1. Merge: Quantum Flight and Quantum Acceleration
Quantum Flight's power description mentions Flight Speed twice.
2. Add: A Recall/Rez component to Glowing Touch*
Allow a PB to Recall and Rez a defeated ally, otherwise just Heal them.
(Note: No Recall of a Live target.)
3. Add: Air Superiority
Quantum F/A's merging would leave an open pick and Air Superiority would help.
All (Pure) Khelds:
As for APP/Patron like pools, I'd rather see a few bonus slots for enhancements available when the APP/Patron level is reached.
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All other AT's: (Except SoA)
A Kheldian APP.
AT's using these would lose their inherent bonus in favor of the Kheldian ones subject to their basic alignment.
Scrapper:PB Stalker:WS (As examples.)
They would gain some Kheld abilities, but still retain their original powersets.
These would be newly formed PB/WS with minimal Kheld abilities...
A Blast, Seekers/Orbiting Death, Glowing Touch*/Stygian Return, Both Forms.
Now this may seem overpowered, but remember to use these they would have to give up their innate ability and gain the Kheldian's innate, including Damage Debuff and combat %'s making this more of a concept APP skillset.
Nuff Said...
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Creator of: Coolio's Tech Beacon Replacements
AE arc 402506, 'The Rise and Demise or Otherwise of Tekna Logik...'.
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The problem with this has been hashed and rehashed. There is no version of Luminous Blast that doesn't have KB, and unlike any Blaster secondary, you can't play Luminous Aura without taking Luminous Blast. I've said a million times that the KB in at least Photon Seekers and Solar Flare are not a good design. I can see keeping the KB in Nova AOE's, and the human TAOE/Cone, since the KB in all those powers can be used for deliberate mitigation, however Solar Flare can't be used deliberately- Or rather, the situations where it can are few and far between, and Photon Seekers KB can never be used deliberately unless you just get lucky (or you're on a very specific part of a map.) That is not good design imo. |
Originally Posted by Darth_Khasei
I just view it like going to the Blaster forum and complaining that the Energy powerset needs to have KB "removed" because you personally don't like KB. I say go play another set that is for "you" that does not have KB or make a suggestion that preserves the initial design of the set with KB and present alternates for those that don't want what the set is designed to do and offers which is in fact KB.
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Also, the ST KB is problematic since between Dwarf and human melee attacks, it's counter-intuitive to knock single targets away from you if it prevents you from being able to fluently use your other ST powers. Warshades suffer from this with Shadow Blast also, but that KB doesn't seem to happen nearly as often.
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Thank you for clarifying your rationale at least. I fear that I doubt we will be able to have productive discourse on this matter, though.|
Originally Posted by Darth_Khasei
I feel it falls under the "Gut them and start over" category, which perhaps is a bleed over from the thread that started this thread.
... To me anything else is just straight up trolling/looking for a fight/disrespecting the AT and those that use it as designed. |
Feel free to disregard the following, though as I'm going to place a comment down here that I know you'd not enjoy. However, I don't wish to double-post.
I personally like the idea of shifting the KB to KU. It's less problematic for most people and satisfying to hit someone and send them skyward. IMO, it gives the impression of hitting hard with energy-enhanced strikes and gives a distinct difference from Warshades. Shades bind enemies, PBs kindly offer to help them reach for the stars...
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Originally Posted by TwoHeadedBoy
The problem with this has been hashed and rehashed. There is no version of Luminous Blast that doesn't have KB, and unlike any Blaster secondary, you can't play Luminous Aura without taking Luminous Blast. I've said a million times that the KB in at least Photon Seekers and Solar Flare are not a good design. I can see keeping the KB in Nova AOE's, and the human TAOE/Cone, since the KB in all those powers can be used for deliberate mitigation, however Solar Flare can't be used deliberately- Or rather, the situations where it can are few and far between, and Photon Seekers KB can never be used deliberately unless you just get lucky (or you're on a very specific part of a map.) That is not good design imo.
