What is most surprising to me is how much hurdle increases SJ'ing speed.
It adds like ~20 mph. The difference is quite noticeable.
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"I don't want it to appear that I'm willing to settle for anything. No-one likes a zombie without standards." -UnknownSubject |
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My only other problem with this is that I tend to like to move quickly throughout my mission maps.
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You just learn to move around in short bunny-hops while in mission. It looks really silly, but it works. Just don't do LONG hops, or you'll hit your head on the ceiling. 
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Training Enhancements don't make as much impact as later. Much depends on your build and your design. Me? I mostly go, as a minimum, all Accuracy until DO. At DOs I still keep at least 3 slots devoted to Accuracy and then drop to 2 at SO level. There is NOTHING i despise more than missing. Even a weak hit is better to me than a powerful miss.
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That's good, sound strategy. The urge to put damage into the slots is pretty strong, but at the TO level, nothing makes as much of a difference as accuracy, so I do the same as you. I use only TO accuracies until I get to DOs. I do wind up breaking down though and using only two accuracy DOs in some powers unless I've turned up the difficulty level. If the difficulty is higher, or if I wind up teaming a lot and going up against tougher mobs, then I stick with the three accuracy DOs.
Arc ID#30821, A Clean Break
The only problem with defeating the Tsoo is that an hour later, you want to defeat them again!
"Life is just better boosted!" -- LadyMage
"I'm a big believer in Personal Force Field on a blaster. ... It's your happy place." -- Fulmens
I know the pure numbers show that Hurdle is slightly faster than Swift, but I still recommend Swift over Hurdle simply for ease of use. Yeah, bunny-hopping all over the place may be faster, but... well... you're bunny-hopping all over the place! It's annoying to have to do that, and you can't "auto-jump". Wtih Swift, you get a VERY noticeable speed increase, and can just auto-run a lot of the time.
Of course, Swift and Hurdle combined would be best (in the absence of a true travel power).
Arc ID#30821, A Clean Break
The only problem with defeating the Tsoo is that an hour later, you want to defeat them again!
"Life is just better boosted!" -- LadyMage
"I'm a big believer in Personal Force Field on a blaster. ... It's your happy place." -- Fulmens
I want to skip the Travel Power with my /Kin Controller and going with
Sprint
Hurdle
Swift
Siphon Speed
Innertial Reduction
What is the best way to slot Sprint, Hurdle and Swift to be the fastest? All Jump Enhancements? Or better Run?
Thanks
Originally Posted by Megajoule
We're being invaded. Again. This time, instead of aliens, zombies, or eyeballs with teeth, it's the marching band.
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I want to skip the Travel Power with my /Kin Controller and going with
Sprint
Hurdle
Swift
Siphon Speed
Innertial Reduction
What is the best way to slot Sprint, Hurdle and Swift to be the fastest? All Jump Enhancements? Or better Run?
Thanks
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I have a Grav/Kin Controller as well. With him I went with Fly - for now.
Planned is a respec in which I will take Hurdle, Combat Jump, and Inertial Reduction (a form of Super Jump/Team Jump).
Slotting Swift beyond one enhancement will not grant much. Stone Tanks do that, but, the increase is about 2 mph extra per enhancement added to Swift and Sprint. Both, 3 slotted with run enhancements will grant you 36.06 mph. Without the extra, it is 29.57 mph. Those slots might be better used elsewhere.
Once again, Combat Jump reduces the chances of being immobilized. You will always move faster Jumping than you can Run. Combat Jump and Hurdle are a perfect duo. On my new Ice/Energy Tank, he is happily "bunny hopping" his way to 50.
As to the above, I went a different route with the Controller for a couple of considerations, and they were temporary only. The greatest reason was that this toon has been working heavily with much higher SG members because of the need for Speed Boost and Increase Density. Otherwise, I would have used the traditional route.
I am Airman America... Super Hero... and I approve this message!
Thanks for your answer. I will only go with the default slot in Sprint, Hurdle and Swift, but was wondering if either Run oder Jump Enhancements will work better.
