Electrical Blast and Performance Shifter : Chance for +End

Unthing · 03-12-2012 01:29 AM

Hi All,

I've been running a Defender with Electrical Blast and bought the Perfromance Shifter: Chance for +End to slot into the AoE attacks for a nice end gain during combat. However it didn't seem to work. I didn't get the message in healing like you do when you slot stamina with it and I didn't get any noticeable end gain either.

Has anyone has any luck doing this on any of the Electrical Blast powers or is my idea flawed?

Cheers.

@Unthing ... Mostly on Union.

Player99 · 03-12-2012 01:43 AM

Unfortunatley, I think the proc only effects the one who's end is being modified, in this case the baddies who get -end from the AoEs...

Ideon · 03-12-2012 02:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Player99

Unfortunatley, I think the proc only effects the one who's end is being modified, in this case the baddies who get -end from the AoEs...

In this case, basically the player is randomly giving endurance back to the enemy after sapping it. Quite generous, and even somewhat heroic, but...

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DreadShinobi · 03-12-2012 02:18 AM

Yep. When slotted into a foe targetted power it will give endurance to the foe, not you.

GuyPerfect · 03-12-2012 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DreadShinobi

Yep. When slotted into a foe targetted power it will give endurance to the foe, not you.

False. False false false.

The Performance Shifter proc will grant Endurance to the target of the power, but will only affect friendly targets. In Stamina, it gives it to you. In Transferrence, it gives it to your team. In Ball Lightning, it does squat.

Unthing · 03-12-2012 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GuyPerfect

False. False false false.

The Performance Shifter proc will grant Endurance to the target of the power, but will only affect friendly targets. In Stamina, it gives it to you. In Transferrence, it gives it to your team. In Ball Lightning, it does squat.

Okay... but does that mean it should do something on Charged Bolts?

If so would it only happen when you get the end back ( 30% of the time )?

@Unthing ... Mostly on Union.

GuyPerfect · 03-12-2012 12:28 PM

Charged Bolts targets enemies. Performance Shifter's proc only affects friendly targets. Ergo, Charged Bolts with a Performance Shifter Proc is wasting an Enhancement.

In the event of getting Endurance back from Charged Bolts itself, that's inconsequential. Charged Bolts targets enemies, and that's what Performance Shifter checks.

Unthing · 03-13-2012 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GuyPerfect

Charged Bolts targets enemies. Performance Shifter's proc only affects friendly targets. Ergo, Charged Bolts with a Performance Shifter Proc is wasting an Enhancement.

In the event of getting Endurance back from Charged Bolts itself, that's inconsequential. Charged Bolts targets enemies, and that's what Performance Shifter checks.

Okay, that makes sense. It also fits in with my experiments.

My original plan was to slot the proc in both Short Circuit and Ball Lightning and with this proc. I thought that would give an quite a lot of end. Shame it didn't work.

@Unthing ... Mostly on Union.

DreadShinobi · 03-13-2012 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GuyPerfect

False. False false false.

The Performance Shifter proc will grant Endurance to the target of the power, but will only affect friendly targets. In Stamina, it gives it to you. In Transferrence, it gives it to your team. In Ball Lightning, it does squat.

No where is this proc flagged to be friendly target only. The IO procs on the target of the power. If it is an enemy it doesn't just do squat it /will/ give endurance to that target.
This behavior is WAI, and was confirmed by Castle.

Thread Refrence, specifically, this post.

JayboH · 03-13-2012 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GuyPerfect

False. False false false.

The Performance Shifter proc will grant Endurance to the target of the power, but will only affect friendly targets. In Stamina, it gives it to you. In Transferrence, it gives it to your team. In Ball Lightning, it does squat.

...unless you are confused.

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GuyPerfect · 03-13-2012 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DreadShinobi

No where is this proc flagged to be friendly target only.

False. False false false.

I direct you to the current power definition for the live client: Crafted_Performance_Shifter_F

Take note of that "If target.isFriend?" line in there. The Endurance CANNOT be granted to enemy targets.

