Defender Inspired...but in need of further counsel


DropZone

 

Posted

I'm still new to all-things CoX (2 month old account)...but am hungrily wishing to create a Defender (or Defenders) that can solo and team with little interruption in my joyful playtime as I level. I have read and reviewed quite a number of the guides and posts found here, but I'd like a little more insight into what I can expect from several specific powerset mixes for PvE play from my peers in cyberland.

They are as follows:

TA/Psi

Storm/Psi

Ice/Ice

Storm/Ice

FF/*

Or any other combination you might suggest. I'll add that I am VERY attracted to any AT that I can mix into a Controller-ish playstyle that can defend, support attack and even heal if the need is present (though not as a primary healer).

Thanks in advance for all your consideration and contribution.


 

Posted

Well, if you want to solo imho the top three primaries are dark, storm, and rad. You want team friendly too, rad would be top, then dark, then storm. I find it interesting that neither rad or dark are even on your list...just don't like them?

TA I have issues with mitigation, at least early game. You can also have trouble getting into teams if you are trying to just get on random teams. Random average player out there = " a defender with no heal? What is that? Me no like"

FF they can understand a bit easier, but that one can be very slow to solo with.

Cold primary I refuse to play unless they ever change the look of the ice shields, so that's the only comment I make on that one.

Out of all the ones you actually listed, storm/ice would be my pick. Very good solo and can be very useful to a team. I still prefer storm/dark blast as the best synergy for storm though. With dark blast you get an immobilize and stacking stuns and a self heal, all very nice.


 

Posted

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TA I have issues with mitigation, at least early game. You can also have trouble getting into teams if you are trying to just get on random teams. Random average player out there = " a defender with no heal? What is that? Me no like"

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And there are also players who actively seek debuffers. Not "healers", not buffers, debuffers. I didn't get Task Force Commander on my TA/Dark by being in a supergroup (never joined one with that character), being invited to teams by forumites (no-one from the forums had ever teamed with my TA/Dark before i acquired TF Commander), or by begging (even if i weren't too terrified of people to send /tells, that wouldn't be my style).

Of course, I'm not being inundated with invitations to Shadow Shard TFs either (or Hess, or the trials...), but I'm just making sure the OP understands that TA is not saddled with the stigma that it used to have. It's not the most popular powerset, but it's not shunned these days and there are intelligent players out there who are aware of the power of debuffs and actively seek them out for their teams.


 

Posted

Welcome to the forums, LordOfRebirth! I'm a big fan of Radiation Emission / Sonic for a mixed-bag Defender myself. Really though, find something that looks fun to *you* and to heck with what you think you ought to be playing. Defenders are good like that, in that even the least synergistic pairing can bring a ton to the team.

(Tangentially related)
I want to love Trick Arrow, I really do. I like all the powers (on paper), as well as the look. There's something buried in my brain about TA from when it launched though, in the dark times when they over-corrected it. That, and I can't seem to figure out what I want to pair it with more, /Dark or /Ice.

Help me Luminara, you're my only hope!


 

Posted

I support Storm/Ice with a hearty HEAR HEAR. The storm set brings a mixed bag of debuffs: speed, recharge, accuracy, defense. The ice blast has a slow component in each attack. The ice storm and blizzard bring big attack numbers; combined with freezing rain, it's a true death zone of triple rain goodness.

Storm is a set that needs more attention to position and terrain. It's also very rewarding. Balancing the possibility of knocking everything hither and thither to your team's dismay with being effective in every situation with your stormy goodness is a fine balance. With experience you will recognize when and where to drop your lightning storm, your tornado, where to use herdicane, and when to just smack an unsuspecting group with freezing rain.

Oh, and coming from an altaholic like myself: try them all, you will find one you like.


Triumphant Defenders Forever
Psylenz FF/Psi, ArticQuark Storm/Rad, Symon BarSisyphus Bots/psn, Max VanSydow Thugs/Dk, Cyclone Symon Bots/stm, Blue Loki Ice/Cd, Widow 46526
HelinCarnate:OMG it is so terrible. I have the option to take 3 more powers but no additional slots. Boo F'ing hoo.

 

Posted

Cold Domination/ is a set that is decent for teaming and solo play. However, one third of the set is dedicated toward teaming, (i.e. can't be used when solo) leading to a somewhat different play style when on teams.