Originally Posted by Megajoule
We're being invaded. Again. This time, instead of aliens, zombies, or eyeballs with teeth, it's the marching band.
Swift is not bad to own. Some ATs, like Stone Tanks, depend on it. This suggestion is simply a way for the Majority to get around between and in missions. Stone Tanks may need to make some changes/adaptations here.
However, let me point out, other that Stone Tanks, Hurdle is simply faster. Couple that with Combat Jump and you have a nice winning combo that keeps you from being immobilized and suppressed on speed.
I am Airman America... Super Hero... and I approve this message!
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... you should know that no AT gets any new powers opened up at lvl 14. The devs made lvl 14 a level where no "new" powers from a primary or secondary are made available to players.
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Just as a point of clarity: Luminous Aura (Secondary) and Shadow Cloak (Secondary) become available to Peacebringers and Warshades (respectively) at level 14.
Of course, Kheldians have inherent travel powers, so it doesn't really matter. But just to be clear: two archetypes have new secondary powers open up at level 14... and two ATs are more than no ATs.
Watch my CoH movie: The Big, Orange Head
True, however, I think he just misunderstood my wording or wanted to catch me on a minor point. Either way, it had little to do with the main idea which was to help out folks with an alternative.
I am Airman America... Super Hero... and I approve this message!
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My only other problem with this is that I tend to like to move quickly throughout my mission maps. Any of my toons without swift, slotted, feel like they're moving through molasses in January in a mish. I do love this idea...but it unfortunately can't address that problem (unless you ALSO take Swift a touch after this and slot it as well-and that eats up a valuable power choice and slots in combo with Hurdle 
).
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I find, in missions (even enclosed ones) I do mini hops or just simply bang my head against the roof. I move pretty quick from room to room and faster than my swift enabled counterparts.
I am Airman America... Super Hero... and I approve this message!
Shameless :::bump::: 
I am Airman America... Super Hero... and I approve this message!
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Just to let you all know, I have successfully ran a Scrapper all the way to 32 with this system. I have not encountered any problems that could not be overcome. In fact, it added a bit of fun to travel. I had to find new routes, overcome some walls that I did not worry about before and stuff like that. It added a bit of change to an area of the game that was "stale".
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Thank you for this idea. Because of this post, I now have a way to stay in concept with my non-super TA/A defender.
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Thanks so much for shamelessly bumping your thread, Airman_America -- otherwise I might have completely missed it. Like Shadow_Coyote's non-super TA/A defender, my MA/SR scrapper (Dash Bleu) is a non-super concept character. Originally he -- and the other Dashes, all clones (in one way or another) of Bleu -- took CJ/SL for their travel power needs. As cool as SL was (and it truly made COH look/feel like an entirely different game when Bleu first took it at lv.14), it was WAY overpowered for his concept -- I wanted cool ninja leaping (a la Babil Nisei, Giant Robo The Animation, or Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon), not mile long super-jumps (a la The Incredible Hulk). Bleu is supposed to be a Paragon City Municipal Court warrant clerk with a knack for hitting things and a real talent for not getting hit by them, but he's still supposed to be "non-super." Previously, I decided to respec all the Dashes out of CJ/SL and go with Sprint/Swift/Hurdle (only the original 1 socket in each) as their movement package.
Like you, Airman_America, I found this put a new perspective on many areas of the game. Any zone I'd accessed after lv.14 had primarily only been seen from the SL perspective -- much of the ground-level design/layout of higher-level zones was therefore new to me now that I was required to run through it. For some of the more notorious zones (like Terra Volta and Faultline), I had to learn the more "pedestrian" paths of navigation. It became something of a point of pride with me that I'd figured out how to get to the Terra Volta trial door (or out of the chasms of Faultline) without a travel power -- heck, I even figured out the route out of the Trench in the center of Terra Volta (a location I'd previously believed to be inescapable without SL/Flight/TP).
