auto turret less useful in I8


Amazing_Shnyet

 

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But as said its definately not pvp "duel" friendly

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PvP duels in CoX are not balanced and probably cannot be balanced, so that doesn't really matter

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Some people are just asking for the /dev set to be more balanced for pvp, not balanced with every set.


He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.

 

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I like Time Bomb, I find it useful, tbh I'd rather they got rid of taser or auto-turret for Build-Up. Devices may not be in your face all out damage, but I like it. I do agree it needs buffing however, the devs need to look at making the set more desireable.

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I'm for keeping Auto-Turret, as I mainly use it to curb an AV's regen rate, but I really want the ability to TP back, as AVs have a habit of moving.


 

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You don't need time bomb, does anyone here who is /dev use timebomb?

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I still use it for the odd giggle in PvP, more for my own amusement than anything else. It takes a certain level of skill to be able to TeleBomb people, and I like to keep my eye in, even though it's 90% useless.

If I had my way, these are the changes I would make (original existing text is blue, my alterations are red):

Devices

Web Grenade
Upon impact, the Web Grenade expels a strong, tenuous, and very sticky substance that can Immobilize most targets. This non-lethal device deals no damage and does not prevent targets from attacking, although their attack rate is Slowed. The Web can bring down flying entities and halts jumping.
Recharge: Fast
Available at level: 1
Changes: NONE, well-balanced as is.

Caltrops
You toss a handful of Caltrops at a targeted location and spread the tiny metal spikes over a large area. Any villains that pass over the Caltrops will be forced to move at a slower rate. They will also take some trivial Lethal damage over time.
Damage: Minor (DoT), Recharge: Slow
Available at level: 2
Changes: NONE, well-balanced as is.

Taser Dart
The Taser Dart is a basically an airborne stun-gun. This small device releases a high-voltage, low-amperage electrical charge that can Disorient most opponents with minimal damage at range.
Damage: Minor, Recharge: Slow
Available at level: 4
Changes: Turns Taser from melee to range - there is NOTHING in the Devices secondary that makes it effective in melee, let's face facts. If you're going to have a "different" secondary, you might as well make it really different. Also change the animation to the tech origin temp power animation.

Targeting Drone
When this small device is activated, the small Targeting Drone hovers around your head and emits targeting laser sights. The lasers can dramatically improve your Accuracy and Damage and increase your Perception, allowing you to better see stealthy foes. Targeting Drone also grants you resistance to powers that DeBuff your Accuracy. This is a toggle power and must be activated and deactivated manually. Like all toggle powers, while active, the Targeting Drone drains Endurance.
Recharge: Slow
Available at level: 10
Changes: TD had half its functionality (the ability to slot more damage in your primary) massively reduced without recompense after ED. In order to make up for the loss of Build Up, I suggest a +35-50% DAM boost whenever TD is activated - allowing for better damage over time, as opposed to better burst damage.

Tear Gas
The Tear Gas envelops all those in the affected area in a cloud of acrid smoke. Most villains will not be able to see past normal melee range, although some may have better perception. If the villains are attacked, they will be alerted to your presence, but will suffer a penalty to Accuracy. Additionally, some foes may be rendered unable to act for a short period of time.
Recharge: Slow
Available at level: 16
Changes: Increased Acc debuff, as it isn't stackable by the same player; Increased range, mobs at high levels have far more range than the Player Character; Additional 50% chance to disorient/hold minions (Mag1) for 10 seconds. Basically, make this power worth taking again.

Cloaking Device
The Cloaking Device allows you to use an LCD body coating, becoming invisible. While Cloaked you cannot be seen at even very close range. If you attack while Cloaked, you will be discovered. Even if discovered, you are hard to see and have a bonus to Defense. Unlike some stealth powers, the Cloaking Device has no movement penalty.
Recharge: Slow
Available at level: 20
Changes: Change CD from Stealth to Invis, basically turning it into Sup Invis for Devices. Increase Endurance Cost appropriately.

