Oh, They think they won...Heh. NOPE.

I assume you realize I could say the exact same thing on the other side of the fence. I'm not trying to convince anyone to change their mind - I'm just telling those who don't know jack about reverse engineering software that even if we had the same people who worked on the game doing it, it might never work right after several years have passed.

Yep, now we can at least breathe a little easier and enjoy the servers while we still can.

yeah.

Originally Posted by mauk2 Evil_Legacy became one of my favorite posters with two words. "Kick Rocks." I laffed so hard. Never change, E_L!

I mentioned it before in another thread, but I wouldn't be surprised if sales talks took place a long time before that fateful Friday.

There is zero inability about it, but you keep judging all you like, mate.

The Electric-Knight ______ Malfaz _____ Zox'Oculox

@Zethustra

"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan

www.pauldamonthomas.com - Original Music

So are the doom and gloom posts. Realistically, ANYTHING we've heard a few times is already 'old'.


I dunno. I think that, from a BUSINESS standpoint, there will never be a better time than now. The main reason a lot of people mention for them not selling it is 'saving face', which isn't a business reason at all.


Despite their actions so far, I really don't think they're THAT stupid. So many people have been expressing their undying hatred for NCSoft. Once they've moved on to another game, I really don't think they'll come back to CoH as long as NCSoft is involved in any way.


Now that would certainly make sense. However, it really does look like they are ditching the Western Hemisphere

We have several people who say something similar, anytime someone makes a comment about the End Times on the Virtue "Help" channel. Its a nice sentiment, but unfortunately we cannot alter reality by mere force of will. I wish we could, but we can't.

NCSoft IS going to take our stuff away from us. Just because.... well, because they can. We none of us like it, but that does not hinder their power to take it in the slightest.

As someone said in another thread, I am also looking over that vast Bermuda Triangle of dodgy MMOs and thinking over which sinking ship I want to jump to next. And my having to do this isnt exactly endearing NCSoft to me, either.

I am resigned. If I can be, I will be there on Nov 30 when the lights go out. I will sporadically play till then. But they keep talking about spnsoring sunset events, and you know what? I am not really interested in an event sponsored by NCSoft. S**** them. They're taking away my stable of characters I have loved and labored over and spent money on, FOR YEARS. Don't do me any favors, you vultures. You're taking my beloved characters and **** you and the Boobs and Soul hoss you rode IN on.

True, but we can change reality by taking actions. That's how the world works.

Remember, most people do not walk that path. They take what they get, do what they're supposed to do and move along the supplied paths, fitting their own interests and oddities between the cracks of society's demands when and where they can.

I'm not insulting anyone for that. It's just the truth. That is the majority of people. If they're happy with that, I can't argue with them for it. I'm happy being me and I'm happy to help others be what they want to be. I have no interest in wasting my time defending my own decisions and approaches to things, especially when most of them don't even respond to the details I offer. Some of them will carry on, but I recognized that it is simply something a great many people can't relate to.
Judging though... that comes as a free right that won't put most of them outside of their comfort zone.

Anyway, yep, that is how the world works.
Whether I get the changes I want or not, my efforts and actions will speak for themselves and hopefully influence things toward the direction I wish it to go. And we adapt and change and/or stand firm as we choose. Not as my neighbor chooses for me, hehe.

The Electric-Knight ______ Malfaz _____ Zox'Oculox

@Zethustra

"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan

www.pauldamonthomas.com - Original Music

Your passion towards the goal of your cause seems undeniable.

Originally Posted by mauk2 Evil_Legacy became one of my favorite posters with two words. "Kick Rocks." I laffed so hard. Never change, E_L!

Hey, everyone picks their own fights, no doubt. I was speaking to the majority of people (and I'd think you'd agree), but yeah, no doubt, the context aimed things at people citing "reality" as their explanation for our "denial".
That's just it. People can pick and choose their own levels of interest all they want, as they so very well should. There's nothing cowardly about that at all.
However, once it becomes a matter of "anyone that would bother trying is in denial and doesn't grasp reality", they're not simply staying out of it.
Even warriors must sometimes choose not to fight.
As my comments pointed out, I don't begrudge anyone for their focuses. However, insulting other people's focus just brings out the mirror. Looking at the string of quotes, I see that I responded to a post that was responding to a snippet of yours, but your post does not contain the outright negativity and judgment and certainly was not the aim of my words.

