Meant to be a brute, but can't stick.

So, I love brutes. There is no doubt about the fact that I love playing brutes. I love fury, I love big damage, and I like the survivability compared to many other archtypes.

However, I cannot find a brute power set combination that has been fitting for me. I've tried a few brutes already, Elec/Shield, SS/WP, SS/EA, DB/WP, and Stone/Stone, yet none of these made me feel very great about them.

I've pushed each of these to 38-50 each and none of them have clicked for me. I've really been wanting to make a very effective farming character for lib and AE, but still be able to mange SFs without feeling like a liability. I really want to have a character that can be highly effective without need for purples, but can later add purples to really peak its performance.

I'm not asking for builds, you can add them if you like they do help, I can, however, make builds on my own. I am pretty handy with Mids. So, what I am asking from the forum community is their takes on powerset combos that will fit those needs and detailed experiences they've had with those combos.

As always, I thank those that take the time to address my concerns. Thank you very much.

What specifically didn't you like about the builds that you tried? My initial reply is that almost any Brute can be effective at what you listed, but it's character concept, design, and implementation that will generally keep you playing a toon.

My Main Brute is a DM/ELA. He was my main before IOs existed in issue 8, he was my main in issue 10, and is still my main. There's amazing synergy in the primary/secondary, but I play him so much because I worked extensively on his costumes and bio while refining his IOs and build. DM provides wicked single target damage with a multi-target Soul Drain, while Lightning Field boosts the set's AoE potential.

My build that receives the most *jaw drop* tells is a WM/SD toon. I went this route initially to have access to a character that could employ the many weapon and shield skins; it's a great way to vary costumes and add variety. The end result, however, is a soft-capped dervish of doom that offers some of the best AoE damage capabilities in the game without being overly FotM.

My final build is a Brute that emphasizes tanking and agro management. This is a DB/Invuln Brute that runs soft-capped smashing/lethal defense and employs Taunt regularly. His secondary theme is accuracy, through stacking ToHit in Invincibility and Blinding Feint.

The builds I've tried are

Claws/SR - Very active combination, claws has all the attacks you need but you can drop some of them for patrons if you want to diversify your damage. If you take aid self you're pretty close to immortal vs everything, if you fit taunt in you can tank most ****, especially with a pain or emp along.

SS/SD - Late bloomer, with its AoEs coming in the early to mid 30s. Heavy endurance use means that pre-stamina is going to involve alot of resting, I got farmed to 22 and I kinda reccomend you do the same. It gets alot better when the AoEs come in, footstomp is some respectable mitigation and great damage. The build doesn't really mature until you get some purples in it though. Its respectable without them, but fully build its an absolute monster.

Another vote for DM/ELA. The heal from DM works really, really well with resist sets, and ELA is ten times better than fire. I have this as a scrapper, and with the IO potential and adding in fighting you can get its alot of fun.

I had a hard time getting into brutes at first as well, what did it for me was my Elec/WP. Leveled quickly and was a lot of fun, after that I've gotten 7 other brutes to 50.

My List of Level 50 Brutes, all fully IO'd

Elec/WP, SS/Fire, SS/WP, Dark/Fire, Dark/Stone, Stone/Energy (Softcapped to all but psi), EM/SR (Softcapped), Fire/Shield (Softcapped)

I wont post builds since you mentioned you're adept with mids. But I only see one of my brutes on my list that you've tried. Any questions on the other builds I listed, feel free to ask.

Thank you for the replies so far.

So far with the builds that I have tried I've ran into the problem of either not like a primary set that I've tried or a secondary with the character. I've also ran into problems where I felt that a character would not reach it's potential without purple sets in its build. As, I currently do not have the means to afford much anything, beyond typical sets with a small assortment of some of the rarer sets, those types of characters really aren't effective to me.

Thus, I'm really attempting to find a brute that can cover all my bases for me and fit a greatly into a farming role and still allow me to remain active in all the endeavors that my friends take on without being a liability to their tasks.

I can say that with super strength, I really enjoyed that set, however the rage crashes could be annoying, but they were managed easily enough. The single target damage was phenominal, but the AoE damage just wasn't enough with footstomp alone. I certainly felt it need a little more to be a compliment to farming. I've considered SS/Fire, but I'm afraid I'm so very unfamiliar with the /fire set and how it plays and what kind of survivabilty it offers in most tasks.