Trip Mine
You can place a Trip Mine on the ground. Any villains that pass near the Trip Mine will cause it to explode, severely damaging all nearby foes and sending them flying. The Trip Mine is almost impossible to detect, but it is fragile and may be set off by an enemy's explosion. Even if destroyed, the Trip Mine will detonate.
Damage: Superior, Recharge: Slow
Available at level: 28
Changes: NONE, well-balanced as is.

Plasma Drones
You create two high explosive Seeker Drones. These Seeker Drones will follow you until they detect an enemy and then they will zero in on targets and detonate in a small shower of burning plasma on impact. This plasma eats through armor causing damage over time, and the concussion can weaken foes. Affected targets will have reduced damage, accuracy and perception and may even be disoriented for a short while. You can only have two drones at any one time. They can be destroyed by your foes.
Damage: Superior (Minor DoT), Recharge: Long
Available at level: 35
Changes: Goodbye LameBomb, hello Photon Seekers+Seeker Drones. This helps make the transition from Devices as a plodding setup set, to a dynamic set in keeping with the rest of the game - the setup time on Trip Mines is acceptable, Time Bomb is far too fiddly to fit in well with any standard team. Devices needs some more damage on the move plx tyvm.

Hover Turret
You can create a mobile gun emplacement. The Hover Turret has an extremely fast fire rate and is equipped with a customized tracking system. Once locked on, the Turret will continue to unload a volley of lead into the target until it is destroyed or is out of range. The Turret is armored, but can be destroyed.
Damage: Moderate, Recharge: Very Long
Available at level: 38
Changes: One, a stationary object that cannot be moved by the player is of little-to-no use in CoX - make the Turret mobile, much like Voltaic Sentinel in Elec/. Two, player-based Auto Turrets are nowhere near as resiliant as they need to be, so a DamRes buff would be greatly appreciated.


@Synaesthetix
"Here, take some more bees with you. You may need them."
Union: FU//LoUD

"that Syn is that that" - Mothers Love

 

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bombs and mines - did somebody say DPS very slowly? and by slwoly I mean ******* slowly

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If you think that Trip Mine and Time Bomb are about dps then you've sorely misunderstood their use. AoE Alpha Strike.

Set up enough and you can vaporize a +2 boss before he deals any damage to you (requires a pull method that doesn't let him shoot at you immedately).

Used wisely they're nearly enough to call /Devices overpowered for solo play. Almost zero risk (especially when combined with CD and Super Speed) and plenty of reward. The only balancing factor is the speed.

[/ QUOTE ]I misunderstood nothing...
Damage Per Second, read way back to some of my old posts about 5 months ago and you see me comment on m blaster duoing with Dreamer's 49 AR/dev, i was slicing through the mobs, bosses and all in the time it took her to kill 1 or 2 mobs, and she knows how to play the build, she'd telemine 1 and start anther in the time i hacked a few lts and mins down without blinking. its rubbish, honest to god .

Also, fought Trix's new respec tonight, laughed at it, lots, he can play it too, well imo, but i just wacked him and wacked him some more, no contest, i even stopped to type while he shot at me.

lollerskates would be a better device for the set than most of whats there atm tbh

Plight


 

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Bruce, I think you have a great post there and I dont think that would make /dev overpowered at all, maybe the damage buff on TD should be kept at 20% afterall it grants +per and +tohit and res to -tohit. the only prob with mobile turret is that elec/dev would be too good, maybe just leave it TPable as it is. strongly agree with the dmgres buff for AT too. and the dart animation and range, i dont think i even know the animation for it atm. Smoke wouldnt hurt to debuff a bit more again, but a blaster shouldnt have a "ha, u cant see me power" to the extent they did back in i3

Plight


 

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Time Bomb: Got it at 35, respeced it out very quickly later...

Auto Turret: Got it at 38, respeced same time as Time Bomb

Only ever had 1 reeal use for TB, but it requires something that very, very few players have in this game: patiance.

Time bomb + Trip Mine + Nuke = Very dead most things.

Trip Mines are fantastic, the Perception buff from TD means stalkers can be spotted in PvP, Tactics can further boost this, combined, you get a fair amount of stakers jumping down, thinking of an easy kill then screaming "HAX" when they get obliterated by up to 16 mines, works well on Brutes too

Teamed with Max a while back, took on Neuron and Mother Mayhem as EBs, so set up 8 or so mines each, pulled Neuron, almost killed him. It was then i realised none of my mines had detonated...

