One-on-One Blaster vs Scrapper...possible?
By
Atreides_EU,
Posted on: 2006-01-05 08:00 in Everything about PvP
Actually yeah I think the /Ice corrupters have a killer Slow power, and of course /Dark can floor Accuracy. But I've only ever torn apart /Fire Corrupters.
Hmm was that a Ninja edit? I could've sworn I saw /Fire instead of /Rad in your post...
World of Jackcraft.
No ninja'ing here, you just need a new prescription in your lenses. 
/Thermal doesn't have enough debuffs to work effectively, at least not until very late in the build - but I don't know how effective Heat Exhaustion and Melt Armor are against Regens, having not seen them in action.
@Synaesthetix
"Here, take some more bees with you. You may need them."
Union: FU//LoUD
"that Syn is that that" - Mothers Love
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In a one-on-one face-to-face fight, I'd say you could take your pick from Ice/Energy, Fire/Energy, and Energy/Energy - with Elec/Energy and Sonic/Energy being outsiders. At the end of the day, you'd need the damage from */Energy, regardless.
[/ QUOTE ]Could /elec not do this? Considering that they have more damaging melee attacks than /NRG.
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That all said, I've seen lone Corruptors completely neuter and crush Regens from range in one-on-one situations.
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Ice/Kin Corrupters for the win right? 
They're incredibly annoying, that's for sure.
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Ice/ and Fire/Kin, and Ice/Dark, as it happens.
My bet is that */Cold and */Rad would be similarly daunting, but I haven't seen that with my own eyes as of yet.
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*/rad is very handy one-on-one...although probably not the Dark primary. I had a fight with a spines/regen, and he just couldn't hit me, and even when he did I could heal it back pretty easy.
regens fear rad more than anything, period. Just watch Chives run away ( albeit slowly )when Cherry Fusion is about ( Rad/Rad Defender ).. 
It's not so much the attack debuffs, as it is the -regen/slow of lingering radiation.
Regen Scrapper+LR=non regen scrapper=dead scrapper.
Although gone are the days where LR would stack horrendously, slowing anyone to a standtill..ouch.
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Lvl 50 nrg/nrg/flame Blaster and lvl 50 spines/regen/* Scrapper, One-on-One in the Arena.
the builds (afaik):
the Blaster (this is me)
Prims: all ranged attacks (incl. Nova)
Secs: Power thrust, Conserve Power.
Pools:
- Concealment: Stealth, Grand Invis, Invis, Phase Shift
- Fitness: Swift, Hurdle, Health, Stamina
- Flight: Hover, Fly, Group Fly
- Teleport: Recall Friend
- Flame Mastery: Bonfire, Fire-Shield, RotP
Slots:
- All Ranged Attacks fully slotted (50++ SO): 3x DMG, 2x ACC, 1x RecRed.
- Nova Slotted (50++ SO): 6x DMG.
- All Buffs (Health, Stamina, DMG Res., Def. Enh.) 6-slotted 50++ SO's.
the Scrapper (don't know much about him, except that he's good.)
Prims: probably all melee and range powers
Secs: All Buffs and MoG will be there.
Pools:
- unknown -
Slots:
- Probably all 50++ SO, and 6-slotted on attacks and Buffs.
The BIG question
Can this be done?
Is it possible for a Blaster to win a PvP with a Scrapper with these builds?
If so, what tactics should there be used?
Any1 done this before?
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Unless the scrapper is a fool you cant win. If you designed your build for PvP your chance would be about 75% to win.
50s
controllers: Ill rad , grav rad, fire kin, ice kin
blaster: ice em
scrapper: spines sr
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Could /elec not do this? Considering that they have more damaging melee attacks than /NRG.
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The /elec version of Total Focus (shocking grasp is it...?) actually does much less damage than /energy Total Focus which is it's main downfall imo.
There are a lot of powers a blaster could pick if all he wanted to do was beat a scrapper, but you will obviously get more kills in team matches and in PvP zones if you focus on the squishys, which is what I am built for killing.
I have also changed my mind on the best of the primaries, and yes, I do think it's Elec again (with fire coming in a close second). I do not like Ice, but I won't go into reasons for that here.
I wont profess to be able to beat any scrapper, because Ive been whooped a few times before (I know how to beat whirlwind now though ), but I will give any a very even fight and the outcome will most definitely be circumstantial, the map being the main factor.
Jupiter is slow looking into his notebook, but he always looks.
The [b]Retribution[/b] is coming.
[url="http://s76.photobucket.com/albums/j19/Valens_ii/"]Some of my toons[/url]
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Could /elec not do this? Considering that they have more damaging melee attacks than /NRG.
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If they were exemped to level 28, */Elec would fare better. At level 50, Total Focus just rules all bets in favour of */Energy - though that's not to say that an Elec Blapper wouldn't stand any chance, it'd just be that iota more difficult.
