Remove the damage delay from Lift/Levitate
By
Aura_Familia,
Posted on: 2011-05-06 15:02 in Suggestions and Ideas
I will agree with this. The delay used to be cool. Now it's mostly annoying. Makes me want to skip those powers, really.
Winner of Players' Choice Best Villainous Arc 2010: Fear and Loathing on Striga; ID #350522
/Signed
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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gee i wonder why it deals smashing damage....|
Originally Posted by Vanden
This made it seem like the enemy took damage from the impact and not the launch.
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seriously, stop posting about things you dont understand.
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Gee, it's almost like you didn't read the rest of the post!|
Originally Posted by Solo_One
gee i wonder why it deals smashing damage....
seriously, stop posting about things you dont understand. |
Oh, wait.
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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Just, wow.
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Originally Posted by Solo_One
gee i wonder why it deals smashing damage....
seriously, stop posting about things you dont understand. |
Issue 16 made me feel like this.
Warning: This poster likes to play Devil's Advocate.
I agree. It looks strange and bugged now, even though it isn't. Perhaps even just shortening the delay a bit?
@Winter. Because I'm Winter. Period.
I am a blaster first, and an alt-oholic second.
To be fair i usually don't read vandens posts either considering what he posts iin the at forums.
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Yeah... this was my thought as well.|
Originally Posted by MothersWomb
To be fair i usually don't read vandens posts either considering what he posts iin the at forums.
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Vanden's got a reputation for whining about every little frivolous thing, and most of the player's started threads tend to generate a desire to post a face-palm picture. Granted there is a difference between Vanden and other whiners in that Vanden actually has logged in and spent time playing the game.
My gut reaction for this thread is also to post a face-palm picture.
Thing is, I play on a pretty lousy wireless connection right now. I try not to lead raids, teams, or TF's because I realize my net connection sucks. I deal with a lot of rubber-banding, enemies that suddenly vanish, powers that don't seem to have an effect, then suddenly massive bursts of damage as the system finally gets all the information back that yes I did actually hit the target.
For me, as a player, I have come to the terms with the reality that what I "cause" as a player may or may not have real-time "effect response"
I suspect, given the lack of whining about it on the forums, that large numbers of other players who also have less than desirable network connection speeds, have come to terms with lag effects as well.
So, go ahead, cry a river because lift / levitate damage doesn't synch up exactly to the animation and effect. Really, there was nothing else going on that was... you know... maybe more important? Are players really timing their attacks and button presses down to the point when they only do something when / if they see a visual effect for it?
Let me clear. This is the kind of change that you send a /bug report in game on.
This is the kind of change that you tap the powers guy (Black Scorpion as of right now) on the shoulder with a PM.
It is not a change that deserved an entire thread to itself.
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So, whats with the massive post every time one idea doesn't merit your liking?|
Originally Posted by je_saist
Yeah... this was my thought as well.
It is not a change that deserved an entire thread to itself. |
It's gone from me respecting you as a poster, Saist, to "Oh lor', here we go again..."
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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Part of me agrees with saist, as far as expecting a Vanden post to be "That shade of green isnt' QUITE what it should be, it should be just a touch less blue-ish, that needs fixing!"
On the other hand, if that's the most there is to complain about, COH is doing pretty good.... pity that's not the case. (See AE, Bases, PVP, or if you want to stick with powers, Gravity Control's slowness, the delay in putting down Rad debuffs... stuff that actually *affects play.*)
You want silly looking? How about a melee attack that does damage after the character has run fifty feet down a hall? (the various Assassin's Strikes.) If we're talking "Time makes that look silly," that would be FAR higher on the priority list. Or maybe the magical homing boulders that will follow a superspeeding/teleporting character down halls and around corners.
Plus, frankly, I think Vanden's full of it as far as this. I pulled three characters in different level ranges to see what happened:
Level 6 Grav/Rad vs lvl 6 Hellions:
Enemy lifted, hit ground, damage appeared just a fraction of a second later. Overall impression - enemy damaged on hitting ground.
Level 36 Mind/Thermal vs lvl 36 Council:
Enemy lifted, hit ground, damage appeared just a fraction of a second later. Overall impression - enemy damaged on hitting ground.
Level 50 Grav/Kin vs Lvl 47 Rikti:
Enemy lifted, hit ground, damage appeared a barely noticable fraction of a second later. Overall impression - enemy damaged on hitting ground.
