Frustrated at the terrible skill level of players.
By
Acyl,
Posted on: 2009-05-20 19:27 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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Y'all should be ashamed of yourselves.
Half of you making the complaints are TF farmers who just can't be bothered; the other half I suspect went through their own "newbie" phase and how *quickly* you forget how we, the first generation of players, carried you along as we hooked you up and waited patiently for you to find your groove.
I've never been as downright obnoxious to new players as y'all are doing now just by listing your complaints out in this thread. Get over yourselves and give new players a chance.
Threads bemoaning new players like this are *much* much worse than anything Positron had to say about MA abuses and it works against everything the Devs do to solicit new players to try the game.
I'm not saying you're wrong for being frustrated, but I do think you're wrong for being uncooperative and airing dirty laundry like this.
Seriously, its just not cool.
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I will give a level 10 new player a chance.
I will not give a level 50 new player who doesn't know how to use the tram or what enhancements do, a chance. Period.
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Yeah i'll give 200K to a new lvl 1 player. Give them advice. Show them the ropes. Follow them around on a healer or buffing toon. Whatever, But i refuse to do that with a lvl 50 hero. I mean, it's just silly. Why would you wanna start a game at the end and expect to learn anything?
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Sure, because every lvl 1 or lvl 10 player you see is a *new* player right...? As if you guys would even know the difference... (I know I can't tell that easily).
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Well.. it's actually quite easy to tell which ones are the real new ones that are worth helping (giving them 100k, advice, etc..). If a level 1 with no vet badges asks where are the trams.. that's one that honestly knows nothing and needs help.
If a level 50 with 5 vet badges asks how to train to the next level.. do you think they're someone who honestly cares about learning how to play the game?
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If a level 50 with 5 vet badges asks how to train to the next level.. do you think they're someone who honestly cares about learning how to play the game?
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How is a lvl 50 with 5 vet badges a newbie?
This example that you're using goes against the original point that there's too many newbies PL'ing to 50 in a day's time.
If anything, I could say bemoan the TF farmers with X amount of vet badges who never play anything else *but* TF farms... they're just as bad, truth be told.
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Sure, because every lvl 1 or lvl 10 player you see is a *new* player right...? As if you guys would even know the difference... (I know I can't tell that easily).
Fact is, the only events in game for constant on-going group activity are the Task Forces and the Mission Architect - and y'all are just more than happy to take a newbie on board who can pad your missions then drop 'em like hot cakes (I know I got asked several times last night to pad for Victory's TF night). And you can't even acknowledge the fact that you've actively contributed to the very problem you're complaining about now!
What a bunch of hypocrites!
You can't have it both ways, people. If you take the newbs for padding your TF farms (regardless of lvl) and they hit 50 as a result of your farming efforts (cause they can't solo 1-50 on their own in just a day without help...) then you've got a responsibility to help them understand how the game works normally or go your own way without commenting and constantly asking everyone to pad your TF farms.
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Well like others have said, it's pretty easy to tell the difference between a new player and one who bought the game or PL'ed. Look at the vet badges.
Also i don't farm. Period. Not TF's. Not for Prestige. Not for influence. I don't.
I don't need lvl 1's to pad anything. Though i have to admit with all the friends i have it's hard to stomach a PUG anymore...
Oh and btw we are all hypocrites, get over it. 
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Sure, because every lvl 1 or lvl 10 player you see is a *new* player right...? As if you guys would even know the difference... (I know I can't tell that easily).
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By looking at the badges, you can see a ton of AE badges, not one Vetran reward, and the 5th anniversary badge being it. Add those together with a level 50 standing under Atlas asking about 'these enhancement things' or 'how do you get a quest' and that's a noob player who pl'd and now wants to find the 'rest of the game'.
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Fact is,
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wrong.
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the only events in game for constant on-going group activity are the Task Forces and the Mission Architect
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Speak for yourself please. Your experience is not mine.
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- and y'all are just more than happy to take a newbie on board who can pad your missions then drop 'em like hot cakes
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Once more, your experience is not mine. I do not EVER ask for padding, I do not play with people who do. I haven't been asked to pad for anything in months.
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(I know I got asked several times last night to pad for Victory's TF night).
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So this means what to me on Protector where we were doing a Rikti raid?
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And you can't even acknowledge the fact that you've actively contributed to the very problem you're complaining about now!
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Because we aren't a problem, you might be though. Since you are unable to acknowledge the presence of other opinions than your own limited scope. We *do* help newcomers. We *don't* help jerks who rush through a side-portion of the game to get to the 'end' and then expect there to be something more. Those are the problem people, not the newcomers who do the tutorial, read, and may become lost in the game when they're trying to find something *for a mission* or *to a contact*, instead of just joining their pals for a quick romp in the AE.