(Aim, Build Up), Charged Brawl, Havoc Punch, Shocking Grasp, Thunder Strike - would be an effective combo - but you do give up Power Thrust in the process. That might not sound like much, but an unresistable KB can mean up to 2 free attacks, which can be all the difference.
FWIW, I think Ice/Elec would do better of all the Elec combos, with the synergy of holds, and the benefit of Ice's -Recharge, -Spd effects.
@Synaesthetix
"Here, take some more bees with you. You may need them."
Union: FU//LoUD
"that Syn is that that" - Mothers Love
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Could /elec not do this? Considering that they have more damaging melee attacks than /NRG.
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The /elec version of Total Focus (shocking grasp is it...?) actually does much less damage than /energy Total Focus which is it's main downfall imo.
[/ QUOTE ]It's thunder strike, and it's BI is only .7 less than TF's, which IMO is offset by the fact that the second most powerful /elec attack has 2.7 higher BI than second most powerful /NRG melee attack.
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FWIW, I think Ice/Elec would do better of all the Elec combos, with the synergy of holds, and the benefit of Ice's -Regen, -Spd effects.
[/ QUOTE ] -recharge, surely?
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I have also changed my mind on the best of the primaries, and yes, I do think it's Elec again (with fire coming in a close second). I do not like Ice, but I won't go into reasons for that here.
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I really don't see what you think Elec has going for it, as a primary - especially in this instance. Could you elucidate a little?
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-recharge, surely?
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Yeah, ignore any obvious errata - this is what happens when you try to cook and type.
@Synaesthetix
"Here, take some more bees with you. You may need them."
Union: FU//LoUD
"that Syn is that that" - Mothers Love
Well it is the only primary with a Hold and a Snipe...
World of Jackcraft.
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Well it is the only primary with a Hold and a Snipe...
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what hobo said
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Well it is the only primary with a Hold and a Snipe...
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... and how does this help you take down a Spines/Regen, exactly?
When you need to be up close and personal to do the damage - as we've already pretty much agreed you need to be - why do you need a snipe? The fact that Elec lacks a high-damage, non-interruptible attack is precisely what works against it, and for the other main primaries: Fire has Blaze, Ice has Bitter Ice Blast, and Energy has Power Burst. Hell, even Sonic has Shout. The time it takes you to fire off a Snipe is dead time that could be better used with another attack, or two - even if you slot for IntRed.
So, whilst having a Snipe and a Hold may be useful in general, in this instance it's of little to no use.
@Synaesthetix
"Here, take some more bees with you. You may need them."
Union: FU//LoUD
"that Syn is that that" - Mothers Love
Actually, I reckon you can get more damage in with Elec than you can with Ice.
Snipe.
Tesla Cage.
Get in close for Energy Punch, Bonesmasher.
Power thrust.
Snipe again before opponent can get back up/use breakfree.
Maybe get a Total Focus in there or a Lightening Bolt somewhere, I'm no expert, though.
World of Jackcraft.
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So, whilst having a Snipe and a Hold may be useful in general, in this instance it's of little to no use.
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Sorry, but you're completely wrong. A very general plan of attack:
Snipe
De-toggle Integration/melee damage
Power thrust/Hold
Snipe
Repeat if still alive.
Obviously have to know what you're doing with all the self buffs, and add in a little more tactics than just the above.
Jupiter is slow looking into his notebook, but he always looks.
The [b]Retribution[/b] is coming.
[url="http://s76.photobucket.com/albums/j19/Valens_ii/"]Some of my toons[/url]
Before we get into the thick of it, please note that under no circumstances am I saying that Elec/Energy cannot take down a Spines/Regen - I'm merely of the viewpoint that it's not the best suited powerset for the job.
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Snipe.
Tesla Cage.
Get in close for Energy Punch, Bonesmasher.
Power thrust.
Snipe again before opponent can get back up/use breakfree.
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Snipe
De-toggle Integration/melee damage
Power thrust/Hold
Snipe
Repeat if still alive.
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First things first - presuming that you'll be able to start with a snipe attack is presuming that you have the initiative from the outset - and not only that, but you have the conditions in which to execute it. That's all well and good, but it's an ideal situation, heavily weighted in favour of the Blaster - and not one you can rely on all (or even most) of the time, necessarily. Irrespective, Energy and Fire could both open with a Snipe attack anyway - and Sniper Blast has the chance of KB, which would work better in the given scenario than Zapp.
Secondly, firing off Tesla Cage before the toggle-drop occurs is probably inefficient - Blaster hold duration isn't worth much even slotted up. It's better off occuring after the detoggling, as Valens points out.