Tackled Marauder with 2 other /Devs and an En/elec, nothing else. Warehouse map, so planted 24 or so mines, pulled the AV, half HP gone.

Devices needs planning and patiance to work the best, things you dont get in teams that often as most people tend to want to rush in a hit things rather than wait for a near insta kill plan.


 

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its not really pvp friendly at all because people arent as thick as the AI.

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Teleport Foe tends to help. And those you'd have problems teleporting you'd have problems hitting in the first place.

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In the PvP zones devices is playable because it is possible to have time to find a good spot, deploy mines, telemine etc. In the arena devices is absolute and utter [censored].

Imo it is complete [censored] in PvE as well.. Sure you can kill mob spawns with the mines but everybody else kills them faster..

The set needs redesigning.


 

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Devices needs planning and patiance to work the best, things you dont get in teams that often as most people tend to want to rush in a hit things rather than wait for a near insta kill plan.

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This is what BindW does not understand about the set (or Trip Mines + Time Bomb). It is not a set for the "Go. Go. Go. XP XPXPXP!" mentality, the requirement for patience is rewarded with a higher level of safety by eliminating opponents before they react.

Any discussion about who can kill the quickest IS about dps. Trip Mines and Time Bomb are not.

And Syn's version would be like bringing back the test version of Regen where you could heal during MoG. It is simply way too good.


 

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Any discussion about who can kill the quickest IS about dps. Trip Mines and Time Bomb are not.

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Depends when you start counting

Time between Mines and Time Bomb and Nuke activating to destroyed targets is very, very short


 

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This is what BindW does not understand about the set (or Trip Mines + Time Bomb). It is not a set for the "Go. Go. Go. XP XPXPXP!" mentality, the requirement for patience is rewarded with a higher level of safety by eliminating opponents before they react.

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Even so it is more like traps than devices in concept. I dont like either btw.


 

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Even so it is more like traps than devices in concept.

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device
-noun
1. a thing made for a particular purpose; an invention or contrivance, esp. a mechanical or electrical one.

Everything in the Devices set fits that (as does everything in both Traps sets). The Devices concept is not the same as the other Blaster secondaries.

Ingame (character creation) description of the set:
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Devices are equipment that you have constructed for use in combat. By using them strategically, you can gain a great tactical advantage. Traps, non-lethal munitions, and demolitions are available in this power set

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Seems to me that having various traps is intended, as is having a Time Bomb or other high-explosive.

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I dont like either btw.

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That still doesn't mean they are bad or underpowered powers or that Devices is underpowered.

I don't like playing with most Control sets as they don't fit my playstyle. I dislike playing Empathy, Spines are right out too and I can easily find other sets that I won't play. Does that mean all those are bad/underpowered and should be changed?

Don't mistake your own likes and dislikes for actual balance problems or concept failure.


 

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Even so it is more like traps than devices in concept.

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device
-noun
1. a thing made for a particular purpose; an invention or contrivance, esp. a mechanical or electrical one.

Everything in the Devices set fits that (as does everything in both Traps sets). The Devices concept is not the same as the other Blaster secondaries.

Ingame (character creation) description of the set:
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Devices are equipment that you have constructed for use in combat. By using them strategically, you can gain a great tactical advantage. Traps, non-lethal munitions, and demolitions are available in this power set

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Seems to me that having various traps is intended, as is having a Time Bomb or other high-explosive.

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I dont like either btw.

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That still doesn't mean they are bad or underpowered powers or that Devices is underpowered.

I don't like playing with most Control sets as they don't fit my playstyle. I dislike playing Empathy, Spines are right out too and I can easily find other sets that I won't play. Does that mean all those are bad/underpowered and should be changed?

Don't mistake your own likes and dislikes for actual balance problems or concept failure.

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/e Clap


 

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and she knows how to play the build, she'd telemine 1..

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An entire group can be dealt with by a /dev in pve too and at alot less risk than what the elec/elec will have normally but still ofc less dps but less risk cos you can give the highest burst damage than anyother toon.


