Prediction: Stalkers will not get the staff set.

You're right, it IS possible. But we have ZERO precedent to use for this issue. The closest analogue we have is Dual Pistols which obviously isn't a Stalker set. And next to that, the closest we can get is Dual Blades which IS a Stalker set... You also have to admit that Staff is FAR more logical as a Stalker set than Titan Weapons.

The very nature of a Stalker's BU > AS > Placate > AS > Rest of Attacks, etc. mechanic kinda moves against the idea of attacking like Titan Weapons seems to want, especially with the priority of going into Hide as often as possible.

[Edit: Yeah, that last paragraph is BS. I disagree with myself and wanted to toss in a disclaimer. ]

Thirty, have you played a Stalker past 30? At that level, when it's not one-shotting orange lts anymore, AS is a situational tool. A handy, but situational attack. One of the reasons you see Stalker players asking for a fix in the HP cap, but not asking for more *base* HP, is that we feel we're already 'durable' enough to scrap it out. On my Elec/Regen I shelved (because regen sucks on stalkers, rerolled him as Elec/Ea but still a lowbie) my opening combo was BU+LRod+Thunderstrike with 50% crit chance since I was hidden, and the Kinetic Melee users like to open with BU+Burst since it has a 100% AoE crit rate from Hide instead of AS.

Also, having played Titan weapons with a 50 Brute on beta, and excluding the RP argument (which I find garbage since we have electric armor, Lightning Rod - you go BOOM, damage and knocks down everyone, but stay hidden, lol - and whatnot), I find its mechanic perfect for the Stalker playstyle, being a very bursty set. Even including AS.

If AS gives momentum in a possible port of TW, doing AS-3 momentum powered fast attacks is perfect for a Stalker. I had my doubts before but after seeing Momentum lasts only for 5 seconds, the current mechanic would fit a Stalker very well, even in your example (which isn't realistic since we don't AS that much past 25-30): Bu-AS-3 momentum powered attacks-Placate-AS-3 momentum powered attacks again, and after, just like scrappers and brutes, some attack-3 momentum powered attacks, repeat till mobs are dead, that's how the set works. Then after the fight is over you can hide again and begin bu, as, etc. Mechanically it'd work flawlessly on a Stalker (I'm not getting into this staff melee debate since the set is not in beta).

Then why the hell are you making such a big deal about stalkers not getting Titan Weapons? How many stealthy "ninjas" carried around 7' tall swords weighing in at 150 lbs?

Personally I don't care that stalkers didn't get TWs, although they should have IMO substituted another set in its place. As for staff fighting, there should be no reason for stalkers not to get that set. And with the jewel that StJ ended out becoming, I don't see a whole lot of room for complaining here.

Why yes, I have. Thank you for asking. I have two Stalkers at 50: a DM/SR and an Elec/Nin.

I also wanted to throw in a quick comment here about Stalker primaries. Your example uses Elec Melee... which, I have to say from experience, is a WHOLE 'nother ballgame when compared to other primaries I have played. My Dark Melee user used AS quite a bit more as an opener and otherwise when compared to my Elec Melee. Lightning Rod pretty much changes the landscape of what you are going to do... COMPLETELY. And, of course, it doesn't hurt that Elec is hugely AoE focused while Dark is about as single target as you can get.

However, I haven't actually played either of those characters in a good long while... and as soon as I finished typing that post, I began to think that everything I had said might be BS.

For me, this argument doesn't hold water because this game should be trying to avoid including MORE sets that are ridiculous... not including more because there already are some. But, I can understand your point.

And this right here is the very point that got me to questioning my own post above. After I had hit [Submit], I got to thinking that the Momentum mechanic is actually very similar to what Stalkers do already... they just don't get a bonus for it. The only issue would be certain fights where you would have killed the group just as momentum kicks in... which would be frustrating, but then again, if you can do that, you didn't NEED the bonus.

Just to clarify, it wasn't meant to be an exact attack chain. I don't know how ANYONE can actually remember the exact order they typically do attacks and what would be recharged when they type those things up, it was pure guessing on my part... the only thing I was confident about was the Build-Up to start. LOL

In his defense, that is NOT his actual opinion... he was speaking as if for one of the Devs.

