Ice control is a matter of love or hate...
your best control power is a knockdown path, it's good, but not as good as seeds of confusion, flashfire or stalagmites.
Not to mention your own aoe immob or anyone's in the team makes your best control power useless...
oh wait, it's supposed to make you -not- delete her?
ahhh.. well, ice looks pretty!! >.>
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ice control is not bad once you get slotted some, ice assault is kinda meh and i personally dont like it, ice assault animations feel like they take a long time to animate coupled with very single target dmg, i dont think it works as well as it could
ice control when paired with some other stuff can be pretty sweet though
ice/fire has a lot of aoe dmg
ice/psi has shockwave and drain psyche
ice/earth is a little end heavy but it has power boost and a lot of melee dmg which will synergize well with arctic air (and a DoT toggle to help with dmg)
i would try rolling up some other combos and see what works for you
This is not the delete you are looking for... Ok, that didn't work.
Personally, if ice slick, artic air, shiver, chilling embrace dont' excite you for damage mitigation you might not want an ice/ice char. That adds -165% rech to your enemies and most of em flopping on their backsides. When they do fire, they have a decent chance to be firing at their own ppl. Once you get past the alpha, it's a very underappreciated setup for control/damage mitigation. and Flash freeze will help a ton with the alpha if you are solo. If in a group, let the wookie win... er, let the tank/brute lead.
As to the damage ice has, it's not the flashiest numbers, but I've been told it has nice activation times so you can fire off bunches in a hurry. That will help you not to feel like you are wasting your time waiting for your next primary power to recharge.
Plus all those slows and kdowns will really come in handy for your ice mastery (all the kids are taking it) and your sleet/ice storm.
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See, this is probably my biggest problem with the set. Ice slick is a really cool power and easy to get perma. Great damage mitigation, but the immobs make it useless and I can't even put a damage proc in it. So, I don't get to see all those pretty "Domination" ticks above their heads.|
Originally Posted by Panikaze
Not to mention your own aoe immob or anyone's in the team makes your best control power useless...
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Actually, Ice Control has a few really cool powers, they just don't seem to have good synergy. Flash Freeze and Glacier...also pretty useless with ice slick.
I've been playing this toon in a team with my hubby's Demon MM and a friend's Electric Brute and I just feel useless. Maybe I'll switch to one of my many other experiments sitting in their late teens and early 20s and come back to this later to see if I feel different before I delete.
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I agree Ice Control has powers that contradict themselves (knock down + immb or damage aoe sleep). |
Originally Posted by Scorcharina
See, this is probably my biggest problem with the set. Ice slick is a really cool power and easy to get perma. Great damage mitigation, but the immobs make it useless and I can't even put a damage proc in it. So, I don't get to see all those pretty "Domination" ticks above their heads.
Actually, Ice Control has a few really cool powers, they just don't seem to have good synergy. Flash Freeze and Glacier...also pretty useless with ice slick. I've been playing this toon in a team with my hubby's Demon MM and a friend's Electric Brute and I just feel useless. Maybe I'll switch to one of my many other experiments sitting in their late teens and early 20s and come back to this later to see if I feel different before I delete. |
However, Ice Slick is an excellent battle opener. I just drop it out of sight and let Brute/MMs go in.
Do you think you have more problem with Ice Control or Ice Melee? I've heard more complaints on Icy Assault. I don't mind Icy Assault. I just think Fiery Assault has too much damage. lol I enjoy the ice swords. They look pretty. :P
What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.
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I think if she is only level 21 and you are not excited about her, just delete her. Level 21 is not that much of an investment and certainly something you could get up to again pretty easily in the unlikely event you want to replay her.|
Originally Posted by Scorcharina
I'm finally getting around to trying all the villain ATs and for my first dominator I decided to go outside my comfort zone (fire) and went with Ice/Ice. She's sitting at level 21 and I'm just not feeling it. I don't know if its just because I've been playing her mostly unslotted (finally crafted a bunch of IOs last night) or the lack of AoE damage.
So, I'm looking for feedback on this build at higher levels. Does it tend to lean more towards the single target damage? What makes this combo enjoyable? |
Yes, I think Ice/ doesn't benefit from domination as much as other control sets do because of ice slick. If you just wanted to play a character with an icy vibe, you can still play an ice/cold controller, a cold/ice defender, an ice/cold corruptor, an ice/ice blaster, or an ice/ice tank, so its not like you can't get the fix somewhere else.
"Hi, my name is Ail. I make people sick."
A partial selection from my 50's on Freedom: Ail = Ice/Traps, Luck = Street Justice/Super Reflexes Stalker, Mist = Bane, Pixy = Trick Arrow/Archery, Pure = Gravity/Energy, Smoke = Fire/Fire Dominator
Lack of AoE is largely a Dominator thing. That part gets better in the epics. Psi Assault makes up for that some but most others just have fidgety cones and very long animation 15ft pbaeos.
