All versions of lightning storm were changed to no longer inherit recharge buffs, this includes the defender version.
*if* it was not changed, it is a bug and will get fixed.
No
Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo
I think you underestimate our fools, sir.
Why /duel is a bad idea
Which is kind of a shame, since pretty much nobody liked the change, and it was an admitted kludge to patch over some recharge related problem with AI attack chains. Of course, conspiracy theories abound since the majority of pets only have one attack.... including Lightning Storm....
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There was mention about how the defender version of Lightning Storm was unchanged or not affected somehow by the Pets attacks no longer being affected by recharge enhancements change. Recharge enhancements will only reduce recharge time of casting the power. In regards to LS, there was mention that the only way to get LS to attack more often and be affected with Recharge enhancements is if it they are mixed IOs such as DMG/RECH or ACC/RECH.
I'm not sure if I caught that last part correctly or what the entire story is on this. Could someone who understands what I'm talking about please elaborate on this a bit more?
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It used to be that slotting set IOs with a recharge bonus into LS or having a recharge buff on you (hasten or speed boost for example) would increase the fire rate of LS (LS would also inherit any recharge set bonuses you had for 10 seconds). This is no longer the case.
The source of the confusion: In the initial change to make pets no longer inherit recharge the defender lightning storm was missed. The change to defender lightning storm did not happen until a couple months after i14 went live. But it is now in line with other pets.
The source of the conspiracy theories: When the change was originally announced it was explained that it was because pets inheriting recharge was causing some pets to not cycle their attacks properly. The problem with this explanation was that even pets with only one attack, Lightning Storm, gun turret, voltaic sentinel, fire imps, were hit as well. The initial assumption was that the change had to be global and all pets needed to be affected by the change. However, defender LS was not affected showing that the pets affected could be chosen on a case by case basis. This lead to requests that powers with only one attack such as LS being exempted from this change. At this point Castle jumped in to clarify that the change was not simply because of pet cycling but that the change was intended to target the single attack pets specifically (LS) because the inherited recharge was making them overpowered.
I hope that clears things up.
Draggynn on Virtue: lvl 50 Storm/Psi, 1389 badges
Draggynn's Guide to Storm Summoning(Gale-Tornado, updated 6/25/2011)
Avatar by Wassy full reference here
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Which is kind of a shame, since pretty much nobody liked the change, and it was an admitted kludge to patch over some recharge related problem with AI attack chains. Of course, conspiracy theories abound since the majority of pets only have one attack.... including Lightning Storm....
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I'm one of the few who liked it.
The scars are still pretty fresh over this one 
The pet recharge nerf was handled by them in the same way they have gone about handling other recent fallouts in this game. Not well.
It left a fair number of people feeling they were either being lied to or that information was being omitted for some other reason.
Straight up lied to, or a lie of omission. Thank goodness for the unwavering dev apologists who got us all through that one 
lol
Shenanigans
LotD - JaL - POWT/SMD - SoCo - AJs
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All versions of lightning storm were changed to no longer inherit recharge buffs, this includes the defender version.
*if* it was not changed, it is a bug and will get fixed.
[/ QUOTE ]I believe Defender LS was missed in the first round of pet-recharge-locks, but was later fixed.
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
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There was mention about how the defender version of Lightning Storm was unchanged or not affected somehow by the Pets attacks no longer being affected by recharge enhancements change. Recharge enhancements will only reduce recharge time of casting the power. In regards to LS, there was mention that the only way to get LS to attack more often and be affected with Recharge enhancements is if it they are mixed IOs such as DMG/RECH or ACC/RECH.
I'm not sure if I caught that last part correctly or what the entire story is on this. Could someone who understands what I'm talking about please elaborate on this a bit more?
[/ QUOTE ]
It used to be that slotting set IOs with a recharge bonus into LS or having a recharge buff on you (hasten or speed boost for example) would increase the fire rate of LS (LS would also inherit any recharge set bonuses you had for 10 seconds). This is no longer the case.
The source of the confusion: In the initial change to make pets no longer inherit recharge the defender lightning storm was missed. The change to defender lightning storm did not happen until a couple months after i14 went live. But it is now in line with other pets.
