Finally someone gets it.
Winner of Players' Choice Best Villainous Arc 2010: Fear and Loathing on Striga; ID #350522
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I played a mission yesterday that for all intents and purposes was a farm. It was "cleverly disguised" as a story with a plot but all it really was was a vehicle to put the team up against the weakest possible custom enemies and level 51 AVs that would give 376 thousand xp to a level 49 character. That's almost a bubble per AV. There was 7 or 8 of them on the map.
Normally, in real missions, this particular AV wouldn't be found in seven or eight easily dispatched instances in the same easily navigated map, filled with such laughably pathetic foes. Normally this AV would only be found at the end of a 2-hour TF, or an almost equally long story arc, or possibly as a bank robber in Peregrine Island. Lord Recluse doesn't leave his tower for nothing.
The problem is thus: we can create missions which puts us up against enemies with insane rewards which lets us bypass hours worth of "build-up" which we would normally have to slog through in order to reach that enemy. This build-up period is what usually keeps us from "farming" those enemies effectively.
As terrible as it seems to me, I think what is needed to keep MA missions in check is a "cool-down period" on AVs and other highly rewarding enemies. After killing an AV in a MA mission we could get a temporary power which would reduce the rewards from killing other AVs within its duration. This temporary power would stack with itself so the more AVs you kill and the faster you kill them, the less reward you would get from each. The reward should not reach zero, but it should be discouraging farms like this. Instead of getting from level 49 to 50 in a single mission we might have to play through an entire arc of 5 missions, which seems much more in line with the normal game content.
Normal story-based MA arcs should probably not be affected too terribly by this suggestion since they would presumably have a reasonable amount of AVs in a single mission. "Real-world" content should not be affected either since those AVs shouldn't drop this temporary power on us.
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This is working as intended, and probably won't be something they get rid of.
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Why do people seem to be begging to get MA missions nerfed?
Heck, let's just get it over with and have all rewards in MA reduced by 75%...
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It will happen, and there will be tears.
"But but but its in the game right now so it must be working as intended".
Rrrright...
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On the other hand, some people here do have a valid point: such AVs are dangerous (or at least supposed to be), which means they have high risk. High risk means high reward, which in and of itself is balanced.
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Does everyone like bs'n themselves in these forums?
Most AV's are a joke in pug teams of 4+. I imagine farm teams have even less trouble.
Lots of risk in killing AV's with a semi-competent group. 
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Why do people seem to be begging to get MA missions nerfed?
Heck, let's just get it over with and have all rewards in MA reduced by 75%...
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It will happen, and there will be tears.
"But but but its in the game right now so it must be working as intended".
Rrrright...
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Oh that there will, but as usual it will be the suckups that have brought the lightening down on their own heads. The farmers will move on the regular players will move away perhaps to other games, and the suckups and the storytellers that a pure MA will be left wondering why no one plays their stories.
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On the other hand, some people here do have a valid point: such AVs are dangerous (or at least supposed to be), which means they have high risk. High risk means high reward, which in and of itself is balanced.
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Does everyone like bs'n themselves in these forums?
Most AV's are a joke in pug teams of 4+. I imagine farm teams have even less trouble.
Lots of risk in killing AV's with a semi-competent group.
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By that logic why have any AV anywhere give more xp ? Or bosses for that matter ?
Hmmm more MA nerfs = badd mojo.
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Normally, in real missions, this particular AV wouldn't be found in seven or eight easily dispatched instances in the same easily navigated map, filled with such laughably pathetic foes. Normally this AV would only be found at the end of a 2-hour TF, or an almost equally long story arc, or possibly as a bank robber in Peregrine Island. Lord Recluse doesn't leave his tower for nothing.
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True perhaps in "real missions", but that does not mean it does not happen regular game content. Few years ago I woulda thought you were describing RV. 3 AVs will spawn every time one side gains more turrets then other.. accomplishable easily within 1-20 mins w/ pretty small group. And the AVs would be in zone with "laughably pathetic" foes known as PvPers.
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On the other hand, some people here do have a valid point: such AVs are dangerous (or at least supposed to be), which means they have high risk. High risk means high reward, which in and of itself is balanced.
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Does everyone like bs'n themselves in these forums?
Most AV's are a joke in pug teams of 4+. I imagine farm teams have even less trouble.
Lots of risk in killing AV's with a semi-competent group.
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By that logic why have any AV anywhere give more xp ? Or bosses for that matter ?
