Were I to get Win7, which should I go with?


Arcanaville

 

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Originally Posted by Dark One View Post
And no, I do not have to "get used to it". I can simply do without.
Actually, that IS getting used to it.

EDIT: I don't know why we are even posting replies - it's like he just wants to argue with all of us that keep up with technology and really know what we are talking about.

I actually have a little faith in game companies; whereas if we can help eliminate the ripoff artists (Gamestop and the like) where developers are making more money due to lack of used game sales, that we might see more direct sales for digital versions regularly.


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Originally Posted by Dark One View Post
Sorry but no. I'm not wasting time calling anyone.

And I've also seen bad things on NewEgg about the OEM/System Builder versions (which are technically for those building systems for resale, not personal use).

Not willing to risk it. Nor am I willing to risk being told, "No.".
We've have OEM versions of Windows on virtually very PC we've ever owned, since Archie built our first one back in 1993. It has never, not once, been a problem.


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Originally Posted by Dark One View Post

As to the locking on OEM/System Builder, go look up some of the reviews on Amazon. I'd rather not tempt fate by purchasing one only to find out that if a hard drive dies, I'm out that money for the OS.

That being said, thank you for the suggestions and help. I will try to find an upgrade for Win7 Premium. I will also look into the method for dual booting. Peace.
I call shenanigans on whatever you've seen on Amazon. Oddly, I can't find anything along those lines in reviews on Amazon, but if you have somewhere found something like that, the person that posted it is lying through their teeth.

Simply replacing a hard drive will not trigger the reactivation. As Hyperstrike said, it requires replacing a significant amount of hardware to trigger the reactivation query.

I've been a tech since 1993 (not to mention the several years before that of starting to tinker and learn hardware) and have built several systems, rebuilt several systems and done minor hardware upgrades and replacements. Not just for myself but for friends, family, strangers and even some of the companies I've worked for.

In that time, I've had to call Microsoft exactly 2 times for activation problems. One of those was because someone had written the license key down in a way that made it difficult to tell if it was a B or an 8 in the key. The other was due to an electrical storm frying the system less than 4 months after it was built and having to replace everything in the computer. As soon as I said "electrical storm" and mentioned where the customer lived the Microsoft rep apologized for the problems in registration and activated the license in their system. He told me that the only reason it had triggered was due to the major number of hardware ID's changing and how recently the OS had been registered. Total time of call? 10 minutes. I was browsing some tech articles while I made the call. I'd have been reading those articles anyway, so no real loss of my time.

Oh yeah, and both of these problems were on Windows XP. I've yet to have a problem with activations on either Vista or Windows 7.

You asked for advice, were given advice, then made a ridiculous statement that was shot down by several people that are computer techs. You came back in with more FUD posting and again the techs gave you accurate information to shoot down those posts. And yet you still want to act like you're being wronged because we are giving you truthful and accurate information to correct the misinformation you've gotten elsewhere.

You take the cake.


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Originally Posted by Dark One View Post
Sorry but no. I'm not wasting time calling anyone.
*facepalm*

If it reactivates a system for you, and you can be browsing, watching a movie, or whatever while you're doing it, how exactly is it a waste of time? You're talking 5-10 minutes depending on whether or not you need to talk to a real person.

And so we're clear.

You'd have to do the same thing WITH A RETAIL COPY if enough hardware IDs change.

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And I've also seen bad things on NewEgg about the OEM/System Builder versions (which are technically for those building systems for resale, not personal use).
Can we come to the REAL reason you're so averse to this, rather than a bunch of lame excuses.


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Not willing to risk it. Nor am I willing to risk being told, "No.".
Whatever. It's your money, time and effort to waste.

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I won't be replying to this thread again. Again, thanks for the info and all. Even though it diverged from what I was originally asking. Cheers.

*SIGH*



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Posted

As was said a few times, the 'activation' features of Vista/7 are also in Windows XP. You're already getting to enjoy them (unless you have a 'volume license' copy... which means you likely just pirated it), except, from every account I've read, a much harsher version. I've been running Vista/7 for years, and yet to notice the activation except upon the very first install. Unlike XP.

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Um what? Buy an upgrade copy of Win7 Premium. Partition my new drive. Install 7 in one partition. Done. At least according to the instructions on dual-booting I've found. Doesn't sound all that expensive or painful to me.

And that's presuming I even get Win7.
People were talking about you choosing Windows XP 64 bit edition. The horrible bastardization of a Windows Server variant, that was largely DoA because it wasn't shipped by virtually anyone (certainly not on a consumer system), and had horrible driver support. According to Valve's Steam Hardware Survey, Windows XP 64bit has less than half the number of users of OS X Snow Leopard... That's not even the current version of OS X! Mind you, to upgrade to the latest version is a grand total of $20, and can be done with just a few clicks of the mouse (it can be bought in the Mac App Store, downloaded, and installed very quickly).

That is what people were talking about as a bad idea. And, personally, I'd still recommend against installing Windows 7 into a second partition. I've done that in the past (with prior versions of Windows), and there's a lot of software that does not expect that and will freak out (because virtually no one does that). Swapping the HDs, IMO, is a far better testing solution, as it'll let you avoid any incompatibilities.

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Originally Posted by Dark One View Post
I put the game into the console. It works.
Where 'game' is 'game by company that has paid $MANUFACTURER (Microsoft, Sony, Nintendo) a huge amount of money, gone through a very lengthy/arbitrary approval process, and then laced the game with absurd amounts of DRM'. You can't run any game unless explicitly approved by $MANUFACTURER, or any other software. You might not realize it, but all modern consoles are just general purpose computers (the PS3 was even advertised as such!), laced with huge amounts of DRM. Actually, scratch 'modern', consoles were general purpose computers since their birth, just laced with DRM a few generations after their birth.

