A Scrapper's opinion on the Stalker Archetype?

Just curious what the Scrapper community thinks about Stalkers. Don't hear much talk about it when comparing Melee archetypes (always Scrapper and Brute).

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Don't know about the others, but I generally ignore stalkers when pondering the melee archetypes because stalkers seem more like blasters to me.

Granted, I haven't played one since the last round of major changes, so that opinion is probably pretty far off now. If it is, maybe I'll try out a MA/NIN after I-16 goes live.

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Be well, people of CoH.

I had fun with my stalker up until about the 30s. Then it just felt weak.

I understand the buffs made them much more playable, but I haven't dipped my toes back into that AT.

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@Catwhoorg "Rule of Three - Finale" Arc# 1984
@Mr Falkland Islands"A Nation Goes Rogue" Arc# 2369 "Toasters and Pop Tarts" Arc#116617

I love my Stalkers they are reallly fun to play solo. I don't team much, but I don't think they would be that good on teams because no one is going to wait for you to hide. Placate can help some but it is not always up.

I didn't like them before the buff but after they are a lot of fun to play for me.

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If you play them as hit and run artists. BORING!

Play them like a scrapper who can hide, REALLY FUN!

Even in the beginning levels, when teaming, I'll only hide if the team is stopped or it comes back on while running to the next spawn.

Early lvls can be a bit hellish, as so many powers you want/need you can lose out on attacks.

But even then, I was scrapping it out.

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BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection

I am a fan of all that is melee. Each of the 6 (scrappers, tankers, brutes, stalkers, widows, and banes) bring something different. Even if they share simular powers. As far as stalkers go, they can crit a lot more thanks to hide and placate. A power I ignored on my first stalker but will not anymore. To me, brutes play more like a scrappers then stalkers do. That's why they are the ones always compaired to scrappers. The same set on a stalker will play completly different then on a scrapper most of the time. An exception would be /SR and /regen. Def is def and a heal is a heal.

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"All problems can be solved by throwing enough scrappers at it."

@Riez on Virtue, Protector, Champion, and Exalted server.

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Don't know about the others, but I generally ignore stalkers when pondering the melee archetypes because stalkers seem more like blasters to me.

Granted, I haven't played one since the last round of major changes, so that opinion is probably pretty far off now. If it is, maybe I'll try out a MA/NIN after I-16 goes live.

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If you look closely, the villain AT's are all a mix of two hero AT's:

Brute = Scrapper + Tank
(More Scrapper level of damage, but Tank sets)

Mastermind = Tank + Controller
(made to be the 'villain tank', higher aggro than the pet-using Controller)

Dominator = Controller + Defender
(The hold side of the controller with some more ranged damage, but not as high as the Blaster)

Corruptor = Blaster + Defender
(Swaps the Defender's Primary/secondaries, and average Blaster/defender damage)

Stalker = Scrapper + Blaster
(Hits hard and fast--melee instead of ranged. Still more defense than a blaster can hope for.)

Edited for clarity

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The plastic tips at the end of shoelaces are called aglets. Their true purpose is sinister.
--The Question, JLU

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Dominator = Controller + Defender


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Dominator=Controller + Blaster

Dom do Blaster damage now.

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[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Dominator = Controller + Defender


[/ QUOTE ]

Dominator=Controller + Blaster

Dom do Blaster damage now.

[/ QUOTE ]

Now? Yes, thankfully. Before? More defender-ish in damage.

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The plastic tips at the end of shoelaces are called aglets. Their true purpose is sinister.
--The Question, JLU

After GR, I see no reason to play Blasters for me.

Dominators do almost* Blaster level ranged damage and bring much more to a team.




* I think the range mod for Dominators is a bit lower, but the melee damage is higher I think.

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Play them like a scrapper who can hide, REALLY FUN!

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This. I like my Stalkers. I have never played them as hit and run artists, even before the most recent buffs. The base damage and base HP boosts, plus unconditional critical chances, made them much more effective and, for me, a lot more fun.

You have to be able to tolerate two things.

1) You don't get a solid attack chain on most powersets before level 26. You can ameliorate this with pool powers.
2) You won't get much AoE potential unless you're Spines or Electri Melee. Sometimes you get absolutely none.

