Long Time Player: First Time Stalker

So, I've played for a long time. And I've tried Stalkers (highest I got was around 26-ish, EM/Dark), but they just have never been for me. They feel off to how I play and I want to change that.

I've nailed down the Primary to Spines, and the secondary... I'm wiggling around on.

I like the idea of both Ninjitsu and Willpower, so those two are my 'primary focus'. Of course there is always wiggle room for both Primary and Secondary if there's enough push for or against something.

I'm really hoping people can give a bit of information on how they play their Stalker (both low and mid-level) so I can get a bit of the mindset I should be in.

Help me, Stalker forum! You're my only hope!

Not much to say on how to play. Solo it's mostly Hide -> Assassin's Strike -> scrap 'til they're all dead.

On teams it's pretty much the same, 'cept you re-hide between spawns and position yourself as close to as many of your teammates as possible when scrapping to get as much of a crit bonus (10% + 3% per teammate within 30ft) as you can, with the occasional Placate if you happen to draw more aggro from your teammates than you can handle (though they will probably get pissed if whatever you Placated heads right for one of the squishies). Do NOT under any circumstances Hide -> AS -> run and Hide -> AS -> repeat or "scout ahead" without explicitly being told to by the team leader. That just gives the rest of us Stalkers a bad name and is one of the main reasons you see so many complaint threads about us.

Might be a few other tactics, both solo and team, depending on your sets, but those tend to just be for variety. Stalkers are, really, quite simple to play.

On the subject of secondaries, while I haven't really played Willpower on a Stalker, I don't see how it would work quite as well as on a Scrapper. Regen and Resistance just tend to work better with a larger hit point pool, I think. Stalkers, on the other hand, get a lot out of not being hit. It lets more Placate+Crit attempts succeed, particularly if you're trying to get an Assassin Strike in the middle of a group melee on a team.

Also, I think Caltrops and Blinding Powder give the Stalker much-needed utility on a team. And with Spines, you have the ability to pile up a bunch of enemies (say, from an ambush) onto a caltrops patch and then nail them with your AoEs.

will power works on a stalker because they can cap hp off slotting hpt and they get reconstruction for a flat heal in stead of regen

I'm not happy with my spines/nin but that's mostly the fault of the really slow attack animations of spines and not the /nin side.

I particularly love caltrops and the self heal and will refrain from my usual in-depth statement of hate for click-based status protection.

Between the two, if you want a secondary that has toys and offensive powers then go /nin and you'll be happy. If you want a fire and forget secondary so you can just kill things, go willpower and you'll be happy.

I don't think there is a badside to either one of the sets.

There will be a smidge more redraw on /nin because of the toys, but it's not a big deal. To me, spines is already so slow that adding another less-than-half-second isn't noticeable.

I tried a Spines/Will once. I hated it, but perhaps it gets better after you pass your 20's. Ninjitsu is fun just because it's so unique; my current is Elec/Nin.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JD_Gumby Do NOT under any circumstances Hide -> AS -> run and Hide -> AS -> repeat or "scout ahead" without explicitly being told to by the team leader. That just gives the rest of us Stalkers a bad name and is one of the main reasons you see so many complaint threads about us.

That's a good tip. I do that with my non-Stalkers, but it seems to annoy people worst with my Stalker (I'm new at Stalking too). This explains a lot.

I love playing Stalkers and observing how others play them and JD pretty much hit the nail on the head. Lots of times when on teams, you don't always have to AS in the middle of each mob. A lot of the times that I have witnessed other stalkers being successful and a difference maker on the team is when they sometimes treat being Hidden as a freebee critical. If your team is mowing down groups, you don't want to Hide -> AS -> Back to hide (don't attack). That often times slows down the tempo of the team.

I tend to play my Stalkers as Scrappers with Hide (yes that's basically what they are.) BUT, it's the mindset that makes the difference. If you think it's your job to slowly kill the group, then thats what you're going to do. If you think of it as going in there and killing them before they kill you as quick as possible, it'll happen like that and in my opinion will be tons of fun

I agree. In general "Build up - AS - Placate - crit-kill a minion -then scrap it out" is my group play style. My two main stalkers are dark and spines. Midnight's grasp and impale can both kill a +1 minion after placate nearly always, especially with buildup running when I can get a +2 reliably.

Dropping two enemies right off the bat, especially if one is high priority like a sapper or something, is a big help.

And the team never complains about me running away, because I don't. =)

Thanks to everyone for play style tips and ideas! It's going to be tough for me to get into the Stalker's swing of things.

So on that note, does any one have suggestions for a relatively successful Primary / Secondary mix? Again, I've had a change of heart from Spines and no am thinking of Broadsword / Ninjitsu. I just can't seem to nail down one Stalker as "My Stalker".

Well, so far I've found that a traditional Martial Arts/Ninjitsu has gotten me a Stalker that's gone up in level faster and easier than any other combo I tried. I'm only at L24 with him and in Sharkhead Isle, though, so the recommendation should be taken with a grain of salt.

I'm a fan of both /nin and /wp.

As someone mentioned, /nin is a pretty active secondary (with plenty of
things you can be doing with it), whereas /wp is a nice, safe and comfy
fire-n-forget kind of secondary.

The added HP and S&L resistance gives the /wp stalker much more staying
power while out of hide -- If you're scrapping a lot, it's a good choice as
you're a pretty difficult target to kill relatively speaking.

