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whoa back up. So he had numbers that he originally intended that ended up different then was actually implemented? how the heck does that work? Was this one of those powers invented 30 minutes before it was released live? If it wasn't what he wanted then why didn't he take it back to the programers back when it was in test for a month+?|
Originally Posted by Werner
It wasn't THAT huge of a nerf, and he didn't say that he would nerf it. He just gave numbers for what he had originally intended the power to do vs. what it was actually doing, then ran off with a migraine. I'm personally expecting a nerf eventually. This will affect farming. How much remains to be seen.
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This sort of thing seems to happen frequently enough you'd think they would look at new powers about to be released very very carefully, to be sure it was what it should be.
Of course they do! Anything else would be stupid. A new power has to look good or nobody will bother to make a build with it. The news will be, "subpar powerset". Nobody would seriously look at it. SC was the only real reason I tried it. If they make shield charge as weak as some of the other armor based powersets damage powers then might as well use one of the other better armors.
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Not totally disagreeing with you. Personally I think that shield charge was pretty obviously broken from the beginning. But what they do at launch is release thousands of little changes to a database with millions of data points. Each of those changes show up in multiple situations throughout different ATs and used against thousands of different enemies ...not all of which can be tested in a controlled environment and carefully verified prior to launch. Beta testers don't always know the design intent, so they wouldn't know if the damage done by shield charge was a mistake.... they just report back "gee... shield charge does a lot of damage." In fact at launch, shields was considered by many people who used it in BETA to be a "sub-par" set. |
Originally Posted by GhostMaster
whoa back up. So he had numbers that he originally intended that ended up different then was actually implemented? how the heck does that work? Was this one of those powers invented 30 minutes before it was released live? If it wasn't what he wanted then why didn't he take it back to the programers back when it was in test for a month+?
This sort of thing seems to happen frequently enough you'd think they would look at new powers about to be released very very carefully, to be sure it was what it should be. Of course they do! Anything else would be stupid. A new power has to look good or nobody will bother to make a build with it. The news will be, "subpar powerset". Nobody would seriously look at it. SC was the only real reason I tried it. If they make shield charge as weak as some of the other armor based powersets damage powers then might as well use one of the other better armors. |
Ironically, Shield Charge was buffed for scrappers a while back, because it wasn't following the rules of damage relative to the other ATs with the same power. One would assume that change was to fix a different number in the powers database then what the more recent nerf changed.
And as to your suggestion that you think without shield charge, there are better armor sets to use then /shields... the fact that someone now thinks that (right or wrong) is evidence to me that the nerf is taking /shields in the right direction.
I gotta make pain. I gotta make things right. I gotta stop what's comin'. 'Least I gotta try.
This thread was necro'd, and you're reading ancient history. I believe that Shield Charge has long since been nerfed. I barely noticed, but I wasn't farming with one until recently.
Yes, Castle had numbers he originally intended - big damage up close, lower damage further away. When implemented, some mistake was made that put the big damage at the full range. Castle and/or QA didn't notice. Then Castle approved using the AT mods for Shield Charge. But I believe the ended up using the wrong AT as the base, so Scrapper damage went through the roof. Castle apparently wasn't even involved in any numbers checking on that one, so QA fail. Compound error. I'm perfectly willing to believe that they made stupid mistakes instead of that they intentionally tried to lure people in then punch them in the face. Luring people in then punching them in the face is not how you retain customers, and customer retention is about all a really old game like this has. But believe he's a big liarmouth liarmouth if you want. Makes no real difference. What is, is.
It is amusing that Shield Defense was once considered very blah. (Edit: I was in the "blah" camp. Looked OK to me. Nothing special. Shred had the foresight to expect it to become the top set.)
Even with the nerf, it's arguably the top secondary.
"That's because Werner can't do maths." - BunnyAnomaly
"Four hours in, and I was no longer making mistakes, no longer detoggling. I was a machine." - Werner
Videos of Other Stupid Scrapper Tricks
spines recharges quick so you attack quicker than the other 2
I have a spines/fire and a Elec/Shield and the electric shield is just amazing in damage if build right.
