http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Threat
It's part of the Threat calculation. Higher ThreatLevel gives you higher Threat, which makes it easier for you to take and hold aggro.
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
And people point and make fun of me for leaving SS on in battle as a squishie. Hah!
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http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Threat
It's part of the Threat calculation. Higher ThreatLevel gives you higher Threat, which makes it easier for you to take and hold aggro.
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And as I recall, most self-stealth gives some form of -Threat.
Orc&Pie No.53230 There is an orc, and somehow, he got a pie. And you are hungry.
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Negaduck: I see you found the crumb. I knew you'd never notice the huge flag.
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And people point and make fun of me for leaving SS on in battle as a squishie. Hah!
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Question is, does it suppress in combat? ;p
Orc&Pie No.53230 There is an orc, and somehow, he got a pie. And you are hungry.
www.repeat-offenders.net
Negaduck: I see you found the crumb. I knew you'd never notice the huge flag.
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And people point and make fun of me for leaving SS on in battle as a squishie. Hah!
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Question is, does it suppress in combat? ;p
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As I recall, yes.
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And people point and make fun of me for leaving SS on in battle as a squishie. Hah!
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Question is, does it suppress in combat? ;p
[/ QUOTE ] During battle and 10 seconds thereafter, yes.
But it is slightly useful to have if you fight in melee and the foe starts running away. You catch them a LOT sooner. lol
As long as you have the endurance/recovery to back it up.. no reason not to just keep it on. lol
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http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Threat
It's part of the Threat calculation. Higher ThreatLevel gives you higher Threat, which makes it easier for you to take and hold aggro.
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And as I recall, most self-stealth gives some form of -Threat.
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Here's a list that Jade_Dragon put together.
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When ever i have SS on my power thing says i have minus threat lvl and i kinda of want to know what the hell that is.
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For the most part, you can think of it as another stealth effect. Technically it isn't, but you're only likely to have an issue with that technicality in PvP. Stacking stealth+SS gives you full invisibility. It's better than Invisibility from the power pool because it doesn't make you "Only Affecting Self", but it's nowhere near as good as what Illusion Control gets.
Some of the stealth effects do not stack with each other but, since SS is 'technically' not stealth, it stacks with all of them.
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When ever i have SS on my power thing says i have minus threat lvl and i kinda of want to know what the hell that is.
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For the most part, you can think of it as another stealth effect. Technically it isn't, but you're only likely to have an issue with that technicality in PvP. Stacking stealth+SS gives you full invisibility. It's better than Invisibility from the power pool because it doesn't make you "Only Affecting Self", but it's nowhere near as good as what Illusion Control gets.
Some of the stealth effects do not stack with each other but, since SS is 'technically' not stealth, it stacks with all of them.
[/ QUOTE ]Keep in mind SS does not give stealth vs other players (PVP zones/arena).
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When ever i have SS on my power thing says i have minus threat lvl and i kinda of want to know what the hell that is.
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For the most part, you can think of it as another stealth effect. Technically it isn't, but you're only likely to have an issue with that technicality in PvP. Stacking stealth+SS gives you full invisibility. It's better than Invisibility from the power pool because it doesn't make you "Only Affecting Self", but it's nowhere near as good as what Illusion Control gets.
Some of the stealth effects do not stack with each other but, since SS is 'technically' not stealth, it stacks with all of them.
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-Threat and and stealth have nothing to do with each other. Not in the way you are indicating.
Orc&Pie No.53230 There is an orc, and somehow, he got a pie. And you are hungry.
www.repeat-offenders.net
Negaduck: I see you found the crumb. I knew you'd never notice the huge flag.
-threat is NOT stealth, and is only considered a type of stealth by some people because some foes may not attack you. They will still notice you, but won't care you are there, and might not attack.
Stealth is just the distance at which the foes will or wont notice you.
Combine the two, and you end up being able to go almost anywhere, and even if you do get close enough to be noticed, the foes wont care that you are hanging around.
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-threat is NOT stealth, and is only considered a type of stealth by some people because some foes may not attack you. They will still notice you, but won't care you are there, and might not attack.
Stealth is just the distance at which the foes will or wont notice you.
