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I just wish people would show as much enthusiasm to forming PA drop teams, mito-clearing teams and generally showing up with enough controllers as you do with GM-team.. 
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Exactly.
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I've got to agree with the above. I have to travel to attend the raids, cause my dial up wont hack it. I cant see a long list of people turning up for a raid on here, just a team turning up for the GMs. Its a concern alright, a two or three page list of "I'll be there" and "Bringing my controller" would put my mind at ease much more than knowing if someone greifs the raid we'd have it covered. If there's no raiders to protect there's no need for a GM team
"Well, they found my diary today.
They were appropriately appalled
at the discovery of the eight victims
They're now putting it all together.
Women wrapped in silk
with one leg missing
Eight legs, one body, silk,
spider, brilliant!"
The mito part of the raid is a lot more fun than GM watching. On at least two raids where OotCS provided the GM team, no GM aggro'd. Result - 8 bored people watching the clearing phase, well 7 anyway, Abu kept doing the super speed around the goo to make sure there were no GM's coming close. So he ended up dizzy instead of bored!!
If I have the choice, I'll go for the mitos everytime. Just need to stock up on some new jokes for the hold phase 
[B]Order of the Cruciform/Crucified Swords[/B] - [B]Defiant[/B]
50's - Tridento (claws/invul scrapper), Robo Medic MkIV (empath/rad defender), Entrino (dark/dark defender) & Captain Wombat (thugs/traps mastermind)
[I]@EU-Cambo[/I]
Ok... Ok... so what exactly are you guys suggesting I do then? Scrap a monster patrol, hope for the best and have 8 extra people for the mito? (Not a rant, just a straightforward question)
If I may, and I know I have no right commenting on Defiants raid strategy as your raid organisation is different to ours on Union.
The Perimeter Guard teams still take part in mito clearing on Union, but we keep an eye out where we can on GM's and are the first to attack any aggro'd targets GM wise during mito clearing.
After which, during the brawl and hold stages of Hami, thats when we stand watch. Please note, stand watch!
If and IF anything does attack, we alert the raid and intercept them as quickly as possible, so that the controller groups ISNT endangered.
As long as your GM team is defensive, not agressive and is happy to be bored some raids ( i'd be happy to stand there bored every night of the week to watch the backs of my friends, but were not that lucky ) then great, a GM team might help you guys.
One thing I would ask, even if you dont run a GM team.
Please please please keep an eye out for a GM counterattack after the Bud drop on the raid, if nothing else, consider evacuating as many hero's that want to swap HO's to pocket d or somewhere else to do so.
Captain - if you want im still happy to send you any data we get from our raids GM wise to compare to yours!
In-game and now on Twitter @Tsumiju Zero "The Nightmare of Dra'Gon"
"The flow of battle can only be influenced, not by realtime tactics, but by strategy."
Proud resident of the Union EU Server.
B.A.F. Trial Guide
I still don't get why you're reporting regular GM aggro after a bud spawn, I've never noticed that on Defiant or Freedom in the US. =\
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I still don't get why you're reporting regular GM aggro after a bud spawn, I've never noticed that on Defiant or Freedom in the US. =\
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It's new. it only happened for the first time on the last Union hami-raid (I beleive, correct me if i'm wrong) and it's not completely known as to *why* it happened. it could have been an accidental pull by a player or the GM may have been changed so they react to the death of their Lord & Master.
Better safe than splattered into goo
Defiant 50: Blonde Justice inv/ss; Lady Aminta emp/elec; Sierra Colt merc/traps; Tess LaCoyle elec/elec (blaster); Powerstorm elec/elec (brute);
Union 50: @Steel Dancer WP/DB; Blast Pulse Fire/Rad (corr); Bitter Twilight Earth/Psi (dom); Compassionate Emp/Psi;
Freedom 50: Incandescent Blaze ElecAm/Fire;
@Cap Alpha
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Ok... Ok... so what exactly are you guys suggesting I do then? Scrap a monster patrol, hope for the best and have 8 extra people for the mito? (Not a rant, just a straightforward question)
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Don't get me wrong mate...I'm not telling you to do anything. This is yours and HHs raid so you do it exactly as you want.
My personal opinion and experience from raids is that it's not needed and will only add to confusion and misguided belief that people other than the designated team should be taunting/helping/debuffing etc any GMs close or far away from Hami.
@TsumijuZero
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If I may, and I know I have no right commenting on Defiants raid strategy as your raid organisation is different to ours on Union.
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You're using our guide.
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The Perimeter Guard teams still take part in mito clearing on Union, but we keep an eye out where we can on GM's and are the first to attack any aggro'd targets GM wise during mito clearing.
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A Hamiraid is all about keeping it simple. Can't exactly say Union follows that rule.
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After which, during the brawl and hold stages of Hami, thats when we stand watch. Please note, stand watch!
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The controller brawl phase always makes me chuckle 
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If and IF anything does attack, we alert the raid and intercept them as quickly as possible, so that the controller groups ISNT endangered.
