multi-color power customization/individual customs
By
BrandX,
Posted on: 2009-07-04 19:24 in Archetypes and Powers General Discussion
There have been no official statements providing details. I don't even think they've said anything... just posted pictures.
This is based on nothing but the two pictures provided, but i have a hunch that the colors will be selected for the whole powerset, not on a per power basis.
i could of course be completely wrong.
Dr. Todt's theme.
i make stuff...
It'll probably be set up for an entire powerset's colors, and due to unexpected overwhelming demand for per-power customization, i16 will then become "everything in i16 besides power customization!". i17 Will then be "Power customization!" ala Mission architect.
[ QUOTE ]
It'll probably be set up for an entire powerset's colors, and due to unexpected overwhelming demand for per-power customization, i16 will then become "everything in i16 besides power customization!". i17 Will then be "Power customization!" ala Mission architect.
[/ QUOTE ]
Actually...I don't mind color costumization being the same for all powers in the set. But then, I don't want to see "City of Rainbowbright" no matter how much I loved that show growing up 
BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
They could just limit it to non-armor sets or sets with only one color.
@Zopharshinta
@Zophar2
Despite my complete lack of knowledge about computer coding, I'm going to try to sound like I do know something about it here, so if I embarrass myself, please feel free to point and laugh.
It seems to me like when they changed things to add color tinting, they would have had to add a place in the code where it looks for the custom color you created to make the power that color. It also doesn't seem like too much of a stretch to imagine that they could easily have it look in a separate place, with a separate color for each power. I can't imagine that a single entry for the color of a power could be that large (heck, it could probably even be stored locally, so storage size wouldn't be that big of an issue).
I guess what I'm getting at here, is that it doesn't seem like it would be much more difficult to give us the ability to color tint each individual power, rather than the powerset as a whole.
[ QUOTE ]
Despite my complete lack of knowledge about computer coding, I'm going to try to sound like I do know something about it here, so if I embarrass myself, please feel free to point and laugh.
It seems to me like when they changed things to add color tinting, they would have had to add a place in the code where it looks for the custom color you created to make the power that color. It also doesn't seem like too much of a stretch to imagine that they could easily have it look in a separate place, with a separate color for each power. I can't imagine that a single entry for the color of a power could be that large (heck, it could probably even be stored locally, so storage size wouldn't be that big of an issue).
I guess what I'm getting at here, is that it doesn't seem like it would be much more difficult to give us the ability to color tint each individual power, rather than the powerset as a whole.
[/ QUOTE ]
The issue I have with this is that it could easily get rather unwieldy. Storing all power customization locally might serve to deal with the issue to some degree, but it would make the the process of determining what another player's attack look like take a longer (because you would have to upload your colors to the server so that it can be given to everyone else) so it would probably be more efficient to simply store those variables on the server if color customization is meant to be visible to other players.
The other issue I can think of that might impact the ability to customize powers independently is that, if power customization is a property of the costume generator (which is where I'm putting my money), unless the devs add more costume option slots (there are only a certain number of specific costume options that are open; Weapon Customization actually ate up one), there aren't going to be enough for each power taken to be given a custom color.
Personally, I'm expecting the color customization to allow for color customization of your primary and color customization of the secondary. Possible additions for APP/PPP are possible, but I doubt it. Depending on whether the color saturation mechanism is changed, we'll either get a single color option or two color options. The single color option would most likely extend about as far as being able to change the base color (Energy Blast becomes any/white rather than blue/white or red/white) without having large effect on the shading beyond the simple additive change (using a darker base causes the second half of the color to be commensurately darker; Energy Blast would then have LightBlue/White, MediumBlue/Light Blue, DarkBlue/MediumBlue, MidnightBlue/DarkBlue as the blue series color options depending on what initial color you picked). The dual color option, which would require some coding workarounds and tweaks to the graphics engine itself, would simply allow you to pick both the primary and secondary color for the power set in question (Energy Blast could be White/Black, Green/Yellow, etc; re: the two colors would not have to be even remotely similar).
