Oh, They think they won...Heh. NOPE.
I hope you get a response. Wonder if it's for something snotty like maybe he doesn't want to completely turn this forum over to passive aggresive cyber bullies (you know like somewhere else). Or maybe he has an agenda he's trying to convince others of like he may not like an outcome, but he gets that when it comes to things out of his control he can accept a "no" answer. Or maybe he has compassion for his fellow players and wants to facilitate the grieving and healing process. Or maybe he is search of viable alternatives in a bad situation. Or maybe he is just as tried of people braying over and over to no avail as much as you are of downer messages.
I hope you get a response. I'm pretty sure my shut up and go away reply will follow in short order. |
![Big Grin](images/smilies/biggrin.gif)
My new Youtube Channel with CoH info
You might know me as FlintEastwood now on Freedom
![](http://www.jaybonaut.com/Stuff/heroes/Samuraiko.jpg)
They won.
There never was any other possible outcome. They held all the cards, owned the table and were paying the dealer. It's still good to fight the fight. Doing so is more about who you are, than winning or losing. Are you someone who lets themselves be hit or do you stand up for yourself ? Our community stood up and threw everything we had at them. It wasn't enough and it could never be enough but still we tried. All in all, not a bad way to go out. |
![Smile](images/smilies/smile.gif)
My new Youtube Channel with CoH info
You might know me as FlintEastwood now on Freedom
![](http://www.jaybonaut.com/Stuff/heroes/Samuraiko.jpg)
My new Youtube Channel with CoH info
You might know me as FlintEastwood now on Freedom
![](http://www.jaybonaut.com/Stuff/heroes/Samuraiko.jpg)
Yeah exactly - nothing's changed other than prolonging the inability of acceptance.
|
![Smile](images/smilies/smile.gif)
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
Right now, it just dont seem to be in their best interest to sell it from a buisness stand point.
|
If they can hold on to it and use it later in the future and know that the players probably will be running back, |
Or maybe they are holding on to it because they may be actually planning on using the IP in the future, or parts of it. |
Paragon City Search And Rescue
The Mentor Project
The odds have been defied before. History teaches us this. We can defy the odds again!
Will it be easy? No. Will NCSoft put as many obstacles in our way as they can? Likely. Will we give it our best shot? The correct answer is YES! |
NCSoft IS going to take our stuff away from us. Just because.... well, because they can. We none of us like it, but that does not hinder their power to take it in the slightest.
As someone said in another thread, I am also looking over that vast Bermuda Triangle of dodgy MMOs and thinking over which sinking ship I want to jump to next. And my having to do this isnt exactly endearing NCSoft to me, either.
I am resigned. If I can be, I will be there on Nov 30 when the lights go out. I will sporadically play till then. But they keep talking about spnsoring sunset events, and you know what? I am not really interested in an event sponsored by NCSoft. S**** them. They're taking away my stable of characters I have loved and labored over and spent money on, FOR YEARS. Don't do me any favors, you vultures. You're taking my beloved characters and **** you and the Boobs and Soul hoss you rode IN on.
Paragon City Search And Rescue
The Mentor Project
True, but we can change reality by taking actions. That's how the world works.
|
I'm not insulting anyone for that. It's just the truth. That is the majority of people. If they're happy with that, I can't argue with them for it. I'm happy being me and I'm happy to help others be what they want to be. I have no interest in wasting my time defending my own decisions and approaches to things, especially when most of them don't even respond to the details I offer. Some of them will carry on, but I recognized that it is simply something a great many people can't relate to.
Judging though... that comes as a free right that won't put most of them outside of their comfort zone.
![Wink](images/smilies/wink.gif)
Anyway, yep, that is how the world works.
Whether I get the changes I want or not, my efforts and actions will speak for themselves and hopefully influence things toward the direction I wish it to go. And we adapt and change and/or stand firm as we choose. Not as my neighbor chooses for me, hehe.
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
Remember, most people do not walk that path. They take what they get, do what they're supposed to do and move along the supplied paths, fitting their own interests and oddities between the cracks of society's demands when and where they can.