He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.

 

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Devices may not have high DPS, but it can sure as hell take out entire groups with next to no risk.


 

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bombs and mines - did somebody say DPS very slowly? and by slwoly I mean ******* slowly

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If you think that Trip Mine and Time Bomb are about dps then you've sorely misunderstood their use. AoE Alpha Strike.

Set up enough and you can vaporize a +2 boss before he deals any damage to you (requires a pull method that doesn't let him shoot at you immedately).

Used wisely they're nearly enough to call /Devices overpowered for solo play. Almost zero risk (especially when combined with CD and Super Speed) and plenty of reward. The only balancing factor is the speed.

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For me the speed factor reduces their usefulness considerably. Most other AT's have finished with the entire fight and moved onto the next one before the mine layer has even laid half the mines he needs. Wasn't so bad when hasten could be made more or less permanent but now, unless you happen to have hasten available before the fight starts, you're in for a long old wait. Teams don't wait that long and even solo, it turns the mission into a boring wait...blast...wait...blast...wait...blast thing.

If the devs see the devices set as overpowered then they obviously know something about it that I didn't discover in the time it took Calamity to reach level 50. Caltrops are useful in PvE and the targetting drone gives you a little extra accuracy. Can't be relied on now though, we still have to slot for accuracy in the attacks because a mouse sneezing next door drops all our toggles now - including the targetting drone.

I've starting playing melee toons now, pretty well discouraged from playing my AR/Devices blaster. Guess I just don't have the patience to spend 10 minutes setting up a minefield, luring something onto the mines then running away because not a single mine has gone off, or they all went off and missed and having to start all over again. There's not a huge amount of fun in that as far as I'm concerned.


 

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bombs and mines - did somebody say DPS very slowly? and by slwoly I mean ******* slowly

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If you think that Trip Mine and Time Bomb are about dps then you've sorely misunderstood their use. AoE Alpha Strike.

Set up enough and you can vaporize a +2 boss before he deals any damage to you (requires a pull method that doesn't let him shoot at you immedately).

Used wisely they're nearly enough to call /Devices overpowered for solo play. Almost zero risk (especially when combined with CD and Super Speed) and plenty of reward. The only balancing factor is the speed.

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For me the speed factor reduces their usefulness considerably. Most other AT's have finished with the entire fight and moved onto the next one before the mine layer has even laid half the mines he needs. Wasn't so bad when hasten could be made more or less permanent but now, unless you happen to have hasten available before the fight starts, you're in for a long old wait. Teams don't wait that long and even solo, it turns the mission into a boring wait...blast...wait...blast...wait...blast thing.

If the devs see the devices set as overpowered then they obviously know something about it that I didn't discover in the time it took Calamity to reach level 50. Caltrops are useful in PvE and the targetting drone gives you a little extra accuracy. Can't be relied on now though, we still have to slot for accuracy in the attacks because a mouse sneezing next door drops all our toggles now - including the targetting drone.

I've starting playing melee toons now, pretty well discouraged from playing my AR/Devices blaster. Guess I just don't have the patience to spend 10 minutes setting up a minefield, luring something onto the mines then running away because not a single mine has gone off, or they all went off and missed and having to start all over again. There's not a huge amount of fun in that as far as I'm concerned.

[/ QUOTE ]LOL, I am sorry to hear your story, but it does show how A) rubbish the set is on occasion and B) how different mentalities and playstyles perceive the game and fun.

Plight


 

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Devices needs planning and patiance to work the best, things you dont get in teams that often as most people tend to want to rush in a hit things rather than wait for a near insta kill plan.

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This is what BindW does not understand about the set (or Trip Mines + Time Bomb). It is not a set for the "Go. Go. Go. XP XPXPXP!" mentality, the requirement for patience is rewarded with a higher level of safety by eliminating opponents before they react.

Any discussion about who can kill the quickest IS about dps. Trip Mines and Time Bomb are not.

And Syn's version would be like bringing back the test version of Regen where you could heal during MoG. It is simply way too good.