/Ice Blast is a decently strong blasting set (at least, as strong as it ever gets on a Defender.) It's main advantages come in the form of two single target holds, and the secondary effects of -spd and -recharge to all opponents. It's main disadvantage is the lack of a utility AoE - Frost Breath is slow to cast and its lack of a visual effect makes it hard to aim, while Ice Storm isn't an 'Every Encounter' power without a lot of +Recharge in it, and Blizzard is a nuke - a ranged nuke, but still a nuke, which means you have to question if it is worth the end crash on your character.

As a Cold/Ice, that -Spd and -Recharge are going to be your life. You're main form of mitigation is going to come from stopping the enemies from attacking as often as they normally would. This does have the caveat that you don't have much to do against an Alpha - you slow down their follow-up, but can't stop the initial strike.


-This Space Intentionally Left Blank.-

 

Posted

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TA I have issues with mitigation, at least early game. You can also have trouble getting into teams if you are trying to just get on random teams. Random average player out there = " a defender with no heal? What is that? Me no like"

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And there are also players who actively seek debuffers. Not "healers", not buffers, debuffers. I didn't get Task Force Commander on my TA/Dark by being in a supergroup (never joined one with that character), being invited to teams by forumites (no-one from the forums had ever teamed with my TA/Dark before i acquired TF Commander), or by begging (even if i weren't too terrified of people to send /tells, that wouldn't be my style).

Of course, I'm not being inundated with invitations to Shadow Shard TFs either (or Hess, or the trials...), but I'm just making sure the OP understands that TA is not saddled with the stigma that it used to have. It's not the most popular powerset, but it's not shunned these days and there are intelligent players out there who are aware of the power of debuffs and actively seek them out for their teams.

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I have a trick arrow/dark too currently at thirty and I'd have to say I'm very impressed with the toon. I solo better than I should. I put out a lot of damage for a defender. I improve team damage a lot. I also through out layer after layer of mitigation that just seems to make everyone safer.

I was doing some PUG AE runs while waiting for people to log and with only a tank and blaster and me, full team they were just all lowbies we were moving at a very good clip. No one thought I was that big a help, but about 15 minutes after I left the group PMed me and asked me to come back because they couldn't move through content anymore.

I don't think that people get what Trick Arrows do. But they do make a huge difference. I would say as toons get stronger on their own at higher levels, Trick Arrow because a better and better choice. People just don't need the heals any more.


 

Posted

Wow! Thank you all for your input and time! I will certainly take the time to discover and explore my options with this AT.
I've revised a few of my interest mostly due to a few themes I've come up with and will gladly report my findings...
Right now a Storm/Ice, TA/Dark and an FF/Sonic are at the top of my "try out" list!


 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
(Tangentially related)
I want to love Trick Arrow, I really do. I like all the powers (on paper), as well as the look. There's something buried in my brain about TA from when it launched though, in the dark times when they over-corrected it. That, and I can't seem to figure out what I want to pair it with more, /Dark or /Ice.

Help me Luminara, you're my only hope!

[/ QUOTE ]

I can't even try to give an unbiased response to that. I'm so infatuated with TA/Dark that anything I say is guaranteed to be skewed in favor of that combination.


 

Posted

I feel lots of love for the Trick Arrow too. Though I combine it with Archery because it's thematically the most suited. And makes for a very Endurance friendly combo. But anything that is TA/ has the potential to be amazing.

When I started playing Trick Arrow I was a bit unsure about it. Compared to other sets it lacked team buffs/healing. However I quickly realized that it was a very fun set and you have a power almost for any situation. It's a bag of debuffs, lots and lots of debuffs. -resist, -to hit, slow, hold, -damage, knockdown, -defense, -regen, -recharge. And some damage on top of that. In the lower levels you will not be as good on a team as the healers/buffers, or at least your contributions aren't as obvious, but once toons start becoming self-sufficient on their own (maturing in the 20s), you'll feel extremely useful.

It really doesn't hurt that your 'nuke' in archery doesn't drain you of all endurance and recharges faster than the other tier 9 blasts.


 

Posted

Storm/Psi was my first defender and I still love the combo.

My love of the dark primary has overtaken storm, though


 

Posted

Ice and Psi are both excellent secondaries. Ice puts out more damage, while Psi excels at recharge denial.

Remember that dual builds are a boon to traditionally "team only" sets like Empathy, Force Fields, and Sonic. Your second build can be fine tuned for soloing. This soloing build can also serve double duty as a tanking build if you're on a pick up group in need of a point man; add knockback protection (which you want when soloing anyway) and take the lead.