I'm not insulting anyone for that. It's just the truth. That is the majority of people. If they're happy with that, I can't argue with them for it. I'm happy being me and I'm happy to help others be what they want to be. I have no interest in wasting my time defending my own decisions and approaches to things, especially when most of them don't even respond to the details I offer. Some of them will carry on, but I recognized that it is simply something a great many people can't relate to. Judging though... that comes as a free right that won't put most of them outside of their comfort zone. ![]() Anyway, yep, that is how the world works. Whether I get the changes I want or not, my efforts and actions will speak for themselves and hopefully influence things toward the direction I wish it to go. And we adapt and change and/or stand firm as we choose. Not as my neighbor chooses for me, hehe. |
Your passion towards the goal of your cause seems undeniable.
-Female Player-
I am as hopeful as anyone that somehow our efforts will magically mean that CoX isn't coming to an end; I would party as hard as anyone on hearing we are NOT about to lose everything - however, I am a realist.
Underhanded slurs such as "They take what they get, do what they're supposed to do and move along the supplied paths, fitting their own interests and oddities between the cracks of society's demands when and where they can" are not changing the REALITY of the fact that NCSoft holds all the cards, and it looks like they own the dealer too.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light all you want. I'm raging too. I realize that NCSoft is gonna pull the plug any time they want, though, and that realization does not mean I'm some lockstepping drone afraid to step outside the path of what some corporation wants.
It means I'm an adult who knows reality when I see it.
Meanwhile I continue the fight to find somewhere to recreate my hero and villain mains; they must live on even if this game dies. I wil accept nothing else.
I am as hopeful as anyone that somehow our efforts will magically mean that CoX isn't coming to an end; I would party as hard as anyone on hearing we are NOT about to lose everything - however, I am a realist.
Underhanded slurs such as "They take what they get, do what they're supposed to do and move along the supplied paths, fitting their own interests and oddities between the cracks of society's demands when and where they can" are not changing the REALITY of the fact that NCSoft holds all the cards, and it looks like they own the dealer too. Rage, rage against the dying of the light all you want. I'm raging too. I realize that NCSoft is gonna pull the plug any time they want, though, and that realization does not mean I'm some lockstepping drone afraid to step outside the path of what some corporation wants. It means I'm an adult who knows reality when I see it. Meanwhile I continue the fight to find somewhere to recreate my hero and villain mains; they must live on even if this game dies. I wil accept nothing else. |
That's just it. People can pick and choose their own levels of interest all they want, as they so very well should. There's nothing cowardly about that at all.
However, once it becomes a matter of "anyone that would bother trying is in denial and doesn't grasp reality", they're not simply staying out of it.
Even warriors must sometimes choose not to fight.
As my comments pointed out, I don't begrudge anyone for their focuses. However, insulting other people's focus just brings out the mirror. Looking at the string of quotes, I see that I responded to a post that was responding to a snippet of yours, but your post does not contain the outright negativity and judgment and certainly was not the aim of my words.
I simply spoke of the majority of people not understanding the truth in what Ironblade said.
Still, anyone who wishes, may take offense to what I said. Any backhanded slur that you glean from that was not intended for every single person that believes there's no hope. I can't take back what I said, but I do not mean to be disrespectful, so I apologize if that is the taken result.
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
Your passion towards the goal of your cause seems undeniable.
|
Eh, I'm prepared for failure. I don't fear that at all. I can handle a hell of a lot worse than my favorite game being gone (although, I feel more for other people in worse situations and for the community's existence more so).
I find it somewhat laughable that people will say that other people are delusional and ill-equipped to handle such loss (so I/we will suffer worse for it when it is all said and done), when it is just the small matter that it is. Why would I fall apart afterward?? I don't need to guard myself against this failure. I can handle it, hehe. I could point that around and turn it on those who say such things, but it's all just nonsense anyway.
![Wink](images/smilies/wink.gif)
I don't fear failure, hehe, I've already felt it. I welcome the fight!
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
My new Youtube Channel with CoH info
You might know me as FlintEastwood now on Freedom
![](http://www.jaybonaut.com/Stuff/heroes/Samuraiko.jpg)
No matter the odds, the only thing we know for certain, is that nothing will change if we don't do anything.
Thought for the day:
"Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment."
=][=
I think if the original Paragon Studio devs were doing the reverse engineering work we would still have massive problems and it could take years.
It's over - really. Immediately I assume attacks will be sent my way for being honest but I don't really care. I just don't understand why people are setting themselves up to be hurt in the near future. I DO understand the majority love rooting for the underdog in most situations but regardless of what is written on the Titan Networks I just don't see anything but disappointment happening. |
Hehe, that's honestly the only way I know how to be. I mean, I strive to be respectful, but I just listen to what I feel is right and no odds or obstacles and no criticisms are enough to dissuade me from making attempts that I feel are worth it when I believe it is the right thing to do and/or when I think something is wrong and I just might be able to steer it in a better direction (or possibly even all the way around).