The only time I saw, to quote Vanden,
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was when I took the level 50 and attacked some level 2 hellions. They were off sight of the screen when they took damage, near the top of their flight path. Now, if you want to complain about THAT - go fight something your own level instead. Either that or take the knockback enhancements out of your power if it bothers you so much.| The damage tick tends to happen at some random point in the target's flight now. |
"Removing the delay all together" for the damage would, frankly, look even sillier.
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So, why is striving to make everything better as much as possible a bad thing? I ask that honestly, because I know I'd be trying ti hunt down as many niggles as possible in something I made. Mind you, I am obscenely perfectionist when it comes to art and such |
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
Part of me agrees with saist, as far as expecting a Vanden post to be "That shade of green isnt' QUITE what it should be, it should be just a touch less blue-ish, that needs fixing!"
On the other hand, if that's the most there is to complain about, COH is doing pretty good.... pity that's not the case. (See AE, Bases, PVP, or if you want to stick with powers, Gravity Control's slowness, the delay in putting down Rad debuffs... stuff that actually *affects play.*) |
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| You want silly looking? How about a melee attack that does damage after the character has run fifty feet down a hall? (the various Assassin's Strikes.) If we're talking "Time makes that look silly," that would be FAR higher on the priority list. Or maybe the magical homing boulders that will follow a superspeeding/teleporting character down halls and around corners. |
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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First, his suggestion for "betterment" in this case (remove the delay) would look even sillier than he suggests it currently does. (Why would the *lift* do damage but not the impact with the ground?) |
Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
So, why is striving to make everything better as much as possible a bad thing? I ask that honestly, because I know I'd be trying ti hunt down as many niggles as possible in something I made. Mind you, I am obscenely perfectionist when it comes to art and such
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Second, there are so many *bigger* issues to deal with - yes, even in terms of animation and powers - that this just seems ridiculous to even bring up. Especially when it's not universal - again, I went and checked various levels against even and (once I got to the 50) lower levels, and it only looked "strange" when fighting something well below my level. Not a situation you'll generally be in outside of *boredom.*
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It's simple physics. Some force is slamming into them with enough strength to send them flying upwards. That's gonna hurt, whether it's your mind powers or your fist. Same reason it's not any more helpful for Superman to simply catch a falling Lois Lane instead of the pavement.|
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
First, his suggestion for "betterment" in this case (remove the delay) would look even sillier than he suggests it currently does. (Why would the *lift* do damage but not the impact with the ground?)
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It looks even sillier when you use it for its -Fly. The enemy backflips, steadies themself, gives you a nasty look...and suddenly plummets out of the sky.
If it makes you feel better, I'll edit the OP to precisely describe exactly when the damage happens on an even-con. But I certainly won't moderate my posting habits to ensure that every thread I make passes the Elite Forum Poster's Guidelines for What's Important Enough for Me to Spend My Incredibly Valuable Time Thinking About.
Issue 16 made me feel like this.
Warning: This poster likes to play Devil's Advocate.
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You assume. They don't look "slammed" to me - Accelerated, yes. Slammed, no. Which would end up with less - or no - damage.
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Originally Posted by Vanden
It's simple physics. Some force is slamming into them with enough strength to send them flying upwards.
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| But I certainly won't moderate my posting habits to ensure that every thread I make passes the Elite Forum Poster's Guidelines for What's Important Enough for Me to Spend My Incredibly Valuable Time Thinking About. |
Nobody's saying you shouldn't post it. *shrug* But it is what you're getting to be known for.
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Eh, it's a matter of opinion. If the damage happened at the start it would certainly imply a slamming is occurring. Some new VFX wouldn't go amiss, but wouldn't be necessary.|
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
You assume. They don't look "slammed" to me - Accelerated, yes. Slammed, no. Which would end up with less - or no - damage.
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Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
But you do post about some *incredibly* inane things almost continually. Once in a while is one thing. You seem to focus on some of the most incredibly - I don't know. We're not talking "Forest for the trees," here, we're talking "Forest for one vein in a new leaf in one tree somewhere off to the side being .3 mm shorter than you think it should be while the rest of the forest burns."
Nobody's saying you shouldn't post it. *shrug* But it is what you're getting to be known for. |
Issue 16 made me feel like this.
Warning: This poster likes to play Devil's Advocate.
