Some advice from top tanks? please?


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Posted

Hi all,

One of my earlier toons was a tank (Invulnerable/Energy Melee I think he was. Got him to lvl5 or 6 and got bored. Character now deleted.

When I7 comes out I am looking to try again. The character will be a Knight in Armour style with a magical origin. Also, as I solo a lot I need high damage rather than agrro retention.

Given the theme of theme of the character Invulnerability is out, So we got Fiery Aura, Ice Armour or Stone Armour as primary and one of the weapons as secondary either axe or mace.

Any recommendations or opinions would be appreciated.

Thanks for your time all.


 

Posted

Ice is best defensively apart for granite stone, and granite has heavy penalties on the offensive front. So I'd definitely go with ice.


 

Posted

I have an Ice armor / Battle Axe tank who looks like a frost gian of D&D world.
You can also choose a Fire armor one (dark character in a black reddish shade armor, like Infernal, the trainer at Founders falls).
Concerning stone, sorry but i cannot see the connection with the knight character you are looking for... Maybe a Troll like Character?
In any case, if you want to deal real amouts of damage you have to go for Battle Axe (pelase take into account that you may need stamina as this power set needs huge amunts of endurane).
Finally, for massive damage you can always go and take an Broad Sword Scrapper...


 

Posted

I went for a inv/axe tanker, so far i know axe has a bit more damage then mace and nearly each attack has a knockup/down effect (no mezz powers though, unlike SS EM or SM). Axe imho looks also a bit better

Stone after lvl32 is by far the most tankable tanker, though sufferes alot penalties (-slow -recharge -jump -sprint -dmg -other armors). Pre-32 you can still come around 'ok'. Magic suits Stone armor i gues, like the earth casters of CoT and you use 'the earthly powers' to get your shields (specialy earth embrace is 'magical'). Also the psionic defence armor is pretty magic-style, floating little purple stones around you Downside would be Granite, as you loose your knight-looks and become 1 big pile of rocks.

Fire is imho the weakest of the tanker, no HP-boost but a heal-power, with use of tough you get a decent s/l-resist and cap fire-resist but the rest is allround decent.

Ice gets a big hug in Issue7 due the new defence-math-thingie, i gues they become more favorite once I7 hits live. Cap-ice resist and the rest is 100% based on defence.


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Posted

Hmmm,

Thanks for the advice so far folks. I am planning 4 toons who have a linked back story. I already have a fire/fire blaster and one of the others is already ear marked as a Broadsword Scrapper.

The Tanker is very much gonna be linked to the land of his birth so I could probably "stretch" to justifiying stone armour via the backstory. Re the black/red fire armor, I like the idea of "healing flames" as an early heal power but I really see this character as very much the shining armour type so it sounds like Ice may be the best option "theme wise".

Keep advice coming all, especially on the effectiveness side of the various powers I want as much info as possible to plan this guy.

thanks,


 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]

In any case, if you want to deal real amouts of damage you have to go for Battle Axe (pelase take into account that you may need stamina as this power set needs huge amunts of endurane).

[/ QUOTE ]EM is the heavies single target hitter, Axe is only the second best. And Fire beats axe for AoE.


 

Posted

Ice isnt realy shiny, it get overloaded with icy effects all around (most 32+ ice tankers i cant see their character anymore). The shiny-style armor would still be Inv-armor, but you dropped that.


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Posted

If you want a high damage, soloing tanker I would suggest you remove all thought of picking mace as your secondary The first two attacks are fine but your third "attack" is a low damage disorient and you have to wait until lvl 20 to pick up another actual damage dealing attack. Getting to 20 with just two damage dealing attacks (plus maybe a pool attack) can be painful. Axe would suit your needs a lot better.

As for a primary I have experience with stone, invulnerability and Ice (to a lesser degree). If you've discounted Inv I would recommend Ice over stone. It sounds like you have a firm concept backing up your character and I think stone might work counter to that. Once you get to 32 Granite armour will obliterate your costume - no one would even know you're supposed to be a knight once you're in Granite. Also, your mez protection in stone armour would be Rooted which means you'd be crawling around missions from a low level (chasing down runners is a huge pain) - this might slow down your soloing rate a tad.

All in all, I'd suggest Ice/Axe for a mobile, soloable, damage dealing tanker (just be prepared to slot heavily for endurance reduction until you get to Stamina).


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Posted

Firstly, as others have said, Ice armour will end up you playing something similar to a white blob if you pick most of the powers! Fire and Invun are probably best to show of your armour, and definately avoid stone.

Fire is probably the best solo tank, as it is most damaging. If you are choosing weapons, axe is better than mace for solo, damaging type offender.

However, bear in mind that if you are choosing a solo freindly tank, you are (almost by definition) becoming less team viable. Dont be suprised that invites a low if you are a fire/axe tank without taunt. Personally, I wouldnt be to keen on inviting a tauntless fire/axe unless the team REALLY needed someone to take the alpha - you simply wont pull your weight in terms of aggro grabbing / defensive strength. As someone has said, a broadsword/invun scrapper is really what you should be playing. Tanks are solo-able for sure but shine in groups. Scrappers are built for solo.