The above weren't a real problem for me, so I dig my Stalkers. I really enjoy my 50. Every now and then I get this sweet chain of crits after an AS and I just cause some poor boss to evaporate in 2-3 hits, and damn if that doesn't feel good.

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Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA

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Dominators do almost* Blaster level ranged damage and bring much more to a team.

[/ QUOTE ]

Blasters have much simpler overall attack chain building capability, and since they don't generally need to use mezzes that deal damage as part of that chain, they often have better endurance efficiency on those chains. Certainly they bring far less control, and that may or may not be better for a given team, but I think you badly underestimate their damage potential in the general sense.

Dominator melee damage scale is still slightly lower than a Blaster's: 0.95 to 1.0.

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Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA

Yea, I'd relate Stalkers more to Blasters than anything else. Deal out a lot of damage in a short time, but don't take it as well as Scrappers or Brutes.

Also, /Regen is far better for Scrappers than for Stalkers. Stalker HP cap is in the 1600's, and HP is highly important for a /Regen. My Scrapper has 1850 HP without DP. So if a Stalker has DP up (without IH), my Scrapper and most /Regen Scrappers out there are -still- going to get back more HP/sec than a Stalker.

Also, I have to disagree with whoever thinks that Doms will negate the need for Blasters. Many people are calling CoX after GR "City of Blasters". I understand that Dom's Ranged damage modifier is fairly close to the Blaster's, but Blaster's are still going to be the damage and AoE kings of CoX.

And in PvP? Blasters will rule on either side.

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I was just talking about myself. I prefer Dominators to Blasters, and I love control sets. Blasters seem to weak to me, and haveing a pet that can take aggro is helpful(unless your Mind, but they get a whole ton of "pets" with MC)


That was IMO, probably should have stated it as such.

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Yeah, every Blaster I've ever rolled ends up deleted in the mid 20s for some reason. I don't fully understand why, but something happens in that range that sucks the fun out of Blasters for me.

Doms of course I can't get enough of. Especially after the changes. Hands down my favorite Archetype.

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Doms of course I can't get enough of. Especially after the changes. Hands down my favorite Archetype.

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*looks at the forum name*

Heyyy, we don't like that kinda tawlkin 'round these parts.

*calls in the angry Scrapper-loving mob*

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A softcapped /Nin Stalker has more staying power than any /SR Scrapper, with slightly lower DDR but alot more toys to play with (including a burst self heal)

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Dominator melee damage scale is still slightly lower than a Blaster's: 0.95 to 1.0.

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Incorrect

Doms ranged damage scalar is 0.95, melee is 1.05

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[ QUOTE ]
A softcapped /Nin Stalker has more staying power than any /SR Scrapper, with slightly lower DDR but alot more toys to play with (including a burst self heal)

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Interesting. How would you guys rate the damage capabilities of a Stalker vs Scrapper (on teams and solo)? Haven't heard many Stalkers soloing AV's, myself.

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That depends on multiple variables, including the Scrapper's primary, HP, regen rate, and pool powers.

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A softcapped /Nin Stalker has more staying power than any /SR Scrapper, with slightly lower DDR but alot more toys to play with (including a burst self heal)

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That's true. Only a matter of time till that set gets ported. It will be interesting to see what they do with hide and caltrops.

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"All problems can be solved by throwing enough scrappers at it."

@Riez on Virtue, Protector, Champion, and Exalted server.

IMHO the best Scrapper (DM/SD) outperforms the best Stalker (DM/Nin) at soloing AVs, at least damagewise.

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IMHO the best Scrapper (DM/SD) outperforms the best Stalker (DM/Nin) at soloing AVs, at least damagewise.

[/ QUOTE ]

What's your opinion on Electric/Nin?

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Electric melee is lackluster in single target damage, but it's an AoE beast

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[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
A softcapped /Nin Stalker has more staying power than any /SR Scrapper, with slightly lower DDR but alot more toys to play with (including a burst self heal)

[/ QUOTE ]

Interesting. How would you guys rate the damage capabilities of a Stalker vs Scrapper (on teams and solo)? Haven't heard many Stalkers soloing AV's, myself.

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I have never solo'd an AV on any Scrapper before. I'm really just not a badass dude.
My sole Stalker (Claws/Nin) could solo Mynx on a team, in the mid 30s, keeping her occupied while everyone else had died and was returning to the mission. Got her down a quarter health. With SOs only, no IOs or anything.

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