This has been requested many times...
The general consensus is the the monumental amount of code changes needed makes it un-feasable.
what does that mean
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It means no, I for one would love vehicles
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Originally Posted by LightningBird
what does that mean
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Why no?
It would take too much programming to ever be plausible in the current game engine.
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If Masterminds didn't suck, they'd be the most powerful AT in the game.
In short: vehicles require a lot of "what ifs" that current travel powers don't need to take into account. For instance, with current travel powers, to activate a power, you just stop and do it (flight actually requires a different animation for powers activated while flying, though). But how would you activate many powers from on a motorcycle, or in a car? It would require 3 new animations for EVERY power in the game that could be used on it. That is an astronomical amount of work for this. And means another 3 animations for each power for each vehicle, or for each new power that gets created, slowing down new powerset releases.
Then you also have strafing issues, over-water issues, in-mission issues, up-hill/down-hill issues, etc.
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Short explanation:|
Originally Posted by LightningBird
Why no?
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| the monumental amount of code changes needed makes it un-feasable. |
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Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill Disclaimer Yes. This is a cut and paste reply that I keep handy, as well as a quick bit of instruction on how to search. Neither are meant to cause fights or to be insulting. The search instructions are in, not just because forum rules say flat out to search, but to help you and anyone else reading this use the search tool effectively. The body of the cut and paste reply is the way it is because we've seen these arguments numerous times before. They're a summary of the salient points that come up each time. They are not here to insult you, make you feel stupid or otherwise "bring you down a peg." Instead, they are meant as instruction and information. Please read through the points and the explanation behind them to see the issues that are commonly brought up in response. They may not always match your suggestion 100% - in fact, you may have explained around one or two of them - but they're there for consideration and refinement of your idea. Yes, I do look forward to the time, with some of these suggestions, that someone not only addresses all the points, but does so exceptionally well. It'll probably be added to the end of the cut/paste reply, with credit. For now, though, read and consider the points. They really are just there to help you, and move discussion along to help ideas evolve. If you're going to see this and say an "evil forum vet is just shooting down your idea," or "You think you're the last word because of your post count," you're wrong. Heck, if you say the second, you've just worried more about my post count than I have in the last four plus years. Tongue-in-cheek comments in here are meant as humor, not put downs. Searching Effectively 1. Click on "Search" up at the top of the forum. 2. On the left, under "Forum(s) to search," select "Suggestions and ideas." 3. On the right, Keyword Search Terms. This is probably where your problem was if you did search. Try the following, exactly as typed: +vehicle -"re: " This will search for anything with the string "vehicle" in the title.The -re: portion of it removes replies, so you'll see the root of every thread that comes up, letting you see just how many threads there are on this. (The last helps for other subjects, as well.) Be sure to put the space between the colon and last quote. 4. Click the "In subject" radio button. This is a search, not a cute blonde in a bikini. Here, you want to ignore the body. 5. Leave Username Search blank. 6. Date range, Newer Than, change the 1 to a 3, and the time to Months. 7. Result format doesn't matter. Click on "Submit." The subject at hand: Vehicles. Vehicles as travel powers. This gets brought up a lot. Short answer, don't expect it. Long answer: There are a lot of problems with the idea. 1. Movement. Forward and back,even turning - ok. But you can do things that a vehicle can't - such as strafe (direct side to side or angular movement.) It doesn't work with a vehicle. There are also issues such as drift and "realistic" handling. We can go side to side, as mentioned, and make immediate right angle turns. Cars... not so much. 2. Movement, part 2. Go stand in the road. No, not you personally. Take your character out and stand in the road, if you're heroside. Or even in the path of civilians. What happens? You get pushed. While not as big an issue with a motorcycle, perhaps, a car would have issues. What happens if two cars meet head on - yours and an NPC, or yours and another player's? Do you just pass through each other? Would you be satisfied with that very odd result? Or would you get stuck? How about those NPCs, can they walk and push your car, or are they walking through it? Neither answer is very satisfying, and intelligent, dynamic pathing is too computationally expensive. 