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We're on TS. Keeps everything simpler and faster. Telling someone to sort a possible GM situation works fine there without having to shout on broadcast so people will panic, start attacking GMs all over and maybe fail the raid (if during the holdphase anyway)
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One thing I would ask, even if you dont run a GM team.
Please please please keep an eye out for a GM counterattack after the Bud drop on the raid, if nothing else, consider evacuating as many hero's that want to swap HO's to pocket d or somewhere else to do so.
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As Extremus said. I've never ever seen this happen. If this supposedly was after the last Union raid (last friday right?) I was there, killed buds till everything was clear...went on to kill a GM which was minding it's own business and then logging...no "massive GM attack" in sight.
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CRACK68:
"The origin of life wasn't planned either, should all life be declared a bug and wiped out?"
Lionsbane:
"You know me.Ever the realist"
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As Extremus said. I've never ever seen this happen. If this supposedly was after the last Union raid (last friday right?) I was there, killed buds till everything was clear...went on to kill a GM which was minding it's own business and then logging...no "massive GM attack" in sight.
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Archy, you may want to check out this thread:
http://uk.boards.cityofheroes.com/showfl...p;vc=1&nt=6
Seems to me that you got out just in time...
Defiant 50: Blonde Justice inv/ss; Lady Aminta emp/elec; Sierra Colt merc/traps; Tess LaCoyle elec/elec (blaster); Powerstorm elec/elec (brute);
Union 50: @Steel Dancer WP/DB; Blast Pulse Fire/Rad (corr); Bitter Twilight Earth/Psi (dom); Compassionate Emp/Psi;
Freedom 50: Incandescent Blaze ElecAm/Fire;
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Ok... Ok... so what exactly are you guys suggesting I do then? Scrap a monster patrol, hope for the best and have 8 extra people for the mito? (Not a rant, just a straightforward question)
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My thoughts are to still have a designated GM team, but rather then all 8 waiting to one side a couple could be outside the goo patrolling. When they see danger they can alert their team and take care of the GM, then return to 2 patrolling, 6 helping with mitos. I think it's simple enough, and provided the GM team leader is on TS then communication is straightforward with the rest of the raid.
My post was just to alert people to the fact that being on the GM team does not necessarily mean a night of action fighting GM's.
At the end of the day, I'm happy to use my scrapper where best needed, or directed, by the leaders.
[B]Order of the Cruciform/Crucified Swords[/B] - [B]Defiant[/B]
50's - Tridento (claws/invul scrapper), Robo Medic MkIV (empath/rad defender), Entrino (dark/dark defender) & Captain Wombat (thugs/traps mastermind)
[I]@EU-Cambo[/I]
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My thoughts are to still have a designated GM team, but rather then all 8 waiting to one side a couple could be outside the goo patrolling. When they see danger they can alert their team and take care of the GM, then return to 2 patrolling, 6 helping with mitos. I think it's simple enough, and provided the GM team leader is on TS then communication is straightforward with the rest of the raid.
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A very good suggestion. Have people appointed to the team should the need arise, have couple scouts and listen to the TS and raidleaders in case of problems. Other than that, keep with the Mito-clearers.
The most crucial part where we'd need the GM team to rescue us from griefers is the controlling phase anyway.
PS. The capabilities of the PA team is in reverse relation to how many times me and my empaths will faceplant during the raid, so I'd like to see some enthusiasm for forming up PA team too. Imo its the most important factor after having enough controllers. (these days lots of people have troller alts which they switch into when control phase starts, so I guess thats why ahvent had many problems on that department recently.)
Generalissimo, are you in?
Thats the first ever time I have heard about something like that.. I ve been to.. I dont remember how many hami raids, and never have we had GM aggro that was not player originated.. Maybe its a new change, maybe not.
@archy - we are using your guide, but in the last few weeks our tacics have changed a little bit, but in the mainstay my comment was merely pointing out that I havn't done a raid on Defiant and as such the way youts teams run and so forth is probably a bit different.
@Hammerfall - we noticed the GM thing for 2 raids now, the first time, we noticed several GM's move in, but I will admit that a couple of players went GM hunting, so while we kept them off the people swapping, there was player involvement and we didnt think too much of it until it was mentioned in chat that some of those GM's wern't anywhere near players. The next time we did stay in place on the raid, because we wanted to try and provide the same defence for everyone swapping
During that time, the perimeter teams didnt spot anyone near the GM's, yet the swapping party was attached shortly afterwards.
We dont know why but i dont like putting things down to conincidence if there is a chance its a new change that we dont know about.
I'd rather you guys kept your eyes open and me be wrong that me be right and you guys suffering massive casualties!
In-game and now on Twitter @Tsumiju Zero "The Nightmare of Dra'Gon"
"The flow of battle can only be influenced, not by realtime tactics, but by strategy."
Proud resident of the Union EU Server.