My spines/fire is a constant damage monster and great in small compact farms especially with reactive now.
I will have to time and compare them.
To be fair they are both fun, but I prefer the Elec/Shield because of the boom factor and solid defense.
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From what I remember, Shield Charge damage calc went like this. |
Originally Posted by GhostMaster
Castle is a prime example of a dishonest person. He lies a lot. When shields was about to be released live from test, I doubt he said, "Well shield charge is way overpowered but we are going to release it anyway so people can see how cool it is then we will cut its throat later"
It works the way it was designed to and Castle knew how it worked then when they fully tested it. |
Random NCSoft Intern: "Hey Floyd, should I make the AT attributes effect the damage of Shield Charge."
Castle: "But of course, silly intern."
Intern: "OK Mr. Grub."
The Intern then went, copied the Scrapper Damage scaler, and put it in for Shield Charge, for all ATs.
Your character does not have capped defense. Depending on your AT the cap is between 175% - 225%. Your defense is not teal in the combat window, it can go higher. STOP SAYING IT IS CAPPED! The correct term is Soft Cap.
I enjoy playing in Mids. I specialize in Melee Characters, other AT's usually bore me.
How do you farm with a Fire/SD? I can't even do 53x8 lethal ambushes because eventualyl enough dmg from bosses get through and drops me more than I have greens. I'm softcapped in all positions and have 35% resist to s/l
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I didn't read the thread, so hopefully I'm not missing important context, but I have no problem farming on my Fire/Shield. First, you should really be farming on +0 if you're farming drops. I don't, though. I farm at +2 or +3x8. As I recall, +3 gives me a rhythm I like, which is to say that Shield Charge is ready to go on every spawn instead of every other spawn, but maybe it was +2. Hmmm, now I think it WAS +2, but with the level shift it's now +3. Charge in throwing a fire ball, fire sword circle once positioned between the two bosses, hit one boss with fire sword and greater fire sword, hit the other with fire sword, build up, shield charge, fire ball, fire sword circle, attack chain to finish off bosses, move to next spawn. The bosses can hit hard, but the greens drop much faster than I take damage in general.|
Originally Posted by Dz131
How do you farm with a Fire/SD? I can't even do 53x8 lethal ambushes because eventualyl enough dmg from bosses get through and drops me more than I have greens. I'm softcapped in all positions and have 35% resist to s/l
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I can see how if I added ambushes to the +3x8, it MIGHT get a little ugly, so maybe our experiences aren't that much different. I just farm without ambushes.
Soft cap, 33% smashing/lethal, 1940 hit points, no heal.
"That's because Werner can't do maths." - BunnyAnomaly
"Four hours in, and I was no longer making mistakes, no longer detoggling. I was a machine." - Werner
Videos of Other Stupid Scrapper Tricks
Ambush farms require a bit more mitigation than old school farms as you have the aggro cap of mobs wailing consistently on you, and by the end of the run the ones left standing are the bosses.
Merely being softcapped with 35% S/L res won't do the trick in my experience. Then again, on alphashifted level 50s I farm on +4/x8 only, as powerleveling is my goal and tickets an afterthought ; your mileage might vary on lower difficulty or bosses off.
I like to cap resistances with oranges and use Rebirth +regen, converting the insps left to reds. If you don't have Rebirth +regen, balancing oranges, greens and reds can do the trick, although I found the process clunky enough to significantly lower speed. My bind-fu is weak however, it's possible that if you set it up right it could be smooth.
I run ambush farms sometimes on my EM/SD scrapper and I don't run at +4, even alpha shifted, I think I only do +3. I don't have rebirth yet either. My fire/shield scrapper build is now all but complete and I should be able to do exactly the same things with her... but yeah, +4/8 would be very difficult on either of them.
But I do okay otherwise. No heals, unless you count the Panacea proc.
my lil RWZ Challenge vid
^Professional Katana/regen build thread