I do not know, but I would seriously doubt it.
No, I tested this the other day, the results were not good!
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How did you test it and what were your results?|
Originally Posted by Sukothai
No, I tested this the other day, the results were not good!
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Did you attack a Monster/GM with a rare Alpha, break off, swap to a non-rare (or nothing) and attack again using the exact same conditions other than the swapped alpha?
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I can say that general-con enemies like the Rikti invasion forces still con the same color, even with level shift applied.
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Originally Posted by GavinRuneblade
How did you test it and what were your results?
Did you attack a Monster/GM with a rare Alpha, break off, swap to a non-rare (or nothing) and attack again using the exact same conditions other than the swapped alpha? |
I jest, I jest. It's a fairly valid question.
But afaik, GMs are always +x regardless of your level, but presumably the added effects from the alpha slot would definitely improve one's odds.
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I went up against Eochai with my tanker..............I died. I did survive for 2 minutes. I had a rare slotted.
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Originally Posted by GavinRuneblade
How did you test it and what were your results?
Did you attack a Monster/GM with a rare Alpha, break off, swap to a non-rare (or nothing) and attack again using the exact same conditions other than the swapped alpha? |
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See Giant Monsters vs. your level for the mechanics.|
Originally Posted by Aneurysmo
But afaik, GMs are always +x regardless of your level,
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I haven't tested it, but for most giant monsters there should be no change. Nearly all GMs have a hidden level lower than 50 and your attacks will be reduced to the level of the GM. The one exception I can think of is probably U'kon Grai. I've heard that it's hidden level is 54, which seems likely, though it's hard to test in the middle of a mothership raid. In that case, according to the way things work, the level shift might work, giving your attacks damage as if you were 51 attacking a level 50, instead of a level 50 attacking a level 49.
Against Devouring Earth Monsters, the level shift should help. They have a hidden level and do not use the GM attack code.
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Thanks for that link, so it's always going to con purple regardless, but the truth of the matter is that it won't all act like it's got the same relative difficulty to people of levels above/below it? That's interesting.
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Originally Posted by StarGeek
See Giant Monsters vs. your level for the mechanics.
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Hmm...
I've always 'retired' my characters at 50 as they've had a full career at that point and I don't much enjoy endless grinds for loot, which up until now, has been the only thing to do at 50.
Since I don't play my 50's, I haven't had any interest in the Incarnate content. I figured it wasn't worth the effort just so I could grind the same TF's a bit easier.
The only thing that even tempted me to go down the incarnate path was the chance to stand toe to toe with the likes of Babbage and Adamaster.
I figure Statesman would have no trouble dispatching the Palladin all by himself so I naturally assumed once the full spread of incarnate goodies is out that we'd be able to do that...
So, even after getting every single incarnate boost possible your saying Palladin will still mop the floor with me regardless?
Just doesn't sound like the demi-god levels of power I'd envisioned.
(As an aside, I can fully understand and stand behind the bonuses not working when exemplared) I just figured if I was running around as an Incarnate and bumped into Jurassic that I wouldn't be afraid...
Guess the system just really isn't for me then. Ah well, at least I'll be able to get double XP from TF's from time to time!
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Confirmed that Level Shift has no effect against Giant Monsters. Tested vs. Ghost of Scrapyard.
With Level Shift...
You activated the Pulse Rifle Burst power.
HIT Ghost of Scrapyard! Your Pulse Rifle Burst power had a 95.00% chance to hit, you rolled a 41.68.
You blast Ghost of Scrapyard with your Pulse Rifle Burst for 72.89 points of energy damage.
You have knocked Ghost of Scrapyard off their feet with your Pulse Rifle Burst!
Ghost of Scrapyard MISSES! Spirit Wrack power had a 60.00% chance to hit, but rolled a 84.29.
Without Level Shift...
You activated the Pulse Rifle Burst power.
HIT Ghost of Scrapyard! Your Pulse Rifle Burst power had a 95.00% chance to hit, you rolled a 20.03.
You blast Ghost of Scrapyard with your Pulse Rifle Burst for 72.89 points of energy damage.
You have knocked Ghost of Scrapyard off their feet with your Pulse Rifle Burst!
Ghost of Scrapyard HITS you! Spirit Wrack power had a 60.00% chance to hit and rolled a 22.22.
So, as you can see my damage remained the same, and Ghost of Scrapyards' ToHit rolls remained the same.
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You can "easily" see the "hidden" level of any GM by checking their hitpoints and extrapolating the number. Ukon Grai has 73k hitpoints, which is the equivalent of a level 54 GM (same with Rikti Dropships during invasions)
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Originally Posted by StarGeek
See Giant Monsters vs. your level for the mechanics.
I haven't tested it, but for most giant monsters there should be no change. Nearly all GMs have a hidden level lower than 50 and your attacks will be reduced to the level of the GM. The one exception I can think of is probably U'kon Grai. I've heard that it's hidden level is 54, which seems likely, though it's hard to test in the middle of a mothership raid. In that case, according to the way things work, the level shift might work, giving your attacks damage as if you were 51 attacking a level 50, instead of a level 50 attacking a level 49. Against Devouring Earth Monsters, the level shift should help. They have a hidden level and do not use the GM attack code. |
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Thanks! I can't test myself, I only have two with rares and neither has enough shards for a new non-rare, so I appreciate the confirmation!
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Originally Posted by Master Zaprobo
Confirmed that Level Shift has no effect against Giant Monsters. Tested vs. Ghost of Scrapyard.