Ah wasn't aware of that, noted.

I... Really like this whole idea. AS giving momentum would kind of give me more incentive to USE AS, and fits along with the whole idea of 'slow start - deadly finish' that the stalker AT likes to utilize. Thematically, I really like the idea of some psychopath with a giant axe flying out of nowhere, scaring the piss out of everyone, and then proceeding to hack everyone apart in a flurry of chaos. If that doesn't scream Stalker, I don't know what does.

Not your fault, the OP was NOT clear on that fact. The only reason I knew that was the case was because I had just read several of his posts in a Titan Weapons thread... and because, well, Test_Rat has been a Stalker advocate (even when it doesn't make sense) for some time now.

As an aside:
I believe the word that should be in the underlined spot is "preclude," not exclude. There is a subtle difference. Where "exclude" means to keep away from, or not allow, "preclude" has more the sense of preventing something from happening in the first place. It implies that because of this thing, this other thing becomes impossible.

then exclude is the right term, looking at titan weapons.
I am saying thy could make a unique mechanic for stalkers to give them a version of the set... But they won't bother.

Gambit?

Maybe a telescopic staff?

I asked because I got a bit irritated not by your post, but the lots of people who never played one past 10 or whatever saying 'TW would be OP on Stalkers' or something like that, and right after that saying something that proved they don't know Stalkers can actually scrap . But that's on another thread.

Yup I used Elec Melee and Kinetic Melee as examples (Spines could also be a case, I hate the set but since it has a huge radius Spine Burst might be a good opener despite only 30% crit chance).

I don't care much about optimal attack chains, I mentioned the TW ones because people are making a big fuss on 'how Momentum is clunky', but imo it isn't. When I was level bumped and started right away on a trial, I felt it was inadequate for my Brute, but after I read that it's simply a 5 second 'buff' and went soloing at 0/x4 (I was afraid to die because I had never played regen), it made sense to me and I was able to leverage it well.

The brute/scrap/tank version has very powerful Aoes, including a footstomp clone (same radius, basically the same damage and almost the same chance to kd compared to non-rage FS) with a 1 sec cast time that can only be used in Momentum. It's not hard to use because every attack in the set (except for the pbaoe and one of the sts only available in 'Momentum time') grant momentum, so if you do the (quite devastating) chain of the +def attack (my opener since I'm /regen) which has a 2.2 sec cast time, you can unleash the PbAoE and two devastating cones. And even when I had to click Recon, Dull Pain, etc during that and I could only get two attacks instead of three during momentum, guess what, the last one I used, as long as it's not the PbAoE which is greyed out when Momentum expires, would use the slow animation instead of the 'Momentum' one and after that grant me Momentum again (plus, no matter if I lost momentum, the slow version would still benefit from BU I used right after, or before, the +def attack), so it's simpler than it looks and could be used well by a stalker, scrapping or opening with AS.

When I understood how easy it was to get it and the mechanics are simple, I found it easy to maintain fury, I stopped corpse blasting a lot on the other trial I ran, fury was easy to maintain too.

It's not like Disintegration, which I dislike on Blasters because of the setup (Disintegrate, use Lancer shot, pray that the 52% chance to spread goes off, use the AoE cone) and because of this I find the set is much better on a corr or a defender. And unlike Disintegration which as an attack is kinda meh due to long DoT, if you have a secondary that doesn't need the +def attack later (which does less damage than parry but it's a cone) like /SR, you can open with the set's ST big hitter (Shatter Armor) and gain momentum from it, while still doing -res, -def and still do almost as much damage as Concentrated Strike (base for Shatter Armor is 200 on a level 50 scrapper, CS is 222, but SA recharges in 16 secs, for comparison Midnight Grasp recharges in 15 and does 172, and you get SA at level 18).

And btw I used BU+AS as an opener a lot too because the Stalker I played the most was my Em/Nin, even more ST oriented than yours (I love Shadow Maul, I have a 50 dm/da scrap so I learned to make good use of it as you probably have too unless you dislike the power like some do - in fact I was quite disappointed when I found out SM and headsplitter which is only a 20 degree cone have the half-crit chance, SM being 45 degrees would be a nice opener for hitting 3-4 targets since you can position yourself from Hide, it should get KM's Burst 100% crit imo).

