Annoying travel powers


Beelzy

 

Posted

I'm sure this has been talked about before, but I figured I'd make my own complaint. Coyote run, rocket board, magic carpet all detoggle. WHY?! That makes these powers impossibly irritating to use, especially if you run leadership buffs which take an eternity to cast. We know the devs have the ability to suppress toggles rather than detoggle completely. Why the @$&% don't these travel powers do this?! Based on comments I've heard in game, it would do A LOT to make purchasing these travel powers more attractive.


 

Posted

I believe it has to do with the way powers animations work, or rather how they don't while those powers are active. What would Foot Stomp look like on a Magic Carpet? Or Shield Charge as a coyote?


 

Posted

There is no example of a self-toggle that causes all other powers to suppress in the game currently. There are only affecting self toggles, but the problem with those is that you can still cause your character to do animations with those active. If the choice the devs had was to use the existing detoggle behavior found in walk or go back through every power in the game to add a new suppression mechanic that works with these travel powers, well, it becomes slightly clearer why they did what they did, no?


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyPerfect View Post
I believe it has to do with the way powers animations work, or rather how they don't while those powers are active. What would Foot Stomp look like on a Magic Carpet? Or Shield Charge as a coyote?
those aren't toggles, those are attack powers, and the mechanic is already in place to disallow attacks when a power is on (Invisibility, Afterburner) I fail to see there being a good reason to detoggle powers


 

Posted

/powexecname Hoverboard
/e swoon

Hilarious, right? Except rather than flying around face-down you'd probably clip out of the bottom of the board with your skeleton all twisted up because the devs didn't want to have to port that and every other emote to some novelty travel powers.


 

Posted

I guess i see your point, PR. It just seems a shame because unless they DO implement some mechanic(s) allowing for suppression of all powers (or at least all toggles--maybe they could split the mechanic by only adding suppression code to toggle powers and keeping the rest unusable), these travel powers will always be relegated to "novelty" status, rather than actually useful. I wonder if the increase in sales from changing it to suppression would offset the cost of going through and adding the suppression mechanic. Taking the time and money to add this QoL feature would allow them to add usable and profitable travel powers anytime they see fit without them being automatically considered novelty powers only useful to RPers and those with PPs to burn.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by nytflyr View Post
those aren't toggles, those are attack powers, and the mechanic is already in place to disallow attacks when a power is on (Invisibility, Afterburner) I fail to see there being a good reason to detoggle powers
They've programmed the rooting powers (like rttc) to work with ab and invis etc but not for the poses on the novelty travels.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by nytflyr View Post
those aren't toggles, those are attack powers, and the mechanic is already in place to disallow attacks when a power is on (Invisibility, Afterburner) I fail to see there being a good reason to detoggle powers
I think the problem is that those powers (invisibility, afterburner) don't suppress toggles. They just add affect self status. Taking Coyote Travel Power as an example, it would be a problem to allow a spines scrapper running quills to keep quills active while in Coyote form. Or maybe it would just be awesome now that I think about it. But still, those powers don't suppress toggles.

Here's some other odd examples that might occur:
Unstoppable Coyote
Quills Coyote
Granite Coyote
Hibernate Coyote


 

Posted

I agree that it would be nice if they could have powers like that allow you to remain toggled. Look at it this way, the devs know well that there's player demand for such a feature. Who knows where that puts it on the priority list, but one thing they do try to do is kill multiple birds with one stone when they can. If a new game system is ever added that could overlap with this demand I think they'd be likely to go for it.


 

Posted

And the moral of the story is, if a travel power annoys you, use a different travel power or shut your dodgamn mouth.


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Little_Whorn View Post
I'm sure this has been talked about before, but I figured I'd make my own complaint. Coyote run, rocket board, magic carpet all detoggle. WHY?! That makes these powers impossibly irritating to use, especially if you run leadership buffs which take an eternity to cast. We know the devs have the ability to suppress toggles rather than detoggle completely. Why the @$&% don't these travel powers do this?! Based on comments I've heard in game, it would do A LOT to make purchasing these travel powers more attractive.
It's because if they allowed powers to be used while on them, they would have to code a new animation for every single power in the game. That is a HUGE amount of work to do just to let people fly around on a magic carpet. Roughly the equivalent of recreating every single power set in the entire game from scratch.

If they did that, it would be the better part of two years between buyable travel powers and they would have to charge $100 or more to recoup what they spent programming teh damn things.

And the toggles are shut off rather than suppressed because even when a toggle is suppressed the animation still plays when you turn it on. Animation playing = Can't use it because the animation for that power doesn't exist while standing on a hoverboard.

I understand exactly why they didn't allow powers to be used, and it is exactly why I will never buy any of those powers.

Look at what I outlined them as having to in order to let your toggles stay on. Would you pay the amount of money it would cost to make that amount of work worth it to them? Not many people would, so toggles stay off.


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Posted

I think the buyable travel powers have an annoyance factor to make them less good than the ones you can actually take as powers.

If for example the hover board did everything that Fly did, a lot of people would probably see it as freeing up a slot for another power choice and never pick a travel power.

I think hoverboard and ninja run are extremely good, given that once bought, they are basically free. I don't have all of the others, so I can't compare. I think hover board is even faster than standard fly, so you can spend the time you arrive earlier at missions to turn your toggles back on.