[/ QUOTE ]Quoting my 1st post on this thread:
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This pretty much has to be yet another devastating blow for /dev (I don't play it, although I don't think any set should be this lame tbh), I REALLY REALY REALLY think the devs should look at the /dev and say "hey, what can /dev do better than any other set?" I think they will find the answer to be somewhere between 'nothing' and 'die more'. The stealth nerf (to external mobs and adds too!?) ruined CD, TD was killed by ED, AT is now being messed with for a critter issue!?(whiskey tango foxtrot?), caltrops? hmm, it's not bad i guess, but in PvP is overshadowed by trollers in teams and laugh at in duels, bombs and mines - did somebody say DPS very slowly? and by slwoly I mean ******* slowly The dev secondary is a TOTALLY CONCEPT SET NOWADAYS, it cannot outperform any secondary at anything that would give it a functional edge (did somebody say "zomg the pools are better?")

Fair enough people still play it for fun and it's looks, but who decided that we had to add fun into the balancing formulae? Surely 'cos something looks great and different in the CoH environment it shouldnt be made to pay for its originality with playability? Sort it out and nerf energy and elec while you're at it eh?

Scuse the rant, just dont see the point in not buffing a set which obviously lacks

Ok last comment, i truely believe with my vast lack of knowledge about games and balancing, that if you doubled the damage of every power in the /dev set OR halved the recharge of all powers whilst doubling the buff bonuses (-speed, stealth, +tohit), /dev would still not out perform the other secondaries in any great way. That, to me my friends, is a bit serious.

Plight

[/ QUOTE ]You think i have an XPXPXPXPXP mentality, I have 1 50 in around 4500 hous of play... right .

While devices offers much safety it really isn't that great compared to the most overtly powerful builds. Lately Abu has ben playing his sonic elec and says soloing is a "joke" or somesuch, it was true for me and I didn't fart about wasting time setting up minefields.

I made a lot of serious points in my 1st post on this thread, almost all were overlooked, your loss i guess. What people don't seem to get is that if no powers were changed I am actually calling for a damage buff and buff buff for /dev. If the set was changed it wouldn't affect anyone who has it already as I said in a previous post. I hate that people get so defencive about 'their' build when I am not attacking them, just the devs for making things underpowered. The devs promtoe multiplay, they promote PvP and they promote balance, as I see it /dev has no edge in any of these. I couldn't care less about inter AT balance, that is the antithesis of ATs imo, although within an AT, that defines a role, i would like some balance.

"Oh I soloed an EB in like 3 hits after spedning 12 minutes setting up" and?... I ploughed through mission after mission after mission on invincible without a single death or pause without hasten, without stamina, without stealth, without an epic. why? Because I play one of the most independent blasters there is (although I never realised this on day one), one of the most overpowered. If someone calls for a nerf against those sets I say "fair enough", if they call for a buff I tell them "that would be way too much". I do not care about XP XP XP XP, I do care about fun, yes /dev can be fun, but the game often moves at a pace and /dev cannot keep that pace. Often I move slowly, I like to chat, I liketo not take stamina, I like to leave my pet to solo everything whilst sitting there doing nothing on both my blaster and my dom. Making /dev faster or higher damage would not stop anyone playing at the current pace with the current tactics, what it would do is shine some light into the area that is the shadow of the other secondaries where /dev stands.

This thread shouldnt be a competition about who's blaster is best, the forum is to show the devs our issues as well as discusssing our own PoVs. If someone wants to turn this into yet another "well I can do this" thread, I will happily show them another 10 things I can do better.

Meh, I don't play /dev, why should I care :/

Plight


 

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Don't mistake your own likes and dislikes for actual balance problems or concept failure.

[/ QUOTE ]A very good comment indeed!

/dev is relatively massively underpowered in a high proportion of CoH scenarios and environments.

There's another statement i personally feel addresses fun vs balance. Do you really think that giving dev more debuff, more damage or more accuracy or less recharge would make everyone roll /devs? Nope

Plight


 

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Takes me 2 mins not 10 mins to do a complete set as mines start going off by themselves anyway but there is no need to do a complete set in teams unless perhaps before an AV whilst waiting for people to arrive in a mission with which you could cut fight duration by 10% or more and turret working with your attacks cuts a small amount more too.