Ok, my new idea is to keep the Ice/Ice for now, but put her on hold while I try a few other things. I'll come back later to see if a different play mood makes her more appealing.
In the meantime, I think I'll start a Plant/Thorns Dom...
I love my Ice/Ice/Ice Dom. I drop Ice Slick, Sleet and ice storm, and go in with frost breath and ice sword circle and everything is dead. Yea the aoe immob stops the knockdown however I use glacier the pbaoe hold then have my immob slotted for dmg and use that while they are all held. At that point again usally ice storm, sleet and sword circle. I just destroy groups.
Not to mention with the 2 ice toggles anything that gets close to me can barly move and gets confused pretty much instantly. I've had more and more people telling me they want to try out ice after seeing it paired with the hero side parton powers.
Oh also I took the Cryonic judgement, which is a nice cone and has a chance to hold. All in all ice has some great AoE with great single target dmg, you just have to wait till later in the game. Like most doms, they bloom late.
I deleted mine. Despite thematic awesomeness, the mechanics of both sets combine to make one of the more difficult to play Doms. This is Doms on hard mode. I'll take another run at Ice/Ice in the future, but for now I'm completely over it.
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You were playing her all the way to 21 with basically nothing slotted? *sigh* TOs and DOs have value, people! USE THEM!
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Originally Posted by Scorcharina
I don't know if its just because I've been playing her mostly unslotted (finally crafted a bunch of IOs last night) or the lack of AoE damage.
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I know your feeling. I've always wanted an Ice/Ice blaster or Dominator. However, unless I play it as a concept toon (which is the way it should be) it just underperforms compared to other combos.
It's a bit like Trick Archery set. It's great for concept and some might even say it's fantastic. However, it's not for min/max players.
If you're willing to accept that it's a fun toon and should be played that way - I say go for it.
@False Fiction - Virtue / Defiant
Current projects - [Glaciologist - Ill/Cold Troller] [Cloudshaper - Storm/Dark Def] [Harald Wartooth - Elec/Psi Domi]
I don't like Ice/ but I do like /Icy. I guess if you're going for thematic pairings you have to put the two together though. I took Ice/ to 50, IO'ed and perma-dommed it, and it just never clicked for me. That toon got transferred off my main server when we had free transfers and I haven't touched it since.
So I wouldn't be in too much of a hurry to get back to that toon. Try some other combos and you'll be in a better position to decide when you do come back to it.
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When I say nothing slotted, I'm more speaking of lack of IOs. I always use my TOs and DOs that drop and occassionally buy more DOs once I acrue funds. Part of the problem was that I leveled her 1-16 during 2xp weekend, so the levels flew by before I could slot.|
Originally Posted by Daemodand
You were playing her all the way to 21 with basically nothing slotted? *sigh* TOs and DOs have value, people! USE THEM!
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Heroside I have an extremely stocked based, so I'm spoiled. Leveling through Praetoria I feel gimped (I know I can gmail stuff to myself, but when I have very limited play time, I didn't want to waste 15 minutes having to individually mail myself a bunch of enh).
By the way, I started my Plant/Thorn Dom and am liking it. One thing I definitely notice is that Ice is a serious end hog.
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I leveled a Earth/TA troller to 50...that was a labor of love (along with a bit of OCD that I couldn't delete a toon that I had taken to 32 and needed to get it to 50).
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Originally Posted by False_Fiction_EU
I know your feeling. I've always wanted an Ice/Ice blaster or Dominator. However, unless I play it as a concept toon (which is the way it should be) it just underperforms compared to other combos.
It's a bit like Trick Archery set. It's great for concept and some might even say it's fantastic. However, it's not for min/max players. If you're willing to accept that it's a fun toon and should be played that way - I say go for it. |
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So you're leveling through Purgatoria?!? That's the reason why you're not liking the char. |
Originally Posted by Scorcharina
When I say nothing slotted, I'm more speaking of lack of IOs. I always use my TOs and DOs that drop and occassionally buy more DOs once I acrue funds. Part of the problem was that I leveled her 1-16 during 2xp weekend, so the levels flew by before I could slot.
Heroside I have an extremely stocked based, so I'm spoiled. Leveling through Praetoria I feel gimped (I know I can gmail stuff to myself, but when I have very limited play time, I didn't want to waste 15 minutes having to individually mail myself a bunch of enh). By the way, I started my Plant/Thorn Dom and am liking it. One thing I definitely notice is that Ice is a serious end hog. |
Seriously, I took my elec/stone Dom through Purgatoria and I almost deleted him. Once I made it to SOland I gained a lot of appreciation for him. I'd say stick it out till 22 and SOs and re-evaluate. It's only 1 more level.
