FEEBACK: Steampunk Faces

While it's nice to have new faces, I really don't see the new tech (normal map texture) adding that much.

In the next post I have pics of the new and old faces (so as to not break the formatting of this post).

First row is Faces 7 and 16. Second row is Classic Steampunk and Victorian Steampunk. Following them are the hi-rez faces of NPCs introduced in City of Villains (Issue 6) and recently used again in Praetorian factions.

When I heard we were getting the better textured faces, I thought it would be the CoV NPC versions or something similar, especially since Noble Savage asked me about them when I posted them to one of the art threads.

But instead, we got more of the same. You can see that a little bit around the eyes and ears are sharper, which unfortunately highlights how low-polygon the ears are. But that's about it. The faces look more like real mannequins than real people. They have sharper and washed out highlights and more of a sheen to them... which isn't natural looking.

Rather than have more detail of the skin like freckles or five o'clock shadow, they appear to be more made-up like runway models.

The other critique I have is that the faces seem to be much more modern than Steampunk. The way the eyebrows go to a point at the edges is more typical of a manicured modern metrosexual than the bushy eyebrows normally associated with Victorian times. Instead, the faces of the Luddites pictured below would be *perfect* for Victorian faces.

So, overall, while nice to have more faces... I still want the hi-rez textures of the Issue 6 NPCs.

Faces 7 / 16
Faces Classic / Victorian





Faces from Cov / Issue 6 (and some older low-rez faces for comparison)

Subjective (with a hint of encouragement):

I just don't like the new faces. I understand what they did to achieve this new "art magic", but I agree... they look like plastic dolls. The methodology of what they are attempting shouldn't be scrapped... it should be refined. Keep playing with it devs.

I like the new male faces, and one of the female faces, the other one looks quite off to me, I dont have time to boot up game, its the one with the beauty spot that looks good.

But I do agree, they are a bit creepy and 'lifeless doll' although I just think its because theres alot more detail than we've had before.

Quote:

Originally Posted by VoodooGirl [*]Watching out for the Spinning Disco Portal of D00M!*

Subjective:
I don't believe the new faces are bad, but they are certainly not good. If the difference between the old and new ones weren't as jarring, you wouldn't be able to tell them apart. If anything, the new shininess and better shaders make them look like they're smeared in oil. They're serviceable for what they are, which is another low-detail face option.

Objective:
The new faces have very low-resolution textures and a very low polygon count that the new shaders don't do much to offset. When compared against the Mutant Pack faces, which have VERY high-res textures, the new faces appear very much out-dated. I run the game at HD resolution, and it's very obvious on my screen what items have high-resolution textures and which don't.

Low-res costume items make the game look dated and ugly, whereas high-resolution items hide much of the age. For years now there seems to have been a concentrated effort to add more special effects to the game when the basic truth is that sharp textures and detailed meshes do far more than graphics technology can ever accomplish. The best graphics technology can hope to achieve is reproduce the effects of large textures and complex meshes, which it utterly fails to do in this case.

The first thing faces in City of Heroes require is not new technology. It is a higher standard of basic quality, which means more detailed texture and more complex meshes. Only once that is achieved should other technical fields be pursued.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arcanaville Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

One thing I noticed is that the high-res faces don't play well with the low-res add-ons, mainly facial hair. Even the new mustache looks pinned on and the older stuff looks like someone slapped a plastic goatee on the guy.

By themselves, they don't look so bad although I prefer the male ones over the female ones.

I just love the new faces. They need to fix the reflective thing, btw.
Would be good if we could have faces with more poligons counts, better meshes for well rounded faces, and tintable eyes that randomly blink...
That would rock.

I honestly don't like the new faces. They look low detail, generic, and emotionless, much like most of the new faces we seem to get. The whole wax look just makes them look creepy. Really wish we could get some faces with character or emotion.

Uncanny Valley

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.ph.../UncannyValley


That much being said however...

The current standard heads in CoX, including those released in the Steampunk pack, simply do not have the resolution for normal maps to look good. This means both texture map resolution and geometry resolution.

I have no idea what the high definition models you're pulling the normal information from look like, but you're not picking up or conveying much more detail than you were before.

Additionally, the lighting system in CoX simply isn't up to the task of showcasing the normal detail either. Aside from the warehouse maps with the bright lights right at the entrances, the lighting in the game simply lacks contrast to show anything off. Normal maps really need a character lighting rig with proper rim lights.

Lastly, any time you add this kind of detail to a CGI human face, it only highlights the fact it lacks Sub Surface Scattering. That's where people are getting the ' plastic sheen' and 'doll/mannequin' vibes from.

The TLDR bottom like is these faces are more lifeless and fake looking than some of the old painted/photosourced ones. Shy of creating new face geometry and complex shaders, you can't really do anything about it except go for a more stylized look.



.

Not a fan of either face. I thought a more weather beaten face and older professor looking faces for the men would be better and more the style. Hell I thought there would be a new scarred face or two since that is popular in that fiction.

The women faces are ugly just have a bunch of detail but are bland. So what if one has a beauty mark? They look boring.

The faces are okay nothing inspiring with them. Nothing original and creative in them.

After the Animal Pack which was brilliant this has been a let down on faces here.

I have no idea what the technology/technique was to do the Organic faces or the Clockwork faces but both seem to look superior to the Steampunk faces. If I was able to use Organic without the "organic" bits or if the basic clockwork face was available as a flesh option, I would use them all the time.



The only alterations I made on these was to add lipstick to the female clockwork. But there's a night and day difference between the organic/clockwork faces and the steampunk ones and I far prefer the look of the former.

The comparisons to the organic and praetorian robot faces highlights some problems:

The Steampunk faces smooth out textures like the tiny lip wrinkles lending toward the waxy appearance.

The Steampunk faces have contrasts that are too high (darks are too dark, lights are too light).

The Steampunk faces have a heavy shadow on both sides of the nose... which only happens when the face is lit from below, which makes the face look unnatural (and especially because the other features are clearly lit from above).

I mentioned above how the male brows become too narrow at the ends... a modern affectation. The same goes for the female brows: They look overplucked and drawn on... which is fine for a modern face, or a 60s face, but not a Victorian one.

Dont like the faces...at all!

'Nuff said.