I simply spoke of the majority of people not understanding the truth in what Ironblade said.
Still, anyone who wishes, may take offense to what I said. Any backhanded slur that you glean from that was not intended for every single person that believes there's no hope. I can't take back what I said, but I do not mean to be disrespectful, so I apologize if that is the taken result.

The Electric-Knight ______ Malfaz _____ Zox'Oculox

@Zethustra

"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan

www.pauldamonthomas.com - Original Music

Hehe, that's honestly the only way I know how to be. I mean, I strive to be respectful, but I just listen to what I feel is right and no odds or obstacles and no criticisms are enough to dissuade me from making attempts that I feel are worth it when I believe it is the right thing to do and/or when I think something is wrong and I just might be able to steer it in a better direction (or possibly even all the way around).

Eh, I'm prepared for failure. I don't fear that at all. I can handle a hell of a lot worse than my favorite game being gone (although, I feel more for other people in worse situations and for the community's existence more so).
I find it somewhat laughable that people will say that other people are delusional and ill-equipped to handle such loss (so I/we will suffer worse for it when it is all said and done), when it is just the small matter that it is. Why would I fall apart afterward?? I don't need to guard myself against this failure. I can handle it, hehe. I could point that around and turn it on those who say such things, but it's all just nonsense anyway.

I don't fear failure, hehe, I've already felt it. I welcome the fight!

The Electric-Knight ______ Malfaz _____ Zox'Oculox

@Zethustra

"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan

www.pauldamonthomas.com - Original Music

True, all I have to go by is the comments of the forum, so maybe you will understand why I wrote it that way.

http://vocaroo.com/i/s0kUfxbwBZlG

You can try and fight all you like, but if the bloke you're fighting is 2 feet taller than you and holding his hand on your forehead and laughing at you flailing your arms about, you're not going to achieve very much.

A lot of the problem is that many of us through being rallied by the various efforts to save the game really believed that we had a chance of success. There is an emotional interest in all this for everyone. After all that, NCSoft have STILL come back with "Nope, sorry chaps, we're still closing it". People may get annoyed with the constant "We can still do it" imperative because they are no longer willing to put themselves through that emotional rollercoaster.

If you compare the cold hard reality of "CoH was NCSofts lowest performer with a continually declining playerbase / financial return" with "I had a bad time and CoH saved my life" in that context, most reasonable people will hold their hands up and say "Yup.. fair enough.. I enjoyed the game while I played it, it sucks that it's shutting down, but that's how it has to be".

Whilst I won't necessarily say that anyone who still thinks there is a shred of hope that something can be salvaged is delusional; after all everyone is entitled to their opinions, that kind of behaviour is indicative of someone who, despite seeing all the evidence that they're presented with, is sticking their fingers in their ears, shutting their eyes and shouting "LALALALALALA" at the top of their voices.

If you want to keep fighting and keep trying, honestly more power to you, but don't be surprised or get upset when someone tries to tell you that it might actually be over. The thing is, we're not superheroes. We're just a bunch of nerds that play a superhero game.

I've never posted this before, but your message deserves a hearty



I'm with you, I don't care to pee on anyone's corn flakes who happens to believe "we are superheroes". Choosing to "save the city" is harmless enough and hey, maybe I actually do lack the imagination to envision an endgame that results in a saved city.

I don't agree with the metaphor you used though, of a big bully holding you at arms lenth. In that case you can use leverage to your advantage. In our case, the playerbase has no leverage whatsoever. That's what the "I'm not done fighting" crowd doesn't seem to get, they're simply not holding anything of value to negotiate with.

But again, whatever. Go nuts true believers and enjoy fighting the good fight that you believe you're actually fighting.

This is exactly the point I made in another thread a while back. While I do not EXPECT the game to be saved, I believe it is possible and HOPE that it happens. In numeric terms, I think the odds of the game being saved are less than 50%, but well above 0.

Right up until I change tactics and kick him in the man-biscuits.