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What a bunch of hypocrites!
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Once more, speak for yourself. You might be, but I am most certainly not a hypocrite here, I have standards and I maintain them. If a new player wants to screw themselves out of learning how to play, they had better learn *before asking me to team with them*, how to play the GAME.
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You can't have it both ways, people.
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Once more, who are you referring to here? Since it's definitely not me, Sam, or most of the other posters here?
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If you take the newbs for padding your TF farms (regardless of lvl)
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Ah you mean the people who aren't here in the forums, those who WANT to powerlevel through the AE?
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and they hit 50 as a result of your farming efforts (cause they can't solo 1-50 on their own in just a day without help...)
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So wait, you're blaming the forum goers here who are NOT part of this stupid process, for ... the process? People who join an AE farm team *know they are doing it.* People who come in here asking, "what's the deal, these people wanted me to come along but all we did was hit the same stupid things over and over, and I didn't see what the point was" - are NOT those you're talking about, nor those who we like to help.
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then you've got a responsibility to help them understand how the game works normally or go your own way without commenting and constantly asking everyone to pad your TF farms.
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... Maybe you should take this up with, say, the players who ask YOU to pad? Because obviously you've got some kind of bug up your butt about it, but we aren't that bug. Move along.
Please read my FEAR/Portal/HalfLife Fan Fiction!
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If a level 50 with 5 vet badges asks how to train to the next level.. do you think they're someone who honestly cares about learning how to play the game?
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How is a lvl 50 with 5 vet badges a newbie?
This example that you're using goes against the original point that there's too many newbies PL'ing to 50 in a day's time.
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a newbie means someone who's just new to the game and is learning the ropes.
a noob/noobie is someone who displays willful ignorance and refuses to learn the ropes and wants everything handed to them.
I did not specify either in my post. But I have seen lvl 50's with multiple vet badges asking things like "where are the trains? what's oro? What do you mean exemp?"
There are people with plenty of Vet badges, but haven't played the game. People who keep their account open, or had played for a few months in the very early live game and then quit for 4 years.
By watching them, looking at their questions, and checking their other badges, you can easily tell whether they're just in the game to ding a lot and whine that there's no "end content", or whether they've come back to try something keen and new after being out of it a while.
Really, you CAN tell. You just have to actually TRY to understand how both the game AND people work.
Please read my FEAR/Portal/HalfLife Fan Fiction!
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the only events in game for constant on-going group activity are the Task Forces and the Mission Architect
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Speak for yourself please. Your experience is not mine.
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All hostilities aside, its not my experience either - its an ongoing observation about how some players "use" the game. Personally I avoid the TF farmers like the plague. In fact, sometimes I go out of my way *NOT* to organize a TF with farmers included. They get pushy, obnoxious and yell at everyone for playing through and sweeping a mish rather than cutting to the end and moving on to the next mish.
Again, its a perception I have from playing this game since 2004. I never voiced a complaint about it till now - and only because the newbie bashing going on here is completely out of line.
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Really, you CAN tell. You just have to actually TRY to understand how both the game AND people work.
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That's a valid observation. I'll give credit where credit's due on this one: I don't monitor people's badges for screening purposes which is why I never noticed. If that's how y'all choose to filter out players for padding and PUG's, that's more than fair.
Why do you still accuse us of wanting to pad for pugs?
We filter out *the idiots* that way. Because - they won't be here long anyway, that's from MY experience.
If you mean "some players" then you need to stop saying "all you hypocrites here" because ... we're not the ones you're referring to. Get that straight please. It's very insulting.
And once more for the record:
We are not 'bashing newbies'.
We are *bashing NOOBS*. there is a DIFFERENCE. It's been stated several times before now, I suggest you actually read those posts about the clear and obvious differences between a new player and a noob.
Please read my FEAR/Portal/HalfLife Fan Fiction!
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I think it boils down to this:
Ignorance is an easily curable condition.
Stupidity is not; furthermore it is contagious in tight quarters and crowded conditions. Quarantine is therefore indicated.
"City of Heroes. April 27, 2004 - August 31, 2012. Obliterated not with a weapon of mass destruction, not by an all-powerful supervillain... but by a cold-hearted and cowardly corporate suck-up."
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And once more for the record:
We are not 'bashing newbies'.