With Level Shift... You activated the Pulse Rifle Burst power. HIT Ghost of Scrapyard! Your Pulse Rifle Burst power had a 95.00% chance to hit, you rolled a 41.68. You blast Ghost of Scrapyard with your Pulse Rifle Burst for 72.89 points of energy damage. You have knocked Ghost of Scrapyard off their feet with your Pulse Rifle Burst! Ghost of Scrapyard MISSES! Spirit Wrack power had a 60.00% chance to hit, but rolled a 84.29. Without Level Shift... You activated the Pulse Rifle Burst power. HIT Ghost of Scrapyard! Your Pulse Rifle Burst power had a 95.00% chance to hit, you rolled a 20.03. You blast Ghost of Scrapyard with your Pulse Rifle Burst for 72.89 points of energy damage. You have knocked Ghost of Scrapyard off their feet with your Pulse Rifle Burst! Ghost of Scrapyard HITS you! Spirit Wrack power had a 60.00% chance to hit and rolled a 22.22. So, as you can see my damage remained the same, and Ghost of Scrapyards' ToHit rolls remained the same. |
"Hmm, I guess I'm not as omniscient as I thought" -Gavin Runeblade.
I can be found, outside of paragon city here.
Thank you everyone at Paragon and on Virtue. When the lights go out in November, you'll find me on Razor Bunny.
Quote:
But alpha is not being an incarnate. It's the "slow path" as per the arc. If alpha gives me all these bonuses, I would hate to see what the other stuff actually does. It stilll may not be for you, but don't discount it. I just pulled out my very first toon I made after 5 years, to find out he can't even get into Cimerora. It prompts the questions, "What else did I miss, and what else is in store for him?"
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Originally Posted by MaestroMavius
Hmm...
I've always 'retired' my characters at 50 as they've had a full career at that point and I don't much enjoy endless grinds for loot, which up until now, has been the only thing to do at 50. Since I don't play my 50's, I haven't had any interest in the Incarnate content. I figured it wasn't worth the effort just so I could grind the same TF's a bit easier. The only thing that even tempted me to go down the incarnate path was the chance to stand toe to toe with the likes of Babbage and Adamaster. I figure Statesman would have no trouble dispatching the Palladin all by himself so I naturally assumed once the full spread of incarnate goodies is out that we'd be able to do that... So, even after getting every single incarnate boost possible your saying Palladin will still mop the floor with me regardless? Just doesn't sound like the demi-god levels of power I'd envisioned. (As an aside, I can fully understand and stand behind the bonuses not working when exemplared) I just figured if I was running around as an Incarnate and bumped into Jurassic that I wouldn't be afraid... Guess the system just really isn't for me then. Ah well, at least I'll be able to get double XP from TF's from time to time! |
Quote:
Getting Alpha means you are an Incarnate. I consider it like the various ranks in the Police or Army. A Chief of Police and a Constable are still Police Officers, but a Chief of Police has more power than a Constable. Constable is the Alpha Slot while Chief of Police is the Omega Slot.|
Originally Posted by Live_Wyre
But alpha is not being an incarnate. It's the "slow path" as per the arc. If alpha gives me all these bonuses, I would hate to see what the other stuff actually does. It stilll may not be for you, but don't discount it. I just pulled out my very first toon I made after 5 years, to find out he can't even get into Cimerora. It prompts the questions, "What else did I miss, and what else is in store for him?"
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I just hope that when we complete our path of the Incarnate that all the enemies of the pre-19 level 50 TFs/STFs will con grey to blue to us. Would be nice to be able to solo the LRSF without having a mind dom. Of course, Monsters and Raid enemies (Riktis, Zombies, etc.) will always con the same to us even if we are 50+10.
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Originally Posted by starphoenix
I just hope that when we complete our path of the Incarnate that all the enemies of the pre-19 level 50 TFs/STFs will con grey to blue to us. Would be nice to be able to solo the LRSF without having a mind dom. Of course, Monsters and Raid enemies (Riktis, Zombies, etc.) will always con the same to us even if we are 50+10.
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I actually hope this does not happen this way. For the same reason enemies in Positron or Sister Psyche don't con grey to us. You're exemped to them to complete that task. In order to protect the TF from becoming the mess that WoW has with the ideal way to complete a dungeon being to just get a high level person to run it for you.
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I already see that as the most efficient way in CoH, and since way before the alpha slot. There is a wide gap in power between an IOed out level 50 exemped at level 20 and a genuine level 20 : more enhancement and insp slots, a few more powers, more set bonuses, more accolades, and so on.| In order to protect the TF from becoming the mess that WoW has with the ideal way to complete a dungeon being to just get a high level person to run it for you. |
I can agree that there's no reason to make it worse, and I hope there's no more level shift.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by MaestroMavius
The only thing that even tempted me to go down the incarnate path was the chance to stand toe to toe with the likes of Babbage and Adamaster.
I figure Statesman would have no trouble dispatching the Palladin all by himself so I naturally assumed once the full spread of incarnate goodies is out that we'd be able to do that... So, even after getting every single incarnate boost possible your saying Palladin will still mop the floor with me regardless? Just doesn't sound like the demi-god levels of power I'd envisioned. |
Please consider that having the Alpha Enhancement, even at VERY RARE / Tier 4 level, is not the same as being an Incarnate in the sense of Statesman and Lord Recluse. We have a long way to go to be on a literal part with them.
Also, I may not be able to solo any GMs, but with the Level Shift of the UNCOMMON Alpha enhancement I was able to go one-on-one against Eochai, Winter Lord, Lusca, etc. I never neat any of them, but they never beat me either. I either kept at them till I was able to get a team together, or I eventually broke it off, usually after more than 30 minutes of melee goodness.
So no, I cannot smack-down Babbage, but he can't smack me down either.
Does level shift apply when fighting critters with no level shown, like Hamidon and other giant monsters?