Also, the ST KB is problematic since between Dwarf and human melee attacks, it's counter-intuitive to knock single targets away from you if it prevents you from being able to fluently use your other ST powers. Warshades suffer from this with Shadow Blast also, but that KB doesn't seem to happen nearly as often. |
I agree with this. At some point, enough knock back is enough. You can't really "stack" knock backs anyway. What's the point of having knock back in almost every attack?
I don't hate all knock backs but I do hate solar flare's pbaoe kb. I rather they do something to nerf solar flare like reducing knock back chance to 10% but keep it knock down. PB has enough knock back powers if I really want knock things away from me.
What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.
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Full stop....not the AT for you move on to the next AT who's design fits your desires. I really don't understand the need to attack one of the two powersets that offers KB for those that like that when all the others are better suited to those that don't want it.|
Originally Posted by TwoHeadedBoy
The problem with this has been hashed and rehashed. There is no version of Luminous Blast that doesn't have KB, and unlike any Blaster secondary, you can't play Luminous Aura without taking Luminous Blast.
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And yes after years of playing the game and having had various devs comment on the subject I still agree with them to keep the KB as is.
I would totally support any viable alternative to the "removal" of KB and will strongly oppose anyone with the position to remove it for "all" which is against the fundamental design of the set period.
Offering a viable alternate seems like the next logical step when the devs have said more than once no to changing the fundamental design which is to yes have KB for the PB.
If you can't do that then yes I see it as a troll and will continue to say pound sand.
The development team and this community deserved better than this from NC Soft. Best wishes on your search.
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You get that next issue, by the way. |
Originally Posted by Jibikao
1. Get rid of shifting delays.
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Originally Posted by Darth_Khasei
Bill already asked this at the start of the thread and it is time for people to respect this now.
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It would be a major change I'd likely dislike - but I don't think I agree with you that it's the same as "Gut them and start over."
Then again, I'd fully admit I'd be a royal ******* as a dev (which is one of many reasons it's good I'm not) - I'd find a way to make a -KB IO, then introduce a nice, fun and rewarding set of arcs that require you to be able to do knockback.
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Originally Posted by Coolio
1. Merge: Quantum Flight and Quantum Acceleration
Quantum Flight's power description mentions Flight Speed twice. |
The resulting power... hmmm. Might be seen as overpowered. Basically starting as QFly and blending into QA - 30 seconds of top speed flight with instant phase, blending into an "ony affecting self" high defense flight speed boost. It potentially would have to not disable combat or energy flight, though, which Qfly - at least from memory - does now, being a travel power.
Kind of curious now - does anyone have slotting or gameplay this would affect? I'd pretty much treat it just like I treat Qfly now - pretty much taking it as is.
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Originally Posted by Jibako
You can't really "stack" knock backs anyway.
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Ah so there is an evil one lurking inside of you. |
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
Then again, I'd fully admit I'd be a royal ******* as a dev (which is one of many reasons it's good I'm not) - I'd find a way to make a -KB IO, then introduce a nice, fun and rewarding set of arcs that require you to be able to do knockback.
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The development team and this community deserved better than this from NC Soft. Best wishes on your search.
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See my thread in general discussion. |
Originally Posted by Darth_Khasei
Ah so there is an evil one lurking inside of you.
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("If you were a dev...")
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I did...see my response lol. |
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
See my thread in general discussion.
("If you were a dev...") |
The development team and this community deserved better than this from NC Soft. Best wishes on your search.
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Don't tell me what is or isn't for me. What you are doing now is putting your fingers in your ears and saying "LA LA LA I CAN'T HEAR YOU." I'm not attacking anything, I was explaining why PBAOE knockback for players and pseudo pets is not good design. I wasn't saying "all knockback is evil."
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Originally Posted by Darth_Khasei
Full stop....not the AT for you move on to the next AT who's design fits your desires. I really don't understand the need to attack one of the two powersets that offers KB for those that like that when all the others are better suited to those that don't want it.
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Yes but I guess what I meant is that a knock back is a knock back.. you don't really stack the "duration" of it. Two knock backs may knock a tiny bit further and that's about it. You really don't get more benefits from knocking and knocking. There are times if you knock right when they get up, you can knock back again and most of the times, you knock again and he still gets up and shoots you. |
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
Actually... if you get them off fast enough, they will stack. The window is *very* short, however.