We are *bashing NOOBS*. there is a DIFFERENCE. It's been stated several times before now, I suggest you actually read those posts about the clear and obvious differences between a new player and a noob.
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Bashing *anyone* is never okay. And that was *my* point.
Have a good one.
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And once more for the record:
We are not 'bashing newbies'.
We are *bashing NOOBS*. there is a DIFFERENCE. It's been stated several times before now, I suggest you actually read those posts about the clear and obvious differences between a new player and a noob.
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Bashing *anyone* is never okay. And that was *my* point.
Have a good one.
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But you called us hypocrites and cast aspersions on our motivation for forming teams.
The lesson for you here to is not to engage in a thread loaded for bear. You seem reasonable, but your initial post stirred Zekiran, and she's never been one that even I would mess with unless I really had my [censored] together. Bad move...
Aside from that, your point is taken, but the tone you've taken isn't likely to garner any friends.
Brother of Markus
The Lord of Fire and Pain
The Legendary Living Hellfire
Fight my brute!
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New players don't have veteran badges.
[/ QUOTE ] So if I start a new account you'll be able to look at my vet badges and tell how long I've been playing?
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Really, you CAN tell. You just have to actually TRY to understand how both the game AND people work.
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Right and when you tell the difference, it's perfectly acceptable to lower yourself and become a poor representation of a CoH player. Got it.
Me? I either ignore them or explain to them how/what/when/where. Why? Because I choose to be a nice person rather then a dick.
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Aside from that, your point is taken, but the tone you've taken isn't likely to garner any friends.
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Because I really need friends like these...? As if.
Just giving folks a taste of their own medicine - and they didn't like it. No surprise there. Fortunately, all my friends are outside this forum looking in - and laughing.
What can I say? I just love their sense of humor. 
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Aside from that, your point is taken, but the tone you've taken isn't likely to garner any friends.
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Just giving folks a taste of their own medicine - and they didn't like it. No surprise there. Fortunately, all my friends are outside this forum looking in - and laughing.
What can I say? I just love their sense of humor.
[/ QUOTE ] You mean that making a bunch of friends on the forums isn't one of your top priorities in life? How can you be happy?!?!?!?!?!?!?!
I agree that with MA there are a ton of people who leveled very fast but if we were in their shoes back then we would of taken the chance as well. New to the game and being able to level and gain that first 50. I have seen new people and five year vets not know how to let a tank pull or how to play game so i think everyone can improve. Share what you know with the new people without sounding too preachy. I remember when i started level 50s in atlas seemed very cold and some still do calling everyone noob and making people feel uneasy. This game is for fun
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Getting into teams with people, who have really no clue of how to play the game, don't understand teamwork, following the Tank, the concept of pulling, or looking at your team roster to see how everyone's endurance is doing before aggroing the next mob,
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While I have seen an increase of both Noobs and Newbs, you might want to consider redefining your definition of skilled player. Not all teams will function in the same fashion. I rarely if ever do any of the things I highlighted from your first comment. Mainly because when teaming with competent players, such tactics are unnecessary and only serve to slow down the team. That's not to say they are bad tactics, just no necessarily the route "skilled players" would chose to go.
I think many of us 'veteran' players have been accostumed to only teaming with other 'veteran players'. In influx of noobery and newbery can been annoying at time, but we need to be curteous to these folks. Yes, I acknowledge there was/is a lot of MA abuse, and folks buying existing accouts with 50s they have no clue how to play. We still need to welcome the new blood that's coming into the game.
Now I can't recall kicking someone off my team in nearly 2 years, but I won't hesistate to kick a noob who won't listen to sense or reason. I try to be upfront about expectations on a given team. If asked to slow the pace down I will. If I don't have the time or patience to deal with slower/conservative tacitcs I gracely bow out with aplogies.
I was a newb once. Folks took me under their wings and showed me the ropes. Odds are most of you experinece the same. Lets not alienate newbs because of noobs.
SI Radio has many DJs and listeners whom hold City of Heroes close to their hearts. We will be supporting many efforts to keep CoH ALIVE!!
I think I'm flattered.
My point is, "bashing" people here, or engaging them in the game itself, is a one-way street. They don't listen, particularly in the game. Pretty much it seems as though all some folks hear is "yes I'm looking for an AE farm please add me to your team".
Like I said, I was there when the OP was having a 'discussion' in Atlas, and though I had to leave the zone, it really was a frustrating time.
If they'd played the game through, they would know they don't "need" x y and z for their team. If they'd played the game through, they would probably have friends and a supergroup to help them out. If they'd played the game, they would KNOW how to get enhancements, where to get a cape, how to form teams and the like. If not specifically from ingame tutorials or help, then from other players over the course of their experiences.