In teams unless its small i barely look at the /dev set unless people dont fancy their chances, but solo i am hardly going to do so many at a time without it and get off scott free.


He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.

 

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and she knows how to play the build, she'd telemine 1..

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An entire group can be dealt with by a /dev in pve too and at alot less risk than what the elec/elec will have normally but still ofc less dps but less risk cos you can give the highest burst damage than anyother toon.

[/ QUOTE ]I didn't feel much risk soloing entire mobs of +1 freaks a dozen or more a time tbh Dawnie, although this sort of tactic is a bit mental for any blaster tbh, I do think that it's best to keep the discussion te commonplace scenarios and gaming. Just like when tanks say ZOMG I CANT HERD 500 MOBS AND LIVE!!?!?11?! Bit silly really

Plight


 

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While devices offers much safety

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thats why i said its a "hero" toon.

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The devs promote multiplay, they promote PvP and they promote balance, as I see it /dev has no edge in any of these

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thats a winner of a point imo

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"Oh I soloed an EB in like 3 hits after spedning 12 minutes setting up"

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2 min set, EB boss and group instantaneously taken out in no time at no risk that should read

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I do not care about XP XP XP XP, I do care about fun, yes /dev can be fun, but the game often moves at a pace and /dev cannot keep that pace.

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another winning point made imo and you dont care about xp but others do and then there are people who like strategy and with various maps and enemy that a /dev could solo it does offer that.

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Making /dev faster or higher damage would not stop anyone playing at the current pace with the current tactics, what it would do is shine some light into the area that is the shadow of the other secondaries where /dev stands.

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Another winning point all the rest is just balls because your opinions of what you've said you've seen a /dev do is countered by what other /devs can do meaning just because someone doesnt play it too well OR doesnt like it doesnt make it bad and need changing, however the other points i can agree on to a very large degree.


He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.

 

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and she knows how to play the build, she'd telemine 1..

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An entire group can be dealt with by a /dev in pve too and at alot less risk than what the elec/elec will have normally but still ofc less dps but less risk cos you can give the highest burst damage than anyother toon.

[/ QUOTE ]I didn't feel much risk soloing entire mobs of +1 freaks a dozen or more a time tbh Dawnie, although this sort of tactic is a bit mental for any blaster tbh, I do think that it's best to keep the discussion te commonplace scenarios and gaming. Just like when tanks say ZOMG I CANT HERD 500 MOBS AND LIVE!!?!?11?! Bit silly really

Plight

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Freaks are the lamest of enemies, and what are you implying? With doubts about ED pre ED the day the changes were made i found i loved it.

i actually liked the /dev so much i had made another one

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Meh, I don't play /dev, why should I care :/

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Cos you like me care about certain aspects of the game but not everyone will share the same view or see the game in the same way.


He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.

 

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Also, fought Trix's new respec tonight, laughed at it, lots, he can play it too, well imo, but i just wacked him and wacked him some more, no contest, i even stopped to type while he shot at me.
Plight

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Yeh i got me head handed to me again lol but interesting thing was it wasn't as bad as the first few times i've dueled plight in the arena took a punding but i got a fairly good idea of my alts limits now, so ty plight, and yes i do need a lot more experiance arena wise lol, PVP wise sirens i do fine 90% time lol, warburg upawards, well that's case of more practice same with arena lol


 

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Any changes made to the set for pvp and i'd imagine would have to be done to whats already coded in, cos they cant game break for it and wont want to affect anyones QoL by changing the feel or the concept. So im thinking seriously low interrupt time on tripmines to a basic plant it quick scenario, extend duration of smoke grenade so as to disappear when stacked with stealth for longer, a greater -spd on caltrops and a faster drop time and longer lifetime for turret (its not like anyone could say "stop the fight pls i wish to build a turret") and perhaps taser should be taser dart.


He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.

 

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I'd agree with dropping with drop time on the turret. have you seen how quickly the malta engineers can drop a turret. Can't be more than two seconds at the most. That's less than a third of the time it takes my blaster to do the same. Not that the turret's a hell of a lot of use anyway.