And yeah, AA is a huuuge end drainer for yourself. With my Ice/thorn, I had AA slotted for 5 end redux DOs during her teens just so I could use my other powers. On the other hand, it's a great defensive toggle sans alpha strikes.
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But you don't have to use Ice Slick and the AoE immob at the same time ^^ Actually you don't really have to use the AoE immob at all: for a controller it's the better way to set Containment and get double damage, but it just brings a lot of aggro to a dominator. I have it on my Ice/Psy dom' just in case I would like to stop foes from running, but never use it (6-slotted with Enfeebled Operation it gives a nice defense bonus to S/L, but that's all).|
Originally Posted by Scorcharina
Ice slick is a really cool power and easy to get perma. Great damage mitigation, but the immobs make it useless and I can't even put a damage proc in it.
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I didn't take Flashfreeze: it animates so slowly that mobs have plenty of time to hit you before they get slept -_- Shiver seems unnecessary to me with all the -rech/-speed I can get.
I had a love/hate relationship with my Ice/Psy/Ice until lvl 50 but now I really like him
A lot of controls are nearly useless in steamrolling teams and it's a waste of time to try to use them. But since one of your best controls - Arctic Air - is a toggle, you can almost focus on your attacks because the mobs are "automatically" controlled. I must admit I have been feeling way too squishy before I could softcap S/L defense with the Ice APP, though.I agree with Shadey_NA: try to SO her (with MASSIVE end redux in Arctic Air) and see if something happens.
Ispahan/or anyone else,
Out of curiosity, have you tried stealth/SS with your AA? Would it send aggro to you if you were invis or just scare/confuse the bad guys?
Honestly, if you dislike a character enough that you have to ask for a reason NOT to delete them, then IMO you should just delete it. If it's not fun, why play it?
@Oathbound
@Oathbound Too
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I want to say Stealth would cancel AA, but I'm not 100% sure on that. Superspeed would stack. (Main issue I have with AA is that it's such an END hog.)|
Originally Posted by Shadey_NA
Ispahan/or anyone else,
Out of curiosity, have you tried stealth/SS with your AA? Would it send aggro to you if you were invis or just scare/confuse the bad guys? |
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Originally Posted by Oathbound_Too
Honestly, if you dislike a character enough that you have to ask for a reason NOT to delete them, then IMO you should just delete it. If it's not fun, why play it?
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But as for "If it's not fun, don't play it?" It makes sense to ask. Some sets bloom later, or are "Hey, when you get THIS key power, it really takes off." Or, for instance with Masterminds in 18-23, "You're hitting the roughest patch for it, stick with it before deciding."
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Originally Posted by Isphan
But you don't have to use Ice Slick and the AoE immob at the same time ^^ Actually you don't really have to use the AoE immob at all: for a controller it's the better way to set Containment and get double damage, but it just brings a lot of aggro to a dominator.
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Admittedly mine has it, but it was a late-ish pick. (Ice/Psy - pre Dom2.0, remember "late blooming set!")
The AOE Immob is useful as a backup - Ice Slick an ambush coming your way, AOE Immob a group that's getting ready to be shredded, head in (with /psy) for a nice, tightly packed Drain Psyche, Shockwave, etc. Deal with the slicked mobs next.
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I wish I could find a place for SuperSpeed, but I need all the powers I picked, either to make my dominator's job or to reach the S/L softcap |
Originally Posted by Shadey_NA
Out of curiosity, have you tried stealth/SS with your AA? Would it send aggro to you if you were invis or just scare/confuse the bad guys?
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Looking at RedTomax.com, I see that Arctic Air always notifies mobs, so I suppose it would immediately cancel the stealth and aggro the foes.
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too bad, but it's still an awesome power. I keep being suprised at how much mitigation it actually does. Like I said, mine's still a lowbie at level 20 so i know all the mez and the like is in the future.
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Originally Posted by Ispahan
I wish I could find a place for SuperSpeed, but I need all the powers I picked, either to make my dominator's job or to reach the S/L softcap
Looking at RedTomax.com, I see that Arctic Air always notifies mobs, so I suppose it would immediately cancel the stealth and aggro the foes. |
I'm finally getting around to trying all the villain ATs and for my first dominator I decided to go outside my comfort zone (fire) and went with Ice/Ice. She's sitting at level 21 and I'm just not feeling it. I don't know if its just because I've been playing her mostly unslotted (finally crafted a bunch of IOs last night) or the lack of AoE damage.
So, I'm looking for feedback on this build at higher levels. Does it tend to lean more towards the single target damage? What makes this combo enjoyable?