Eh, I'm prepared for failure. I don't fear that at all. I can handle a hell of a lot worse than my favorite game being gone (although, I feel more for other people in worse situations and for the community's existence more so). I find it somewhat laughable that people will say that other people are delusional and ill-equipped to handle such loss (so I/we will suffer worse for it when it is all said and done), when it is just the small matter that it is. Why would I fall apart afterward?? I don't need to guard myself against this failure. I can handle it, hehe. I could point that around and turn it on those who say such things, but it's all just nonsense anyway. ![]() I don't fear failure, hehe, I've already felt it. I welcome the fight! |
A lot of the problem is that many of us through being rallied by the various efforts to save the game really believed that we had a chance of success. There is an emotional interest in all this for everyone. After all that, NCSoft have STILL come back with "Nope, sorry chaps, we're still closing it". People may get annoyed with the constant "We can still do it" imperative because they are no longer willing to put themselves through that emotional rollercoaster.
If you compare the cold hard reality of "CoH was NCSofts lowest performer with a continually declining playerbase / financial return" with "I had a bad time and CoH saved my life" in that context, most reasonable people will hold their hands up and say "Yup.. fair enough.. I enjoyed the game while I played it, it sucks that it's shutting down, but that's how it has to be".
Whilst I won't necessarily say that anyone who still thinks there is a shred of hope that something can be salvaged is delusional; after all everyone is entitled to their opinions, that kind of behaviour is indicative of someone who, despite seeing all the evidence that they're presented with, is sticking their fingers in their ears, shutting their eyes and shouting "LALALALALALA" at the top of their voices.
If you want to keep fighting and keep trying, honestly more power to you, but don't be surprised or get upset when someone tries to tell you that it might actually be over. The thing is, we're not superheroes. We're just a bunch of nerds that play a superhero game.
@SteelRat; @SteelRat2
"Angelina my love, I'm a genius!"
"Of course you are darling, that's why I married you. Physically, you're rather unattractive"
http://faces.cohtitan.com/profile/SteelRat
You can try and fight all you like, but if the bloke you're fighting is 2 feet taller than you and holding his hand on your forehead and laughing at you flailing your arms about, you're not going to achieve very much.
A lot of the problem is that many of us through being rallied by the various efforts to save the game really believed that we had a chance of success. There is an emotional interest in all this for everyone. After all that, NCSoft have STILL come back with "Nope, sorry chaps, we're still closing it". People may get annoyed with the constant "We can still do it" imperative because they are no longer willing to put themselves through that emotional rollercoaster. If you compare the cold hard reality of "CoH was NCSofts lowest performer with a continually declining playerbase / financial return" with "I had a bad time and CoH saved my life" in that context, most reasonable people will hold their hands up and say "Yup.. fair enough.. I enjoyed the game while I played it, it sucks that it's shutting down, but that's how it has to be". Whilst I won't necessarily say that anyone who still thinks there is a shred of hope that something can be salvaged is delusional; after all everyone is entitled to their opinions, that kind of behaviour is indicative of someone who, despite seeing all the evidence that they're presented with, is sticking their fingers in their ears, shutting their eyes and shouting "LALALALALALA" at the top of their voices. If you want to keep fighting and keep trying, honestly more power to you, but don't be surprised or get upset when someone tries to tell you that it might actually be over. The thing is, we're not superheroes. We're just a bunch of nerds that play a superhero game. |
![](http://i46.tinypic.com/33zeohf.gif)
I'm with you, I don't care to pee on anyone's corn flakes who happens to believe "we are superheroes". Choosing to "save the city" is harmless enough and hey, maybe I actually do lack the imagination to envision an endgame that results in a saved city.
I don't agree with the metaphor you used though, of a big bully holding you at arms lenth. In that case you can use leverage to your advantage. In our case, the playerbase has no leverage whatsoever. That's what the "I'm not done fighting" crowd doesn't seem to get, they're simply not holding anything of value to negotiate with.
But again, whatever. Go nuts true believers and enjoy fighting the good fight that you believe you're actually fighting.