Combine the two, and you end up being able to go almost anywhere, and even if you do get close enough to be noticed, the foes wont care that you are hanging around.
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Maybe that explains getting pretty close to Rikti Drones, who ignore stealth, yet sometimes don't bother to shoot you. Provided you start out with an AT that has a threat level of 1 or less.
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Tanks start with a Threat level of 4. This is why many tanks ask you to kindly not invis them, because it reduces their threat level. A tank always works best that is the first seen by a new group of foes, they will always consider him the biggest threat. It is then up to him/her to back that up with some form of taunt or attack to multiply that threat.
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When ever i have SS on my power thing says i have minus threat lvl and i kinda of want to know what the hell that is.
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For the most part, you can think of it as another stealth effect. Technically it isn't, but you're only likely to have an issue with that technicality in PvP. Stacking stealth+SS gives you full invisibility. It's better than Invisibility from the power pool because it doesn't make you "Only Affecting Self", but it's nowhere near as good as what Illusion Control gets.
Some of the stealth effects do not stack with each other but, since SS is 'technically' not stealth, it stacks with all of them.
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-Threat and and stealth have nothing to do with each other. Not in the way you are indicating.
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orly? So you're saying they don't combine for effective invisibility?
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orly? So you're saying they don't combine for effective invisibility?
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No. They're saying the fact that they combine for effective invisibility has nothing to do with -threat. Only +stealth.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
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http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Threat
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Hm. There seems to be something off about that formula they give. If you have no taunt effects, then your final threat calculation would be zero. We know that's not the case.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
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http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Threat
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Hm. There seems to be something off about that formula they give. If you have no taunt effects, then your final threat calculation would be zero. We know that's not the case.
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And if there's no debuff effect, it would also be zero, which we know is not the case. If you have a non-damaging effect, it would also be zero, which we know is not the case.
THe formula is the best information that we have gotten. Most of those values floor at 1, meaning that they will keep the threat level of the other values. We don't know if (TauntDurationRemaining * 1,000) floors at one, or a much lower value, in order to keep aggro values low for anyone without a Taunt effect.
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
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"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
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We don't know if (TauntDurationRemaining * 1,000) floors at one, or a much lower value, in order to keep aggro values low for anyone without a Taunt effect.
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Yeah, that could do it. If the taunt floor is .001 it would work out.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
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Tanks start with a Threat level of 4. This is why many tanks ask you to kindly not invis them, because it reduces their threat level. A tank always works best that is the first seen by a new group of foes, they will always consider him the biggest threat. It is then up to him/her to back that up with some form of taunt or attack to multiply that threat.
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That initial 'sighting' of the Tanker is worthless if it's not backed up with an attack or taunt, as you admit. Without that back up, any teammate can easily grab 'sighting' agro way from the Tanker by attacking. And so, to ensure the grabbing of agro, the Tanker has to attack and/or taunt, which always breaks invisibility anyway.
Furthermore, Group Invisibility is the only buff that can be bestowed on another character to reduce their threat. This brings the Tanker's threat level from 4 to 3. Three times 1000 from Taunt times the modifier for an attack makes the Tanker's Threat Level still insanely higher than any other AT. Additionally, if Group Invisibility is used, then not only is the Tanker's Threat Level reduced by 1, so is the threat level of all the other teammates that catch that buff, still making the Tanker the highest rated Threat on the team.
It is important to remember that as soon as the Tanker attacks, even with Taunt, his invisibility is gone, but not any secondary defense the invis buff may have. Not only is his invis gone, but the other members of the spawn which the Tanker hasn't Taunted or hit yet are aware of his presence unless the Tanker is trying to pull from a long distance, in which case, then it is actually more helpful for the Tanker to be invised!
Finally, if a Tanker is relying upon being seen to hold agro, then HE'S DOING IT WRONG! Foes which only see the Tanker and haven't been Taunted or hit by the Tanker for a heap of Punchvoke will go after the Blasters, who, even though they have a lower Threat rating and are farther away, will easily surpass the Tanker's final Threat Rating because of all the damage they're doing to their friends in the spawn. Also, if a Tanker thinks that simply being visible running by a spawn will make them all give chase around a corner without the aid of an attack or a taunt or a damage/taunt aura, then HE'S DOING IT WRONG! Foes not attacked nor taunted easily give up the chase on a player who runs and hides.