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Yes! Thats exactly how extreme i want it to be
My Point: The risk everyone talks about is completely overblown. Yes they should still give xp, but dont act like AV's cant be farmed easily for great rewards /facepalm
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I played a mission yesterday that for all intents and purposes was a farm. It was "cleverly disguised" as a story with a plot but all it really was was a vehicle to put the team up against the weakest possible custom enemies and level 51 AVs that would give 376 thousand xp to a level 49 character. That's almost a bubble per AV. There was 7 or 8 of them on the map.
Normally, in real missions, this particular AV wouldn't be found in seven or eight easily dispatched instances in the same easily navigated map, filled with such laughably pathetic foes. Normally this AV would only be found at the end of a 2-hour TF, or an almost equally long story arc, or possibly as a bank robber in Peregrine Island. Lord Recluse doesn't leave his tower for nothing.
The problem is thus: we can create missions which puts us up against enemies with insane rewards which lets us bypass hours worth of "build-up" which we would normally have to slog through in order to reach that enemy. This build-up period is what usually keeps us from "farming" those enemies effectively.
As terrible as it seems to me, I think what is needed to keep MA missions in check is a "cool-down period" on AVs and other highly rewarding enemies. After killing an AV in a MA mission we could get a temporary power which would reduce the rewards from killing other AVs within its duration. This temporary power would stack with itself so the more AVs you kill and the faster you kill them, the less reward you would get from each. The reward should not reach zero, but it should be discouraging farms like this. Instead of getting from level 49 to 50 in a single mission we might have to play through an entire arc of 5 missions, which seems much more in line with the normal game content.
Normal story-based MA arcs should probably not be affected too terribly by this suggestion since they would presumably have a reasonable amount of AVs in a single mission. "Real-world" content should not be affected either since those AVs shouldn't drop this temporary power on us.
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I dont really recall to much build up to fighting 8 AVs at a time in the LRTF. I dont recall to much build up to a mission that has 4 avs followed by another 4 in the next in the Statesman TF. Or to much build up to the mostly "kill boss" avs in the Jenkins story arc, that i believe is 12-13 in a row if i recall.
I personally think what we need is a "cool-down" period where anyone who wants to judge how others want to spend their time gets an account suspension for 3 days, with no refund for time off. Cause unfortunately people seem to not realize that another player either playing through the "build-up" to an AV or not, doesnt effect their life in the slightest, but seem hell bent on making others want to play only their way.
You would think "heroes" would be into things like tollerance, freedom of choice, live and let live......
So rate the ARC as you see fit and move along to the next one. No one forced you to play this Arc.
The whining and complaining over "farms" is getting old already. Any MA created content can be considered a farm.
If you did not like the story, the content or whatever, quit the mission and rate it as you feel appropriate. Then move on to something else.
Shard Warrior - 50 MA/Regen/BM Scrapper
Founding Member and Leader : Shadow-Force
Co-Leader: Council of Heroes
"Whatever evils come this way... we will be there to stop them."
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Why do people seem to be begging to get MA missions nerfed?
Heck, let's just get it over with and have all rewards in MA reduced by 75%...
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These people think that if us dirty farmers weren't farming, that we would be playing their stupid arcs.
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I personally think what we need is a "cool-down" period where anyone who wants to judge how others want to spend their time gets an account suspension for 3 days, with no refund for time off.
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Ummmm.... I hate to bring this up ... but, um.... we need to suspend your account for 3 days.
Unfortunately, by making your recommendation you accidentally made a judgment on how others should spend 3 days of their time ...i.e., suspended. 
I'm just saying ...
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Break out the whips and the hairshirts
Somebody made a story that gives good rewards
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he may be right! nerf the stf!. 5 av's and a GM in the final mission is obviously a farm.
Lots of 50's yada yada. still finding fun things to do.
Cthulhu loves you, better start running
I�! I�! Gg�gorsch�a�bha egurtsa�ar�ug d� Dalhor! Cthluhu fthagn! Cthluhu fthagn!
You are in a maze of twisty little passages
When will ppl stop crying a river over MA? Are you guys set on driving away half your player base? Look at how many so called "farm" maps in MA. If you can only create 3 per account, then why is there still hundreds if not thosands of them? Please let your fellow players enjoy their $15 a month and stop telling them how you would like them to play. Eventually there will be no one left bc everyone is fed up with all these complaints. Just accept MA for what it is and stop dwelling on the past. The devs will do what they need to do, but it seems like you will still find a way to cry about it on the forums.
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Reporting an AE farm isn't griefing.
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When there is no definition of what a farm is and mish's get banned without any human evaluation, it most certainly is.
By even the most expansive definition of farms, what teh OP describes isn't one. If it meets your own personal standard, which exists only in your head and you get it banned for that reason, that's griefing in my book. It lets the lowest common denominator decide what's a farm. To prove a point, maybe I should start reporting anything that gives more xp than a map full of rikti monkeys as a farm.