 

Posted

I enjoy soling all my defenders; Storm/Sonic, Dark/Ice, and TA/A, I'm also starting a Sonic/Elec that isn't high enough to comment on.

I think a combination that would do really well solo would be Dark/Sonic. The sleep from Sonic makes spawns without bosses trivial, and you can stack -Res from the Primary and Secondary, you get a heal and a hold, not to mention a pet.


Poisonous Ice 50 Ice/Rad
Icy Jax 50 Ice/SS
Jaxon Penn 50 Shield/Mace
Cpt Clax 50 Thugs/Dark
Lady BlackIce 50 Dark/Cold
Lady Black Ice 50 Dark/Ice
Bella Jax 50 Storm/Sonic
Operative Jax 50 SoA
Level 50 Trick Arrow Alts
TA/A-Plant/TA-Bots/TA
Level 50 Claws Scrappers
SR-Regen-DA-Invul-WP-FA

 

Posted

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Right now a Storm/Ice, TA/Dark and an FF/Sonic are at the top of my "try out" list!

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Any of those combinations will be great on a team, and they should also solo well, too, though FF/Sonic will probably be the slowest of the three.

You said in your original post that you liked the idea of a Controller-ish style of Defender, so I think you should take a long hard look at Dark Miasma. Dark, and particularly Dark/Dark, plays quite a bit like a Controller, so keep that in mind.

Personally, I think you have made a fabulous choice of an AT to play. No matter how many times I roll something else, I always come back to Defenders. They just suit me perfectly.

I will close by agreeing with Psylenz: You get a lot of character slots. Make all the toons you think sound fun.


Bye, everybody!

*Champion*

 

Posted

Update...So, far I am LOVING both my TA/Dark and my Storm/Ice alts! They both bring a series of "toys to the table that are simply too fun to get tired of! My TA/Dark alt is current lvl 13 and my Storm/Ice is lvl 14! Fun, Fun, FUN! ^^

My only problem? Now that I've been playing with the TA set...I find myself being lured towards rolling a TA/A as well...>.>

Altitis, anyone?
LOL!


 

Posted

*Scibbles notes to consider Dark Miasma as well*

You all don't want me to have a personal life, do you? ;-)

Thanks again for the insights and possibilities.


 

Posted

I agree with Riverdusk and you'll find there are very few teams that don't jump at the chance to have a Rad. You get one nice heal, not as good as Emp but it auto hits and heals you as well so it is valuable even when soloing, along with a Rez in case a team mate falls. Acelerated Metabolism also boosts everyone's ability to recover end including your (again good solo as well). Everything else is debuff and good ones. You limit speed, make it harder for them to hit you and make it easier for you and/or the team to hit them. Name the team.. Radio, Contact, TF/Trial, or Giant Monster battle and a good Rad is always a welcome addition.

TA has some pretty good holds but I also agree with his assessment.. Team leaders will look at you and the neanderthal kicks in. "You no heal Heals good You bad Me no want you on team anymore." Strangly I am am currently playing an Ice/Storm Controller.. and have a grand total of on tiny little heal with almost everything else being holds, immobs, or some form of control of mobs abd have no proble getting her teams.

Rad Blast is good your attacks add an additional debuff to everything they hit .. so if anyone tells you not to attack let them know that cuts the amount of debuffing you can provide.

Never tried the Archery set on a Defender but I have several Arch Blasters and if its half as accurate for a Defender as it is for them It is a good set.

Dark/Dark Good combination set The attacks, like rad, add to the debuff affect main it harder for an enemy to hit you or your team and it has some good holds as well. Only drawback to Dark Masima is it requires a villain for your heals and rez to work. If the entire spawn is dead the team mate on the floor better have an awake or someone else on the team needs to give them one. Also has a chance of missing so you may want to slot 2 accuracies to increase it's overall effect.


�We�re always the good guys. In D&D, we�re lawful good. In City of Heroes we�re the heroes. In Grand Theft Auto we pay the prostitutes promptly and never hit them with a bat.� � Leonard
�Those women are prostitutes? You said they were raising money for stem cell research!� � Sheldon

 

Posted

Archery is actually pretty 'Blah' for Defenders.

It has the same enhanced accuracy that the Blaster Version uses - the exact same values. Which is good for conserving slots - one Accuracy SO/IO enhancement in your attacks, and you sholdn't have many issues missing things. Throw in Aim when against things that DO have a high defense, and hitting things isn't ever going to be a problem.

