Were I to get Win7, which should I go with?
By
Arcanaville,
Posted on: 2012-05-14 16:16 in ALL ACCESS Gameplay Technical Issues Bugs
Win 7 Home Pre 64bit. Just an heads up: will cap out at 16gb of RAM.
I'd say Home Premium.
Professional's extra features are targeted at business/enterprise users. Encrypted File System might be desirable for some users, but I'd not trust it for too much (I'd much sooner trust TrueCrypt). There's also Windows XP Mode, but VirtualPC kinda sucks *** (I'd rather run even VirtualBox...). It can use a theoretical max of 192 GB of ram... but building a system with > 16GB ram isn't exactly... common.
IMO, pretty much everyone that buys Ultimate is completely wasting their money (unless you use MUI... but the number of people doing that has to be very small).
Edit: 64 bits, of course. No point in upgrading if you stay 32 bits.
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Originally Posted by ShadowNate
;_; ?!?! What the heck is wrong with you, my god, I have never been so confused in my life!
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Hmm...
How about dual-booting? I just got a new 1Tb HD and could conceivably stick 7 on a partition on it. It's been a long time since I've tried doing that so dunno how it would work.
I could get Professional for about $20 more than Premium. Would that be worth it?
Oh, and I'll be completely avoiding Win8. I think that is one of the fugliest OSes I've ever seen. Have no desire whatsoever to have anything to do with it. Just for the record. 
I wouldn't really recommend dual booting... there isn't a whole lot of benefit to it, and its tended to be a bit messy in my experience.
What I would do, though, is pull out your current hard drive, and put the 'new' 1TB drive in as the primary master (or SATA 0, since the system probably isn't that old). Then, install Windows 7 on it.
That way, you'd have a totally clean install. You can then install all your programs and test them out. If everything works fine (I'd imagine it would, but never can be totally sure till you try), you can then plug in your old hard drive as a secondary drive.
You can then pull the files from it at your liesure.
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It really isn't. Home Premium is actually quite a good option, having pretty much all the features most everyone (for values of 'everyone' that isn't equal to 'enterprise') would want.
| I could get Professional for about $20 more than Premium. Would that be worth it? |
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Originally Posted by ShadowNate
;_; ?!?! What the heck is wrong with you, my god, I have never been so confused in my life!
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I second Kitsune on this one; Home Premium will be fine. Professional really is aimed at businesses that require a 32-bit environment for any programs that are not compatible on the 64-bit front. For home users, it really is a waste. The 16GB memory limit probably would not be a real problem for the forseeable future, unless you plan on running some serious graphics or scientific kind of stuff. Even then, 16 should be fine. Even at $20 you have to consider not really the XP Mode, but the memory thing being a bigger issue for the future. It would be up to you and your needs.
For what it is worth, I run the enterprise edition on my laptop (hooray for bring-home work computers!) and I played around with XP mode in case a client had questions. Otherwise, I've not even used the BitLocker in favor of another drive encryption program work requires, or anything else that doesn't come on Home Premium.
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I generally avoid Home versions like the plague. As for version, I tend to stick to professional as the only reason to get Ultimate is if you're doing something that requires file encryption. If you're a student, then you can actually get Pro for free btw through the (previously known as) MSDNAA system.
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Originally Posted by fallenz
Win 7 Home Pre 64bit. Just an heads up: will cap out at 16gb of RAM.
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See, I want dual booting though. For some of my older games, I don't want to go through the hassle of trying to get 'em to work in 7 (if they even will work in it). I've gotten them to the point in XP that they work just fine.
What I was planning, is keeping the current OS drive. I would partition the 1Tb into a ~100Gb for the 7 OS, a 150 for the Win7 programs, then a 750 for everything else.
And no, I'm not a student, so no free versions.
You are better off just going all Win 7. Dual booting is a pain with Window OS sometimes and you will find alot of your games will work under Window 7
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Dual booting ... works. *shrug* i see no point to it for XP to 7, quite honestly. A nice, clean install is best. |
Originally Posted by Dark One
Hmm...
How about dual-booting? I just got a new 1Tb HD and could conceivably stick 7 on a partition on it. It's been a long time since I've tried doing that so dunno how it would work. I could get Professional for about $20 more than Premium. Would that be worth it? Oh, and I'll be completely avoiding Win8. I think that is one of the fugliest OSes I've ever seen. Have no desire whatsoever to have anything to do with it. Just for the record. |
And if you get pro for $20 more... well, do you think you'll be using over 16 Gb RAM? That's really the main reason I can see for most people using it.
(As far as Win8... with all my various issues with it, its looks are down the list a ways. It's functionally annoying as hell. For instance, you won't be able to use media center in Home, just Pro... and it'll be an added price addon at that.)