The source of the conspiracy theories: When the change was originally announced it was explained that it was because pets inheriting recharge was causing some pets to not cycle their attacks properly. The problem with this explanation was that even pets with only one attack, Lightning Storm, gun turret, voltaic sentinel, fire imps, were hit as well. The initial assumption was that the change had to be global and all pets needed to be affected by the change. However, defender LS was not affected showing that the pets affected could be chosen on a case by case basis. This lead to requests that powers with only one attack such as LS being exempted from this change. At this point Castle jumped in to clarify that the change was not simply because of pet cycling but that the change was intended to target the single attack pets specifically (LS) because the inherited recharge was making them overpowered.
I hope that clears things up.
[/ QUOTE ]Basically they lied about the recharge issue. We all know they did this nerf so masterminds can get kinetics on the next go round of when they port sets. LS, VS, and Gun Drone were not overpowered in any way shape or form. This change to me was brutal to the point where I have shelved every stormy I have. I could have just as easily done them as cold instead since all the worth while powers are now gone and the set is gutted because of the nerfed LS. 
I case you all havent noticed I am still pretty nerd raged about this nerf because it was completely unjustified.
Bump and Grind Bane/SoA
Kenja No Ishi Earth/Empathy Controller
Legendary Sannin Ninja/Pain Mastermind
Entoxicated Ninja/PSN Mastermind
Ninja Ryukenden Kat/WP Scrapper
Hellish Thoughts Fire/PSI Dominator
Thank You Devs for Merits!!!!
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The scars are still pretty fresh over this one
The pet recharge nerf was handled by them in the same way they have gone about handling other recent fallouts in this game. Not well.
It left a fair number of people feeling they were either being lied to or that information was being omitted for some other reason.
Straight up lied to, or a lie of omission. Thank goodness for the unwavering dev apologists who got us all through that one
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Pfft, I'm still bitter about Dark Servant not being given an infinite duration. We're "not controllers", so we don't get a buff to reconcile the nerf that we got because we were similar to controllers. We got the exact same nerf as them, so why couldn't we get the exact same buff?! If my fluffy can't be permanent, then I want 3 of him again*.
Let's not even get on to the topic of how Warshades dodged that bullet entirely.
*admittedly, this was beyond ridiculously overpowered
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I case you all havent noticed I am still pretty nerd raged about this nerf because it was completely unjustified.
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I don't disagree with your nerd rage in this case, although, I wouldn't necessarily call the lack of justification 'complete'. +rech is something that pushes coh's current combat processing into very worrisome areas. It's not like mapwide-taunt that can be capped or stacked mez that can be purple-triangled. The engine itself starts to sputter as increasingly more things want to be processed in decreasingly small windows of time.
Let me put it this way. In part of this game review the point is made that game quality is very strongly served by a 1:1 input-to-game-response ratio between the player and the game engine. If you increase the quantity of input (for example because players/ai have less recharge delay between actions) and the game's ability to respond is not increased, game quality suffers. For a game like coh where much of the game's ability to respond to input is locked in (and would get lots slower if the devs put in even half of the crazy stuff the playerbase keeps asking for), +rech is a variable threat to the overall quality of their work.
The devs may not handle the pr side of +rech nerfs all that well, but if they really care about getting the best quality into their game's experience, then it seems they have some reasonable justification to aim nerf guns at abusive input situations.
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I case you all havent noticed I am still pretty nerd raged about this nerf because it was completely unjustified.
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I don't disagree with your nerd rage in this case, although, I wouldn't necessarily call the lack of justification 'complete'. +rech is something that pushes coh's current combat processing into very worrisome areas. It's not like mapwide-taunt that can be capped or stacked mez that can be purple-triangled. The engine itself starts to sputter as increasingly more things want to be processed in decreasingly small windows of time.
Let me put it this way. In part of this game review the point is made that game quality is very strongly served by a 1:1 input-to-game-response ratio between the player and the game engine. If you increase the quantity of input (for example because players/ai have less recharge delay between actions) and the game's ability to respond is not increased, game quality suffers. For a game like coh where much of the game's ability to respond to input is locked in (and would get lots slower if the devs put in even half of the crazy stuff the playerbase keeps asking for), +rech is a variable threat to the overall quality of their work.
The devs may not handle the pr side of +rech nerfs all that well, but if they really care about getting the best quality into their game's experience, then it seems they have some reasonable justification to aim nerf guns at abusive input situations.
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This sounds plausible. How does it impact single power entities? As far as I know single power entities experience no glitches from the recharge cap down to the negative recharge cap (which I've tested with LS). And why doesn't this come into affect with player recharge? My player is at the recharge cap far more often than any "pets".
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I case you all havent noticed I am still pretty nerd raged about this nerf because it was completely unjustified.
