Alpha Incarnate: Shards or Thread?

Recently, I commented on a global channel that it looks like Shards are being phased out now that the "solo Incarnate path" of Dark Astoria isn't going to drop Shards or Shard components, but it was explained to me that there would still be plenty of things to do that still drop those that I'd want to do despite chasing Incarnate progress. Morality and Alignment tips were brought up, which is a very good point, as were most non-Incarnate TFs.

So, since I'm learning new stuff recently, I wanted to ask this in plain text: Come I22, will there be any point in Shards at all, or should I just try creating Alpha stuff with Threads, instead?

Now, what prompted me to ask this question was I finally did run an iTrial - Behaviour Adjustment Facility (confused the hell out of me, in case you're curious) and left with two rare thread components, around 5 Threads, an Astral Merit and an Empyrean Merit. This caused me to finally check out what the Empyrean and Astral vendors are actually selling, and to my surprise, they do sell "Shard Vouchers" that can be redeemed by any character, I'm assuming including the one who purchased them. These seem to be a 1-to-1 conversion.

So this got me thinking... I already have an Uncommon Alpha enhancement slotted (just now, after tonight's ITF), so what would it take to make a Rare level-shift one? Well, using Shards, a Notice of the Well, which is either a WST or I believe 56 Shards. What would it take to make one using threads? Well, four Uncommon components, each 60 Threads in cost, so 240 threads. One of my concerns about Dark Astoria was that Alpha was getting punished since Thread components are five times as expensive as Shard components, and I'm not sure Thread drop rates are five times as common as Shards are in the normal game, but here's the thing...

I have about 5 threads. If I dump that Astral to 4 Threads and that Empyrean to 20 threads, that'll give me around 30 Threads, give or take. If I then cross those over to Shards via Vouchers, that's already half a NotW... Or, like, 3/4 of one, I can't say off-hand. Now, granted, an Emp merit isn't something I expect to see in Dark Astoria since I don't believe those drop out of anything, but my point is that if we really CAN turn Threads into Shards at a 1-to-1 basis, then isn't it far smarter to disassemble disassemble my components to threads and then turn them into Shards since that's much less expensive in terms of total number?

Again, I want to stress that I truly and honestly do not know what I'm talking about. I checked the in-game conversion interface, I looked at ParagonWiki and I'm inferring the rest. So seriously - is it better to work with Shards or Threads when working on your Alpha stuff?

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Originally Posted by Arcanaville Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

i personally think that shard method is a lot easier and deterministic to craft higher tiers, to get the rare or very rare thread components it will either A) require a lot of luck on the trial reward table, or B) a LOT of inf, threads and other components

to get rare/very rare shard components the rare is simply a notice of the well which can be gotten from the weekly tf, the very rare just requires 2 notices and 32 shards which can be gathered over time through all non trial/non DA content

using threads it *can* be faster for the common/uncommon, to get the higher than uncommon tiers it usually requires a lot of luck or a lot of time saving emp merits (8 emp merits for 1 rare and 30 emp merits for a very rare which i feel is very disproportionate compared to the shard conversions)

I almost always get the t3 via shards using the WST or Mortimer Kal for the rare. Otherwise trials are faster for getting it to t4.

It also depends on what you have access to. If you run TFs on a regular basis and have components/shards just lying around, then use those up.

How about earning threads, but turning those into Shards and gaining components that way? I mean, I know that pure Thread/Shard paths aren't ideal... And are pretty much rock bottom the slowest, but if both of those actually are viable, wouldn't Thread->Shard be the better option?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arcanaville Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

I wouldn't discount the weekly strike target. Heck right now it's just the 2nd respec trial, requires a low amount of people, pretty easy to nab a rare, just have to pull together a group doing it. Sometimes folks will even announce here on the forums when they want to form one.

The way I did it was to craft a common from Shards (+1 from the Alpha unlock arc, +3 from farming Peregrine, 1 Gr'ai matter from doing the 35 - 50 Vanguard arcs, +4 shards from joining in on a hamidon raid). crafted an uncommon with thread stuff, then made a rare with shard stuff and a notice from the WST. Went pretty quick. But Victory has a pretty active community for doing end game stuff too

How exactly does one convert shards into threads? I have yet to find a way to do it, myself.

I find the best way to do it is this.

T1 Alpha, shards (a total of 12 merits turned into shards if you are doing it just via merits)

T2 Alpha, threads (10 merits and a bit of luck, as opposed to 20 merits)

T3 Alpha, shards (WST and 8 merits)

T4 Alpha Threads (Getting lucky)

I'm not sure if Dark Astoria even offers Astrals (I suspect it does), but I do know it drops threads, so doesn't that just divide your efforts between two no-cooperative modes of progression? For instance, say I only have 9 Astrals, in obtaining them, I've also earned around 30 Threads? Would it be smarter to go with Threads, then?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arcanaville Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

I find shards are the best route to go when it comes to getting the Alpha.

I can then save the threads for the other four Incarnate powers. If I get in on some itrials, I may use the common thread components to craft the lower tier alpha abilities to help speed along my way to tier 3 Alpha. However, after getting the level boost, imo, it's better to just play the waiting game and work your way up to tier 4 with shards and saving the threads for Interface, Judgement, Destiny and Lore.

I always get my alpha slot with shards. Not necessarily because I think it's faster, but because I don't feel like I'm really contributing when I bring a plain 50 on a trial. With DA coming this won't be as big of a reason to use shards, but for now I would always get a rare alpha via shards before I do anything else incarnate.

And it doesn't actually take that long to get a tier 3 with shards, either. You need 7 commons, an uncommon, and a notice. That's 40 shards and a notice if you build that way, but it gets easier if you can arrange things so that you can use grai matters and ancient nictus fragments for a couple of the components. For example, to get a spiritual partial core requires 2 grai matter, 3 ancient nictus fragment, an essence of the incarnate, a penumbra of rularuu, and a drop of the well. Most of my characters reach 50 with a healthy stockpile of vanguard merits, and ITFs are run all the time and usually garner a healthy amount of shards. I could see a wtf and 3 itf runs getting you your rare. Sure, you won't be getting it in a single night like you could through trials, but it definitely wouldn't take more than a few days - assuming, anyway, that you can get the task forces going. That would be the big advantage of doing it in DA; that you don't need anyone else's cooperation.