones, they are mostly ignored for just killing other players or diverted to primarily PvE purposes (Shivans, nukes for PvE missions). Third, the PvP zones seem like a poorly tacked on feature of the "real" game as opposed to a seemless integration of the two worlds.

Let me elaborate on this last point a bit. When I first heard of PvP being announced in issue 4, I thought the devs would eventually figure out a way to seemlessly integrate PvP in the context of the PvE game. PvP should sometimes just happen as opposed of having to just look for it.

Here's a few scenarios I thought of with this concept in mind:

* Hero event broadcast: "Villains are attacking Steel Canyon". Up to 30 villains and 30 heroes can enter an instanced zone of Steel Canyon. The instanced zone takes the first 30 on each side that enter. Villains and heroes are auto sk'ed to level 25. Numerous objectives are on the map: rob the bank/stop the robbery, set/defuse the bombs, kidnap/rescue the hostages, vandalize/prevent vandalization. For every objective won by either side, that side wins PvP merits which can be used to purchase PvP recipes. The amount of PvP merits that can be won scales with the number of opposition participants, and are rewarded for *achieving each objective* and not for killing opposition players. Killing opposing players are a means not an ends.

* Villain event broadcast: "Heroes are assaulting the Fab in Grandville" Up to 30 heroes and 30 villains can enter an instanced zone of the Fab. Heroes and villains are auto sk'ed to level 50. Numerous objectives: defend/destroy the Fab power generator, release Longbow captives/prevent their rescue, download information from the Fab mainframe/prevent computer access. Just like the other scenario, every objective won by either side wins that side PvP merits.

* Parallel missions: Have a number of missions with an "Allow PvP combat" option. When this option is toggled, it allows any opposition faction player to enter that mission as a PvP opponent to stop that player from completing the mission. The goal for the protagonist will be accomplishing the mission, the goal for the antagonist will be to stop the protagonist anyway possible, including killing them. A few rules that would need to be added: missions will be timed at 15 minutes. Every time a player is killed, they receive an cumulative buff that makes them slightly harder to kill (+5% damage, +5% defense to all, etc.) This would ensure that even an outmatched player will eventually be on par. Both parties would have a certain number of gladiator based allies that they could deploy at certain points of the map to help them strategically. Once set, they behave as NPCs of the appropriate level. PvP merits would be awarded when either the protagonist achieves the objective or when time runs out.

So why would the above be more advantageous than the current implementation? Well, first I think it would be more popular for PvE players. With the emphasis on achieving the objectives versus just killing players for the sake of killing them, I think it would have more appeal. I also think that many PvE based builds would be more successful in getting objectives done and they would feel less obligated to spec into a build built solely to kill oppsition players. Second, such missions fit in the context of the PvE game. PvP would just happen as opposed of just having it occur in isolated parts of the game. Third, such a system allows for more role play opportunities, since it may allow for the advent of a arch nemesis type system. Appealing to PvE'ers and role players to a new PvP are IMO an important goal to any sort of revamp.