The bag of tricks from /nin offer much more of a hands-on approach, and
using them well, means there's no PvE fight you can't get away from
should you feel you need to. Caltrops is a superb PvE mitigator.

From a primary view, I've always liked Ninja Blade (despite what detractors say)
and its fast attacks hit harder (in my subjective opinion) than Spines or Electric.

Divine Avalanche is a great power for the scrapping Stalker. It makes
capped melee defense a piece of cake to achieve when you most need it.

I've dabbled some with Spines, and I like the range it provides.

Recently, I started an Elec/Wp and it's pretty cool (he's only in the L30's)
so there's more to learn, I'm sure, but Thunderstrike is making me a Big Fan.
I'll be picking up Lightning Rod next, and I've heard good things about it - We'll see.

In the end, of course, it'll come down to playstyle, but there are a lot of
very viable choices available.

Good Luck, Have Fun!

Regards,
4

So I ended up rolling a Ninja Blade / Ninjitsu Stalker. I ended up picking up Ninja Blade, because after comparing all the numbers of Ninja Blade and Broadsword, I decided that a faster animation was worth the lower overall damage because that would give me a more "active" feel. I chose Ninjitsu over Willpower for the same reason, throw on three toggles, and the rest is combat stuff to make my gaming more "active".

I figured that being "less active" was what drove me away from Stalkers in the first place (not the attack -> hide -> attack, but the feel of having so few attacks for so long in the early game). Having fast acting and fast recharging attacks can mitigate that, and the toys from Ninjitsu can give me extra things to play with.

So thanks again to everyone who has responded with advice, I took it all in and it's really helped me out. My Stalker is only level 11, but so far it's growing nicely.

I think I'm going to try a Dual Blade/Nin Stalker. I've got a Spines/Regen stalker that's fun but that concept toon will probably go the way of Poison if it ever gets proliferated to Corrs.

Anyone have feedback on how DB/Nin functions?

Spines actually felt too slow for me. The long activation times on the early powers just didn't do it for me. Teaming isn't really the issue for me, it's soloing, and short activation times coupled with quick recharges help me with that specifically because it feels more active, not necessarily because it is more active (especially later on).

Also, see the parts about why I picked Ninjitsu over Willpower. Willpower is powerful, I'll grant you that, but Ninjitsu works better for me and my issues.

Interesting ideas with the procs, Zem. I hadn't really considered the Lethal Resistance to be a large issue, as I'm still early on and have hunted down mostly the Vahz because those guys are suckers for Lethal. I haven't gone into any serious planning for the build yet, but I can see how slotting the -Res Proc from Achilles Heel could work into most of my attacks.

When the devs assigned damage resistances, my guess is that they mainly did it by concept rather than with any eye towards balance or fairness. So if an enemy is robotic, armored, incorporeal, or supernatural in some way (and let's face it, that covers a LOT) then they get some lethal resistance. Also, because bullets do lethal damage, anything that should be bullet-resistant is ALSO given decent lethal resistance even where a sword should do well such as against body armor (Malta/Longbow) or Warwolves (non-silver bullets don't hurt them?)

Anyway, it's a mess. Mostly it is low levels of lethal resistance but it's kind of evenly distributed, so it's nice to have another 10-20% of +dmg from IOs if you can eventually swing it. Unfortunately some sets like Mako's Bite and Touch of Death give +def in the sixth slot bonus, so slotting an Achilles means giving that up. I went with the Mako's lethal proc in one or two places rather than use an Achilles so I could get the +ranged def.

NB/Nin was my first Stalker and arguably still my favorite (I have a few of
them scattered across a few servers and levels)

My experiences are much more in line with Zem's than Dae's.

The Lethal resistances can be noticeable with certain mobs, but hardly
debilitating. I don't find it anywhere near a "big deal".

I too would consider my stalkers well slotted (60/90 Acc/Dmg minimum) on
all attacks, along with a few procs (AS is particularily nasty) like Zem's.

In terms of taking a few extra attacks (and it IS few), it's not a problem.
Double stacked Divine Avalanche (which is easy to get) makes the few
additional hits required for pesky Mechmen (etc.) a non-problem - especially
when they're more interested in escaping trops than hitting me.

YMMV, I guess...


Regards,
4

Course when your fighting Carnies then having Lethal damage type is rather handy and the magic salvage drops quite nice as well

Somewhat outweighed by the horrid time fighting Council robots ect but there you have it.

Oh and my Spines/Dark Stalker is easily the most capable on teams for its AoE ability, while I bring out my Energy/Nin for nasty EB's/AV's. My Ninja Blade/Regen is quite survivable but in no ways a real damage monster. Currently working on a Spines/Elec and its pretty decent so far - still a slog at level 21. Also have another 50, a Claws/Energy Aura but its not one I'd really recommend, at least for a first proper go at playing a Stalker.

My biggest hurdle, I think, is that due to rampant alt-itis, I have already done many of the primaries to a high level, so I have this idea of how it should play, always from different ATs. This caused a few issues inky first Stalker, but I have gotten better.

So far my Nin/Nin has done well, both on teams by hitting the bosses and letting others deal with the minions, and solo, which is actually slower then I'd like. I may have to raise the level to make it manageable. A small issue I've found is spotting my powers properly with IOs. But that's not really the fault of the power sets, so much as needed three times as many Luck Charms.

Level 18 is right around the corner, and I have to say, the Natural booster pack was the best investment I could make in this game. No serious need for a travel power until much later. And City Traveler gets that done fast.

With that in mind, would you push back Caltrops for a travel power?