Bad_Influence

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Once again, how many Farm builds/PvP builds can go without stamina?? Regen Scrapper? I think not, especially when you are facing off against a really sturdy brute. Fire/kin trollers with transference? Maybe if u are io'd out and slotted for some major rech, tried it before without stam, it sucked terribly. Give me more terrible builds to play without stam please.

[/ QUOTE ] Farm builds are an entire different animal and I dont think is really relevant to the discussion. The entire goal of a farm build is to kill at extremely high rates, and getting stamina goes a long way to accomplishing that.

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Well, but wait a minute. The argument I see all the time [not necessarily from you, just sayin'] is that "no one needs Stamina and only lazy/greedy people pick it up."

As Samuel said, I think the definition of "highly functional" is the problem. I think some people are calling being able to fire off three attacks in a row while teamed, "highly functional." That's not my definition.

My definition of "highly functional" is "able to stand there for ten minutes straight pounding on an AV such as Romulus + his Nictus pals, or the entire Freedumb Phalanx at once, without huffing, puffing, begging for blues, having all my toggles dropped, or any of the other bad things that occur when END bottoms out."

I am not here to fire off three attacks and then have to Rest while my team mates pick up my slack. I am here to act as a one person Weapon of Mass Destruction; this is my function and it is very high, admittedly. High function means I need a lot of Endurance and this is just me.... +End power choices are nice, but they nowhere near fill the bill that Fitness does. +End powers are grace-notes, not the foundation of my build. And these powers are almost never, or never, avaliable to me as a lowbie under level 20.

I think a lot of people, especially people blueside, don't see function that way. They're thinking those three piddly little attacks are all they need to do, so why would they need Stamina?

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You, personally? No, you're an insignificant speck, barely worthy of notice, much less drastic gameplay balance changes solely for the virtue of your pleasure (or displeasure, if we want to assume the devs have something against you).

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.....But you, or anyone else here is/are somehow different, eh? I seriously doubt it. Do note for the record that I never made any such claim about myself in any respect or category whatsoever.

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However, as part of a community then your behaviours compound with those of everyone else- even if you never so much as look at another character in your entire gameplaying career. So, if you PL, then you're part of that x% of the population which PLs. If that percentage gets too high, then the devs may take action against it

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Thank you, Captain Obvious.

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Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

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It's funny that just by glancing at a post, if I see things like "Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii iiight" and "LOTS OF SENTENCES IN ALL CAPS" and sprinklings of things like "Sure thing," and "You bet," I immediately know it's a B_I post.

Does anyone else read B_I's posts with a valley girl voice?

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Gomer Pyle

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*rolls up section of newspaper, smacks Pain across the snout with it*

BAD dog! I told you not to do that anywheres except Virtue! Now get back over there and be a good girl!

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You can make a highly functional build without stamina.

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Ok, let's take this ball and run with it. What build is "highly functional" without Stamina? On what AT? And don't say regen; tell us something new. After all, the canon argument is that no one needs Stamina; one of the real thigh-slappers I remember was that people who picked up Fitness are "greedy."

And even if you can think up a build, how does that address all the others that cannot move three steps in any direction without it? Rhetorical question only, there.

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The more self-righteousness preaching I hear in these discussions, the more I want to powerlevel. Its having the opposite effect of the intended.

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The more you do stuff like this, the more noticeable it is, thus the more likely it is to be nerfed, thus the more you come here and whine about those awful devs and self-righteous preachers like me.

In the end, it all balances out, and I'm still happy. But hey, good luck with that.

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LOL @ the idea that what I personally do causes the developers to readjust the entire game[s]; I don't think I'm anywhere near that powerful.

Please continue with the nerfherding and preaching, I find it amusing. Not real effective as in changing people's behavior, true - but amusing nonetheless.

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If you ALWAYS have to get stamina you should make your builds better. That simple. If I can get by without it, anybody can.

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Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

And yes, that was sarcasm. Once again, what is claimed on these forums and what goes on in the actual game bear little to no resemblance to each other. If they DID, everyone I saw without Fitness in-game wouldn't 1. have 2 ticks of END left at all times and 2. be continually begging for spare blues.