Id consider taking a more "middle road" so that you can solo fairly comfortably but also reasonably pull your weight to a team. Taunt power is very helpful to teams (especially non - ice tanks). Invun/Axe might be more balanced in terms of solo/team. All my 2 influence of course.

Ultimately, theres no getting away from the fact that the more solo freindly you get, the less team freindly you get (and visa versa). I wouldnt (personally) go for the extremes of either, but you really have to work out what you want. A very solo-able tank isnt going to be first on the list for invites to teams when they have an Ice/Ice tank available, for instance.


 

Posted

Ok, this is taking an interesting turn.

It actually sounds as if INV may be best choice to fit with the "shining armour" image although I ruled it out as I thought it would be too "bland". Re the weapon, mace strikes me (pun intended)as being slightly more "in concept" than axe but I think I will compromise there, as axe sounds more effective in game play.

I do want to strike a good balance between solo/team play but I fear I will have a steep learning curve to get out of the mindset that a tanker is just a bigger slower scrapper. I suspect thats one reason I got so bored of my original Tank.

Again, thanks for all advice and any more thoughts are always welcome.


 

Posted

Inv/Axe should suit your concept quite well, I think, and both are great sets, in my opinion.

As for Inv being bland, I'm not sure where you came up with that from. I've seen invulnerability on an older PC which couldn't really handle the graphics overly well, and there it did come up quite un-shiny. On a nice new PC with big graphics up, Inv is as shiny as a disco ball.

If a disco ball is what you're after.

If you want to see Tech Tower with all his shields on, give me a yell later tonight in game. I'm sure there are loads of Invulns around that would give you a demo.

Shrug.


 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]

I do want to strike a good balance between solo/team play but I fear I will have a steep learning curve to get out of the mindset that a tanker is just a bigger slower scrapper. I suspect thats one reason I got so bored of my original Tank.


[/ QUOTE ]

Thats kind of the point methinks. If you play as a big, slow, scrapper, you arent probably much value to a team. They would prefer a fast, kill em quickly scrapper that you get with.... scrappers!

Basically, the trick with tanks is to hold as much aggro as you can (you can probably let scrappers take some hits mind) whilst not killing yourself. Ironically, if you soak up aggro well, you probably make yourself "tougher" in that you allow defenders to focus on healing you and blasters killing everything in sight without panicking and running off.

Tanks dont really come into there own until level 22, when they get SO and really can take an immense amount of punishment. Levels 1-11 whip fairly fast and you do play sort of scrappery, levels 12-21 are a kind of difficult period from my experience. You have dual origins so you are fairly tough, but you cant take the whole shebang. And, it is at this point that the squishies start to really need aggro management. Funnily enough, this period is when you will probably need most judgement about how much aggro to pick up.

Well that was long winded. What Im trying to say is that you have to get out of the "scrapper" mind set to be a good team tank. Its a mind set of courage and fortitude - your role is to free the other players from fear and let them get on with there own job. By all means you should contribute to the damage (and you can do a fair bit), but I find the best way to tank is to have that attitude - your job is to free up the other toons to do their job without panicking about their own safety.


 

Posted

Never thought I'd see the day where almost an entire thread recommends ice armour...almost brings a tear to my eye. At last our time has come...nerfs will be incoming thanks to all the FOTMer's though.


 

Posted

The problem with any tank being played as a scrapper is endurance due to the toggles you will be running (on most tanks that will be at least three) plus attacks do less damage and thus you use more end per enemy


 

Posted

ie dont do it


 

Posted

Hey folks, thanks for lots of great advice and also great PICCIES!

I have had another thread going for advice on how best to use a tank (ie not a big slow scrapper ) and between the two lots of posts I am now fairly happy and have a concept and choices pretty much fixed.

Still not sure how I'll take to tankin mind, I fear it may just be not my style but even if this is the case, I'll definitely keep the toon this time and just lvl it slowly.

For the record I think INV/AXE is gonna be the choice.

Thanks again one and all for the help!


 

Posted

Inv (together with ice) has something special on the taunt-arua.. a tauntaura that your actualy need. The Inv one gives your great defence/acc for each mob in melee range to each element except toxic/psionic. Ice has Chilling embrace, wich slow/debuff recharge massive and a nice -dmg debuff at all mobs in melee range.
With those aura's running you already become a 50% tanker while still can play your complete own style. Inv can become a quite end-heavy buid (Temp.inv is a end-eater, other 2 are avarage/low - but has 3 auto-powers) if you add tough to hit s/l-cap resist. But slot them alot with end-reds and maybe a few extra in your attacks and you shouldnt have that big problem to get around (as tough isnt really needed when going solo).
And if it really goes wrong, hit Unstoppable and become a capresist-all insane axe-wielder

Both basicly a part of the core build (tank or scrank or midsize) unlike fire (bl.aura is only damage, end-heavy) or stone (mudpots does slow, but again end heavy).

I have a lvl18 inv/axe tanker, with the right powers you can create very nice damage output and still can take massive ammount of damage.

sorry for the bit messy post, its late


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Posted

The problem with inv is that you can't tank properly before 18 as your aggro aura comes so late.


 

Posted

i had my taunt and punchvoke, was pretty good enough to get myself to 18 without any much of a problem. Outside that is your defence not that good either (except a end-eater s/l) so it makes a nice little balance along the way.


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