3. Terrain. Not every place has roads, or even makes sense for "off roading." Go look at Founder's Falls. Go look at Crey's Folley. Or Eden. Try to get to the north islands in Talos. What, do you have a kubelwagen? Look at the Pit in Sharkshead. Try to use your travel power (car) to get up to some of the doorways in high caves. Cars and motorcycles would be more like Superspeed - horizontal movement, period. And look - I'll be blunt - flat out *stupid* tied with, say, Combat Jumping or Superjump. 4. Combat. You get ambushed on the way. How do you fight? Just have your powers blast out of the rolled up windows? How do you buff or debuff? EVERY power would need a new animation. EVERY. SINGLE. ONE. Then you want people with motorcycles instead of cars. Redo ALL the animations AGAIN. And they still wouldn't make sense - how do you use Footstomp in a car? Or Stalagmites? 5. Customizing. Yeah, it would come up. Not everyone would want a sports car, or a mid-70s Buick boat, or an exotic, or a minivan, or whatever else. 6. Making "sense." This was touched on in terrain - how do you get across water? How about the Shadow Shard? And if you want downright ridiculous looking, go do the heroside 25-34 Respec. Look at the Sky Skiffs inside of rooms or the reactor room. It makes no sense and looks *ridiculous.* Something that, yes, the devs try to avoid. That's just a quick overview of why vehicles as generally envisioned aren't a spectacular idea for a travel power. Further discussion This I think merits a bit of extra commentary, honestly. "Vehicles" covers a lot of different ground for different people. Some only consider cars/jets/motorcycles vehicles. Others add jetpacks, wings and the like. Much of the above considers cars and similar sized vehicles, with nods to motorcycle type vehicles. Jetpacks and such, I don't see happening as travel powers. As costume options for Flight? Or as invented pieces that interact with Fly, similar to wings? Absolutely - but they don't need to be a separate travel power for that. I'm all for more jetpack and wing (or combination) designs. Besides, there are so many "temp" jetpacks, I don't see introducing yet another one as really being feasable - just my opinion. But vehicles - cars, specifically - as a travel power, have issues. One way to have them "somewhat" work. For all that, I know some people *would* still like to pull up in front of a mission. So how do we do it? A temporary power, based on the same tech from the Mac/Valkyrie pack Mission Teleporter. The temporary power would: (a) be an invention - dropping from enemies. (A reward, because you saved... well, we'll get to that,) (b) be a single use each time - you can only hold one at a time, not one of each, one total. (c) use rarely used salvage, because... it's rarely used, and cheap. No Luck Charms here. (d) come in multiple varieties. How does this get around the various issues? Terrain - It doesn't pass terrain. It just arrives. It follows the same 'rules' as the mission teleporter - it's not indoors, doesn't go to contacts, etc. Just mission doors. Customizing - It's not "your" vehicle. It's a temp power. You've called a cab, limo, or other transport. Power animation - since you're skipping the space in between, no powers can be used 'til you arrive anyway. The varieties? - Limo: Stereotypical slightly stretched black limo. - Checker cab: The classic yellow cab. |
Guess which one the devs decided to give us (hint: it's bolded in green)
Half the characters you listed don't even use vehicles.
"You don't lose levels. You don't have equipment to wear out, repair, or lose, or that anyone can steal from you. About the only thing lighter than debt they could do is have an NPC walk by, point and laugh before you can go to the hospital or base." -Memphis_Bill
We will honor the past, and fight to the last, it will be a good way to die...
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Except for Rocketboard. Magic Carpet. No attack powers. Problem solved. |
Originally Posted by Aett_Thorn
In short: vehicles require a lot of "what ifs" that current travel powers don't need to take into account. For instance, with current travel powers, to activate a power, you just stop and do it (flight actually requires a different animation for powers activated while flying, though). But how would you activate many powers from on a motorcycle, or in a car? It would require 3 new animations for EVERY power in the game that could be used on it. That is an astronomical amount of work for this. And means another 3 animations for each power for each vehicle, or for each new power that gets created, slowing down new powerset releases.
Then you also have strafing issues, over-water issues, in-mission issues, up-hill/down-hill issues, etc. |
So, flying vehicles doable. Now, if only we could get a flying jetbike. Though... Y'know, with that new one-off pop up bar, I bet they could add something like rocket launchers to a flying jetbike...
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Look, frankly, I'd say I'd just be happy with a flying car without rocket launchers or any other gadgets, it's a freakin' flying car that will likely consume only 0.02 end per-second.|
Originally Posted by ThePill
Except for Rocketboard. Magic Carpet. No attack powers. Problem solved.
