I'd rather see an auto power that effects all your other melee range attacks.
"Null is as much an argument "for removing the cottage rule" as the moon being round is for buying tennis shoes." -Memphis Bill
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I wouldn't mind that either but in what way? Boost special? Boost dmg? don't forget that fighting is used by more than just melee ats so it would have to effect all attacks right?
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Originally Posted by Lemur Lad
I'd rather see an auto power that effects all your other melee range attacks.
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I personally wouldn't mind the 5th power to be something like "Practiced Brawler" a status protection click power exactly like, if not less powerful than the version reflex scrappers use. I know this may not be much use for characters with status proctection, but it would really come in handy or the squishier types. If the devs were worried about balance they could increase the rech so it couldn't be set to perma. This pool would become a very attractive choice for the softer archetypes if a status protection power was available in it.
KI
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I remember that being cited as a potential problem in the past though; it'd be seen as more than "useful" to any archetype without status protection; it'd be seen as downright necessary. Probably something they'd want to avoid for a power pool. Then there's the whole question of should you give a status protection power to an archetype which was balanced around not having one..|
Originally Posted by Krazy_Ivan
I personally wouldn't mind the 5th power to be something like "Practiced Brawler" a status protection click power exactly like, if not less powerful than the version reflex scrappers use. I know this may not be much use for characters with status protection, but it would really come in handy or the squishier types. If the devs were worried about balance they could increase the rech so it couldn't be set to perma. This pool would become a very attractive choice for the softer archetypes if a status protection power was available in it.
KI |
Or the question of do you give a fifth power to just fighting and nothing else? If so, why? If not, how many other power pools do you add a fifth power to? I would see it more likely being a 'free' health pool power than going under fighting, considering how potentially game altering it could be.. even if you can't perm it for whatever reason.
Not that I'd personally mind seeing it. I just consider it.. unlikely.
J
Still hate the visit Winscott mission- make it dropable, have it give actual exp or remove it altogether. PS- Down knows who you are.
J/ Wilde/ / AIL - Celebrating five years!
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I'm thinking no on that one. |
Originally Posted by joshdex
Then there's the whole question of should you give a status protection power to an archetype which was balanced around not having one..
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Why do melee characters get status protection? Because they have no reliable ways of preventing them from happening.
Look at a Katana/Regen scrapper with Body Mastery. There is nothing in any of those sets that gives them any way of preventing an incoming mez effect. If they did not get passive mez protection they would be practically unplayable.
On the other hand, any controller in the game has the ability to lock down an enemy mezzer before they get mezzed themselves. Often before that enemy mezzer has even agroed on them.
It comes down to active versus passive protection. Those who cannot protect themselves from mez powers by actively preventing them get passive protection instead.
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
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Well the Leaping pool has Acrobatics which resists Knockback and Hold. It could be something like that. Weave already has Immob resist.
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Originally Posted by joshdex
I remember that being cited as a potential problem in the past though; it'd be seen as more than "useful" to any archetype without status protection; it'd be seen as downright necessary. Probably something they'd want to avoid for a power pool. Then there's the whole question of should you give a status protection power to an archetype which was balanced around not having one..
Or the question of do you give a fifth power to just fighting and nothing else? If so, why? If not, how many other power pools do you add a fifth power to? I would see it more likely being a 'free' health pool power than going under fighting, considering how potentially game altering it could be.. even if you can't perm it for whatever reason. Not that I'd personally mind seeing it. I just consider it.. unlikely. J |
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I think that could be managed. (Not saying I'm for or against it.)|
Originally Posted by joshdex
Then there's the whole question of should you give a status protection power to an archetype which was balanced around not having one..
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Sure always on full value status protection would be crazy talk, but Controllers (for instance) already get mez protection in Indomitable Will (clickie version). It's not that much of an issue due to uptime. Yes a High end IO build can get it perma, but honestly I'd have to say that's the least of Recharge-based IO build problems.
Partial protection could also work. Several support sets already provide this (FF, Sonic, Traps).
Perma protection could be balanced with low Mag (like the initial protection given to Arachnos Soldiers). Low enough mag that it's not going to save you from the focus of a group of mobs or even necessarily a Boss, but high enough so that every stray minion can't constantly detoggle you. Say an auto 2-3mag protection from hold/sleep/disorient.
Again, not saying For or Against, just saying it could probably be balanced.
@Oathbound & @Oathbound Too
How about this:
Rise Up
Self Rez, Special
-Grants 50% HP, 50% Endurance.
-Grants Mag 10 mez protection and +50% damage for 20 seconds.
-Untouchable for 5 seconds.
Mains (Freedom) @Auroxis
Auroxis - Emp/Rad/Power Defender Pylon Video Soloing an AV
Pelvic Thunder - SS/Elec/Mu Brute
Sorajin - Elec/Nin Stalker
Neuropain - Sonic/Mental/Elec Blaster
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I'm assuming you're referring to the leaping pool, more specifically to acrobatics(KB resist) I agree it was almost necessary if you had a fire/dark primary set on your tanker before the invention system. I wasn't suggesting this option to become a game changer, but if you didnt have a break free it could be a useful power in a pinch..long rech(maybe resistable to rech enh/recipe bonus). I figured it fit in the set since you get an attack power/s, a resist toggle, def toggle, why not a short term status protection as the fifth. I see it fitting in this set as you need attacks/def/resistance and the ability to withstand a stunning shot to be a fighter.|
Originally Posted by joshdex
I remember that being cited as a potential problem in the past though; it'd be seen as more than "useful" to any archetype without status protection; it'd be seen as downright necessary. Probably something they'd want to avoid for a power pool. Then there's the whole question of should you give a status protection power to an archetype which was balanced around not having one..