I'd rather see a Tanker invised all the time in order to force them to grab agro the correct way rather than relying on any sort of 'being seen' which is inconsequential for holding agro once the fight begins.
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Some of the stealth effects do not stack with each other but, since SS is 'technically' not stealth, it stacks with all of them.
[/ QUOTE ]All stealth effects stack. Most stealth toggles are mutually exclusive (you can't have two on at the same time).
And Super Speed IS technically stealth; it has 35ft PvE-only stealth to go with the -1 ThreatLevel.
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
AFAIK, the -Threat on powers that have it does not suppress. It has nothing to do with stealth (which effects when you gain aggro in the first place) it reduces aggro.
My understanding is that Threat is a multiplier which is applied to your damage when you hit a foe. That is how much aggro you have from that foe. If an ally on your team has twice the Threat rating, he will have twice the aggro, even if he does the exact same damage.
Thus, Super Speed makes it harder for you to get aggro(because of its stealth) and makes you get less aggro when you do get it. (Because of its -Threat) As SS is a travel power, this gives you some protection, since you are not able to fly over foes like with Flying and Super Leap, and stay out of their radius of perception. It can be used in combat, though, as others have mentioned, and will make it easier for the tank to pull aggro off of you.
I'm not quite sure exactly how it works, but since Threat can actually be reduced to zero, I usually guess that your aggro is damage * (Threat+1). I don't think you will get aggro of zero all the time when your Threat is zero, but I suppose it's possible. (An aggro of zero might not mean you can't aggro foes, but you would always be the bottom of the aggro list)
And thanks to StarGeek for posting my list. It's not really clear what gives -Threat and what doesn't, and I suspect this has changed over the years. (I could have sworn Stealth gave -Threat, even though most Brute and Scrapper stealth powers didn't. My list was compiled from City of Data, though, so it's at least as accurate as that)
Jade, the link to the Threat formula has been given here, which explains most of what we know about how Threat is generated.
If you are attacking, or applying debuffs or doing other non-damaging moves to an enemy, you will have a threat value. It can only be zero before a fight has begun (i.e., the enemy doesn't know you're even there), or if you stop fighting and run away, and allow aggro to degradate back to zero (when the enemy returns to it's starting point).
Other than that, aggro will never be at zero. The Threat formula has a lot of points where the value won't go below 1, so you'll always have at least a 1 value for Threat.
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
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AFAIK, the -Threat on powers that have it does not suppress.
[/ QUOTE ]Powers with -Threat, and whether the -Threat get suppressed:
Super Speed: suppresses
Invisibility: does not suppress
Phase Shift: suppresses (on click glowy only)
Superior Invisibility: suppresses
Group Invisibility: does not suppress
Quantum Flight: suppresses (on click glowy only)
Nebulous Form: suppresses (on click glowy only)
Hyper Phase: suppresses (on click glowy only)
Combat Invisibility: suppresses
I think there's a few more temp powers with -Threat, but I think the point has been made.
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
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Jade, the link to the Threat formula has been given here, which explains most of what we know about how Threat is generated.
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Actually, I hadn't checked that link, but it is quite complete. It even lists the powers with negative Threat. I guess I just posted to be redundant. 
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Other than that, aggro will never be at zero. The Threat formula has a lot of points where the value won't go below 1, so you'll always have at least a 1 value for Threat.
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If AT Mod is a multiplier, and AT Mod is zero, then anything AT Mod is multiplied by will be zero. The formula does not contradict that. However, it is possible a min cap is placed on the AT Mod during the calculation, or the AT Mod is increased by one. The AT Mod itself isn't capped, though, I've seen it go to zero. And it seems to me a waste to allow a value to go to zero, when it will actually not have an effect different from 1.
I suppose it's possible, though, at which time negative Stealth would really only apply to melers, Kheldians, SoA, and Masterminds. I don't think the formula itself is taken from the game, but what the devs have told us that it is.
When ever i have SS on my power thing says i have minus threat lvl and i kinda of want to know what the hell that is. Thanks for any help you can give me.