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A lot != all.|
Originally Posted by fallenz
You are better off just going all Win 7. Dual booting is a pain with Window OS sometimes and you will find alot of your games will work under Window 7
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I would rather deal with whatever issues crop up with a dual-boot than haul out another box just to play my older games.
The only real differences between Home and Pro are:
- Pro can access more memory
- Pro can join domains
- XP Mode (running a Virtual PC XP instance inside Win7)
- Full access to the backup/restore tool for full system backups.
Unless you're on a system with +16GB of RAM or you happen to need Active Directory support for some reason, going Windows Professional is a waste of money.
XP Mode isn't very useful to many home users. A couple of my clients use it to support some apps that don't play nice in Win7. But other than that...
As for the backup/restore tool. Most users aren't going to use it anyhow. Moreover, there are third party system imaging tools out there that are easier and far superior to the somewhat arcane backup tool.
In short, just save time and money and go XP Home 64-bit.
Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
/headdesk
What I thought was a good deal on Win7 turns out to be OEM/System Builder garbage. You know, the version that (supposedly) locks to a specific configuration. Forget that noise.
I guess now I have to find a copy of XP 64 bit that works and isn't a scam/burned copy.
Sorry for wasting everyone's time. 
So you're going to pay double for a retail copy, just on the off chance you may replace your system in a year or two?
Don't waste your money.
Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
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The OEM versions are not garbage.|
Originally Posted by Dark One
/headdesk
What I thought was a good deal on Win7 turns out to be OEM/System Builder garbage. You know, the version that (supposedly) locks to a specific configuration. Forget that noise. I guess now I have to find a copy of XP 64 bit that works and isn't a scam/burned copy. Sorry for wasting everyone's time. |
I've never been locked to a specific configuration on any OEM version of Windows I've bought.
I had a system that I'd been running Windows 98SE on that I reloaded with XP shortly after XP came out using an OEM version of XP Pro. A few years later I did a major rebuild of the system basically re-using just the case, power supply and optical drives with the rest of the system internals being new and didn't have any problems using that same OEM version of XP Pro.
That system had a motherboard failure shortly after I moved back to Texas and I replaced the motherboard with a different manufacturer's board (couldn't find a reasonably priced ASUS of the same model) and had no trouble with activating the same XP Pro license on it.
And that's just one system. I've regularly re-used OEM licenses when doing complete upgrades. I know several other techs that do the same thing.
If the game spit out 20 dollar bills people would complain that they weren't sequentially numbered. If they were sequentially numbered people would complain that they weren't random enough.
Black Pebble is my new hero.
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A lot of what you have said in this thread is based off fear of the unknown. It would be far easier for us to determine a good fit for you if you listed the old programs you are nervous about losing so we can check if it works in Win 7 64.|
Originally Posted by Dark One
/headdesk
What I thought was a good deal on Win7 turns out to be OEM/System Builder garbage. You know, the version that (supposedly) locks to a specific configuration. Forget that noise. I guess now I have to find a copy of XP 64 bit that works and isn't a scam/burned copy. Sorry for wasting everyone's time. |
XP 64 is out of the question if you ask me, especially if you are already thinking of changing systems so soon that you destroy the entire idea because of a system builder version. XP is losing all support in 2014 if I remember right.
...also, might as well get used to DRM. Everything will end up having it eventually, except shareware. All consoles have it, unless you are illegally modding them too.
My new Youtube Channel with CoH info
You might know me as FlintEastwood now on Freedom
Windows XP 64 bit edition is simply an awful idea.
Support is nearly over, it's not actually XP (it's a modded Server 2003), and it has crappy driver compatibility. It's basically the worst of all worlds.
And as was stated, if you object to PC gaming due to DRM, then you shouldn't even touch console gaming (the DRM on consoles makes Steam & co look like open source software by comparison).
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Originally Posted by ShadowNate
;_; ?!?! What the heck is wrong with you, my god, I have never been so confused in my life!
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... also, if a home user (like the OP) with a copy of XP needs it, (a) the "Virtual XP mode" does work on home, or at least used to, and (b) he can also do it via Virtualbox or other virtualization software. |
Originally Posted by Hyperstrike
XP Mode isn't very useful to many home users. A couple of my clients use it to support some apps that don't play nice in Win7. But other than that...
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| As for the backup/restore tool. Most users aren't going to use it anyhow. Moreover, there are third party system imaging tools out there that are easier and far superior to the somewhat arcane backup tool. |
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Originally Posted by Dark One
/headdesk
What I thought was a good deal on Win7 turns out to be OEM/System Builder garbage. You know, the version that (supposedly) locks to a specific configuration. Forget that noise. |
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| I guess now I have to find a copy of XP 64 bit that works and isn't a scam/burned copy. |
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While I may be able to only play an Xbox 360 game on an Xbox 360, I still retain the capability of reselling that game when I am finished with it. Try doing that with anything requiring Steam/Origin/Uplay/Battle.net.|
Originally Posted by Kitsune Knight
And as was stated, if you object to PC gaming due to DRM, then you shouldn't even touch console gaming (the DRM on consoles makes Steam & co look like open source software by comparison).
