Whats a good MM combo for someone to learn MM with
By
Bim_NA,
Posted on: 2009-06-12 08:56 in Masterminds
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the best learning mm is going to be necro/dark
you learn the following:
goto
cone positioning
pet positioning
how to CC
the importance of bodyguard
while still being both solo and team viable (personal preference, but i use only the lich on a team and sometimes grave knights. the zombies themselves are more of a liability on a team)
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Finally, someone else who understands.
I had started with a Merc/dark and took it to level 23. I found It pretty easy to solo,all I had to do was use twilight Once in awhile. Team Play was a Little more Difficult. I found for me,that as long as you can control your pets, any of the MM types can be played on the harder settings with little Difficulty.
My highest MM is a bots/ff and I can steamroll anything.
Anything.
I run on CL 4 or 5. Usually 4 because I like the bigger fights rather than just flattening one purple guy. I can solo AVs without much trouble, only losing a bot or two, and if things DO go pear-shaped, PFF is there to save the day.
However, yes boredom can be a factor as you really become kinda extraneous after around level 30 or so. Mostly you're there to bubble pets and toss an occasional heal other around, but the rest of the time you can read or do emotes or post on the forums :-)
My second highest is a Necro/Storm which is much busier and more challenging but I find suits me perfectly :-)
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Originally Posted by eltonio
This is over the top mental slavery.
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My highest MM is a bots/ff and I can steamroll anything.
Anything.
However, yes boredom can be a factor as you really become kinda extraneous after around level 30 or so. Mostly you're there to bubble pets and toss an occasional heal other around, but the rest of the time you can read or do emotes or post on the forums :-)
My second highest is a Necro/Storm which is much busier and more challenging but I find suits me perfectly :-)
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That's why if I ever get around to rerolling my original thug MM test server char I'll take the personal attacks. The char was a thug/ff. Intensely fun, but /ff didn't give me much to do beyond buffing pets once every few minutes.
Come to think of it, FF is the one defender primary I could never really enjoy.
"The danger is not that a particular class is unfit to govern. Every class is unfit to govern." Lord Acton
Madam Enigma's History
My first MM was a Merc/Posion. And it wasn't IMO "noob" friendly. LOL. I hated it... I only leveled him out of shear stubbereness. I didn't want the game to DEFEAT me cause i was having issues learning to play a Char i had a CONCEPT for. I didn't want to change his concept, and i didn't want to admit defeat, so... I keep going, and he really leveled out and got pretty fun in the later levels. Now, at 50, I love him. He's got a -res prog in each pet... plus his own debuffs... i make mince meat out of stuff.
But it's not for a noob IMO.
My easiest MM from start to finish was my Bot/Dark. The difference was jaring. Very easy, very powerful... very few headachs... NOTHING like my first one. I'd start there IMO.
My Thugs/Pain IMO is my "BEST", as far as teaming goes. It's not as easy as the Bot/Dark, nor does it have the raw firepower, but it's better team support with great damage. I'd recommend it too.
@KingSnake - Triumph Server
@PrinceSnake
My common sense is tingling... ~ Deadpool
If you can't learn to do something well... learn to enjoy doing it poorly...
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But it's not for a noob IMO.
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Exactly. A noob refuses to learn, a newbie will learn though. The OP specifically asked for one that's good for learning the AT with. And the best way to learn a class is to be challenged and forced to learn.
Your first was a merc/poison. And you kept going because you refused to admit defeat. Now, in hind sight are you glad you started with a challenging combo? Or do you think you'd have learned as much about playing a mastermind if you'd gone with a easy combo which barely requires effort such as bots/force field? /poison is a great secondary to learn masterminds with because it forces you to learn what your doing. It's a case of learn or die frequently.
"The danger is not that a particular class is unfit to govern. Every class is unfit to govern." Lord Acton
Madam Enigma's History
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But it's not for a noob IMO.
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Exactly. A noob refuses to learn, a newbie will learn though. The OP specifically asked for one that's good for learning the AT with. And the best way to learn a class is to be challenged and forced to learn.
Your first was a merc/poison. And you kept going because you refused to admit defeat. Now, in hind sight are you glad you started with a challenging combo? Or do you think you'd have learned as much about playing a mastermind if you'd gone with a easy combo which barely requires effort such as bots/force field? /poison is a great secondary to learn masterminds with because it forces you to learn what your doing. It's a case of learn or die frequently.
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In all honesty, i was thinking pretty much the same thing you just said as i was typing up my reply... cause I am kind of thankful i started with a harder build... forced to me learn how to make and manage macros, something i've taken into OTHER at's to great effect... much like playing my first ever hero was a Gravity/Kin, and THAT made me work back then too...
I suppose I took the OP's question to be, "that's a good starter MM" to mean, what's a good "easy" mm to play... and that's how i answered it. heh.