Archery also gives a Crashless nuke, meaning there's one of the usual dilema of if the Nuke's damage is worth the end crash.

But now the bad news - It's a lethal damage set (regularly resisted to some degree). This isn't so much an issue on Blasters, as their damage base means that they will still pull off decent damage. Defenders? Not so much. You will feel how much less effective your attacks become as the game progresses.

And... it has NO secondary effect. Many times, the secondary effect of your blasts mean the difference between survival and a faceplant. Archery brings nothing to the table in this case... all it can do is hit things with higher regularity.

So... go with it for theme if you must, but I wouldn't recomend it for a new Defender.


-This Space Intentionally Left Blank.-

 

Posted

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Update...So, far I am LOVING both my TA/Dark and my Storm/Ice alts! They both bring a series of "toys to the table that are simply too fun to get tired of! My TA/Dark alt is current lvl 13 and my Storm/Ice is lvl 14! Fun, Fun, FUN! ^^

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Pro tip: slot Tenebrous Tentacles for Range in addition to whatever else you like. It has a 40' range, Night Fall (the cone you can access at 20) has a 60' range. If you match the range of the two cones, you'll be a happy person, kittens will shower you with kisses and puppies will snuggle with you.

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My only problem? Now that I've been playing with the TA set...I find myself being lured towards rolling a TA/A as well...>.>

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I'd recommend exploring the other ATs with TA, rather than overdosing on TA/* defenders right away. There are all kinds of nifty things you can do as a */TA controller or */TA mastermind (and playing as a */TA mastermind is very similar to playing a TA/* defender with an above average pick-up group). You can always make more TA/* defenders, but it's useful to experience TA from other perspectives because it can teach you how to use some powers differently or in unique ways.

Like using Oil Slick Arrow as a heal dummy for Zombies. >.>


 

Posted

The only 2 I can really comment on are cold/ice and storm/psi.

Cold/ice. Nice thematic pairing, a very interesting jack of all trades kind of defender. The shields are quite good, not up to forcefields, but powerful and on the same long 4 minute timer so you don't get the buff bot carpal tunal of say, a speed boosting kinetic. It has nice soft control, -resistance, -regen, group wide stealth, and even a recovery buff power. It really is a jack of all trades kind of set.

It's on the painful to solo side as many powers only affect others, and the really cool debuffs that help you solo Sleet and Heat Loss come very late.

Storm/psi. While storm isn't nearly as reviled as it once was, it is still a difficult set. Many powers cause knockback which annoys many players particularly melee types (and kinetics). It has a hard learning curve and people tend to be less forgiving of a stormy learning the ropes than say a cold or an empath. A poorly played stormy will cause all kinds of aggro.

That said, it is one of the more powerful sets out there, and once you get the hang of it can solo or team very well. Just learn your knockback-fu.


 

Posted

I'd recommend exploring the other ATs with TA, rather than overdosing on TA/* defenders right away. There are all kinds of nifty things you can do as a */TA controller or */TA mastermind (and playing as a */TA mastermind is very similar to playing a TA/* defender with an above average pick-up group). You can always make more TA/* defenders, but it's useful to experience TA from other perspectives because it can teach you how to use some powers differently or in unique ways.

Like using Oil Slick Arrow as a heal dummy for Zombies. >.>

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I have taken your advice --- exploring Plant Control/TA and Illusion/TA...they play very differently from each other and are really AMAZING! I was a little skeptical of re-using TA so much so soon...but I am truly impressed with how far apart all the specs really are.
This game continues to impress me by leaps and bounds...and I embrace my altitis like a badge of honor. ^^


 

Posted

I'm a little late to the party and for that, I apologize. Before you run off and fill all of your character slots with alts; consider these odd-ball builds for a moment!

Grav/TA Controller: An excellent team player and soloist! Wormhole (a highly entertaining power) a mob in a an already waiting Oil Slick and keep them there with a well placed AoE immbolize. Singularity is a fine pet and Grav has some good single target controls/attacks. Add epics to garnish.

TA/Elec: What's this you say?! A damage type that will light Oil Slick with no problem! A hold to stack with Ice Arrow! Win, win. You can also sap mobs with Power Sink from the Elec epic pool. It's a build that's truly more than the sum of its parts. Join PuGs and amaze them with what a supposed "gimp" pair can accomplish.


When there is no room left in Hell, the Dead shall walk the earth.

 

Posted

I recomend Rad/Sonic ... though, I didnt read any post other then part of the first.

... do I really need to?

<3 Rad/Sonic