Now we get to the issue of Snipe post-Power Thrust, which is where we differ. I can't speak for anyone else, but when I'm Blapping, I work on a basis of redundancy - reducing the number of things that can go wrong in order to secure a quick drop. Throwing an interruptible attack into the middle of a combat situation has a number of potential drawbacks, especially if you're in a 'non-sterile' environment like Warburg; less so in the Arena. Regardless, in the time it takes to fire Zapp, the other powersets I listed could execute: (Fire) Fireblast + Blaze; (Energy) Power Blast + Power Burst; (Ice) Bitter Ice Blast + Ice Blast - all for higher DPS than Zapp. The benefit of Fire and Energy is that the second attack forces you to be close enough in, that you can cue up Energy Punch/Power Thrust directly afterwards. In the event that the first Power Thrust/Tesla Cage misses, Elec is left with a potential gap in the chain (at least in terms of maintaining a high DPS) whereas the other sets are not.
Even if you insist that damage isn't enough (Fire), and that KB isn't reliable (Energy), you must accept that there's nothing Elec can do against a Spines/Regen that Ice can't do better, and with the benefit of slows on top - there's a reason why Ice/Energy is the FotM PvP Blapper build, like it or not.
@Synaesthetix
"Here, take some more bees with you. You may need them."
Union: FU//LoUD
"that Syn is that that" - Mothers Love
[ QUOTE ]
Even if you insist that damage isn't enough (Fire), and that KB isn't reliable (Energy), you must accept that there's nothing Elec can do against a Spines/Regen that Ice can't do better, and with the benefit of slows on top - there's a reason why Ice/Energy is the FotM PvP Blapper build, like it or not.
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How does your opinion that ice/energy is bettter for fighting one build of scrapper (which the post is about) suddenly become the best pvp blapper archetype? personally i'd much rather face an ice/energy blaster with any character in the arena than elec/ or fire/energy
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How does your opinion that ice/energy is bettter for fighting one build of scrapper (which the post is about) suddenly become the best pvp blapper archetype? personally i'd much rather face an ice/energy blaster with any character in the arena than elec/ or fire/energy
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Don't put words into my mouth. I never said it was the best all-round - I said it was FotM (Flavour of the Month), which it arguably is - much in the same way that Spines/Regen is the FotM PvP Scrapper build, so on and so forth.
Edit: But on that note, paging Seiche to the arena for a quick demo of why Ice/Energy is a feared build. *blows on his special Prof whistle*
@Synaesthetix
"Here, take some more bees with you. You may need them."
Union: FU//LoUD
"that Syn is that that" - Mothers Love
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How does your opinion that ice/energy is bettter for fighting one build of scrapper (which the post is about) suddenly become the best pvp blapper archetype? personally i'd much rather face an ice/energy blaster with any character in the arena than elec/ or fire/energy
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Don't put words into my mouth. I never said it was the best all-round - I said it was FotM (Flavour of the Month), which it arguably is - much in the same way that Spines/Regen is the FotM PvP Scrapper build, so on and so forth.
Edit: But on that note, paging Seiche to the arena for a quick demo of why Ice/Energy is a feared build. *blows on his special Prof whistle*
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now you're talking about the player not the build
Yeah... it isn't fair to count Prof... PvP knowledge leaks from his ears.
World of Jackcraft.
Can't help but think of Prof when I hear "Ice/Energy", though. The only other Ice/Energy Blaster I know by name is Freezypop (AKA: Frozen Rogue ), but I don't think he's SL 50 yet.
@Synaesthetix
"Here, take some more bees with you. You may need them."
Union: FU//LoUD
"that Syn is that that" - Mothers Love
If you're an /nrg blaster, take bonesmasher and energy punch. Slot them. Use them. Love them. You're not a ranged AT, you're a damage AT.
En/En/En Blaster vs Claw/Invul/Body Scrapper.
Really depends on who can get the drop on each other.
Stase will be slamming me with multiple attacks, opening with her KD and then SS'ing off if I drop her too low.
I'll be using Stealth and Flight to get the drop on her; then melee pounding before backing off to blast the last bits of her health off.
It depends solely on the maps at times. Crowded Environments will get me toasted; Open ones I soar in.
When faced with a tank / scrapper / stalker / whatever likes to punch things in an uncivilised manner I try to juggle Electric Feild (immob) and/or Telsa Cage (Hold). Without melee, they are nothing. If you can get in first that is, and it takes considerable luck more than anything, but it is possible. Wouldn't fancy my chances against an SR or Regen (spit) scrapper/stalker build though in the long run. Getting them knocked-back 20 yards back the way they came is enough for me before I tell Checkov to perfom evasive flight 
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That all said, I've seen lone Corruptors completely neuter and crush Regens from range in one-on-one situations.
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Ice/Kin Corrupters for the win right?
They're incredibly annoying, that's for sure.
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Ice/ and Fire/Kin, and Ice/Dark, as it happens.
My bet is that */Cold and */Rad would be similarly daunting, but I haven't seen that with my own eyes as of yet.
@Synaesthetix
"Here, take some more bees with you. You may need them."
Union: FU//LoUD
"that Syn is that that" - Mothers Love