Free Anti-virus Software
By
Aggelakis,
Posted on: 2009-08-25 09:55 in ALL ACCESS Gameplay Technical Issues Bugs
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I didn't backpedal squat. I said I saw it on one site, went looking, and found confirmation. And no, it was not a site with an ulterior motive.|
Originally Posted by F_M_J
Interesting, how you went from a very definitive statement, then back pedaled to information you saw on one site, but don't remember which site. Probably a site advertising, or one that supports, a malware or spyware program.
Sorry, but this is less than convincing. |
I wasn't trying to convince you of anything and I don't care if you believe me or not. I was describing circumstances to the best of my recollection. Feel free to take that as a statement that my memory is faulty and all my comments should be ignored.
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Oh, and this comes awfully close to putting words in my mouth and claiming that I suggested people not bother with anti-virus. My exact words were:|
Originally Posted by F_M_J
While I do agree that stopping the infection before it even occurs would be ideal, this sadly is not always possible. That is where a proven and reliable AV product comes into play. To not have one is just asking for trouble.
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"By all means, install AVG (I use it). For malware, SpyBotSD and AdAware are both on my computer."
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I'm with you Ironblade. I don't trust my AV to detect new, unknown (as in nothing in the AV signature file). However I do trust it to detect those that are known but I still run a full, all drives, all files, AV scan once a week.
Too many people in my opinion believe that once they have an AV package loaded they are safe. Too many don't realize they only got a 90 day trial edition or simply assume that no intervention is needed on their part to guarantee that the package is fully up to date.
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An excellent tool for keeping your system clean is GMER - Rootkit Detector and Remover from http://www.gmer.net
I've used it to clean a rootkit from a system that was so infected, it wouldn't even let you install or run every a/v and spyware scanner I tried. GMER didn't even have to run a scan for it to find the rootkit, it was found automatically!
Right now I've been running the free Comodo antivirus and it seems to be doing its job of nagging me every time something wants to write to a suspicious directory. Not sure how beginner friendly it is, but I certainly feel protected from trojans modifying my system.
I would say that there is no one tool that will protect you. The layered approach, as mentioned previously, is the only way to go.
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I don't see how that is anything near "putting words in your mouth" I was simply making a statement. No where did I say "You said..." "Like Ironblade said..." etc or anything. I only said to not have one was asking for trouble, which in fact would support your statement if anything. Sorry, but you are not the center of attention, everything is not always about you.|
Originally Posted by Ironblade
Oh, and this comes awfully close to putting words in my mouth and claiming that I suggested people not bother with anti-virus. My exact words were:
"By all means, install AVG (I use it). For malware, SpyBotSD and AdAware are both on my computer." |
As for the backpedaling comment, perhaps that was not the right word. I just founf it amusing how you went from
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| Many security experts are moving toward the opinion that most AV and malware software simply don't cut it because they are reactive and, in many cases, it's already too late. |
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I read that on a security site, was skeptical, and found the same basic opinion expressed elsewhere. If I remembered where I had seen it, I'd post a link. But I don't... |
I don't know why you are even arguing with me, we are essentially saying the same thing. I just feel it is more important than you do, but we both advocate using them.
It all started by me asking for some evidence to support a rather bold and seemingly unlikely statement which, despite your smiley faces and dismissive comments, still has not been proven or supported so I will just drop it and hope an uninformed person reading this post at least gets the point that he should have and use an AV solution supported by at least some kind of malware/spyware utility.
The computer service/sales shop I work at uses AVG and MalwareBytes, and occasionally Advanced SystemCare. For the few times we've had customers request some sort of web filter, we've found K9 has worked just fine, though it is a bit stringent.
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Interesting, since nearly, if not all, "free" products state specifically that they are not to be used in a commercial environment.|
Originally Posted by macskull
The computer service/sales shop I work at uses AVG and MalwareBytes, and occasionally Advanced SystemCare. For the few times we've had customers request some sort of web filter, we've found K9 has worked just fine, though it is a bit stringent.
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Not sure why people are even still using AVG when it is clearly not the best product. It is consistanly behind Avira and Avast in testing, how it manages to even stay in the top 3 confuses me. Must be the power of advertising, because it sure isn't on performance.
I use Avira AntiVir Personal Free edition (and you can easily disable the popup that some people whine about) and love it. It is very fast scanning and light on resources.
Here are some articles of interest.
http://www.techsupportalert.com/best...s-software.htm
http://antivirus.about.com/od/antivi...a/freeav_2.htm
http://www.pcworld.com/article/17067..._software.html
I would have to agree.
Apart from real time monitoring programs, relying on an anti-virus program to catch infections before they do damage is missing the point. By the time the anti-virus scan is run, the virus has already done damage.
Hardware firewall + anti-virus with real time monitoring + software firewall to monitor outbound connections is probably the most effective approach to catching things before they do damage.
No one thing is a solution anymore.
The path of least resistance for me is actually Microsofts Security Essentials:
http://www.softpedia.com/get/Antivir...sentials.shtml
Free for corporate use as well.
It fills my line item 'have Antivirus' checkbox.