Willpower, this seemed to be a phenominal set as well, however, I did find that in many task that my VG run on a regular basis he was always in danger of dying, speed run LGTFs, speed run ITFs, RSFs, he didn't quite boast the survivability that I saw in the numbers on Mids and he was very well IO'ed. In large groups he was very adept at surviving, but he had trouble holding aggro when it came to him absolutely need to and the rage crashes paired with this set were a little more troublesome fo rme. I know SS/WP is a good pairing, it just simply did not work out for me.

I forgot to mention that I had a Energy Aura brute as well, that set...I don't know what to say about that set other than I have never gotten that set to perform well for me even though I've made several attempts at it. Highly lack luster in my opinion and has not performed well for me.

My Elec/SD brute seemed well enough off other than having pathetically poor single target damage and rather low defense debuff resistances. He managed to survive most situations well, but did rather poorly when it came to vengeance stacking nemesis and large groups of defense debuffing Cimeorians. Perhaps, I would have been better of with SS/SD, but I do not think that the particular combination is going to meet my needs until I have more resources to perfect such a build.

I have been curious as to how ELA performs when paired up with various sets and DM/ELA sounds like a pretty good pairing as I've played DM on a couple of scrappers and found the single target damage to be rather intense, but was more curious as to how it's managed putting out enough AoE damage and how it would survive things like Lib farming, speed run ITFs, and on the RSF.

Well you've already tried the combinations I'd have tried.

SS/WP and ElM/shield are two of the best with a fairly minimal investment (I don't slot purples and not always top flight sets).

ElM/shield I did as a scrapper, and only nemesis and DE gave me a problem. The defence debuff resist issue can be overcome with HOs (your mez prot will take def/rech type HOs and these will enhance your debuff resist, it also stacks with itself) although I haven't bothered. I pwn Cimerorans and have no issues even with the lower scrapper hits. If the lack of ST damage worries you, set to no bosses solo.

To get your big AoEs up faster, footstomp, and thunderstrike love the Force feedback chance of +rech (it doesn't work properly in the teleport attacks).

I did ElM/EA on a stalker and have successfully "tanked" SFs on that. EA is very easy (but not cheap with the kinetic combats) to softcap by the mid 30s.

Also remember that you can seriously up your AoE damage from your epic, so if you've judged a set by the mid 30s, you may be a tad premature (there are some good ST punches in there too).

I'm kindof surprised that you weren't happy with the AoE potential in Super Strength... the Rage crashes are the problem for me, but it's not hard to get Footstomp to a low recharge and with Mu Mastery you can daisy chain Ball Lightning/Electric Fences/Footstomp and substitute in alternating Haymakers and Knockout Blows against bosses.

War Mace has been suggested as an alternative, and if you're not wanting to heavily invest it will get you similar (or better, at lower recharge levels) AoE damage while still retaining a good single target punch. I just dislike how many of the animations change with weapons (including shields) so I avoid them - and if you're number crunching and care about patron AoEs at all then the animation time hurts.

Since you didn't like the ElM/Shield due to the lack of single-target, try a WM/Shield and see how it fares?

Quote:

Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle it has gone from unconscionable to downright appalling that we have no way of measuring our characters' wetness.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brillig It's hard to beat the entertainment value of Whackjob Wednesdays.

So this is going to sound like blasphemy, but I've been farming with my SS/ELA brute lately and I've come to the conclusion that I don't NEED to run RAGE all the time. I've actually started not running rage at all to see how well things move and with lightning field, foot stomp, and dark obliteration, I'm killing fast...very fast without any sort of down time due to rage crashes. I'm not saying it's not needed...but I've discovered (for me) that it's not required to be on ALL the time.

It's actually now got me considering SR for my next SS toon to see how well it can go with only using RAGE for certain fights (bosses and large fights, etc...).

I have a feeling the reason you haven't been liking the sets is that you haven't been happy with the build - not the set.

For example, you grabbed scorp with focused accuracy on a SS brute with rage? Rage already has a to-hit power, and with sets that give accuracy bonuses, you don't really need rage either to hit things (but for damage)

Second, Footstomp is arguably the sole reason why SS is the best AoE set in the game - the excellent recharge time, the mitigation from knockdown, and the large radius all combine for an excellent AoE power. If you want more, go Soul Mastery for Gloom and Dark Obliteration. Gloom is an excellent ST attack (though has a DoT component) and Dark Obliteration will add some AoE.