Next: Forumistas claim that their Dark/dark Brutes and Scrappers NEVER need Fitness and HAVE NEVER NEEDED IT. If yours do, UR DOIN IT WRONG. Once again..... riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii iiiiiiiiiiiiight, I believe that. I sure do! You bet.

p.s. to Ares: I agree that an Ice/psi Dom is an unpleasant creature indeed; mine made it to level 18 and then was deleted in a fit of rage, mid-mission. Logged off in the middle of a mission and nuked her right then and there! that was how fun she was to play. WORST EVER

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So it isn't just me? The same people which you referred to as "forumistas" are following me around agreeing with one another regardless of how idiotic it is? Hmmm. Yeah but I couldnt have said it better myself.

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Not just you, this is an acknowledged forum phenomenom.

The more self-righteousness preaching I hear in these discussions, the more I want to powerlevel. Its having the opposite effect of the intended.

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Luckily, we can look at other people's badges and see how long someone has played. That is the only way to have even a somewhat accurate estimate on how familiar someone is with game play.

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If only a good 1/4 to 1/3 of long-time vets were not clueless re strategy and other gaming knowledge, you'd have a point; unfortunately Veterans Without A Clue are sprinkled liberally throughout the CoX universe.

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Virtue is the best server on the whole game.

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Virtue SUCKS and my only regret is that I can't go to Warburg and steal a nuke that I could deploy against the entire Virtue server. The entire population at the same time would get a mighty bout of screen-shake and then "YOU HAVE BEEN MAPSERVED!" as they got punted offline high, wide and handsome. Ah, what a sweet vision that is.

Yes, it is that bad.

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I'll be sure to cyber on my catgirl extra hard, just for you. <3

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Knock yourself out; I won't be on Virtue to see it.

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If you ALWAYS have to get stamina you should make your builds better. That simple. If I can get by without it, anybody can.

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Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

And yes, that was sarcasm. Once again, what is claimed on these forums and what goes on in the actual game bear little to no resemblance to each other. If they DID, everyone I saw without Fitness in-game wouldn't 1. have 2 ticks of END left at all times and 2. be continually begging for spare blues.

Next: Forumistas claim that their Dark/dark Brutes and Scrappers NEVER need Fitness and HAVE NEVER NEEDED IT. If yours do, UR DOIN IT WRONG. Once again..... riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii iiiiiiiiiiiiight, I believe that. I sure do! You bet.

p.s. to Ares: I agree that an Ice/psi Dom is an unpleasant creature indeed; mine made it to level 18 and then was deleted in a fit of rage, mid-mission. Logged off in the middle of a mission and nuked her right then and there! that was how fun she was to play. WORST EVER

Post deleted by Moderator 08

Once upon a time, we had this really handy "contact"-tree site avaliable. It had all of the zone contacts in a "family tree" type diagram. The diagram showed what level contacts were, which missions had AV/EBs in them and which missions granted badges.

I clicked on my favorite link to it recently, and that site is gone. I don't see anything comparable on Paragonwiki. Does anyone know of a similar page/site where we can see what we need to do to get [x] badge?

^^^ I dunno, ask the Grammar Nazis. I am certain they will enlighten you with several argumentative pages of "polite discourse" on the subject.

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...That's *not* stoked about Going Rogue? For me, I see less pros and more cons. Like, if defenders make their way to villains, corruptors will most likely be ignored. People will prefer Tankers to Brutes. Am I just being overly-negative?

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I'm not stoked until I know more. If side switching involves sacrificing badges/levels/whatever then I won't care for it. Also we have no idea what content beyond side switching this will hold. So waiting and seeing.

Also brutes are what scrappers should have been, not evil tanks.

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Put me in this camp too.

Until there is actual information about it, it's on par with my gf telling me she went shopping
and got a new blouse.

My Response? "That's nice, dear" (as I turn my attention back to the Forum)

Same for Going Rogue. "That's nice, Devs" (call me when you're sharing actual information)

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Exactly. I am not really planning to outright switch anyone over here, although if all ATs are opened up to both sides, I might work with that a bit. I also would not mind creating a Brute blueside, because Tanking is just noooooooot for me, and Brutes > Scrappers, in my honest opinion.

I think we were told about this because the developers wanted to silence the many and noisy Sour Grapes about MA nerfs on the forums. I have no way of actually knowing that for sure, yet it all makes sense when you think about it. And this strategy worked, to a point, although the frost is definitely off of the MA "pumpkin" over here, ergo real enthusiasm is gone.

I'm still looking forward to i15 though.

This thread is one of the saddest things I have seen on this board in many a long day. A two-page fight over someone's favorite word. Sheesh.

