Creating a new SG, But need numbers...and thoughts

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I would seriously consider getting in touch with the US servers' CCCP and asking if they'd feel bad about CCCP expanding over to the EU servers as well. (In effect, asking if they'd allow us to use the name here as well.)

I think that building up an estabilished brand is better than having scattered groups across servers that try to do the same thing but have no unity.

That's just my two cents though.

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Does it really matter?
Unless they somehow have ownership over the name(or the EULA prevents it) surely asking permission is not needed?

But then I am not a big fan of "franchise" super groups as they tend to restrict players control over the group and adopt what ever baggage that the parent SG had.

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"Mir", there used to a soft drink called Mir
Perhaps it would be easier to get a core group of characters/players and then choosing a name?

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Does it really matter?
Unless they somehow have ownership over the name(or the EULA prevents it) surely asking permission is not needed?



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Well for a start, it's astonishingly impolite. Downright rude, if you ask me.

As for ownership, then, personally, I'd ask if you're talking legally or morally. The two may be different in a case like this.

Put this way, who'd like a reputation for being a plagarist?

--Sorry to slightly take this away from the thead purpose--

I dont see it as plagirism, and if we are to ask people in the US permission before creating SGs or the like, then I want to see a whole plethora of heroes and groups in the line seeking back dated permission.

Does the SG sign up creator allow a group called CCCP to be creator here in europe? If it does then the name is free game if it does not then its not.

Perhaps I'm being prickly about this, but I refuse to have to get permission from random players before creating a SG or character unless that character/SG is taken directly from their creativity...If as players we had to do that every time we maed a SG or character then we would be reduced scraping the bottom of the barrel for names and ideas due to americas head start on game play.

Hehe, we've got an unoffical group called The Dark Knights of Russia over on Defiant. It's comprised of All American Russian, Sputnik Boy, Red Mao and Kid Soviet. Together they protect Paragon City from their arch foes, Viet Kong and Guantanamo Bob.

Moto: "The Commies are back...but this time, they're on our side!"

I'm with Gideon on this one, I'm afraid.

I could accept it not being plagiarism if the person had no idea the name/concept had already been "taken" as it were. However, as stated, they do know it's being used across the pond; not only that, but this person would like to create an SG almost identical to the existing one.

Using the name itself is not plagiarism, using the concept alone - again, not plagiarism. Taking the name and the concept even though you know it's being used by the original (?) creator, is.

Definately not accusing the OP of plagiarism, and not suggesting that he'd even think about it. But the simple fact that he knows it's in use should stop him from using it without expressed permission from the creator.

Rather like knowing of the Harry Potter series and yet writing an almost identical series. If the writer had never heard of Harry Potter then it could be suggested that he just happened to have the same idea; however, with even the slightest bit of knowledge of it, his defence doesn't stand.

I'd at least attempt to gain permission. That way, even if the OP receives no reply, he can at least say he tried .

Did the SG called CCCP ask the USSR if they could the Cyrillic characters that made up that country's name in Russian? CCCP translates into the Roman alphabet as SSSR, standing for Soyuz Sovetskikh Sotsialisticheskikh Respublik.

The combination of name and concept is not plagarism (unless the full evolution of the concept is exactly identical), taking from historical events and entities is not plagarism. How many fictions have been written set in WWII? More than one of them will have the same idea behind them. How about films about pirates? And then there's been at least 4 films featuring the Titanic, and they all have the ship sinking at the end, shockingly similar to each other!

The USSR exisited, in its own language it was written as CCCP, it contained Russians who were Soviets. Isn't the US SG as guilty of plagarism as the conceptual EU SG of similiar idea if the use of name and concept already taken is plagarism?

I'm sure you know a real life event can't be copyrighted, only an individual's take on it can. Hence the "The characters in this film are fictitious creations of the creator, any resembelance to real life persons is merely coincidental" blurb at the end of a film. If you wanted to write a film/book based on a living/dead person, you'd need to get written permission (unless the person couldn't be proved to have existed).

Therefore, the original SG hasn't been plagiarised from "canon" (going on the very little information I have of them at least). However, having been created, the idea is "owned" by the...creator (I need a thesaurus). As the idea is now material, it can have a copyright placed on it, therefore any copycat products could been seen as having been plagiarised.

It's entirely up to the US SG if they view it as having been stolen; and so, in order to avoid any big arguments, I'd suggest the potential SG owner gains permission.

Though, seeing as I'm fairly sure the EULA states that they hold the copyright to every character/storyline etc ingame, this is all moot point anyway .

As Gideon said, it's only polite to ask.

(Copyright can be taken too far occasionally though. Take HG Wells' "Invisible Man". Wells died with the copyright still entact, and as far as I can recall, the copyright is still in effect. Most unfortunate as his version is the only decent version of the lot, and I'd adore to see a remake.)

Totally off topic, I once saw that disclaimer at the end of film, following a line saying "This film is based on a true story"... It's true! But the events portrayed are fictional and any resemblance to persons living or dead is entirely coincidental! Hollywood, dontcha just love the consistency?

Back on topic...

We could go round in circles about plagarism and concepts, I had a Soviet hero last summer, does that mean that that concept couldn't be used again? If you get technical, there are only 7 concepts in CoH for characters, the ATs... Deep and dangerously silly that road leads, but it all rests on how fine you chop up the definition of concept...

I would say there is no need to ask permission from the US SG, I don't even think it is rude not to ask about this. If the members of the US SG get wound up that someone else in the world applied the same historical references to the same concept, they really need a reality check.

Are most US players even aware of the EU servers anyway?

And if you're really worried about plagarism, put quotemarks round it..

Or just call it SSSR or USSR...

