Is it possible to end a T9 power prematurely?
By
Call Me Awesome,
Posted on: 2010-07-10 12:26 in Player Questions
no.
Ok, thanks for the quick response =)
As saist said, it doesn't work that way, and I don't think that the game engine would allow such a system.
The only way to allow the player to end the power would be to make it a toggle. Right away, that changes the balance of the power, because click powers start recharging while they're still in effect, whereas toggles start recharging when you turn them off.
There's also the issue of duration. I'm not aware of any toggle in the game, or previously in the game, which has a duration and detoggles itself when the duration runs out.
Then there's the matter of the power's effect. In a click power, you get a buff for a set amount of time. With a toggle, you get a buff that doesn't stack with itself for a very shot duration, but it refreshes itself before the duration ends, while the toggle is still active. No real difficulty here.
The crash on a click power is just a self debuff after a set delay. There is no check for the toggle turning off, so there's no way to trigger the crash early. And baking it into the buff pulse won't work; any instant effect, like Invuln's End and HP crash, will fire every time it pulses; the "doesn't stack" flag won't affect them. See the -End portion of the crash in Rage for an example of this.
I personally would like it if "Godmode" powers could be prematurely ended. But I don't think the system allows it to work.
@Roderick
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Phase shift powers work this way. Specifically I'm thinking of Hibernate. It will detoggle itself after a set duration. So the tech does exist.|
Originally Posted by Roderick
There's also the issue of duration. I'm not aware of any toggle in the game, or previously in the game, which has a duration and detoggles itself when the duration runs out.
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EDIT: Also I can't think of a power that has an effect when you detoggle it but I also can't think of a reason why it couldn't be set up that way. With the standard disclaimer of I have no idea how their powers system is set up and all that, so I could be totally off base. It doesn't sound out of the realm of possibility for things that could be programmed.
But yeah, I agree it's probably not going to happen.
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The only phase shift power I remember using is the Warshade one that grants +jump, and it stays on while you phase in and out. I've never used Hibernate, so I forgot all about it.|
Originally Posted by Frost
Phase shift powers work this way. Specifically I'm thinking of Hibernate. It will detoggle itself after a set duration. So the tech does exist.
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| EDIT: Also I can't think of a power that has an effect when you detoggle it but I also can't think of a reason why it couldn't be set up that way. With the standard disclaimer of I have no idea how their powers system is set up and all that. |
@Roderick
Hey thanks for the additional information guys. My main concern with the fixed duration is that I would use the T9 as a panic button and if I can resolve the situation before the timer is up then I would like to just click off the power, recover from the crash and move on. Crashing a few encounters after I innitially needed the power could turn out just as bad as if I never used it in the first place.
Ah well, the price of power I suppose.
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Originally Posted by Roderick
There's also the issue of duration. I'm not aware of any toggle in the game, or previously in the game, which has a duration and detoggles itself when the duration runs out.
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Originally Posted by Frost
Phase shift powers work this way. Specifically I'm thinking of Hibernate. It will detoggle itself after a set duration. So the tech does exist.
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Person34, I understand your desire for a more eloquent way to end the effects of the tier 9 (the hold portion of Power Surge never seems enough to compensate for the whole "oh god, I'm dead" thing), but it's probably not going to happen...
"My inner mind has become a reality-cracking overgod. He torments me! Help!"
There IS a way to mitigate the crash in combat though; I used it quite frequently on my Inv tanker before issue 13.
Go to Wentworth's and buy the "Ethereal Shift" temp power and craft it. That gives you a 5 use CLICK phase shift power that lasts (I think, it's been awhile since I used it) 30 seconds. Since it's a click power it's unaffected by the crash.
When you pop your tier 9 power watch your icons... when the buff icon starts blinking (if you're a tank) toss out a Taunt to hold aggro and click Ethereal Shift. You'll safely wait out the crash phased; pop a blue, retoggle and you're ready to continue on when the phase shift drops.
Good luck!
COH has just been murdered by NCSoft. http://www.change.org/petitions/ncso...city-of-heroes
There's also the actual Phase Shift itself and the matching temps that run for a while and then turn off.
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/em facepalm|
Originally Posted by The Grim Heaper
Also, the GVE Jump Pack is a toggle that runs out after a set duration.
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I use that power all the freakin' time. How did I not think of it?
@Roderick
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I'm surprised no one mentioned this: use Self-Destruction, use a wakie and rest. Debt free death |
Originally Posted by Person34
are you required to wait the full duration of the power?
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AFAIK, there's no way to trigger and effect when the toggle is turned off. However:|
Originally Posted by Frost
I can't think of a power that has an effect when you detoggle it but I also can't think of a reason why it couldn't be set up that way. With the standard disclaimer of I have no idea how their powers system is set up and all that, so I could be totally off base. It doesn't sound out of the realm of possibility for things that could be programmed.
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- Toggle has a short activation period (eg: 0.5s)
- Toggle has a long-duration non-stacking effect to self (eg: +20% def to self for 120s, ignores enhancements and buffs)
- Toggle has a short-duration non-stacking negative effect to self (eg: -20% def to self for 0.55s, ignores enhancements and buffs)
The net effect would be nothing while the toggle is on, and some time between shutting the toggle off and 0.5s after shutting the toggle off, you'd get +20% def for somewhere between 119.5s and 120s.