The word "faction" is appropriate when referring to the two sides of this game. If some Grammar Nazi wants to have a conniption fit if I say "faction" instead of their pet preference "alignment," have at it, I say. It won't be changing what I say/type by one iota.

LOL at the mere idea that anyone is going to "learn something" when people post this kind of rant-thread. Yeah, we'll "learn" all right; perhaps not the things the Grammar Nazis intended, but we'll do some "learning." Yessirree. Forgive me, Grammar nazis when I say, "epic phail."

OR DON'T. *shrug*

QR:

How many times can we beat this dead horse with the same damn sticks?!

The Poor Person's Guide to slotting:

*NEver buy training origins. Leave those slots empty until level 12; meanwhile vendor everything you get except basic IO recipies - sell those to your origin vendor. Sell your other recipes to him too, unless they're going for a lot on the market.

Which, if you're like me, they won't be.

*At level 12, buy level 15 Dual Origins. These will about double your effectiveness, so they are worth doing IMO.

At level 17, you can buy level 20 DOs if so inclined. This sounds expensive, but wait....

*At level 22, you are going to do a respec and sell ALL of your enhancements [with the exception of anything you crafted] BACK to the house, and you will take this money and use it to help fund your first set of SOs. Vet respecs are excellent for this.

OR you can get on a MA team, earn many tickets and buy your enhancements with those. This is an excellent way to keep your money where you need it. Mind you, this is not without risk since the Banhammer can come down on you at any time, hypothetically, if you are judged to be [*gasp!* the horror....] "farming." But if you don't mind skirting the edge of danger a bit, tickets can save you considerable cash.

They are indeed requisites, not "enhancements."

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This is all well and good, but its not really answering my original query about what this infamous 50-million-each set of IOs, or original single IO is, that allows people to completely disregard Fitness. This is the foundation for my growing suspicion that no such set or single IO actually exists which acts as a Fitness "magic bullet."

My closest guess is that he [and others] are talking about 6-slotting Apocalypse and Hecatomb. But even with those, I'd still want Fitness. I tend to run END-heavy characters.

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someone else: Aye, ways to get rid of stamina if desired:

Heavy end reduction slotted into powers
Slot for as much Recovery and Max Endurance as possible.

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[sighs] If we were allowed to six-slot everything, i'd be happy to slam three END-reducers into every last power I have. I do not have this luxury, however, because many things need to be three-slotted for ACC. And, slots are scarce commodities. The only sets I've played where I almost actually had spare slots for this type of luxury were Archery and /regen.

But that is just me.

I have got someone with the Miracle set on one power and most of the Numina on another, including both procs and I sure wouldn't strip Fitness off of him because of it.... because he's an END-hog for sure.

It helps, but negate the need for Fitness..? Not seeing it. But that's just me.

OK, sick of the tease: someone do tell us exactly what IO set negates the need for Fitness. Much talk do I hear, but when it comes down to an exact set name, people just suddenly develop memory loss.

And since this is so, I am calling shenanigans on the whole idea until I hear something logical. I think its an urban legend, myself.

Seen this evening in the middle of a mission, levels high teens for everyone - and might I add, the person making the claim was doing a whole lot of not much fighting.... must've had END issues, you think?:

Tank: "No Fitness pool yet."

some PvP guy: "A couple of IOs will fix that."

Bad: "I have unfortunately never seen the IOs or IO sets that replace Stamina. What is the name of the IO or set?"

some PvP guy: "Lool, IOs fixes everything."

Someone else: "All toons need Stamina."

Some PvP guy: "no."

Bad: "What set fixes not having Stamina? I am all ears."

some PvP guy: "If you have a lot of money you can fix it."

Bad: "Yes, but what exact sets?"

some PvP guy: "Let me see....."

Bad: "I hear all this talk, but no one ever names the sets."

Some PvP guy: "I have one on my Brute [one what? One IO? One set? -editor] I forget what it was, they cost like 50 mill each."

Bad: "Yeah I can do that at level 16, no problem!!"

[Then he talks abut how afraid he is to do an Influence transfer.... snip]

Bad: "Think I'll just pick up Fitness and save the billion bucks. I'm cheap like that."

some PvP guy: "LOL! Fitness does no good without IOs!!"

Bad: "ROTFL!! WHAT?!"

some PvP guy: "It depends on your build. But you have to have IOs or Fitness does you no good at all."