More self protection comes from not using IE6-7, switching to IE8 OR even better using Firefox / Google Chrome.
Even more significant and or extra protection can be had by using DropMyRights and NoScript.
http://download.cnet.com/DropMyRight...-10722877.html
I am in complete agreement with Ironblade, desktop AV is significantly depreciated to the point of being useless against todays zero day polymorphic virus/trojan/phishing/social engineering attacks.
I prefer to stick with proven top tier products, and not just settle for whatever "fills my line item". There is a considerable difference between quality in AV products in both wild detection, and known detections.
If you use IE in ANY form you are at greater risk than if you used Firefox, Chrome or even Opera and Safari.
AV's, good AV's, are far from useless against zero day virii/trojans, etc. Heuristic analysis can make a good bit of difference, and is quite capable of catching previously unknown viruses. No, it's not perfect, and does give false positives but the engines are improving along with the newer viruses and detection is only getting better and more accurate.
Viruses, trojans, phishing and social engineering don't belong in the same category. The last 2 rely on human stupidity rather than exploiting any vulnerabilities in any software.
There is no program that will protect you from Social Engineering, and it only takes common sense to be protected from phishing.
I also use Secunia PSI for keeping software up to date. Many people have things like Quicktime, Real Player, Adobe Reader/Flash Player etc on their PCs but rarely keep them up to date which can make them a weak point regarding security.
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Maybe if you spent less time attacking everyone and their mother when they share their opinions/views, you wouldn't have to waste so much energy. I mean really, who the flip cares if a commercial entity is using something designed for personal use. Who are you to decide whether that's acceptable or not?|
Originally Posted by F_M_J
Useless information
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How about sticking to the topic and helping the OP?
On that note:
I use Avast or AntiVir and highly recommend them. I steer clear of AVG. Too many issues.
We'll see....
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Of course there will always be variations in quality of software. That is the whole purpose behind VB100 and other testing sites.|
Originally Posted by Hugginator
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Also of note is the large number of programs that passed. The ones that failed are little known, or poor quality programs anyway.
The ones that passed are ones I would expect to, Avira and Kaspersky among them.
Among the failures, Symantec...huge surprise! /sarcasm off
(Note: The testing was done on Vista)
Sorry, you came into this thread and rudely accused someone of lying basically, then being rude to other people and throwing your internet weight around as if what you spout should be taken as gospel.
Even going so far as to harangue the OP who politely asked FOR people's opinions on what decent internet/computer security would be.
Please stop posting your self-righteous and indignant arguments. Let the thread be an 'OPINIONATED' base for the different kinds of security out there and the way people use it.
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Everything posted in this thread is opinion and should be taken as such. however, I would like to see proof of this claim as i find it rather ridiculous. |
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| Interesting, how you went from a very definitive statement, then back pedaled to information you saw on one site, but don't remember which site. |
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| Catwhoorg - using "Patch Day" for windows to compare vulnerabilities to the ineffectiveness of an AV product is pretty silly. Completely different things, that is like saying the space shuttle has technical difficulties there for my Honda might not be safe to drive. |
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| just seems odd to go from a definitive statement very exactly stated, to one that, at least appears to be, filled with conjecture. |
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| It all started by me asking for some evidence to support a rather bold and seemingly unlikely statement which, despite your smiley faces and dismissive comments, still has not been proven or supported so I will just drop it and hope an uninformed person reading this post at least gets the point that he should have and use an AV solution supported by at least some kind of malware/spyware utility. |
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| Interesting, since nearly, if not all, "free" products state specifically that they are not to be used in a commercial environment. |
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| I prefer to stick with proven top tier products, and not just settle for whatever "fills my line item". |
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Originally Posted by F_M_J
Of course there will always be variations in quality of software. That is the whole purpose behind VB100 and other testing sites.
Also of note is the large number of programs that passed. The ones that failed are little known, or poor quality programs anyway. The ones that passed are ones I would expect to, Avira and Kaspersky among them. Among the failures, Symantec...huge surprise! /sarcasm off (Note: The testing was done on Vista) |
The point to get from this wasn't that there was differing qualities of AV software, it was instead that the very very best AV software was only ~95% effective on the most recent known Virus on the reactive (after its known and the definitions are downloaded), and the very very very best AV software was only ~79% effective on the proactive (heuristics etc) emerging unknown viruses.
If its not stopping 99.9-100% let alone just 99.0% considering that there are 30-100 new viruses every day, its not doing a good enough job and more significant protections are needed including not running as admin, having control over scripting, changing email and browsing habits, staying patched, etc etc etc, virus writers have always had the upper hand in this battle, now they are really making use of it, sitting back and pretending that your AV will protect you will get you rooted.
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Ah, so asking someone for some evidence to back up a statement is calling them a liar?|
Originally Posted by Lime_Jello
Sorry, you came into this thread and rudely accused someone of lying basically, then being rude to other people and throwing your internet weight around as if what you spout should be taken as gospel.
Even going so far as to harangue the OP who politely asked FOR people's opinions on what decent internet/computer security would be. Please stop posting your self-righteous and indignant arguments. Let the thread be an 'OPINIONATED' base for the different kinds of security out there and the way people use it. |
I do back up my opinions with factual data and links to respected sites backing up my claims. If this means "throwing my internet weight around" then so be it.