[/ QUOTE ]
I don't disagree with your nerd rage in this case, although, I wouldn't necessarily call the lack of justification 'complete'. +rech is something that pushes coh's current combat processing into very worrisome areas. It's not like mapwide-taunt that can be capped or stacked mez that can be purple-triangled. The engine itself starts to sputter as increasingly more things want to be processed in decreasingly small windows of time.
Let me put it this way. In part of this game review the point is made that game quality is very strongly served by a 1:1 input-to-game-response ratio between the player and the game engine. If you increase the quantity of input (for example because players/ai have less recharge delay between actions) and the game's ability to respond is not increased, game quality suffers. For a game like coh where much of the game's ability to respond to input is locked in (and would get lots slower if the devs put in even half of the crazy stuff the playerbase keeps asking for), +rech is a variable threat to the overall quality of their work.
The devs may not handle the pr side of +rech nerfs all that well, but if they really care about getting the best quality into their game's experience, then it seems they have some reasonable justification to aim nerf guns at abusive input situations.
[/ QUOTE ]
Although an interesting and valid point, I suspect that this particular consideration had almost no impact on the decision by the devs.
It's true that in Castle's post he mentions the limitations of processing power to make the RIP set work as intended. This fix would entail checking which elements of a power are enhanceable by certain sets. It is my understanding reading the post, that if they could implement this change, LS would still not inherit recharge buffs as this was unintended behaviour. No where in the post was I given the impression that this unintended behaviour was related to processing power. The two thoughts, LS firing too fast, and changing the way enhancments effect powers to be CPU intensive seemed to be completely separate to me.
Draggynn on Virtue: lvl 50 Storm/Psi, 1389 badges
Draggynn's Guide to Storm Summoning(Gale-Tornado, updated 6/25/2011)
Avatar by Wassy full reference here
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I case you all havent noticed I am still pretty nerd raged about this nerf because it was completely unjustified.
[/ QUOTE ]
I don't disagree with your nerd rage in this case, although, I wouldn't necessarily call the lack of justification 'complete'. +rech is something that pushes coh's current combat processing into very worrisome areas. It's not like mapwide-taunt that can be capped or stacked mez that can be purple-triangled. The engine itself starts to sputter as increasingly more things want to be processed in decreasingly small windows of time.
Let me put it this way. In part of this game review the point is made that game quality is very strongly served by a 1:1 input-to-game-response ratio between the player and the game engine. If you increase the quantity of input (for example because players/ai have less recharge delay between actions) and the game's ability to respond is not increased, game quality suffers. For a game like coh where much of the game's ability to respond to input is locked in (and would get lots slower if the devs put in even half of the crazy stuff the playerbase keeps asking for), +rech is a variable threat to the overall quality of their work.
The devs may not handle the pr side of +rech nerfs all that well, but if they really care about getting the best quality into their game's experience, then it seems they have some reasonable justification to aim nerf guns at abusive input situations.
[/ QUOTE ]
Although an interesting and valid point, I suspect that this particular consideration had almost no impact on the decision by the devs.
It's true that in Castle's post he mentions the limitations of processing power to make the RIP set work as intended. This fix would entail checking which elements of a power are enhanceable by certain sets. It is my understanding reading the post, that if they could implement this change, LS would still not inherit recharge buffs as this was unintended behaviour. No where in the post was I given the impression that this unintended behaviour was related to processing power. The two thoughts, LS firing too fast, and changing the way enhancments effect powers to be CPU intensive seemed to be completely separate to me.
[/ QUOTE ]I still think its a crappy lie because if they are so worried about performance of the game then why do we still have uber lag on the ITF map? Why is it that grandville lags badly unless you have the latest and the greatest hardware? Literally I had to build a new system just so grandville was fully playable for me. So all that crap about performance is just garbage and I am not buying it. I am sticking by my first guess, they did it so masterminds could get kinetics.
Bump and Grind Bane/SoA
Kenja No Ishi Earth/Empathy Controller
Legendary Sannin Ninja/Pain Mastermind
Entoxicated Ninja/PSN Mastermind
Ninja Ryukenden Kat/WP Scrapper
Hellish Thoughts Fire/PSI Dominator
Thank You Devs for Merits!!!!
You fool, you should have kept it to yourself. Now the black helicopters are coming.
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I case you all havent noticed I am still pretty nerd raged about this nerf because it was completely unjustified.
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Having a power that does more damage in addition to coming up faster when you have recharge buffs on you while all other powers simply come up faster is bad design. The change brought lightning storm in line with all other powers in the game in that regard.