In that vain, if your looking for a build that'll challange you and force you to think and learn... /posion is a GREAT secondary... or maybe /TA.. i've been thinking about making a 4th MM myself with /TA, cause i like the secondary so much on my troller... pick any primary.
@KingSnake - Triumph Server
@PrinceSnake
My common sense is tingling... ~ Deadpool
If you can't learn to do something well... learn to enjoy doing it poorly...
While I had a merc/poison, a necro/dark, and a thugs/dark, it was ninja/storm that really made me able to play a mastermind. Hell, my thugs/dark was so easy I took almost none of my secondary. I didn't need it to solo, so I didn't see the point.
Ninja are squishy as sin starting out. Even in teams I had trouble keeping three genin alive. They're a bit like fire imps in that they love to jump into other groups to agro. This forced me to learn storm aggressively in order to solo, as well as the finer points of macros, keybinds, and pet positioning. My nin/storm was my first villain to 50 and now I can hardly stand to play with storm defenders blueside because it's clear how many of them never have to learn their powerset in order to survive.
Incidentally, going from nin/storm to, well, just about anything, was a walk in the park. I wouldn't suggest ninja/storm for someone unwilling to learn, but it's definitely rewarding and very powerful for the dedicated mastermind.
I'd say it all depends on how much frustration you're willing to deal with in learning a new AT. Like I posted before, I started with ninja/storm and it wasn't as much fun as I'd hoped for a "starter" combo. It felt more like work than play, and I often wondered if my ninjas were even in the same fights I was in since they often ignored whatever was attacking me, even when in bodyguard mode.
I eventually named them Leo, Kelso, Eric, and Fez, after I kept picturing the Jounin talking to the others in Tommy Chong's voice. It was like "Hey, I think I know that guy, man" while they stood by, watching a Werewolf throw me across the street in Cap during ToT as they stood around sharing in the circle. As some of my SG mates can attest it got to the point where I would actually talk as Leo (Chong) whenever we were on voice chat, which at least got laughs from everyone.
The bots almost never fail to step in to defend me when I'm attacked on my bots/ff. The ninjas seemed to excel at watching me get killed over and over, without lifting a finger. Especially the Jounin. Maybe I just had really bad luck with the AI. I double and triple checked the macros to make sure everything was set up properly. *shrugs* It turned me off from that combo though, and if I hadn't had a different experience with my bots/FF I probably wouldn't have played a MM after that.
I've started a ninja/dark since getting my bots/ff to 50, so we'll see how that plays out. So far with no change in tactics from the last ninja MM, they seem to actually be involved in the same fights I am at level 22.
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Daemonchilde: ((fluffy thinks he's a tank)) Demon . Hunter: (( I think mine is >.> Daemonchilde: ((Yours is no longer fluffy, it is Obliteron, destroyer of worlds)) |
I just tried Bots/Dark, I've only gotten to lvl8 so far. After playing a Dark Defender to 50, it seems easier.
I'm not sure I'll need stamina.
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I just tried Bots/Dark, I've only gotten to lvl8 so far. After playing a Dark Defender to 50, it seems easier.
I'm not sure I'll need stamina.
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Think again.
Dark... yea you want stamina. Those are some expensive toggles.
"The danger is not that a particular class is unfit to govern. Every class is unfit to govern." Lord Acton
Madam Enigma's History
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I suggest Necro/Dark. The combo is pretty easy to get the hang of, and provides some wonderful mitigation and absolutely superb crowd control.
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Personally I found the zombies harder/more annoying to control than Bots or Mercs, but - as always - YMMV.
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My experience with the zombies is that when injured they love to run off a split second before Twilight Grasp fires 
That said, so long as at the start of the battle they got off their two (small) aoe vomits onto the mobs that I'd usually Darkest-Night-Corner-Pulled into a bunch on Tar Patch, I didn't really care what happened to them after that.
Necro/Dark was my first MM and is a fairly solid performer able to trample most encounters, especially once you have Fearsome Stare. It wasn't my first MM 50 though, that was a Bots/FF - it's not fast, but on the other hand nothing slows it down either and it practically plays itself (which may or may not be a good thing).
I think I've played them all. My first CoV charachter was Necro/Posion. Extremely powerful late game, but a bit of a bother early. For a first timer, I'd say go Necro/Dark, Bots/Dark, or Thugs/Dark. Extremely fun, not boring, and able to debuff the heck out everything in the game. Also getting "Dark Fluffy"later on, as a pet, is great. It's like having a second MM there to debuff, do damage, and heal.
My level 50 Dominators:
Madame Mindbender 50 Mind/Energy
Fly Agaric 50 Plant/Thorn
Nate Nitro 50 Fire/Psi
the best learning mm is going to be necro/dark
you learn the following:
goto
cone positioning
pet positioning
how to CC
the importance of bodyguard
while still being both solo and team viable (personal preference, but i use only the lich on a team and sometimes grave knights. the zombies themselves are more of a liability on a team)