Roderick · 03-14-2012 01:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DreadShinobi

No where is this proc flagged to be friendly target only. The IO procs on the target of the power. If it is an enemy it doesn't just do squat it /will/ give endurance to that target.
This behavior is WAI, and was confirmed by Castle.

Thread Refrence, specifically, this post.

I've said the same thing - recently, even - and used the same post as evidence. However, that post was made quite a while ago, and Guy is or has been part of the team that works on Mids' and/or Red Tomax. I'm pretty sure that he knows what he's talking about, and if he doesn't, he should know where to look up the info.

@Roderick

GuyPerfect · 03-14-2012 09:35 AM

I asked Codewalker to look into it yesterday. According to his records, the proc was restricted to friendly targets with the release of Strike Pack, aka Issue 19.5. This means that it's been that way since February 1 of last year, significantly earlier than even that thread.

Necrotech_Master · 03-14-2012 09:39 AM

hmm, i had not known that it had been changed, thats good information ill have to keep in mind

Codewalker · 03-14-2012 10:21 AM

To elaborate, prior to Issue 19.5, most (but not all) damage and debuff procs had checks to prevent them from proccing on yourself, but there wasn't anything of the sort for beneficial procs, and damage procs could still hurt friendlies in some edge cases.

In Issue 19.5, a sweep of all the procs was done. All of those special conditions were removed, and new ones were introduced with a set methodology -- harmful procs are only allowed to fire on hostile targets, and beneficial procs can only fire on friendly targets. This patch fixed not only Performance Shifter, but likely also the issue with Coercive Persuasion sometimes confusing friendly pets.

Those safeguards must have become part of the standard procedure, as all procs created since then include them as well.

This change doesn't appear to have been mentioned in the patch notes, which is why even as long as months afterwards players were not necessarily aware of it.

The one outlier is Energy Manipulator: Chance for Stun, which not only has the isFriend check, but also retained the check that makes it simply not work on players at all. I believe this PVE-only restriction dates back even further, to when people were griefing by slotting it in Speed Boost, and it got missed when the procs were all fixed properly. Though if it were to be fixed, it would need to have a correct PvP version added with the appropriate mez duration and suppression.

Necrotech_Master · 03-14-2012 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Codewalker

The one outlier is Energy Manipulator: Chance for Stun, which not only has the isFriend check, but also retained the check that makes it simply not work on players at all. I believe this PVE-only restriction dates back even further, to when people were griefing by slotting it in Speed Boost, and it got missed when the procs were all fixed properly. Though if it were to be fixed, it would need to have a correct PvP version added with the appropriate mez duration and suppression.

i remember when that IO first came out and poeple slotted it into stamina and had it randomly stun themselves too lol

Roderick · 03-14-2012 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GuyPerfect

I asked Codewalker to look into it yesterday. According to his records, the proc was restricted to friendly targets with the release of Strike Pack, aka Issue 19.5. This means that it's been that way since February 1 of last year, significantly earlier than even that thread.

Y'know, because I was on my phone when I posted, I assumed that that was a link to Castle saying that Perf Shifter giving End to enemies was WAI. I really shouldn't do then, because then I just make myself look stupid.

I can't find the post now, but Castle did say that - it was also much, MUCH before the change you're talking about.

@Roderick

GuyPerfect · 03-14-2012 03:57 PM

Greyhame · 03-16-2012 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GuyPerfect

False. False false false.

The Performance Shifter proc will grant Endurance to the target of the power, but will only affect friendly targets. In Stamina, it gives it to you. In Transferrence, it gives it to your team. In Ball Lightning, it does squat.

Quote:

Originally Posted by GuyPerfect

Charged Bolts targets enemies. Performance Shifter's proc only affects friendly targets. Ergo, Charged Bolts with a Performance Shifter Proc is wasting an Enhancement.

In the event of getting Endurance back from Charged Bolts itself, that's inconsequential. Charged Bolts targets enemies, and that's what Performance Shifter checks.

I'm a little confused by this. Transference targets enemies.

War-Nugget · 03-16-2012 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greyhame

I'm a little confused by this. Transference targets enemies.

IIRC [Transference] summons invisible pet entities which affect teammates.

@War-Nugget

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