If you still are unsatisfied, there's SS/SD for shield charge, but it costs a decent amount to make it viable, and even more to be sustainable with the end costs. SS/WP helps avoid this with quick recovery. SS/Elec is always an option, though I've grabbed defense sets for that combo for layered survivability.

I really do think the problem isn't the combos you picked, but how you built them. If you would post your builds, I'm sure we can tweak them (with or without adding purples) to your liking.

Based on what you have said I agree with Twilight Snow. If you have played this many Brutes to the levels you have (instead of speed leveling) then I am confused. What you describe you want and the way you describe playing or how things don't work for you makes me think you want to play a tank.

Going Rouge is coming and that should allow you to play a tank red side. That should put some color on your cheeks. Because I think thats the only thing that will meet your description other than Fury.

In my time I have meet people with Billion INF builds that seem so uber on paper. But to watch the player behind the keys I am amazed at how they play.

Given how flexible the game is or how you built your character that could be the problem your having. Maybe you should show us a few of your builds that you think were good but not quite there. We might be able to help fix it up?

You are right Archlight, I do play tanks on blue side a lot and a handful of scrappers. I like the idea of a brute which seems to be a fusing of tank and scrapper.

Here are a few of the builds I have used and one that I am currently considering for a SS/Fire brute.

Elec/Shield:

Villain Plan by Mids' Villain Designer 1.601
http://www.cohplanner.com/

Click this DataLink to open the build!


SS/WP:

Villain Plan by Mids' Villain Designer 1.601
http://www.cohplanner.com/

Click this DataLink to open the build!

SS/Fire:

Villain Plan by Mids' Villain Designer 1.601
http://www.cohplanner.com/

Click this DataLink to open the build!

If you shift and right click on Ball Lightning, Electric Fences, Blazing Aura, punch, and mu lightning, in the SS/Fire build I have place purple sets for future use.

The biggest problems with the builds are lack of expected performance and endurance issues, which actually seems to be a reoccuring issue with many of my builds. But, I may simply have a hard time with the conversion of the number values to gameplay.

No offense but it sounded like you were a tanker come brute. I play nearly 80% of the time red side and I can spot the Blue side players when I team with them. Brutes are about the SMASH if you understand SMASH then you will not want to tank for the team. It might still happen by virtue of your pursuing Fury and SMASH but its a different mind set. What server are you on?

In looking at your SS/Fire build I see your very concerned with Recharge and getting + damage bonuses. With a very similarly expensive build i think you could still have a lot of recharge (not as much) but have quite a bit of defense something Fire lacks. However 10-18% defense is not going to cut it long run. Its nice to have but you could have a lot more. Either by focusing on typed S/L or by going like Tonality with heavy Melee defense.

+ damage is nice to have but with Fury its not as needed. For my tanks I sure want plus damage. Brutes its nice to have but I focus on still being in the fight so I can continue to SMASH.

I would not get rid of all the + damage everyone likes plus damage. My main has about 10% damage buff and similar recharge. I agree recharge is always good but a lot of things need to hit yah to debuff. They also have to live long enough to make something of the debuffs they do land.

I have a SS/Fire I am about to IO out in the high 30's I will compare to your build and let you know.

Sad to hear red side players asking you to tank.

Ok. Let me see if I can dust off my mind and come up with a few good ideas.

You seem hell bent on trying a SS/Fire. Good, its a fun set. It is also a set that can need careful attention. Before IO's there was really only one or two ways to build a /Fire. You had to have knockback protection, and at that time, you could build towards acrobatics, or you took hover. Most went with acrobatics, and in a tight build already, most were stuck with just Super Jump as their travel power. Hasten was needed to get the recharge up, so that Healing Flames and Consume were back up when you needed them the most.

Now, with IO's, it seems like you have a wealth of possiblities.

You want to build towards a farm build? Great I would suggest building as much fire resists and seting up an AE mission with game supplied baddies that all use fire in their attacks. To do this you make sure to take Temperature Protection. Before IO's I would have skipped this power to make room for more fun stuff. Now, I can stuff a -kb IO in that power, and almost have enough yummy for my survival.