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I don't mind all the knock backs but I don't like solar flare's. I also wish Photon Seekers didn't have knock back because if one seeker hits first and scatter the crowd, the other two may not hit as many targets. You can't really "drop PS" the way you can with Seeker Drone so to get the most damage out of them, you are more likely to just drop it right in the middle of the crowd, which creates another Pbaoe knock back effect just like what I don't like in Solar Flare.
I've talked to many of my online friends and the #1 thing they don't like about Peacebringer is all the knock backs. It is a legit issue IMO and one I wish could be addressed. Of course, all is well if we have an option to reduce knock back effects. Then those that love it can keep it and those that hate it can reduce it to knock down.
What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.
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Of course you can't say "all Knockback is evil" since you are a Warshade lover...to do so would be absurd.|
Originally Posted by TwoHeadedBoy
Don't tell me what is or isn't for me. What you are doing now is putting your fingers in your ears and saying "LA LA LA I CAN'T HEAR YOU." I'm not attacking anything, I was explaining why PBAOE knockback for players and pseudo pets is not good design. I wasn't saying "all knockback is evil."
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I know you are not listening because the devs have already addressed this issue multiple times since I came to this game in I8. Some people like all of the KB in all of the attacks that have it and use it to their advantage in deploying their playstyle.
Arbiter Hawk is on record very recently acknowledging the fact that they are not interested in making changes that muck up playstyles that are currently working using the PB in it's present state of KB.
So I will keep campaigning as actively for the status quo as those who are trying to change the PB into (insert your favorite AT) are actively campaigning for a fundamental change "NOT" desired by all.
The development team and this community deserved better than this from NC Soft. Best wishes on your search.
1. Get rid of Proton Scatter on the human form. Animation seems too long and the damage is low that it doesn't even seem worth picking the power up anyway. Pure conjecture on my part.
2. With Proton Scatter gone I would replace it with a sniper attack that does the one handed open palm animation. It could be called "Solar Lance". If the animation is going take time I would like some bang for my buck, plus I think it would look cool on a PB.
If the sniper does not grab you then maybe a small range melee attack. Have the human form create a blade of light. It could do Energy/Lethal damage. The animation would be akin to Vegito's energy sword for those of you that have ever watched DBZ. It could be called "Solar Blade", "Cosmic Sword", or maybe "Starcalibur"
3. Change Photon Seekers so that they fire at your target instead of waiting for them to find it. That way they can be shot from a far at the single enemy but still have the explosion hit any surronding mob. Probably tweek the radius which I think is 10 to maybe 15 or 20. Then it can be used either from a distance or up close. I never had much use for the things following me around.
Change the animation to the three puffs flying in a spiral formation at the target with a little comet tail going.
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It will not go well with some PB players to change the power from a Cone to a Single target attack. Some players just might pick the power so they can slot some good IO's in it for the bonuses. I do like the idea of the snipe attack. Maybe turn it into a new power and it can be a snipe Target AoE like LRM Rocket in Munitions Mastery for Blasters. That way everyone will be happy |
Originally Posted by newclay24
1. Get rid of Proton Scatter on the human form. Animation seems too long and the damage is low that it doesn't even seem worth picking the power up anyway. Pure conjecture on my part.
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Proton Sentry Peacebringer:lvl 50+++ - Human Build / Triform Build
Quasar Sentry Warshade:lvl 50+- Human Build / Triform Build
Red Katipo Arachnos Soldier:lvl 50+++ - Crab Build / Bane Build
Black Katipo Arachnos Widowlvl 50+++ - Fortunata Build / Night Widow Build
The three things I'd like changed would be.
1. Increase the damage scales from .850 melee & .800 ranged to 1.000 like the VEATS have.
2. Give the PBs a pbaoe attack similar to the WSs Orbiting Death power.
3. Give all khelds inherent mez protection without having to switch to dwarf mode.
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Originally Posted by RCU
The three things I'd like changed would be.