I never once "harangued" the OP, and in fact contributed quite a bit of information regarding various AV services and their reliability.
As for your comment on me letting this be an thread on opinions, err...my very first post backed that up saying everything in this thread was opinion, which obviously includes me but thanks.
Thanks for the string of quotes of my OPINIONS taken out of context and then not given any narrative, not sure what your point was there.
If you wish to attack me personally in a thread which you were not originally involved in and does not contain any relevant information to the topic, please PM it to me so you don't derail this thread more than you already have, thanks.
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The VB100 logo signifies that It detects all In the Wild viruses during both on-demand and on-access scanning, and it generates no false positives when scanning a set of clean files. So, in my opinion, using a product with this logo is the best idea.|
Originally Posted by Hugginator
The point to get from this wasn't that there was differing qualities of AV software, it was instead that the very very best AV software was only ~95% effective on the most recent known Virus on the reactive (after its known and the definitions are downloaded), and the very very very best AV software was only ~79% effective on the proactive (heuristics etc) emerging unknown viruses.
If its not stopping 99.9-100% let alone just 99.0% considering that there are 30-100 new viruses every day, its not doing a good enough job and more significant protections are needed including not running as admin, having control over scripting, changing email and browsing habits, staying patched, etc etc etc, virus writers have always had the upper hand in this battle, now they are really making use of it, sitting back and pretending that your AV will protect you will get you rooted. |
I totally agree with you that the efficacy of these products is much lower than we would all want. I just feel that having 95% chance is much better than 0%. I follow just about the same security procedures you have listed in the past, and yes I have been pretty much virus free for over a decade. But, there have been the lucky few that have gotten through and my AV has caught it before it caused any irreparable damage.
The problem I believe may not necessarily be with the lack of ability of the AV programs, but may be the fact that the vast chunk of the computer using population doesn't have ANY av solution running, or are still using the 90 day demo that came with their computers long after the 90 days have expired and they still think they are protected.
Obviously the above category does not include anyone from these forums, but I was shocked to find out just how many computers there are without any form of protection on them. I sure hope MS gets the go ahead to put their Microsoft Security Essentials bundled with new pc's, but i feel they won't be able to thanks to Symantec and McAfee paying vendors to pu their rubbish bundled on computers instead.
Well, this was a useful thread. Not so much anymore.
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Originally Posted by Catwhoorg
general replies:
Back-ups ? Thats a discussion I will be having with them (AGAIN). If it costs, I can see zero positive response, and I'll be bashing my head against a brick wall. Personally I have automatic backups for my documents over the web. Software I can re-install and dont particularly care about. Photos and the like are my precious things. Thanks for the pointers folks, and keep em coming. |
To point this at least a little closer to the OP, anyone ever have any luck convincing someone they need to do this when they are not prone to. I've mentioned this many times to people who are having issues, or have suffered data loss, and can count on one finger those that have started to back stuff up. Went so far as to get my mother a "1 touch" external drive for backups a year ago, and to the best of my knowledge the only backup was the one I did when I installed it.
And as far as software goes, I found a nifty little tool a couple of years ago for XP called Startup Monitor. Resides in memory after its installed with a minimal footprint and throws up a warning anytime something tries to edit the registry, asking if you want to allow it. No idea if it's available for Vista or Win 7 though.
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In summary, most everything I was about to say has already been said by the brilliant minds here, but just in case your just joining us lets recap
The number one product I run in my shop is malwarebytes, theres nothing out now that it cant remove, to help keep a computer protected from future attacks its always good to an antivirus like AVG free. its the best free one out.
To help protect your important data you have to options, onsite backup, or offsite. Both work the same, offsite theres normally a charge. mozy will give you 2GB free. but I'd buy an external HD case and buy your own HD, thats normally cheaper then a mybook.
k-9 is great to keep your kids safe and its hard to crack, but I've had to before. But one thing i haven't seen here in the forums yet is opendns.com
not only can you control your whole networks security, its impossible to crack when setup correctly.
hopefully I've helped a few people out and answered some questions. In any case, good luck and stay thirsty my friends 
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Except, it's actually not. It does seem to stay in the top 5 however. Currently the ones that are consistently fighting for first place are Avira and Avast. | ...an antivirus like AVG free. its the best free one out. |
AVG is a fair program and is definitely better than nothing.
If I remembered where I had seen it, I'd post a link. But I don't, so I can't and don't feel like trying to track it down again. Feel free to regard it as ridiculous and ignore it and/or me. I promise not to be offended.
Sorry, but this is less than convincing.
While I do agree that stopping the infection before it even occurs would be ideal, this sadly is not always possible. That is where a proven and reliable AV product comes into play. To not have one is just asking for trouble.
Personally, I have had very few infections, luckily each one was stopped by Avira AntiVir and cleaned with no impact to my system.
Catwhoorg - using "Patch Day" for windows to compare vulnerabilities to the ineffectiveness of an AV product is pretty silly. Completely different things, that is like saying the space shuttle has technical difficulties there for my Honda might not be safe to drive.