You can see in this video someone posted how TW plays out - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hmmeswm4Nkw

At the very end (2:00), he is beating a rikti dummy (with momentum since he's attacking fast), then he loses it, and you see that as the video starts fading, he uses a slow attack (in the case Shatter Armor, the animation looks a lot like an AS) and right after that he's attacking 'fast' again (the video is almost black at this point since it's ending but you can see it).

EDIT: I found another video http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=YS5jy55HvC4 - in this one, the player is repositiong, using BU during momentum, meaning he's not exactly worried about getting three-four attacks in EACH momentum, and even so he is still obliterating mobs and getting Momentum easily to use when he wants.

Blood Widow Ricki * Tide Shifter * T-34 * Opposite Reaction * Shaolin Midnight * ChernobylCheerleader

Entropy Legion * Hyperion Force * Hero Heights

Promise me that if the Devs ever do create a nunchuck set that we'll make a homage team consisting of the 4 + The Rat + K.C. Jones.

Stalker is NOT ALLOWED TO HOLD A BIG WEAPON. That breaks the theme.


BUT!!! It is okay for Brute to hold a Ninja Sword or girlish looking Claws. :P

It is also okay for Brute to have stealthy sets like Dark Armor and Energy Aura to turn them like an "Assassin".

So the logic in this game is RESTRICTIONS ONLY APPLY TO STALKER.

And since when "Assassin" is automatically labeled as "Ninja"?


Oh wait, I have one PERFECT solution. Give Stalker Titan Weapon (the mechanism fits!) but RESTRICT WEAPON CHOICE. Stalker is not allowed to carry any weapon that looks too big so they have to hold a little bit longer version of Ninja Sword or Broadsword and nothing else.

Theme conflicts? Problem solved!

Stalker advocates actually get s!@#$ done. People like Test-Rat and I would beta test Street Justice to make sure the set is balanced for Stalker. You want a set like Martial Arts that's badly designed with no AoE or you want a set like Kinetic Melee that is actually modified for Stalker's needs?

The dev really don't have much idea on how to design for Stalker's needs. Looking at the old sets, all they did we taking one pbaoe out and inserting Assassin strike. This formula screws up the sets and that's why Stalker has several inferior sets (but not useless).

Which part does it not make sense? Stalker shouldn't use a Titan Weapon or Brute shouldn't use a Ninja Sword? You can't have restriction on one theme but not the other. How come Stalker is the ONLY AT that has "theme restriction"? Titan Weapon is just a name for the set but there are different looking weapons. Why can't they design some weapons that look less "freakish" to match THEIR DESCRIPTION of what a Stalker should hold in his hand? Remember, I say "Their" description because it has just occurred to me that we need the dev to tell us what kind of THEME a Stalker should have. We are stupid and unable to come up our themes apparently.


I am bitter that Stalker won't have Titan Weapon. I wish they could just re-name the set so people can stop thinking that "TITAN IS NOT FITTING FOR NINJA". They re-named Katana to Ninja Sword for Stalker. I wonder why can't they name Titan Weapon to something else for Stalk this time? Many of you tend to think Stalker is...

1. A Ninja
2. Must be physically small
3. Therefore, cannot hold a Giant Weapon

Sure, dev said "we don't hate Stalkers", which translates into: We just don't want to spend the necessary time to create something for Stalker's needs. Just be patient while we create several new sets for Brute/Scrapper. Remember, I don't hate you. I just don't have time for you. :P

Jibikao, KM and EleM were the outliers.
The best you can hope for when things are ported to stalkers is half *****.

*slowly backs away from Warkupo

I wonder if we should just ask art staff to come up with a nunchuck model for War Mace, and get that proliferated to Stalker. And a hockey stick model too... I think we're on to something.

Blood Widow Ricki * Tide Shifter * T-34 * Opposite Reaction * Shaolin Midnight * ChernobylCheerleader

Entropy Legion * Hyperion Force * Hero Heights