1. Increase the damage scales from .850 melee & .800 ranged to 1.000 like the VEATS have. 2. Give the PBs a pbaoe attack similar to the WSs Orbiting Death power. 3. Give all khelds inherent mez protection without having to switch to dwarf mode. |
Do PB's still need a damage buff? Inner Light can be made perma with enough recharge. Then with the new form shift you can use Inner Light in Nova and Dwarf without losing time. Also their are set bonuses in IO sets that can give a damage buff.
I personally don't like the Inherent Mez protection idea for PB's. We have Dwarf for this and I think it is enough. If the human had a definance inherent like the blasters where you can still use your tier1 - tier2 powers then I go for that.
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It does not matter. Might as well have named the thread three things that would change the PB into (insert your favorite AT here) instead cause that is all these kinds of threads ever attract anyway.
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Originally Posted by newclay24
I personally don't like the Inherent Mez protection idea for PB's.
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The development team and this community deserved better than this from NC Soft. Best wishes on your search.
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IMO they still need a damage buff. I love what they did to Inner Light, but the damage is still not that good. I think they do not want to bump it up to the 1.000 like the VEATS because of Cosmic Balance. If we team up with tankers and defenders our Cosmic Balance damage buff would be insane. That is why I think they need to change Cosmic Balance first and then bump up the Kheldians Damage. Some players like to solo and lose out on the Cosmic Balance buff. Why should anyone be force to team to use their inherent power. All the other AT's inherent powers do not require players to team up. Even defender's Vigilance gives a damage buff when less people are on the team and get a 30% damage buff when solo.
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Originally Posted by newclay24
Do PB's still need a damage buff? Inner Light can be made perma with enough recharge. Then with the new form shift you can use Inner Light in Nova and Dwarf without losing time. Also their are set bonuses in IO sets that can give a damage buff.
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Proton Sentry Peacebringer:lvl 50+++ - Human Build / Triform Build
Quasar Sentry Warshade:lvl 50+- Human Build / Triform Build
Red Katipo Arachnos Soldier:lvl 50+++ - Crab Build / Bane Build
Black Katipo Arachnos Widowlvl 50+++ - Fortunata Build / Night Widow Build
I keep on thinking of a way to fix the KB and I just had another idea. How about give Kheldians two more options during character creation. It will pop up when you are asked for your character info. It will be like this... Select Origin(natural), Select Play style (Tank), Select Archetype (Kheldian), and then on the power selection screen you will get the option of Knock back and Knock down prior to picking your first powers. When you do a respec then it will once again be the first question you are asked like how the VEATs are asked if they want to go Bane/Crab or Widow/Fort.
I know the Dev's are totally against changing KB to a KD, but so many people want this to happen and this idea can still make both KB lovers and KD lovers happy. Do I think it will happen? No 
, but a man can dream.
Proton Sentry Peacebringer:lvl 50+++ - Human Build / Triform Build
Quasar Sentry Warshade:lvl 50+- Human Build / Triform Build
Red Katipo Arachnos Soldier:lvl 50+++ - Crab Build / Bane Build
Black Katipo Arachnos Widowlvl 50+++ - Fortunata Build / Night Widow Build
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My PB is only in the low 20's, but if this option existed, I wouldn't hesitate. Even if she was 50+3 with all iSlots at t4 with a 50 billion IO build I would strip, delete and remake her so fast it'd make Synape's head spin.
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Originally Posted by Big_Soto
I keep on thinking of a way to fix the KB and I just had another idea. How about give Kheldians two more options during character creation. It will pop up when you are asked for your character info. It will be like this... Select Origin(natural), Select Play style (Tank), Select Archetype (Kheldian), and then on the power selection screen you will get the option of Knock back and Knock down prior to picking your first powers. When you do a respec then it will once again be the first question you are asked like how the VEATs are asked if they want to go Bane/Crab or Widow/Fort.
I know the Dev's are totally against changing KB to a KD, but so many people want this to happen and this idea can still make both KB lovers and KD lovers happy. Do I think it will happen? No , but a man can dream. |
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In my idea ever happened you will not have to reroll your PB. You will just have to respec and click on the Knock Down Option. The Knock Back will just be the default for the Kheldians that already exist. Of course we would need to get a free respec too |
Originally Posted by Kazz
My PB is only in the low 20's, but if this option existed, I wouldn't hesitate. Even if she was 50+3 with all iSlots at t4 with a 50 billion IO build I would strip, delete and remake her so fast it'd make Synape's head spin.