B.A.F. Trial Guide
It might be that we clear the Hive pretty quickly afte Hami has gone down.. I don't know.
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Generalissimo, are you in?
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I've never missed a raid it was possible for me to attend and I don't intend to start now I don't know what time I'll be turning up though; it might be just before the start or it might be the full hour beforehand.
Defiant 50�s: Generalissimo, Righteous Bob, Splortch, Brutus Cayuga
Union 50's: Chimera Obscura, Diet Anthracite, Grim Proctologist, Puny Little Minion, Raging Bitumen
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Hammerfall, count me in on the tank heal team with Cunundrum. Was great fun last time.
Defiant:
Cunundrum, Defender (Generic Supergroup 101)
Other servers too.
New Global: @cunundrumEU
Count me and my Nebula team in 
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Ok... Ok... so what exactly are you guys suggesting I do then? Scrap a monster patrol, hope for the best and have 8 extra people for the mito? (Not a rant, just a straightforward question)
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Right, I feel I have to apologise for this; last night after going through this thread countless times, and returning to the drawing board about whether a patrol is needed, I just made myself more stressed out than needed. However, after giving it alot of thought, I've decided that the monster patrol will still operate in place. I have my reasons, and I'm more than glad to share them with you.
Firstly, anyone who says that everyone who turns up in the Hive to participate in the actual raid appropriately is wrong... very wrong. I've seen many, many times dozens of heroes who just turn up to the raid, and float about while the rest of the people are doing an excellent job. I don't think many people have commented on this factor before; but in my opinion, the people that aren't where they are supposed to be are a security threat.
Secondly, while I realise that a monster patrol may just be more hassle than it's worth; it could be useful, not just to protect raiders whilst they are in the mito/holding/tanking etc, but the transition of groups in and out of the jelly could lead to the monsters being aggro'd. This is just an assumption, something I will monitor with my team whilst the raid is going on.
The monster patrol will stand, needed or un-needed. I'll make the descision whether it's needed again myself if I ever decide to put together another raid.
Will be there with mchackalot.
I should be able to bring Steampunkette along for some Mito bashing.
I'll be on for my first hami raid with Cryostasis, lvl 50 ice/energy tank.
I'll be there Cap if you need a hand with anything.
Defiant's GoEH/MILITIS METUS
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I'll be there Cap if you need a hand with anything.
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Thanks Chels All help is very appreciated; well 3 days to go till the raid, I think everything is looking good so far as numbers of people attending are concerned.
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a two or three page list of "I'll be there" and "Bringing my controller" would put my mind at ease much more than knowing if someone greifs the raid we'd have it covered.
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I'll try and do my bit - Slavegirl (50 spine/regen scraptastic lady) should be there barring RL getting in the way
just logged out after tonights raid on Union and there was definately a GM counterattack, this time one after the Mito's were eliminated, and a further one after Hami himself took a dive!!!
please guys, be prepared!
In-game and now on Twitter @Tsumiju Zero "The Nightmare of Dra'Gon"
"The flow of battle can only be influenced, not by realtime tactics, but by strategy."
Proud resident of the Union EU Server.
B.A.F. Trial Guide
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Thing is....lot of people will think "oh...I'd better help that GM team...Oh I'd better taunt that GM away from Hami...Oh what's that team doing over there?" etc....and suddenly you have way too much GM attention because people wont do what the raidleader tells them....even if they think they're helping.
The best route imo would be to have 1-3 tanks patrolling the area and taunting any GMs that would be coming too near the raiders.
Some background from the raids we've done:
We always had a few people from OotCS to keep an eye out for troublemakers and GMs. We never told anyone because of the reasons above.
At one point we more or less decided that this was basically a waste of good raiders so OotCS joined in instead and all was good.
The night came where we had 2 certain people at the raid (who's names I've pm'd Cap Alpha) and it failed because of GM aggro. We still don't know if 1 of these people was the cause of said aggro or if it was another player or team intent on griefing the raid or maybe just unintentional aggro from a random player.
Ever since that incident people have been more concerned about patrolling for GMs than the actual raid....which is a bad development imo.
Concentrate about doing the actual Hamiraid and maybe keep a few scouts out and you will do fine.
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That is a very fair point Archy, and I do agree with you. But I don't think people are actually more concerned with monster patrol than the actual raid. It's still more of a side issue I'd say. Perhaps just having a few tanks would be the more sensible option. As you mentioned though about "oh...I'd better help that GM team...Oh I'd better taunt that GM away from Hami...Oh what's that team doing over there?" etc, I think that if the message to stay away at all costs from the monster patrol is put across on local, B'cast and request once outside the hive, and a reminder when everyone is inside, the message should be clear. I'll admit last time there was major problems from random non-monster patrol people gathering them up without consent from me (I was very very stressed at that point). Perhaps if me and HH do a 2nd raid later on, we'll revise some of these tactics, but I always want to make sure that bringing Hamidon down in the proper form always remains the main priority.