You see, we can completely agree to reasonable opinions and personal stances. There is no argument there.
I've not attacked or argued with anyone who understands that the odds are not in our favor and that they don't believe it will happen and/or aren't interested in doing much (if anything) to change the outcome themselves. We came here to play a game, not spend time and energy fighting for something we're likely to lose anyway. Do what you feel is right and what is best for you and yours, no doubt.

However, if you look at the words of people stating that their position of deriding people who've taken the stance that they're willing to put more effort in, you'll see the blatant insults. "Delusional" is bandied around aplenty.
There's nothing delusional about it.
You can say we have no leverage, but it's not entirely true.
People do have leverage and that is all we are doing - attempting to apply any and all leverage that we can. It matter-of-factly may not be anywhere near enough...
But, to use your analogy...
That pipsqueak fighting the overwhelming bully is not necessarily doing so in vain. Maybe they can win the fight... probably not. However, maybe winning the fight isn't the most important thing. Maybe their defiance and good-hearted efforts will lead to other turn of events. The true success of battle is not in the physical fight, but in the conquering of minds and hearts. You can change people's minds and positions. You can influence others to do wonderful things. You never know until you try... but, honestly, it's not about that. It's simply about doing what one feels is right and true.

Your example is precisely what was in the Captain America movie. When the little pipsqueak Steve Richards refused to back down and got his butt handed to him... did you want to stand up and mock him and tell him to stop, because there's no use?

Now, don't take any flaws with the anaology against me... it's your analogy, but that's how I see this situation in the analogy that you've shared.

Beyond the personal aspects, the efforts being put forth can certainly have impact on the mmorpg landscape, both for customers/players and for companies to consider what this entire industry is about, what it means and how to go about these things. At its very least, it draws attention, and adds, to that discussion of what mmo communities are about.

There's nothing delusional about any of that.

Lastly, the major thing going on right now is... NCSoft's latest announcement/reply to us has had some people change their minds (in both directions, actually).
However, nothing actually changed. They told us on August 31t that it was over, period.
They released another announcement a few days ago, in response to our efforts saying, that it really is over, period.
If you can read their latest announcement and believe that they sincerely put in a good effort and truly wanted to sell the game, IP and studio, but couldn't, more power to you. If you truly believe exactly what they said in that press release, then that is where we differ. As far as I see, it is just a PR spin. They publicly implied that they cared and that they wanted to help, but have "exhausted" their efforts.
I just think, for the most part, they wanted to shut us up, stop our drawing attention in the media and be done with us.
So, we got their attention. And we believe we can do more and we can do better and our efforts simply have not been exhausted yet.
It's as simple as that.
Anyone who believed we might make a difference on August 31st should not be swayed, one bit, by the latest words from NCSoft.
That's all.
That last reply was damage control PR spin. I don't say that as though it's a major storm for them. It could be, but could very well be rather insignificant to them. Our goal is to raise the volume as much as we can and find out.
If we can push them a little, maybe we can push them more. And maybe it'll make a difference.
No difference between August 31 and now, regarding any of that.

The Electric-Knight ______ Malfaz _____ Zox'Oculox

@Zethustra

"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan

www.pauldamonthomas.com - Original Music

I'm not going to draw flaws in the analogy; in fact you've over analysed the analogy I've used. All I was trying to illustrate is that if a corporation like NCSoft is THAT determined on an outcome, that is the outcome that will prevail. They hold all the cards, and as someone said earlier, we don't have anything they want to bargain with. In fact, as I've said in other threads, I honestly believe they EXPECTED the kind of reaction they got from us and have already provisioned for it. Granted, possibly not the scale that the SaveCoH movement has demonstrated, but I think it was prepared for before the announcement was made.

I'm sorry, but I also don't buy the whole "damage control PR" BS. That as a reaction to Tuesdays announcement, to me, is another symptom of "LALALALALA not listening". The business based facts of their decision haven't changed, and despite the efforts of the SaveCoH community, since the announcement even more players have stopped playing, thus further bolstering their position.

It's cold, hard, sentiment free facts like that which are what NCSoft have based their decision on and what why they continue to hold their position. All the demonstrations and rallies in the world aren't going to change that fact. If you believe they will, knock yourself out and enjoy the limelight.

Basically.

Originally Posted by mauk2 Evil_Legacy became one of my favorite posters with two words. "Kick Rocks." I laffed so hard. Never change, E_L!