From the rest of your description, it doesn't sound like you have any problems with DRM itself, just poorly functioning functionality. You'll get DRM either way, except consoles just ensure you can't avoid it.


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Originally Posted by ShadowNate
;_; ?!?! What the heck is wrong with you, my god, I have never been so confused in my life!

 

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Most of his concerns/knowledge come right out of the 2000-2005 era it seems - we've all gone through most of his worries, only many years ago, and he needs to catch up.


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Originally Posted by JayboH View Post
EDIT: I don't know why we are even posting replies - it's like he just wants to argue with all of us that keep up with technology and really know what we are talking about.
Not to mention that he seems have made some of the stuff up. At the very least, it's contradictory to the personal experience of multiple other people. Seriously, though, it started out okay but became a rant. At that point, it's no longer subject to rational thought or discussion.

The fact remains, however, that there is a very good reason for replying - correcting misinformation so that someone else doesn't come along and get inaccurate information from this thread. We can't convince a ranter, but we can present useful information for a hypothetical clueless person who reads this thread because they have the same question.


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Originally Posted by Hyperstrike View Post
Also, one thing you can spend money on, OTHER than a craptastic old copy of XP, or the full retail Win7? A copy of Acronis True Image.
Tangent: I haven't used the 2012 edition, but Acronis has given me some unexplainable fits over the years and sometimes it just plain sucks up too much resources while its backing up for some reason, so I moved to ShadowProtect. Acronis' interface is a lot better, but I've found ShadowProtect to be much more bulletproof. That's important in any continuous incremental backup system and periodic verify is nice. A combination of the two would probably be the perfect backup solution.

Although, part of my opinion of both is due to the fact that I have to use these things in enterprise environments as well, and in enterprise environments I think SP is significantly more solid than Acronis.


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Posted

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Originally Posted by Hyperstrike View Post
The hardware activation isn't THAT sensitive. You basically have to swap 3/4ths of the system components to trip it, and if you do, you simply call the activation line and tell them your CPU and motherboard died in a freak lightning storm and you've replaced them. It's STILL the same machine.
Actually it's a little more sensative than that, BUT...it's way easier to fix than that sounds. Simply put, it involves a touchtone phone, patience to deal with an automated system (still easier than That sounds), and the ability to see and type. I've probably done that 2-3 times in the last year (ok, so I lost track of which laptop had which license...) and the whole double checking the verification numbers is what took the longest.

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Instead of needing to take 4-8-hours to reinstall everything AGAIN if you blow a drive, you simply mount the new drive, fire up Acronis and drop the original image back onto the system in an hour or two. Then just patch it to current, reimage it, and keep truckin'.
A thousand times THIS. I always create a baseline (OS + hardware drivers only) image of my windows installation and then I'll do a +Software image as well once I install my core software.

I'm sure that Acronis must be decent as it was mentioned, but something I found out the hard way was that Win7 uses a different version of NTFS than XP and my older cloning software couldn't see the drive to clone my mom's laptop when she got it. I had to deal with the builtin windows backup that worked, but when I had to use it to restore her system (I forget what the issue was, probably a bloody IE toolbar she DL) it resulted in losing the system's recovery partition (that 200mb partition Win7 creates on a fresh install).

For reference, I've been using Avanquest's Partition Commander and Perfect Image for a number of years now.

As for XP Mode, unless you're wanting to run something that requires 3D graphics, then you could also create a virtual machine separate from XPM so that you don't screw that up, but unless we know What you're wanting to preserve, then there's no way we can give you an absolute answer. IE: There's no way for me to run my circa Win95 games on anything beyond true XP and since I still love them, then that's a killjoy. That said, unless it's a laptop, then I could just nab a small drive to put XP on. Dual-boot works, but it can get annoying after a while and if you do it install the older OS first.


 

Posted

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Originally Posted by Arcanaville View Post
Tangent: I haven't used the 2012 edition, but Acronis has given me some unexplainable fits over the years and sometimes it just plain sucks up too much resources while its backing up for some reason, so I moved to ShadowProtect. Acronis' interface is a lot better, but I've found ShadowProtect to be much more bulletproof. That's important in any continuous incremental backup system and periodic verify is nice. A combination of the two would probably be the perfect backup solution.

Although, part of my opinion of both is due to the fact that I have to use these things in enterprise environments as well, and in enterprise environments I think SP is significantly more solid than Acronis.
I'm not actually using Acronis as an installed backup tool.

I'm booting off the Acronis disk, and just making an image of the entire drive.

And yes, I don't care for Acronis' enterprise offerings. But for imaging a single system, the regular True Image works just fine.



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Posted

Hyperstrike, TexasJustice, thanks for the info on OEMs. I was looking to purchase Windows 7 in the near future and you've assuaged my concerns about going OEM. Thanks!

PS: Hyperstrike, is there going to be a GenCon M&G this year?


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Posted

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Originally Posted by Bonehead View Post
Hyperstrike, TexasJustice, thanks for the info on OEMs. I was looking to purchase Windows 7 in the near future and you've assuaged my concerns about going OEM. Thanks!

PS: Hyperstrike, is there going to be a GenCon M&G this year?
Why yes. Yes there is!



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Posted

Heh, missed that somehow.


But still I fear and still I dare not laugh at the madman!

One man's "meh" is another man's "zomg". - Leatherneck

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