Agreed ('cept the politeness part, I suppose I'm just paranoid).

And I put about as much faith in Hollywood officials as I do in electric flannels.

Oooo... Electric flannels... Mmmm, feel the exfoliating power of frying your face off...

I still like my idea of using the first line of the Anthem better...

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I'd say play up culture, play down politics. More Mother Russia, less Party. Place of music, of art, of architecture. A proud people who hail from a country that is somewhat inhospitable in several parts. Although I'd say you could key into the sense of decayed empire a bit. Ignoring communism and such, Russia was once a great world power, now it's a country in debt and trying to grope its way forward.

Just thematic ideas.

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Thats pretty much how marvel portrayed russia, even during the cold war. there were heroes from russia and noble enemies too.

Not all comic book companies portrayed russia as total bad guys, although the vast majority did.

So I've gone and made an ice tanker named,'originally', Siberia.

as to a name for this SG, The People's Guardians, or Guardians of Honour?

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I'd say play up culture, play down politics. More Mother Russia, less Party. Place of music, of art, of architecture. A proud people who hail from a country that is somewhat inhospitable in several parts. Although I'd say you could key into the sense of decayed empire a bit. Ignoring communism and such, Russia was once a great world power, now it's a country in debt and trying to grope its way forward.

Just thematic ideas.

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Thats pretty much how marvel portrayed russia, even during the cold war. there were heroes from russia and noble enemies too.

Not all comic book companies portrayed russia as total bad guys, although the vast majority did.

So I've gone and made an ice tanker named,'originally', Siberia.

as to a name for this SG, The People's Guardians, or Guardians of Honour?

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Hah! So thats why I could not have that name :P

As others have said, *if* we wanted to use "CCCP" (which isn't certain by any means, it's just an idea out there, like Commissar's own idea) then I'm not sure if there are any actual legal problems with it - and in any case, I consider any such problems to be irrelevant - I am merely suggesting asking the Americans out of *politesse*.

That is after all what separates us from Americans; we're polite over on this side of the pond.

(Just kidding.)

Soyuz Nerushimiy Respublik Svobodnykh (SNRS), Crimson Guard or Peoples Guardians?

Right, I've decided on Workers of Eastern Europe, I just formed the group. I've made it so young cold war relics and hip new heroes of Eastern Europe can both join.

RC usually hangs around the Galaxy Girl statue at 9PM GMT and onwards, pop by and see him if you wish to join.

Aha - it may be time to dust off the Arctic Princess - former ballerina turned Soviet Spy turned crimefighting debutante

@Midnight Rose

RC hangs around at the Galaxy Girl statue 9PM GMT and onwards. Once we get a few members I'll post the official thread on the Union board.

We'd need to sort out who does what first though.

EDIT: The base is up.

Yurgi Chestikov, The Russian Bear

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d1...Wulf/Yurgi.png

Yes, he IS an anthromorph

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d1...Wulf/yurgi.jpg

Mwuahahaha. Because Z is Teh Roxx

He is an interesting character. I take it he'll be revamped facial wise when I7 hits?

no, because the monster faces in CoV suck.
Bigtime.

I mean seriously. those arn't even werewolf faces. those are like fruitbats. except less cool.

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It'd be difficult to protray. Traditionally, Communist characters in comics have been the villains, so you've got that hurdle to overcome. Communism is seen in most forms of fiction as going hand in hand with dictatorships, so the SG will have that stigma to contend with.


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Although Communism is seen as a bad thing many of its ideas are good, its just always been badly implemented. I can quite easily see communist heroes holding on to their ideals and yet be oppossed to the waytheir country was run. I can also see such characters considering capitalism a flawed system, especially when you consider the hardship and poverty suffered by the former soviet peoples since the introduction of capitalism to their own lands. Good example of such a hero is Marvels Colossus, he was opposed to the regime but believed in the communist ideals himself.The real challenge is explaining a bucketfull of East European heros protecting the American people rather than their own. With Britanic, hes an Architech working in America, ashamed of his own inaction during the Rikti war, now taking inspiration from the Brit Hero-1 he fights as Britanic. I suppose many potential super human threats to the world would come from Paragon so you could say the SG is like a forward defense, then you would have your exiles, worldly curious etc. So you got some ideas to work with.

For RC, The Government finally employed him to train the new generation of normal Special Forces when they discovered they could improves ties with the American's by sending many employed or unemployed USSR/Eastern European heroes to help Paragon and America as well as other parts of the World recover from the Rikti Invasion.

Also, the SG is getting along quite well. Most of us our Russian, but we have a few Romanians, an Albanian and somebody from Afghanistan (should be interesting that one)
We're still looking for people to join.

Send me a mail ingame or a PM in the forums. You will get reply and some questions answered.

Well, speaking from Arctic Princess's perspective: She's a product of the latter part of the Soviet Union, so although she still believes in the ideals of a shared government/economy etc. she is, like a lot of younger people, drawn towards a place like Paragon.

The Paragon we inhabit is comprised mostly of Americans. And I get the feeling, although correct me if I'm wrong, that some of our members are escaping from a place which has changed so much.

Paragon after the War is still rife with the Rikti presence, and the gangs who seek to take their share of the capitalist spoils of Paragon are not dissimilar to those in Russia and he surrounding countries.

Without going overly politcal, I think the Workers represent the globalisation (ooh, my brain hurts from the big word ) of concern for life on Earth.

It doesn't matter, to Arctic at any rate, where she is - as long as she can contribute to a society in as muich trouble as Russia was in the mid-90s. And a group of ex-pats provides her comfort when everything around her is so strange.

Right, profound statements over. Arctic also like to 'kick [censored]' and party with the rest of em