Global = Hedgefund (or some derivation thereof)
Paragon City Search And Rescue
The Mentor Project
You can try and fight all you like, but if the bloke you're fighting is 2 feet taller than you and holding his hand on your forehead and laughing at you flailing your arms about, you're not going to achieve very much.
|
![Big Grin](images/smilies/biggrin.gif)
Paragon City Search And Rescue
The Mentor Project
You can try and fight all you like, but if the bloke you're fighting is 2 feet taller than you and holding his hand on your forehead and laughing at you flailing your arms about, you're not going to achieve very much.
A lot of the problem is that many of us through being rallied by the various efforts to save the game really believed that we had a chance of success. There is an emotional interest in all this for everyone. After all that, NCSoft have STILL come back with "Nope, sorry chaps, we're still closing it". People may get annoyed with the constant "We can still do it" imperative because they are no longer willing to put themselves through that emotional rollercoaster. If you compare the cold hard reality of "CoH was NCSofts lowest performer with a continually declining playerbase / financial return" with "I had a bad time and CoH saved my life" in that context, most reasonable people will hold their hands up and say "Yup.. fair enough.. I enjoyed the game while I played it, it sucks that it's shutting down, but that's how it has to be". Whilst I won't necessarily say that anyone who still thinks there is a shred of hope that something can be salvaged is delusional; after all everyone is entitled to their opinions, that kind of behaviour is indicative of someone who, despite seeing all the evidence that they're presented with, is sticking their fingers in their ears, shutting their eyes and shouting "LALALALALALA" at the top of their voices. If you want to keep fighting and keep trying, honestly more power to you, but don't be surprised or get upset when someone tries to tell you that it might actually be over. The thing is, we're not superheroes. We're just a bunch of nerds that play a superhero game. |
![Smile](images/smilies/smile.gif)
I've not attacked or argued with anyone who understands that the odds are not in our favor and that they don't believe it will happen and/or aren't interested in doing much (if anything) to change the outcome themselves. We came here to play a game, not spend time and energy fighting for something we're likely to lose anyway. Do what you feel is right and what is best for you and yours, no doubt.
![Smile](images/smilies/smile.gif)
However, if you look at the words of people stating that their position of deriding people who've taken the stance that they're willing to put more effort in, you'll see the blatant insults. "Delusional" is bandied around aplenty.
There's nothing delusional about it.
You can say we have no leverage, but it's not entirely true.
People do have leverage and that is all we are doing - attempting to apply any and all leverage that we can. It matter-of-factly may not be anywhere near enough...
But, to use your analogy...
That pipsqueak fighting the overwhelming bully is not necessarily doing so in vain. Maybe they can win the fight... probably not. However, maybe winning the fight isn't the most important thing. Maybe their defiance and good-hearted efforts will lead to other turn of events. The true success of battle is not in the physical fight, but in the conquering of minds and hearts. You can change people's minds and positions. You can influence others to do wonderful things. You never know until you try... but, honestly, it's not about that. It's simply about doing what one feels is right and true.
Your example is precisely what was in the Captain America movie. When the little pipsqueak Steve Richards refused to back down and got his butt handed to him... did you want to stand up and mock him and tell him to stop, because there's no use?
Now, don't take any flaws with the anaology against me... it's your analogy, but that's how I see this situation in the analogy that you've shared.
Beyond the personal aspects, the efforts being put forth can certainly have impact on the mmorpg landscape, both for customers/players and for companies to consider what this entire industry is about, what it means and how to go about these things. At its very least, it draws attention, and adds, to that discussion of what mmo communities are about.
There's nothing delusional about any of that.
Lastly, the major thing going on right now is... NCSoft's latest announcement/reply to us has had some people change their minds (in both directions, actually).
However, nothing actually changed. They told us on August 31t that it was over, period.
They released another announcement a few days ago, in response to our efforts saying, that it really is over, period.
If you can read their latest announcement and believe that they sincerely put in a good effort and truly wanted to sell the game, IP and studio, but couldn't, more power to you. If you truly believe exactly what they said in that press release, then that is where we differ. As far as I see, it is just a PR spin. They publicly implied that they cared and that they wanted to help, but have "exhausted" their efforts.
I just think, for the most part, they wanted to shut us up, stop our drawing attention in the media and be done with us.
So, we got their attention. And we believe we can do more and we can do better and our efforts simply have not been exhausted yet.
It's as simple as that.
Anyone who believed we might make a difference on August 31st should not be swayed, one bit, by the latest words from NCSoft.
That's all.
That last reply was damage control PR spin. I don't say that as though it's a major storm for them. It could be, but could very well be rather insignificant to them. Our goal is to raise the volume as much as we can and find out.