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Proton Sentry Peacebringer:lvl 50+++ - Human Build / Triform Build
Quasar Sentry Warshade:lvl 50+- Human Build / Triform Build
Red Katipo Arachnos Soldier:lvl 50+++ - Crab Build / Bane Build
Black Katipo Arachnos Widowlvl 50+++ - Fortunata Build / Night Widow Build
Since the desire is to improve PB's without significantly altering the way they play currently is the goal, here are my top three suggestions that don't remove/replace anything.
1) Add -res to all PB attacks (in addition to the -def). This not only improves the PB's damage, but also aids any teams they might be on (and because -res is not something that can be slotted for, it requires no changes in current slotting).
2) Add an additional non-enhanceable component (minor damage and/or some additional debuff) to the white dwarf's taunt power so that it acts as a viable "fourth attack" in the dwarf's attack chain without the need to spread your slots even thinner (because the new effects would be non-enhanceable).
3) Since the devs have figured out how to change KB into KD (with their new unique IO set for the summer event), release some non-unique IO sets with a KB-to-KD IO in them so that those who dislike knockback can remove it from all their powers if they desire, while those who like it can keep it as is. This would also allow for selective conversions from KB-to-KD (ex. removing it from solar flare, but not from the nova attacks or radiant strike) and could even apply to non-Kheld AT's.
The devs have themselves a BIG MISSED opportunity with the KD IO's. They should have been regular IO's anyone can buy at anytime and not tied to some lame summer event crappola.
The development team and this community deserved better than this from NC Soft. Best wishes on your search.
Fun thread.
Most of my suggestions deal with endgame problems. I think that Peacebringers could use their abilities shuffled a bit during the leveling process and probably gain too much at endgame from IO's versus their gain during the leveling process.
1) Modify Cosmic Balance / Dark Sustenance so that it modifies defense vice resistance. Khelds already get a lot of resistance in their trees; a little defense per appropriate teammate would go a long way towards a real bonus in survival over the resistance, which generally is capped out on endgame Kheldians regardless. Given that it's 10% per, make the defense bonus 5% per appropriate teammate for an identical relative survival return.
2) Animation speed pass OR damage cap upgrade. Khelds have slow animating attacks in general which locks their raw activity potential, be that in damage or support, to the speed of their abilities. Khelds also can gain a truly monumental damage modifier between buffs (either double-Mire or stacked Inner Light) and their innate Cosmic Balance / Dark Sustenance design. In endgame teams, Kheldians are typically damage capped at all times regardless of Sunless Mire / Inner Light usage, between enhancements, IO / Incarnate bonuses, buffs from teammates, and their innate ability. One of the two should be fixed for i23, and I'd lean towards fixing the damage cap and looking at animations afterwards since it's substantially tougher.
3) Implement common sense fixes suggested elsewhere. Things like rapid form shifting, toggle suppression fixes, all that good stuff deserves at least a gander. Epic pools are interesting but would have to be very carefully created to avoid breaking the generalist mindset of the Kheldian.
Long term I'd like to see a substantial redesign of the Peacebringer, as we don't have near enough non-dps utility to differentiate us from Warshades. We'd probably need to turn one of the shields into an AoE self and ally buff (or perhaps them all and Essence Boost) before we'd cross the threshold into a more support-oriented toon. It might too late for the Peacebringer to have that kind of radical redesign.
I just view it like going to the Blaster forum and complaining that the Energy powerset needs to have KB "removed" because you personally don't like KB. I say go play another set that is for "you" that does not have KB or make a suggestion that preserves the initial design of the set with KB and present alternates for those that don't want what the set is designed to do and offers which is in fact KB.
Doing this allows you to be respected by the designers of the AT(devs) and those that use the tools as designed(those that use KB effectively and have for YEARS AND LIKE IT).
To me anything else is just straight up trolling/looking for a fight/disrespecting the AT and those that use it as designed.
The development team and this community deserved better than this from NC Soft. Best wishes on your search.