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I will not support gaming companies that are actively trying to destroy my rights. If they use business practices or software that I detest, I simply won't purchase their products. That includes games that use Online Passes, Single-use Day-1 DLC codes, and DRM that eliminates any secondhand value. And yes, I realize someone will say, "CoH has no resale value!" and while true, I see CoH as a service rather than a discreet product ala Skyrim.
And no, I do not have to "get used to it". I can simply do without. There's plenty of games that can keep me playing for a significant length of time into the future without having to support people that treat me like a criminal.
As to the locking on OEM/System Builder, go look up some of the reviews on Amazon. I'd rather not tempt fate by purchasing one only to find out that if a hard drive dies, I'm out that money for the OS.
That being said, thank you for the suggestions and help. I will try to find an upgrade for Win7 Premium. I will also look into the method for dual booting. Peace.
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Windows XP has the exact same restricts. Vista/7 is less anal in this regard. I didn't see any of the reviews you were talking about, just a bunch of positive reviews and the usual occasional nut job.| As to the locking on OEM/System Builder, go look up some of the reviews on Amazon. I'd rather not tempt fate by purchasing one only to find out that if a hard drive dies, I'm out that money for the OS. |
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| I will not support gaming companies that are actively trying to destroy my rights. |
Hell, Sony deserves an extra special insult here, with marketing the PS3 as being able to run Linux, then retroactively striping out support (from the pre-slim models) just weeks after they made an official statement that they weren't going to remove the support! Hard to top that.
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Originally Posted by ShadowNate
;_; ?!?! What the heck is wrong with you, my god, I have never been so confused in my life!
|
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Amazon is NOT a haven for the technically literate. If your hard drive dies, you plonk a new one in.|
Originally Posted by Dark One
As to the locking on OEM/System Builder, go look up some of the reviews on Amazon. I'd rather not tempt fate by purchasing one only to find out that if a hard drive dies, I'm out that money for the OS.
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If worse comes to worst, you simply call Microsoft's Activation line, explain that the old drive died and the new drive is replacing it.
The hardware activation isn't THAT sensitive. You basically have to swap 3/4ths of the system components to trip it, and if you do, you simply call the activation line and tell them your CPU and motherboard died in a freak lightning storm and you've replaced them. It's STILL the same machine.
As long as you're not going:
Install: Activate
6 weeks later: New system, install, reactivate
6 weeks later: New system, install, reactivate
6 weeks later: New system, install, reactivate
THOSE kinds of things they track.
Also, one thing you can spend money on, OTHER than a craptastic old copy of XP, or the full retail Win7? A copy of Acronis True Image.
Once you have your system installed, patched, and just the way you like it, THEN register it. THEN IMAGE IT.
Instead of needing to take 4-8-hours to reinstall everything AGAIN if you blow a drive, you simply mount the new drive, fire up Acronis and drop the original image back onto the system in an hour or two. Then just patch it to current, reimage it, and keep truckin'.
And no pesky reactivation to worry about.
Sorry if you find what I'm about to say offensive. But the way you're looking to go about this is the most painful, expensive and bass-ackwards method available to you.
Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
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I dunno where you live, but I noticed the other day that one of the local videogames resale shops is no longer buying XBox 360 games (or PS3, or Wii for that matter)... only games for the older consoles. There are other shops, of course, but one has to wonder if it's a sign of things to come. (There are rumors that the successor to the XBox 360 will require an always-on Internet connection for DRM purposes.)|
Originally Posted by Dark One
While I may be able to only play an Xbox 360 game on an Xbox 360, I still retain the capability of reselling that game when I am finished with it. Try doing that with anything requiring Steam/Origin/Uplay/Battle.net.
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I do miss the days when said shops also dealt in PC games, but those days are long gone and are never coming back. I can't remember the last time I went into a store and saw a boxed computer game (besides MMOs) that DIDN'T require online activation of some sort. These games are pretty much tied to the original purchaser and/or PC for life.
If you're going to insist on avoiding any kind of PC game involving DRM, online codes, etc., better be prepared to stick with low-budget indie games and never play another AAA title. (Which may be enough for you... just saying.)
TargetOne
"If you two don't work this out RIGHT NOW, I'm turning this invasion around and going home!" - Emperor Cole
What Target said. That ship has sailed. From this point on (more like a couple of years back - check your EULAs), you can assume that you won't ever get to "own" any game (if you ever really did). Much the same situation as anything copyrighted after the release of Steamboat Willie. :/
For what it's worth, Steam is one case where my own principles have bowed to practicality and/or convenience.