 

Posted

If you want a fly power that doesn't de-toggle or prevent you using other powers and doesn't expire then you have a very simple solution - pick Fly from the travel powers. A permanent power doing that for a very modest financial outlay would be vastly overpowered - in many ways it could be argued that the various jump/fly packs available should also have the same power suppression effect but that would be harder to apply as they are already in-game without the disadvantage and retrogressively applying it to a huge proportion of the playerbase would be a marketing nightmare.


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Posted

Here's a better idea, decrease the cast time of toggles! There is no game mechanic reason to have a long cast time on a toggle, it will not affect combat aspects of the game, but it will make life a heck of a lot easier, on start-up and when using the annoying travel powers.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle View Post
/powexecname Hoverboard
/e swoon
Hilarious, right? Except rather than flying around face-down you'd probably clip out of the bottom of the board with your skeleton all twisted up because the devs didn't want to have to port that and every other emote to some novelty travel powers.
That is missing the point. The devs didn't have to port every emote to work with the being held animation, because you cant use them. Why would they have to code animations that are not even allowed to work? If the hoverboard puts you in "only affecting self" and locks your animation to only the hoverboard animation whats the problem there?
People keep saying that the devs would have to redo all of the animations, but that doesnt sound true to me. If hoverboard puts you in only affecting self mode, and only allows the hoverboard animation, then you visually have the same thing we already do, but dont have to turn on all of your toggles all the time. Why would we have to combine hoverboard animation + power animation, when nobody is asking for that? Just make it so that when hoverboard is active, only the hoverboard animation is allowed. Copy/paste that wherever it needs to go in the code. Im sure that will still take some time, but how many people out there refuse to buy the novelty travel powers just because they are so useless?

ETA another thought:
When I turn on hibernate, it does not allow me to do any other animations. If I already have conductive aura on before hibernate the aura keeps displaying, but if I turn on hibernate first I can not turn on conductive aura until hibernate is done. Why cant something like that be done for coyote/hoverboard? No new animations needed, because none are allowed.

I don't know how powers and animations are actually coded, so maybe Im just way off on this whole thing. But if the devs want me to buy things they need to be useful. If enough other people are already buying them anyway, cool, Ill be fine without those powers anyway. I just dont believe the "have to reanimate every single power in the game" argument when the single animation is already made. The only issue is suppressing the other animations.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by RogerWilco View Post
I think the buyable travel powers have an annoyance factor to make them less good than the ones you can actually take as powers.

If for example the hover board did everything that Fly did, a lot of people would probably see it as freeing up a slot for another power choice and never pick a travel power.
I'm....starting to think the same way...or at least a solution isn't on the priority list because of that reason.

Considering most toggles are simply particle FX and not animations (since the animations can often be overwritten by movement) I'm not sure if I buy the needing to animate every power over...when you can simply set an animation to do nothing...can you not do that with /emotes while flying? Or some /emotes when you're holding a shield?

Another reason I'm thinking they're limited to scale the convenience of these powers: why do they nullify other powers when toggled? Why does Coyote Run not work with Swift inherent power which doesn't even have an animation? Can someone cast Grant Invis on me and it still work when I use Magic Carpet? Some of those I'm not sure of since I've only done limited testing with these powers on Beta...but I haven't bought any yet...maybe when they release the Panther form....can use that for my Stalker...although a plain white housecat would have been a more instant buy for me...


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beelzy View Post
Here's a better idea, decrease the cast time of toggles! There is no game mechanic reason to have a long cast time on a toggle, it will not affect combat aspects of the game, but it will make life a heck of a lot easier, on start-up and when using the annoying travel powers.
/signed to the 23rd power


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by RogerWilco View Post
I think the buyable travel powers have an annoyance factor to make them less good than the ones you can actually take as powers.

If for example the hover board did everything that Fly did, a lot of people would probably see it as freeing up a slot for another power choice and never pick a travel power.

I think hoverboard and ninja run are extremely good, given that once bought, they are basically free. I don't have all of the others, so I can't compare. I think hover board is even faster than standard fly, so you can spend the time you arrive earlier at missions to turn your toggles back on.
I already find it ridiculous how fast hoverboard is... if it didn't detoggle, I would be irate. Besides animation issues, it's a purchasable power that could possibly replace other powers, like you said. The devs were worried enough about how prevalent Ninja Run was (doesn't seem to be as bad an issue anymore), but that one actually has limitations below Super Jump (and I believe SS) that hold it back from me using it on too many characters alone.

Purchasable stuff like the hoverboard and flying carpet should be for fun, not to replace things like Fly.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beelzy View Post
Here's a better idea, decrease the cast time of toggles! There is no game mechanic reason to have a long cast time on a toggle, it will not affect combat aspects of the game, but it will make life a heck of a lot easier, on start-up and when using the annoying travel powers.
Not that I wouldn't mind instant cast toggles, but instant cast toggles would affect combat. There are still toggles that turn off when mezzed, and they all turn off when you die.


Dirges

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirges View Post
Not that I wouldn't mind instant cast toggles, but instant cast toggles would affect combat. There are still toggles that turn off when mezzed, and they all turn off when you die.
I was referring to toggles that do not detoggle when mezzed, such as tough and weave. Of course, toggles that detoggle or are generally toggled on during combat need to retain their cast times. I would also add that having long cast times on powers makes trying to get back into combat after faceplanting more difficult than it needs to be.