If we can push them a little, maybe we can push them more. And maybe it'll make a difference.
No difference between August 31 and now, regarding any of that.
![Smile](images/smilies/smile.gif)
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
If you frame the conversation as one side winning and the other side losing, then NCSoft is always going to win.
If you actually want to save CoH, you're going to have to find a way to do so that allows NCSoft to win as well.
If, as the thread title suggests, you're focused on NCSoft not winning - well, enjoy whatever the hell it is you're doing, but it won't be saving CoH.
You see, we can completely agree to reasonable opinions and personal stances. There is no argument there.
![]() I've not attacked or argued with anyone who understands that the odds are not in our favor and that they don't believe it will happen and/or aren't interested in doing much (if anything) to change the outcome themselves. We came here to play a game, not spend time and energy fighting for something we're likely to lose anyway. Do what you feel is right and what is best for you and yours, no doubt. ![]() However, if you look at the words of people stating that their position of deriding people who've taken the stance that they're willing to put more effort in, you'll see the blatant insults. "Delusional" is bandied around aplenty. There's nothing delusional about it. You can say we have no leverage, but it's not entirely true. People do have leverage and that is all we are doing - attempting to apply any and all leverage that we can. It matter-of-factly may not be anywhere near enough... But, to use your analogy... That pipsqueak fighting the overwhelming bully is not necessarily doing so in vain. Maybe they can win the fight... probably not. However, maybe winning the fight isn't the most important thing. Maybe their defiance and good-hearted efforts will lead to other turn of events. The true success of battle is not in the physical fight, but in the conquering of minds and hearts. You can change people's minds and positions. You can influence others to do wonderful things. You never know until you try... but, honestly, it's not about that. It's simply about doing what one feels is right and true. Your example is precisely what was in the Captain America movie. When the little pipsqueak Steve Richards refused to back down and got his butt handed to him... did you want to stand up and mock him and tell him to stop, because there's no use? Now, don't take any flaws with the anaology against me... it's your analogy, but that's how I see this situation in the analogy that you've shared. Beyond the personal aspects, the efforts being put forth can certainly have impact on the mmorpg landscape, both for customers/players and for companies to consider what this entire industry is about, what it means and how to go about these things. At its very least, it draws attention, and adds, to that discussion of what mmo communities are about. There's nothing delusional about any of that. Lastly, the major thing going on right now is... NCSoft's latest announcement/reply to us has had some people change their minds (in both directions, actually). However, nothing actually changed. They told us on August 31t that it was over, period. They released another announcement a few days ago, in response to our efforts saying, that it really is over, period. If you can read their latest announcement and believe that they sincerely put in a good effort and truly wanted to sell the game, IP and studio, but couldn't, more power to you. If you truly believe exactly what they said in that press release, then that is where we differ. As far as I see, it is just a PR spin. They publicly implied that they cared and that they wanted to help, but have "exhausted" their efforts. I just think, for the most part, they wanted to shut us up, stop our drawing attention in the media and be done with us. So, we got their attention. And we believe we can do more and we can do better and our efforts simply have not been exhausted yet. It's as simple as that. Anyone who believed we might make a difference on August 31st should not be swayed, one bit, by the latest words from NCSoft. That's all. That last reply was damage control PR spin. I don't say that as though it's a major storm for them. It could be, but could very well be rather insignificant to them. Our goal is to raise the volume as much as we can and find out. If we can push them a little, maybe we can push them more. And maybe it'll make a difference. No difference between August 31 and now, regarding any of that. ![]() |
I'm sorry, but I also don't buy the whole "damage control PR" BS. That as a reaction to Tuesdays announcement, to me, is another symptom of "LALALALALA not listening". The business based facts of their decision haven't changed, and despite the efforts of the SaveCoH community, since the announcement even more players have stopped playing, thus further bolstering their position.
It's cold, hard, sentiment free facts like that which are what NCSoft have based their decision on and what why they continue to hold their position. All the demonstrations and rallies in the world aren't going to change that fact. If you believe they will, knock yourself out and enjoy the limelight.
@SteelRat; @SteelRat2
"Angelina my love, I'm a genius!"
"Of course you are darling, that's why I married you. Physically, you're rather unattractive"
http://faces.cohtitan.com/profile/SteelRat
-Female Player-
But if you feel that way, why bother posting?
My new Youtube Channel with CoH info
You might know me as FlintEastwood now on Freedom