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They're being lifted into the air by telekinesis. The only damage they'd be taking is some lightheadedness as they woosh upwards.
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Originally Posted by Vanden
Eh, it's a matter of opinion. If the damage happened at the start it would certainly imply a slamming is occurring. Some new VFX wouldn't go amiss, but wouldn't be necessary.
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But how and why does it affect flying foes then?|
Originally Posted by YippeeGo
They're being lifted into the air by telekinesis. The only damage they'd be taking is some lightheadedness as they woosh upwards.
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Or at least not apply a -fly debuff?
Click here to find all the All Things Art Threads!
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
City of Heroes is a game about freedom of expression and variety of experiences far more so than it is about representing any one theme, topic or genre.
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Again, simple physics. Sudden, rapid acceleration = physical trauma.
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Originally Posted by YippeeGo
They're being lifted into the air by telekinesis. The only damage they'd be taking is some lightheadedness as they woosh upwards.
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Issue 16 made me feel like this.
Warning: This poster likes to play Devil's Advocate.
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Top thrill dragster rollar coaster at Cedar point go and I quote|
Originally Posted by Vanden
Again, simple physics. Sudden, rapid acceleration = physical trauma.
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| launches riders from 0-120 mph in less than four seconds. |
so ya "sudden, rapid acceleration = physical trauma" is bull even for us non-supers.
First, that force is being applied over a period of time, not all at once. Second, it's being applied evenly over a body, not at a small, focused area. Third, that amount of acceleration (about 13.4 m/s²) is not enough to cause the 2 seconds of air time the powers are apparently supposed to cause.
Issue 16 made me feel like this.
Warning: This poster likes to play Devil's Advocate.
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Who says I'm *not* doing that, or being careful (for whatever reason) to lift them into the air so they can "enjoy" the fall? Or that I'm applying it at a point instead of all over?|
Originally Posted by Vanden
First, that force is being applied over a period of time, not all at once. Second, it's being applied evenly over a body, not at a small, focused area. Third, that amount of acceleration (about 13.4 m/s²) is not enough to cause the 2 seconds of air time the powers are apparently supposed to cause.
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Heck, one of the sets with that power is *mind control.* Who says I'm even *really* lifting them up, versus showing what they think is happening?
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This is justification for it still being thematic with the damage up front. Right now, you're apparently doing exactly that.|
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
Who says I'm *not* doing that, or being careful (for whatever reason) to lift them into the air so they can "enjoy" the fall? Or that I'm applying it at a point instead of all over?
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Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
Heck, one of the sets with that power is *mind control.* Who says I'm even *really* lifting them up, versus showing what they think is happening?
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Wait, if they only think they're flying through the air, what's making them take smashing damage?
Issue 16 made me feel like this.
Warning: This poster likes to play Devil's Advocate.
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remember The Matrix when it happens to the mind it happens to the body. Same logic
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Originally Posted by Vanden
This is justification for it still being thematic with the damage up front. Right now, you're apparently doing exactly that.
Mind also has Telekinesis, and that sounds more like Illusion anyway... Wait, if they only think they're flying through the air, what's making them take smashing damage? |
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Ok then how fast according to your calculations does Lift/levitate accelerate someone at to what G degree? Cause 120mph in 4 seconds is no slouch at about 1.36 Gs.
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Originally Posted by Vanden
First, that force is being applied over a period of time, not all at once. Second, it's being applied evenly over a body, not at a small, focused area. Third, that amount of acceleration (about 13.4 m/s²) is not enough to cause the 2 seconds of air time the powers are apparently supposed to cause.
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Lift and Levitate have a 2 second delay from when the power hits to when the damage applies. This is an artifact of the pre-CoV days, when the game didn't have ragdoll. Used on an even-level or so enemy, the damage would apply roughly when the enemy hit the ground. This made it seem like the enemy took damage from the impact and not the launch. Now that we have ragdoll, though, things are a lot less predictable. The damage tick tends to happen while the enemy's ragdoll is resting comfortably on the ground having already landed from their trip through the skies. It ends up looking very spastic and unprofessional. So, I think the easiest solution would be to just remove the delay altogether.
P.S.:These powers also do -Fly. Replace every instance of "damage" with "-Fly" in this post to complete the suggestion.
Issue 16 made me feel like this.
Warning: This poster likes to play Devil's Advocate.