So, flying vehicles doable. Now, if only we could get a flying jetbike. Though... Y'know, with that new one-off pop up bar, I bet they could add something like rocket launchers to a flying jetbike... |
So what we'd have is a car that can subvert normal traffic congestion issues and have infinite fuel capacity.
That's more than "super" enough for me for a super-mobile.
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
City of Heroes is a game about freedom of expression and variety of experiences far more so than it is about representing any one theme, topic or genre.
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Heck, I would even accept if you could not use it in mission maps.
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Originally Posted by AzureSkyCiel
Look, frankly, I'd say I'd just be happy with a flying car without rocket launchers or any other gadgets, it's a freakin' flying car that will likely consume only 0.02 end per-second.
So what we'd have is a car that can subvert normal traffic congestion issues and have infinite fuel capacity. That's more than "super" enough for me for a super-mobile. |
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Well may not see vehicles totally implemented into the game but seem to be a sliver of one, the longbow flyer. well in a sense. Now as a non-teleport travel power, probably will take some work to put it in the game totally and work out the bugs. But it would be cool, you know a super hero that gets around on a motorcycle. Would be fitting for some gruff, StJ/WP brute scrapper or tank. And helicoptors as a fly power, nice. Batman has his travel gadgets, wonderwoman have her invis plane, wolverine is a known motorcycle rider, catwoman, I think some sort or motorcycle, robin his travel thingy, Twoface was a car I beleive but could be wrong. Been a while since I looked into him. So it would be cool I would like to see but not sure how it would work.
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Originally Posted by LightningBird
I was thinking for a suggestion maybe players could use vehicles like motorcycles,helicopters,jet,cars,ect.
For example different styles like catwoman has a motorcycle and so does batman both different styles so like a spots motorcycle and a chopper,ect. With all vehicles allow different styles. And the vechicles can be earned when you can fly or pick a new powerpool. The reason is Batman,Wonderwoman,wolverine,catwoman,robin,TwoFac e,all have vehilces why cant these guys for ppl who dont want powers to get around.  |
-Female Player-
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Originally Posted by mauk2
Evil_Legacy became one of my favorite posters with two words.
"Kick Rocks." I laffed so hard.  Never change, E_L! |
I would like to see one or two versions of a hoverbike, at least. (One racer/sleek, one Harley/hog style.)
They'd be pretty much the same as the Rocket Board and Flying Carpet, yes. But people that want a motorcycle could at least ride them down near the ground to mostly get that effect. And unlike the board and carpet, you'd actually be SITTING on this one.
The main problem I would see, other than actually making it, is doing the animations for moving the handlebars when you turn.
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I'm pretty sure that's also a possibility. Though part of me wants to say: Hey, if Sky Raider pilots are skilled enough to fly a Sky Skiff indoors/through doors without blasting them open, why can't I be good enough to 'donut' all over the carpet of Cole Tower's lobby before Cole comes in and invalidates my insurance.
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Originally Posted by ThePill
Heck, I would even accept if you could not use it in mission maps.
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
City of Heroes is a game about freedom of expression and variety of experiences far more so than it is about representing any one theme, topic or genre.
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a car or plane -.- no, those would be kinda lame.
but a motorcycle? >.> don't see what not, the T3 pet for thugs shows up on one.
as for 'combat' related stuff, easy fix, no attack powers, and a stealth bonus to keep things off you
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Originally Posted by LightningBird
I was thinking for a suggestion maybe players could use vehicles like motorcycles,helicopters,jet,cars,ect.
For example different styles like catwoman has a motorcycle and so does batman both different styles so like a spots motorcycle and a chopper,ect. With all vehicles allow different styles. And the vechicles can be earned when you can fly or pick a new powerpool. The reason is Batman,Wonderwoman,wolverine,catwoman,robin,TwoFac e,all have vehilces why cant these guys for ppl who dont want powers to get around. |
Already been done:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Txl_YwVmhKQ
I was thinking for a suggestion maybe players could use vehicles like motorcycles,helicopters,jet,cars,ect.
For example different styles like catwoman has a motorcycle and so does batman both different styles so like a spots motorcycle and a chopper,ect.
With all vehicles allow different styles.
And the vechicles can be earned when you can fly or pick a new powerpool.
The reason is Batman,Wonderwoman,wolverine,catwoman,robin,TwoFac e,all have vehilces why cant these guys for ppl who dont want powers to get around.