Yes, and no. 
Generally, your blast powers do more damage over time if you have +recharge boosts on your character. After the change, Lightning Storm still technically does more dps as your +recharge increases, because you can have multiple LS deployed at once.
Controler pets and VS on the other hand, recharge fast enough to be perma without slotting, and replace themselves when recast, so their dps does not increase, even if your character is at the recharge cap. (I think Gun Drone also replaces itself, but its base recharge is twice its base duration, so its dps does increase with the first +100% recharge; beyond that, it would have flat dps like the others.)
Hazel Black - Mind/Psi D
Stephanie Winters - Nightwidow
Jacqui Frost - Cold/Ice D
Jacqui Embers - Fire/Kin C
Simone Templar - Fire/MM B
Mallory Woods - Kin/Rad D
Sanguine Melody - Grav/Sonic C
Fumina Hara - Plant/Storm C
Nutmeg - Warshade
Lauren Wu - SS/WP B
Additionally, I wouldn't say capping Lightning Storm to one summon at a time isn't a total impossibility, given the current design direction.
I don't mean to throw a slippery slope out there, just to show that this change is just part of a ongoing reduction of the role of recharge buffs in the game.
If they did then the base recharge time would probably be reduced as well so that it's perma out of the box. That would make it more in line with voltaic sentinel. The advantage would be that it would be easier to summon in every battle, but sustained damage would go down. I prefer it the current way simply because I'm used to it and it's more intuitive, even though lowering the recharge time and making recastings overwrite it would technically be a buff in pvp and in most pve situations.
Would it be possible to have it follow us around, like Voltaic Sentinel? That would be kinda neat.
If we are to die, let us die like men. -- Patrick Cleburne
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The rule is that they must be loved. --Jayne Fynes-Clinton, Death of an Abandoned Dog
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Would it be possible to have it follow us around, like Voltaic Sentinel? That would be kinda neat.
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Please, NO. If it follows you around you lose the ability to use LS's knockback for positioning and it just becomes another random chaos inducing power. Storm already has tornado to run around and knock stuff about, it doesn't need another.
Draggynn on Virtue: lvl 50 Storm/Psi, 1389 badges
Draggynn's Guide to Storm Summoning(Gale-Tornado, updated 6/25/2011)
Avatar by Wassy full reference here
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another random chaos inducing power. Storm already has tornado to run around and knock stuff about, it doesn't need another.
[/ QUOTE ]If I didn't want chaos, I wouldn't be playing Storm
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
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If I didn't want chaos, I wouldn't be playing Storm
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Although crazed chaos is certainly one way to play a stormie, it's not the only way. I, for one, prefer to produce highly controlled chaos. A moving LS would make that much more challenging.
Draggynn on Virtue: lvl 50 Storm/Psi, 1389 badges
Draggynn's Guide to Storm Summoning(Gale-Tornado, updated 6/25/2011)
Avatar by Wassy full reference here
[ QUOTE ]
Yes, and no.
Generally, your blast powers do more damage over time if you have +recharge boosts on your character. After the change, Lightning Storm still technically does more dps as your +recharge increases, because you can have multiple LS deployed at once.
Controler pets and VS on the other hand, recharge fast enough to be perma without slotting, and replace themselves when recast, so their dps does not increase, even if your character is at the recharge cap. (I think Gun Drone also replaces itself, but its base recharge is twice its base duration, so its dps does increase with the first +100% recharge; beyond that, it would have flat dps like the others.)
[/ QUOTE ]Mmmmmm.... gatling LS......
*duos with an Ice/Storm that gets 3 storms out at once. Is a sight to behold.*
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Back Alley Brawler
Did you just use "casual gamer" and "purpled-out warshade" in the same sentence?
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I was talking about this issue on Global chat one day and I don't really recall what the resolution was so I'm asking here.
There was mention about how the defender version of Lightning Storm was unchanged or not affected somehow by the Pets attacks no longer being affected by recharge enhancements change. Recharge enhancements will only reduce recharge time of casting the power. In regards to LS, there was mention that the only way to get LS to attack more often and be affected with Recharge enhancements is if it they are mixed IOs such as DMG/RECH or ACC/RECH.
I'm not sure if I caught that last part correctly or what the entire story is on this. Could someone who understands what I'm talking about please elaborate on this a bit more?
Thank you.
Currently on Virtue:
Jinrazuo - Crab Spider
RWZ All-Pylon Solo Run