[ QUOTE ]
The issue I have with this is that it could easily get rather unwieldy. Storing all power customization locally might serve to deal with the issue to some degree, but it would make the the process of determining what another player's attack look like take a longer (because you would have to upload your colors to the server so that it can be given to everyone else) so it would probably be more efficient to simply store those variables on the server if color customization is meant to be visible to other players.
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm not so sure it would though. Assuming they used fairly simple RGB color values with 256 values for each color, that's only 3 bytes to describe the color. Double that to 6 if we can use 2 colors. A character gets 24 powers, so that's only 144 bytes to describe the colors for each and every power (2 colors each) that that character has. That means you could store color data for over 7200 characters in 1MB of data. Although I'm not so sure what kind of identifying data they would need to tie the color to the power it's supposed to go with, so that might add more data. I'm not sure how many characters exist in CoH at the moment, but most of them wouldn't be taking up the memory for the full 24 powers, since only characters level 49 and higher would have all 24, and some (a lot?) characters will certainly be left with the default power colors. I also don't know what kind of storage space the CoH servers have, but I would think it's quite a bit, and the color data would be a fairly small fraction overall.
[ QUOTE ]
The other issue I can think of that might impact the ability to customize powers independently is that, if power customization is a property of the costume generator (which is where I'm putting my money), unless the devs add more costume option slots (there are only a certain number of specific costume options that are open; Weapon Customization actually ate up one), there aren't going to be enough for each power taken to be given a custom color.
[/ QUOTE ]
This one I'm not so sure on the solution to. Maybe we'll deal with the color options somewhere else, or maybe there will be a change to the costume editor if that's where it is.
Either way, I'm hoping the devs will take the same attitude towards this that they did towards the architect, and decide that if it's worth doing, it's worth doing right, even if it takes longer.
CO allows you to choose the colors for each individual power, so there's a fair chance the upcoming power customization will also allow it.
[ QUOTE ]
I'm not so sure it would though. Assuming they used fairly simple RGB color values with 256 values for each color, that's only 3 bytes to describe the color. Double that to 6 if we can use 2 colors. A character gets 24 powers, so that's only 144 bytes to describe the colors for each and every power (2 colors each) that that character has. That means you could store color data for over 7200 characters in 1MB of data. Although I'm not so sure what kind of identifying data they would need to tie the color to the power it's supposed to go with, so that might add more data. I'm not sure how many characters exist in CoH at the moment, but most of them wouldn't be taking up the memory for the full 24 powers, since only characters level 49 and higher would have all 24, and some (a lot?) characters will certainly be left with the default power colors. I also don't know what kind of storage space the CoH servers have, but I would think it's quite a bit, and the color data would be a fairly small fraction overall.
[/ QUOTE ]
The big issue isn't the size of the transfer alone. With MMOs it's generally not the issue. It's more often an issue of the sheer number of transfers that have to take place for the server. Every time you make an attack, the server would have to load up from you and give that info to everyone that can see you. It's also got to do the same thing for everyone that the you can see.
Think of how little space we get with AE for individual missions. It's just like that. What may seem like a tiny increase to you is actually a rather huge increase when you consider multiplying it over a large number of users.
I'd be happy if they just offered red/orange/yellow/green/indigo/blue/violet choices for each powerset, keeping all the powers the same general hue. That would limit the amount of customization a little (rather than the huge color palette we have for costumes, just keep it to 7) but still make it more manageable for the developers. I don't particularly *need* aqua-teal fire, for instance. Green or blue would be fine.
[ QUOTE ]
I'd be happy if they just offered red/orange/yellow/green/indigo/blue/violet choices for each powerset, keeping all the powers the same general hue. That would limit the amount of customization a little (rather than the huge color palette we have for costumes, just keep it to 7) but still make it more manageable for the developers. I don't particularly *need* aqua-teal fire, for instance. Green or blue would be fine.
[/ QUOTE ]
Believe it or not, this would be the same amount of work, or possibly more work.