You want more, get Blessing of the Zephyr -kb piece, and the rest of the set and stick that into Combat Jumping, or Super Speed, or any way you want.

Or get the -kb from one of the Resist Sets and stick that into the 3 choices you have for Damage Resistance.

The 2nd idea is more of a question. Do you have any vet attack powers? If you do, or have access to them as an option, I would say, pick up Sands of Mu, and the Ranged attacks. My usual tactic is to use Sands of Mu as my next attack after Rage crashes.

I find, that I "feel" like I am still doing damage, as it hits most of the time, and that the activation time of that power, eats into the 10 second grace period of the rage crash. If I have a few more seconds till my attacks are back to normal, I smack the bosses or annoying mob type with the remaining vet attacks I have. This is also the time I would look to hit Healing Flames as well as Consume. Again eating into the grace period, and is usually when I need one or both.

The pace of running a good SS/Fire is nearly as constant as healling a party of 7 scrappers and blasters with a death wish, using a Empathy Defender. Meaning, the use and timing of powers will keep you busy!

On my 2nd SS/Fire, that I made and built for AE farming, specifically the map with the round room at the end and the nearly endless ambushes. I tried an experiment. I took Handclap, added in procs for damage, and the force feedback proc for recharge. You know, it made me giggle the first time a killed a group of left over mobs with a power that shouldn't do damage!

I run with a fella that uses his SS/Fire on the LGTF, ITF, and RSF. He built him to last and does rather well. Personally. After years of playing my own SS/Fire and having moved onto various other builds, I still find it fun, though in some ways a let down. But, then, I run mine with almost all SO's and the old stand-by of acrobatics!

My list of 50 Brutes, in no particular order and why..kinda

Nrg/Invul....First brute, when CoV was first let loose. Love him and hate him, more so with the changes to Nrg!

SS/Fire..fond memories of all my friends' Fire/SS tanks, but with yummy fury. But something seemed to happen between using SO's and getting IO's and global specials. Suddenly, he is not as tough at before, kinda ticked me off.

DB/WP..made when both sets first came out. Still love the fun of making attack chains that had something to show for it, and grew to love the endless endurance. Really appreciate it after the low blue bar being the kryptonite of the /invulnerable brute

SS/WP...combined the great AoE, with the statis protection that makes me happy. PvP with a SS/Fire before the changes was always fun, in Sirens' particularly, but fear effects are your downfall. /WP fixes that, and the extra endurance, makes for non stop farming! This combo on my 2nd account was why my 1st account now has 34 50s. I kinda use it a lot!!

Axe/WP..Just wanted to use some of the cool weapon skins, and I built this one to never have to redraw his weapon!..kinda fun, if a little squishy!

Stone/Wp..just something to level...like it, but not a lot of time with it!

Elec/Stone...runs if a bit long in the tooth for my tastes, unless you have a /kin to boost you

SS/Stone...copy in reverse of my first Tank...more for theme. I get cranky with it for the simply reason...when the STF first got birthed, most of my friends list wanted me to be the stoner...never let me be anything else...i cried myself to sleep..now..this one is just my red-headed step child.

Elec/SD...hate it, feels squishy

SS/SD...spec'd it out different, like it a lot more.

Fire/Fire..did it to just to do it, not a fan, no way to knockdown, away or stun, me no wants it...not my precious.

Claws/Ela, new favorite toon. Made it for a Superteam of all claws, so much fun its sick!

Elm/Ela..more fun than a barrel of monkies.

Stone/Ela, if i build this one for force feedback proc, I would be a stupidly happy man...

SS/SR. Just for fun and not to bad. Makes me miss my /WP when I play it and run out of endurance.

On test I have a 50 claws/stone. Let me tell you. It is just sick fun to have those two sets together. Almosts makes me want to make test my new home server.

I had an Energy Stalker that I killed for being to pretty. So I have never made a brute with EA. Dark Armor I had on a scrapper, and it just never drew me in, so I have no desire to make a brute.

I could keep going on and on, but my dog is looking at me, saying.."I have been waiting to pee for way to long"..And "lets see if you like it if I bhump your leg for this long!"..so...imma go. Good luck and let us know how it goes.