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KI
I like that idea!
A passive Mag 2-4 Mez Protection from Hold/Immobilize/Stun.
Enough to shrug off 1 Mag 3 Hold, but not multiple or stacked from same caster protection.
It could also be useful to some Melee types, if they're that worried about being overloaded, but int he long term really not that needed (and I know enough Tsoo have overloaded my melees on Stuns, to know it's possible to do it)
BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
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That untouchable period would make it infinitely better than similar powers in Willpower and Regen.
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Originally Posted by Auroxis
How about this:
Rise Up Self Rez, Special -Grants 50% HP, 50% Endurance. -Grants Mag 10 mez protection and +50% damage for 20 seconds. -Untouchable for 5 seconds. |
Winner of Players' Choice Best Villainous Arc 2010: Fear and Loathing on Striga; ID #350522
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I just think it would suck to have a self rez power that isn't very useful in letting you overcome a sticky situation. Perhaps replace the untouchable with a PBAoE ToHit debuff, and fiddle around with the recharge to balance things?
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Originally Posted by FredrikSvanberg
That untouchable period would make it infinitely better than similar powers in Willpower and Regen.
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Mains (Freedom) @Auroxis
Auroxis - Emp/Rad/Power Defender Pylon Video Soloing an AV
Pelvic Thunder - SS/Elec/Mu Brute
Sorajin - Elec/Nin Stalker
Neuropain - Sonic/Mental/Elec Blaster
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You are correct in thinking it would suck, but basically Fred was saying that you're not going to get around the pretty hard and fast rule that no Pool Power can be better than a power that exists in a Primary or Secondary set.|
Originally Posted by Auroxis
I just think it would suck to have a self rez power that isn't very useful in letting you overcome a sticky situation. Perhaps replace the untouchable with a PBAoE ToHit debuff, and fiddle around with the recharge to balance things?
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On top of that, a self rez in Fighting would more than likely not be allowed because we have a Medicine pool where it would be more appropriate.
As for the Mezz protection suggested in another post:
I doubt they'd allow a toggle. You'd more likely see a long recharge click power that has the same effect as Domination (can be used when already mezzed).
"Null is as much an argument "for removing the cottage rule" as the moon being round is for buying tennis shoes." -Memphis Bill
I like the idea in concept. I'm definitely in favor of all pools getting a 5th power, say at about level 30. (I also happen to be in favor of removing the requirement to purchase earlier powers to access later ones. The level gate is enough of a impediment. I'm sick of having to waste a power slot on Aid Other in medicine, which many of my guys will never find a practical use for, just to get Aid self, effectively making Aid Self cost 2 power slots.)
I would love to have an Auto mez protection, like spider armor, though honestly I'd rather see that in a new Patron/Ancillary pool. I remember when shields were in early post development, there was some talk about making the mez clicky a break free effect (for all the advantages clicky mez prot has, some of us dislike it greatly). This would be an excellent place to experiment with something like that. Make the power (called Break Free of course) function much like hitting a small BF. Give it a 15 second duration and a recharge of about 75 seconds. You can't make it perma without being really dedicated to the idea, but it doesn't usually need to be either. It's not a game changer, since anyone could theoretically just keep BFs on hand, but it creates the option for those who want it built in to their character, like self rez vs wakie.
Dear NCsoft, if you go through with this shutdown you've guaranteed you'll not see another dime from me on any project you put out, ever.
http://xx-starhammer-xx.deviantart.com/
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I disagree that Medicine would be more fitting concept-wise. You can't really utilize medicine while you're passed out, while real fighting spirit will get you up and combat-ready after defeat.|
Originally Posted by Lemur Lad
You are correct in thinking it would suck, but basically Fred was saying that you're not going to get around the pretty hard and fast rule that no Pool Power can be better than a power that exists in a Primary or Secondary set.
On top of that, a self rez in Fighting would more than likely not be allowed because we have a Medicine pool where it would be more appropriate. As for the Mezz protection suggested in another post: I doubt they'd allow a toggle. You'd more likely see a long recharge click power that has the same effect as Domination (can be used when already mezzed). |
The idea is to have something that fits within the theme of the pool, and gives some degree of mez protection while not making it a "must-have". Balance issues(while important) are an afterthought, as a lot of minor things can be done to bring it in line with the other self rez powers(fiddling with the recharge, lowering the bonuses).
Mains (Freedom) @Auroxis
Auroxis - Emp/Rad/Power Defender Pylon Video Soloing an AV
Pelvic Thunder - SS/Elec/Mu Brute
Sorajin - Elec/Nin Stalker
Neuropain - Sonic/Mental/Elec Blaster
My point was actually that the Willpower and Regeneration self-rezzes should have the untouchable period added to them, and then this Rise Up power could exist as written.
Winner of Players' Choice Best Villainous Arc 2010: Fear and Loathing on Striga; ID #350522
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I've been saying this for quite a while now. |
Originally Posted by FredrikSvanberg
My point was actually that the Willpower and Regeneration self-rezzes should have the untouchable period added to them
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I've written off the self rez in Regen and Willpower as useless, simply because every time I'd actually want to use a self rez it's in the middle of combat, and I get killed again during the standing up animation (during which you can't even use an inspiration)
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
Should be easy to code(standard code rant applies)
Power: "Focused brawl"
Brawls old end cost, twice the dmg and made unresistable
Since travel pools are getting 5th power choices I thought this pool could use an opener power that was more compatible with weapon sets and since brawl doesn't cause you redraw my hope is this ability can use all the same animations as the normal brawl does