Currently all of the powers have baked in colors, the way Power Customization will work is that this baked in color will be set to an alpha channel, which means it can be set to any color that they want, in theory they could give you a color wheel and let you pick literally any color and it wouldn't be any different than letting you pick the 7 colors that you mentioned, in terms of work.
No
Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo
I think you underestimate our fools, sir.
Why /duel is a bad idea
[ QUOTE ]
in theory they could give you a color wheel and let you pick literally any color and it wouldn't be any different than letting you pick the 7 colors that you mentioned, in terms of work.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah, but in theory you would only have to transmit three bits across the network instead of 24.
Of course, that assumes their network packets are binary, when more likely they are a string of characters, since that's far more common. Since most costume definitions are a string of characters, that's probably what it is. So more than likely they would go ahead and give a full range of color choices (as much as they have for costume colors anyway) and that will be nearly as efficient as 7 colors.
Actually, IIRC there are actually more colors available in the format they use for costume definitions than can actually be selected in the editor.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I'm not so sure it would though. Assuming they used fairly simple RGB color values with 256 values for each color, that's only 3 bytes to describe the color. Double that to 6 if we can use 2 colors. A character gets 24 powers, so that's only 144 bytes to describe the colors for each and every power (2 colors each) that that character has. That means you could store color data for over 7200 characters in 1MB of data. Although I'm not so sure what kind of identifying data they would need to tie the color to the power it's supposed to go with, so that might add more data. I'm not sure how many characters exist in CoH at the moment, but most of them wouldn't be taking up the memory for the full 24 powers, since only characters level 49 and higher would have all 24, and some (a lot?) characters will certainly be left with the default power colors. I also don't know what kind of storage space the CoH servers have, but I would think it's quite a bit, and the color data would be a fairly small fraction overall.
[/ QUOTE ]
The big issue isn't the size of the transfer alone. With MMOs it's generally not the issue. It's more often an issue of the sheer number of transfers that have to take place for the server. Every time you make an attack, the server would have to load up from you and give that info to everyone that can see you. It's also got to do the same thing for everyone that the you can see.
Think of how little space we get with AE for individual missions. It's just like that. What may seem like a tiny increase to you is actually a rather huge increase when you consider multiplying it over a large number of users.
[/ QUOTE ]
Picture a well attended Rikti Invasion/Raid where everyone has their colors for every power set to different values. That is a lot of additional lag to something that is historically laggy already.
And that is if power customization is per character not per cosutme (the only place they currently have for customization to be set up). By costume people will be changing costumes and lagging up the place even more.
There is definitely a volume issue. In a 2 player mission it may not matter, but at events/auction houses it will be felt if they just stack it on everything else.
----------------------------
You can't please everyone, so lets concentrate on me.
[ QUOTE ]
CO allows you to choose the colors for each individual power, so there's a fair chance the upcoming power customization will also allow it.
[/ QUOTE ]
I wouldn't call that a guarantee. CO's power customisation was programmed in from the start (and seems to be connected to loot, which may not be the same at all) while this game has to be heavily modified to accomodate it.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
CO allows you to choose the colors for each individual power, so there's a fair chance the upcoming power customization will also allow it.
[/ QUOTE ]
I wouldn't call that a guarantee. CO's power customisation was programmed in from the start (and seems to be connected to loot, which may not be the same at all) while this game has to be heavily modified to accomodate it.
[/ QUOTE ]
Of course, if you're going to heavily modify something (and, if past posts are anything to go by it'll require rewriting a lot of code from scratch) you might as well go the whole way.
Not that I'm expecting such a thing, they may have just found a work around.
Given that there is some variance of colour between powers in some sets as is, it seems likely to me that you would set the colours per power.
Goodbye may seem forever
Farewell is like the end
But in my heart's the memory
And there you'll always be
-- The Fox and the Hound
I have a question about color customization. How will customization work for power sets that have individual colors for powers-for instance fire armor with fire shield and plasma shield. Will there be individual color customization for each power -OR- will there be a single color and willl armors be indestinguishable (sp?) from each other.