This is similar to the way enhancements in Hover are made useful. Hover has -flyspeed which is unaffected by enhancements, and +flyspeed which is affected by enhancements. Since the +flyspeed is a larger value, enhancements do more to your actual speed than would normally be expected.
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
you can also dismiss T9 pets, although I'm not sure if that has anything to do with his discussion.
The more people I meet, the more I'm beginning to root for the zombies.
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Somewhat tangental - the way Quantum Flight used to work. (Initially - instant phase with max flyspeed. Then they added a slowly increasing END cost after X amount of time, before going to the current "phase is off after 30 sec.") |
Originally Posted by Fleeting Whisper
AFAIK, there's no way to trigger and effect when the toggle is turned off. However:
- Toggle has a short activation period (eg: 0.5s) - Toggle has a long-duration non-stacking effect to self (eg: +20% def to self for 120s, ignores enhancements and buffs) - Toggle has a short-duration non-stacking negative effect to self (eg: -20% def to self for 0.55s, ignores enhancements and buffs) The net effect would be nothing while the toggle is on, and some time between shutting the toggle off and 0.5s after shutting the toggle off, you'd get +20% def for somewhere between 119.5s and 120s. This is similar to the way enhancements in Hover are made useful. Hover has -flyspeed which is unaffected by enhancements, and +flyspeed which is affected by enhancements. Since the +flyspeed is a larger value, enhancements do more to your actual speed than would normally be expected. |
They can do some interesting things with toggles.
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I was going to mention this myself because I do it all the time. Although I only do it with characters that have a self rez or a teammate who has a rez up and ready. The wakie and rest causes almost as much downtime as waiting out the crash.
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Originally Posted by Mr_Body
I'm surprised no one mentioned this: use Self-Destruction, use a wakie and rest. Debt free death
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Don't count your weasels before they pop dink!
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There is another balance issue, which is what drives me into nerd rage over click-based mez resist. If you are dropped, the click power ends and you have to wait for the remaining recharge cycle before you have status protection again. While anyone with toggle protection can just toggle up and go because toggles all recharge faster.
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Originally Posted by Roderick
As saist said, it doesn't work that way, and I don't think that the game engine would allow such a system.
The only way to allow the player to end the power would be to make it a toggle. Right away, that changes the balance of the power, because click powers start recharging while they're still in effect, whereas toggles start recharging when you turn them off. There's also the issue of duration. I'm not aware of any toggle in the game, or previously in the game, which has a duration and detoggles itself when the duration runs out. Then there's the matter of the power's effect. In a click power, you get a buff for a set amount of time. With a toggle, you get a buff that doesn't stack with itself for a very shot duration, but it refreshes itself before the duration ends, while the toggle is still active. No real difficulty here. The crash on a click power is just a self debuff after a set delay. There is no check for the toggle turning off, so there's no way to trigger the crash early. And baking it into the buff pulse won't work; any instant effect, like Invuln's End and HP crash, will fire every time it pulses; the "doesn't stack" flag won't affect them. See the -End portion of the crash in Rage for an example of this. I personally would like it if "Godmode" powers could be prematurely ended. But I don't think the system allows it to work. |
"Hmm, I guess I'm not as omniscient as I thought" -Gavin Runeblade.
I can be found, outside of paragon city here.
Thank you everyone at Paragon and on Virtue. When the lights go out in November, you'll find me on Razor Bunny.
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On the other hand, if your godmode crashes you in the middle of a fight you at least still have your mez protection with a click-based power. Those with toggle protection are out of luck until after the crash subsides and we can take a breather inpiration.|
Originally Posted by GavinRuneblade
There is another balance issue, which is what drives me into nerd rage over click-based mez resist. If you are dropped, the click power ends and you have to wait for the remaining recharge cycle before you have status protection again. While anyone with toggle protection can just toggle up and go because toggles all recharge faster.
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With experience I've learned about how much I can take on during the time the power is active and try to take full advantage of it. If I do misjudge, which is pretty rare, and it doesn't look like I can finish the fight then I'll try to bail out early... jump and run (my SR is really fast while the godmode is still running), even the GvE pack is a big help if in an outdoor map.
If I used the "panic button" for a truly horrendous battle (like the final mission for Serpent Drummer) then I frequently take a short break afterwards anyway. Get a drink, wash the sweat off my palms, savor the VICTORY, etc... By the time you get back you are good to go. Of course that works best solo but if you need it in a team you are probably the only survivor when all is said and done anyway and you'll have time while the rest return from the hospital.
I usually don't take the melee defensive set T9s, but was curious if you activate one (the ones with detrimental crashes, like unstoppable, elude etc) can you just simply click it off when you are done using it or are you required to wait the full duration of the power? I figure if I could control when it goes down it would allow me to determine the best time to be "at risk". Also, with a power like the electric armor's T9, which has an AE hold associated with the crash, it would allow for the option of locking down a group of minions and possibly some Lts at the expense of a health/end crash and -recovery debuff.
Do the T9s operate in this manner? If not, would it be overpowered to allow for it? Thanks.