At this point I nearly fell out laughing, and I think that ticked him off and he shut up. He claimed to be seriously into PvP and I'm skeptical as to why one would need a billion-dollar +END set in PvP, since those matches tend to last less than three minutes.... in fact often less than 30 seconds. BOOM, you're dead. But this whole thing is ridiculous. What is this infamous Purple set that costs 50 million per enhancement and negates the need for Stamina? You can tell me, because when it comes to a choice between spending a billion bucks and picking up one power pool, you know what I am gonna do. I will not be purchasing them.

But I AM curious. Especially since every last person who has made this claim has been gasping for END the whole time. Shenaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaanigaaaannnnnnnss...

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I wouldn't mind seeing an out of combat recovery bonus

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It's called Rest. That said, I would like it if they slightly reduced Rest's recharge again.

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"Slightly" reduced its recharge...? Bah. Why wait? Pre- level 22, 3-slot Rest with Recharge enhancements. Respec at level 22 [after Stamina, but in time for those delicious SOs] and move two of those slots to a more fruitful location of your choice. Works quite well.

With that said, I find myself extremely impatient with the game before level 35 lately. Its really been difficult, because everything is crap. You got no END, you got little ACC, your recharge sucks, if you have shielding it has the protective power of, oh about three canaries fluttering madly around you trying to deflect bullets. Yeah, that'll work.

It just gets really old.

I don't think that we will ever get decent hair with hats. I just don't.

I could even live with the hair we have now, if we could have the hair not HAVE to be the same color as color #2 on the hat. This right here is why my guy who needs the Baron hat isn't able to wear it; because his hair and color #2 on the rest of his costume are light-years away from each other. And coloring everything black just wipes out all of the beautiful detail on the Baron chapeau, so why bother...?

No one wears the Witch hats because of the same issue. The hat needs to match the rest of the costume. I am very specific on this point.

I would like to see different hair used for hats, and I'd like to see some masks wearable with some "makeup." Dont think I am gonna get either wish

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Run out of things to complain about? lol If you're not playing with your ingame sounds up really high, you'd hardly notice it.

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I'm still trying to figure out why I hear a cash register when someone activates the power. For real. It was a true "What the h....?" sort of thing when I heard that KA-CHING! for the 1st time.

It is also true that the kissing sound is both silly and.... well... silly. I don't need to hear this silly sound every time I zone, but this is very minor really. I decline this stuff unless i am on a big team [one episode of The Tower taught me to do that reaaaaalllll quick, since being on a team makes this debuff somewhat less noticeable].... but for real, the sounds are more immersion-breaking than anything. As such they have little place in the game.

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Really looking forward to this. I tend to 3 slot Hover and Swift just to get my flight characters up to a tolerable speed.

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/jawdrop

What?! Hover is supposed to be the defensive boost power, not a travel power. Fly is a travel power. If you're going to 3 slot Hover, put in the Defense Boost, not flight speed...

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LAWL at the idea that Hover gives you anything more than about 0.001% of any "Defense Boost." In almost 3 years of playing I have never one time noticed any "Defense Boost" while using it. In fact, nowadays Hover can get you killed very dead at low levels, unless you have a -KB IO slotted somewheres: It'll in essence freeze you in place so enemies can pound on you all the harder. "Defense," my posterior.

All of my Ranged people use Hover as a travel power inside a mission. Mine is slotted up, but its also a good idea to use it as a foil for SB when on teams, if you dont want to slot it: it really foils the intentions of the SB-happy. Stack Stealth on top of that and you'lll need like, 6 SBs to get anywere faster than 2 mph.

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Group fly is just one of those powers that will just never get any love. It makes me sad

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Well, it won't. That is true. Probably because it only takes one experience with some ninnyhammer who refuses to turn it off, to really sour one on the power.

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Yep, any opponent who sets up a base in an area where the topology forces his enemies into a neatly constrained kill zone (if their approach is to charge en masse ino the chokepoint) is...well, just not friendly.

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Weeeeeeeeeeellllllllllllllllllll, in caves I'm often in the back [usually behind 3 MM's-worth of pets, whether I like it or not], actually AROUND THE CORNER from the fight. I'm not contributing back there, and the MMs almost never have the courtesy to move their pets to allow others to get by.

I don't fight it, I just leave team after that mission, if the team insists on running mission after mission on these maps.

I could be in front, but most MMs are very adamant about themeselves and their pets being IN FRONT AT ALL TIMES. So the pets can take the damage, true enough, and I'm not gonna fight to try to be in front.... but I'm toddling off to go do something that I actually find FUN, if provoked enough.

So in a sense small-bore caves can actually discourage teaming.