That's the key word: "Experience".
They have "none" because they have not played the game through before jumping into a sandbox designed essentially as a *distraction* from the rest of the game.
The shiny of AE is very, very tempting to people - many of whom appear to be of the 'get it now, get it fast, abandon it when it's no longer shiny' bent. I feel sorry for them, because they're just not playing the same game as most of us are. I also feel sorry for anyone who winds up on a team with them, because their behavior is NOT condusive to long-term play, it's very much "love em and leave em".
Not in the same way that, say, a PUG churns - that's a very typical thing to have, a 5-8 person PUG will go through maybe 8-10 different players over the course of a few hours. That's normal. Some folks may be just getting on to play, while others only have half an hour to enjoy before heading to work. There's nothing wrong with hanging on for one or two missions and then begging out.
But if you're talking about a team of 50s, and one or two of them *do not know how to use the tram*, or have serious issues with their powers and how to use them, ... the bulk of *bad* players should indeed be left in the dust by those who are playing *well*. There's another thread about "when it's okay to kick" - my opinion, whenever someone isn't pulling their weight on a team, doesn't know what to do, or *doesn't want to be asked what the issue is*.
"Dude, you know you don't have a snipe, right?"
"I can still pull!" *aoe* "See!" *faceplant* "The tank wasn't doing their job!!"
"Sigh."
(now, I know there ARE players outside of the ones we're bickering about who do that... they also need to be whopped with a rolled-up newspaper.)
In any case, players who are unwilling to learn to play the game *before* playing in the distraction of the AE, likely aren't going to be the ones sticking around to play anyway, when the farms are nerfed and their powerleveled characters are stunted. Like I said earlier, I think that the MA should be left to *experienced* players, who've at least put some time and effort into learning the rest of the game *first*, rather than just ones who throw together a character and run around dinging like it's going out of style.
Please read my FEAR/Portal/HalfLife Fan Fiction!
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I don't see how this turnewd into an argument. Newbies who get PLed to 50 are a problem. I teamed with a Soldier of Arachnos the other day who didn't know what the black market was. That shouldn't happen.
The issue isn't taht newbies are bad, newbies are great when they want to learn the game. The problem is that we're getting more newbies and the number isn't going down, because so few of them are actually learning to play.
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New players don't have veteran badges.
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Here's an interesting data point - how many people have accounts started several years apart? This is not a claim one way or the other, it's an actual question that might bring more meaning to the discussion. Personally, I never remember to check badges at all out of sheer forgetfulness.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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I do.
My second account is approximately a year and a half behind my primary account.
However... it's not just veteran badges to keep an eye on.
A 50 with no exploration badges except Thrill Seeker has probably never ventured very far beyond the AE, as they've missed the Hero Corps Recruit and Patriot badges, which are the first two people tend to 'trip over'. Freedom and Top Dog take some effort, but they're widely known and easy to find once you have the means to get to them. Redside, if they don't have Next Big Thing or Snake Charmer, it's probably a good bet they haven't wandered around Mercy very much.
There's also the Accomplishment and Achievement badges, that indicate what 'key' story arcs people have participated in, what they've defeated, et cetera. A dearth of these is another gimme to an AE-only character.
A character's level just tells you how much XP they've got. The badge details tell you HOW they got it.
"City of Heroes. April 27, 2004 - August 31, 2012. Obliterated not with a weapon of mass destruction, not by an all-powerful supervillain... but by a cold-hearted and cowardly corporate suck-up."
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Doesn't take any skill to fill.
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But you do need skills to grill!
Simple situation of vet players not wanting to deal with the new influx of inexperienced players coming in due to the MA media exposure.
Nothing new to see here. Move along.
"The One"
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Originally Posted by Infernus_Hades
The way you play changes your IO slotting..
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76 characters and Twenty-four 50s later, I still love this game.
AlienOne's Human-Form Warshade Guide (Old guide+New guide = 12,000+ views!)
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Sure, because every lvl 1 or lvl 10 player you see is a *new* player right...? As if you guys would even know the difference... (I know I can't tell that easily).
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New players don't have veteran badges.
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Fact is, the only events in game for constant on-going group activity are the Task Forces and the Mission Architect - and y'all are just more than happy to take a newbie on board who can pad your missions then drop 'em like hot cakes (I know I got asked several times last night to pad for Victory's TF night). And you can't even acknowledge the fact that you've actively contributed to the very problem you're complaining about now!
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What proof do you have that the people who have posted here do that?