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Reporting it in itself doesn't get it banned. They look at the reported content before banning them. The report gives them a 'flag', if you will.
The fact that they are indeed banning farms makes it impossible for it to be griefing by reporting an arc as such.
Farm, don't farm, whatever. It doesnt matter to me, but implying that someone who reports farm missions is griefing is plain wrong.
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Break out the whips and the hairshirts
Somebody made a story that gives good rewards
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he may be right! nerf the stf!. 5 av's and a GM in the final mission is obviously a farm.
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Because all AV's are created equal right?
You cant possibly make weak and farmable AVs/Boss/Lt/Minion for your farm characters.
Thats UnPossible!!!!
There is no farms
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... which lets us bypass hours worth of "build-up" which we would normally have to slog through...
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Damn AE! Gets rid of the slogging part!? That's just wrong. If you don't eat your meat, you can't have any pudding. How can you have any pudding if you don't eat your meat!?
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=
The whining and complaining over "farms" is getting old already.
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Getting?
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Reporting it in itself doesn't get it banned. They look at the reported content before banning them. The report gives them a 'flag', if you will.
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I won't. You know what's awesome? Having some semblance of a clue about what you're talking about before you open your bonghole.
Complaints get a mish pulled, and you have a chance to revise and update. If it gets more complaints, it gets locked. Then you can go to CS to have it reviewed. In his postings on this Posi made it pretty clear that this is when actual human beings look at the mission. This, IIRC, is when a mission gets a flag and is unbannable until it is changed. If a person was deciding whether or not it should be locked initially, why would I have the option of going to CS?
Since you can have a mish pulled through reports and make the player have to petition to get his slot back, the system is wide open for griefing.
'On farms', ho well, this thread should be in "the official farm thread' in city life.
Besides, for the griefers i got a warning in front of my farm, sayin, "farm"....
....this said,
The only issue here is that i see some venues,
appealing like fruits of the loom,
some dudes are saying:
"In this Arc, you will have some challenge, speak to the alien, and meet leonardo di cap , oops, Da Vinci"
and all i got is:
crap.
so, in the 1st place, if you want to shoot high, aim low.
(soz for the english, im french.)
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Reporting it in itself doesn't get it banned. They look at the reported content before banning them. The report gives them a 'flag', if you will.
The fact that they are indeed banning farms makes it impossible for it to be griefing by reporting an arc as such.
Farm, don't farm, whatever. It doesnt matter to me, but implying that someone who reports farm missions is griefing is plain wrong.
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No, they don't. It is obviously an automatic process. If an arc gets enough complaints to push it over a threshold compared to how many votes it has, it gets banned automatically. It is then up to the player to appeal the lock.
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Reporting it in itself doesn't get it banned. They look at the reported content before banning them. The report gives them a 'flag', if you will.
The fact that they are indeed banning farms makes it impossible for it to be griefing by reporting an arc as such.
Farm, don't farm, whatever. It doesnt matter to me, but implying that someone who reports farm missions is griefing is plain wrong.
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No, they don't. It is obviously an automatic process. If an arc gets enough complaints to push it over a threshold compared to how many votes it has, it gets banned automatically. It is then up to the player to appeal the lock.
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a real good farmer cant get banned, since he asks for 5 stars per runs.
Are you talkin' about PL'ers?
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Reporting it in itself doesn't get it banned. They look at the reported content before banning them. The report gives them a 'flag', if you will.
The fact that they are indeed banning farms makes it impossible for it to be griefing by reporting an arc as such.
Farm, don't farm, whatever. It doesnt matter to me, but implying that someone who reports farm missions is griefing is plain wrong.
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No, they don't. It is obviously an automatic process. If an arc gets enough complaints to push it over a threshold compared to how many votes it has, it gets banned automatically. It is then up to the player to appeal the lock.
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a real good farmer cant get banned, since he asks for 5 stars per runs.
Are you talkin' about PL'ers?
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Most of the farmers I know do one or two things, they either publish on demand or they want 3 star or less ratings.
On one hand, the OP is right - the ability to place many, many copies of an AV that gives such high reward in a single mission (i.e. without the preceding time investment of their normal in-game encounters, such as task/strike forces or long story arcs) is of concern.
On the other hand, some people here do have a valid point: such AVs are dangerous (or at least supposed to be), which means they have high risk. High risk means high reward, which in and of itself is balanced. The real question here is are the rewards for these AVs balanced around the encounter itself, or the encounter plus the time and effort that's needed to get to them in the first place in the regular game?
"If I had Force powers, vacuum or not my cape/clothes/hair would always be blowing in the Dramatic Wind." - Tenzhi
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