My characters at Virtueverse
Faces of the City
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Sorry but no. I'm not wasting time calling anyone.|
Originally Posted by Hyperstrike
Amazon is NOT a haven for the technically literate. If your hard drive dies, you plonk a new one in.
If worse comes to worst, you simply call Microsoft's Activation line, explain that the old drive died and the new drive is replacing it. |
And I've also seen bad things on NewEgg about the OEM/System Builder versions (which are technically for those building systems for resale, not personal use).
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| The hardware activation isn't THAT sensitive. You basically have to swap 3/4ths of the system components to trip it, and if you do, you simply call the activation line and tell them your CPU and motherboard died in a freak lightning storm and you've replaced them. It's STILL the same machine. |
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| Sorry if you find what I'm about to say offensive. But the way you're looking to go about this is the most painful, expensive and bass-ackwards method available to you. |
And that's presuming I even get Win7.
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| If you're going to insist on avoiding any kind of PC game involving DRM, online codes, etc., better be prepared to stick with low-budget indie games and never play another AAA title. (Which may be enough for you... just saying.) |
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| I dunno where you live, but I noticed the other day that one of the local videogames resale shops is no longer buying XBox 360 games (or PS3, or Wii for that matter)... only games for the older consoles. There are other shops, of course, but one has to wonder if it's a sign of things to come. (There are rumors that the successor to the XBox 360 will require an always-on Internet connection for DRM purposes.) |
If the 720 is going to block used game sales, then I won't get it. Just that simple. There's all the games from the NES, SNES, N64, GC, PS1, PS2, Xbox, and 360 that I never got around to playing before. I can be entertained for a considerable time for the future.
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| Nintendo, Sony, and Microsoft all have a long history of actively doing that with their consoles. Every one of all their consoles has been incredibly locked down, with DRM out the wazoo (this Google Tech Talk was quite a fascinating presentation on the topic, although it's 4 years old now). Personally, I find it more detestable to lock hardware down in such a way than it is to try to restrict software. |
Compare that with trying to play a PC game. Gotta install. Gotta make sure the drivers are updated. Oops, can't have that other program running or the DRM will not let me play. Ah hell, error #88392-XQR, what the frak does that mean? Internet's down? Can't play. Uninstall? Crud, it didn't get everything. DRM's still there too.
I won't be replying to this thread again. Again, thanks for the info and all. Even though it diverged from what I was originally asking. Cheers.
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Originally Posted by Hyperstrike
Amazon is NOT a haven for the technically literate. If your hard drive dies, you plonk a new one in.
If worse comes to worst, you simply call Microsoft's Activation line, explain that the old drive died and the new drive is replacing it. The hardware activation isn't THAT sensitive. You basically have to swap 3/4ths of the system components to trip it, and if you do, you simply call the activation line and tell them your CPU and motherboard died in a freak lightning storm and you've replaced them. It's STILL the same machine. As long as you're not going: Install: Activate 6 weeks later: New system, install, reactivate 6 weeks later: New system, install, reactivate 6 weeks later: New system, install, reactivate THOSE kinds of things they track. Also, one thing you can spend money on, OTHER than a craptastic old copy of XP, or the full retail Win7? A copy of Acronis True Image. Once you have your system installed, patched, and just the way you like it, THEN register it. THEN IMAGE IT. Instead of needing to take 4-8-hours to reinstall everything AGAIN if you blow a drive, you simply mount the new drive, fire up Acronis and drop the original image back onto the system in an hour or two. Then just patch it to current, reimage it, and keep truckin'. And no pesky reactivation to worry about. Sorry if you find what I'm about to say offensive. But the way you're looking to go about this is the most painful, expensive and bass-ackwards method available to you. |
/em golf clap
Best post on the subject.
H: Blaster 50, Defender 50, Tank 50, Scrapper 50, Controller 50, PB 50, WS 50
V: Brute 50, Corruptor 50, MM 50, Dominator 50, Stalker 50, AW 50, AS 50
Top 4: Controller, Brute, Scrapper, Corruptor
Bottom 4: (Peacebringer) way below everything else, Mastermind, Dominator, Blaster
CoH in WQHD
I'm thinking it's about time to upgrade to 7 from XP. Problem is, there's too blasted many versions to choose from. I'm thinking either the Premium or Professional 64-bit.
Things that I need it for...
Access to higher than 4gigs of RAM. My XP 32-bit is not seeing my other 4gigs, so they're basically wasted as it stands now.
CoH and older games. I'm pretty much done with PC gaming as it stands due to the overreliance on using Steam, Origin, Ubisoft's, and Blizzard's DRM. Unless something changes, I doubt I'll be going back to it as a gaming platform for anything "new".
I like to play around with Daz 4 and some other programs. Nothing major.
Thoughts?