I got questioned by LOTS of teammates as to why I had no travel power, and the number of negative reactions I got to my "character concept" justification was far fewer than the neutrals/positives. In fact, I got quite a few compliments on just how quickly the Dashes were able to get from point A to point B -- a greater familiarity with the "pedestrian" routes thru zones really helped to keep my travel times from getting out of hand.
However, the Sprint/Swift/Hurdle combination STILL wasn't exactly what I'd wanted for the Dashes' original concept. The jumps -- while certainly well beyond normal human limitations -- just weren't "wuxia" enough for me. And I missed the extra control (questionable though its physics may be) that Combat Jumping offered. I recently respec'd Dash Bleu out of Hurdle and back into CJ, and was enjoying the extra jump distance and greater freedom of movement again. And then, I read your thread...
Thanks so much for posting the Sprint(2)/Hurdle(2)/CJ(1) idea -- I had never realized that you could even put Jump enhancements on Sprint! Dash Bleu still had a few respecs left over, so I headed to Galaxy City to test his current travel speed capabilities, respec him to use your suggested combo, and retest. With +2 SOs in each of the 5 Jump sockets, I found that his overall travel speed had been improved by a full 33% (over Sprint(run)/Swift(run)/CJ(all def))!. And the distance/height boosts have combined to make the whole package feel like a mini-SuperLeap! This is exactly what I've been looking for all this time: cool wirework-style ninja leaping without crossing into the realm of tall buildings and single bounds. Thanks very much once again!
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<ul type="square">[*]Grab HURDLE at level 6. You will probably want this power in any case as it is a basic before you can get Health and Stamina. Place a Jump Enhancement in Sprint and Hurdle.[*]At Level 7, slot both Hurdle and Sprint with one extra so that each has 2 slots. Yes, put Jump Enhancements in both of those slots.[/list]
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It's faster to move the extra slot from Sprint to Hurdle. 3-slotted Hurdle plus 1-slotted Sprint is slightly faster than what you've suggested.
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Just wondering if Airman tested this? Is it true?
I randomly stumbled on this Thread when first posted a few months back and have been looking for it ever since. Glad I found it as I have tried this idea on quite a few toons. Let me share.
25 elec/elec Brute-First toon I tried this on. I did it because I already had the temps from the Mayhem missions and thought is was a cool idea, wanted to try it. Works great! when I got Lightning Reflexes It got even better. Good ground speed and the jump was more than enough to get me up onto most first story rooftops.
23 SS/Dark Brute-He was 18 at the time I did this. He was made pre-i7 so there were no temp travels available yet. i actually respec'd OUT of SJ in favor of this setup, and with the temp travels, im golden.
15 Dark/SR Scrapper-Anything with /SR is a tight build due to the fact that you want to take as many peices of the /SR defense as you can. This was a perfect fit because in order to get what i wanted in my primary and secondary I had decided that Travel had to go.
Having played a while with more than one of every AT, I find this setup to be more than enough to get me where I am going. Granted I havent used it at the 25+ lvls but I cant see it being game-breakingly detrimental.
I couldn't remember yer exact slotting specs as I couldn't find this thread for so long so I did mine like so: I'll grab Hurdle and put one slot in that and one in sprint-Jump and Run respectively. Then I grab CJ and just slot the default with a Jump. Thats it! I'm happy with that.
I like this setup for a few reasons:
-It's great for a Natural type Hero/Villain that really has no 'Super' powers.
-It allows me to Milk the temp travel powers like nobody's business.
-In my DM/SR it covered my Travel AND my Fitness pool requirements before 14 and allowed me to take (not nesecarily a critical lvl 14 power) other powers that are available in and around 14(I was able to take a few powers with a few toons that came up at like 16 or 18) that are very useful instead of later or way early, i.e. it just loosens up some builds nicely.
-Also its a good precursor to SJ/Acro if u decide you want/need to go that route.
With my aforementioned Brutes, they are both quick enough to use only this getting around what I typically do is use this as my main travel and if I need extra verticality or have a longer distance to go I can just dial in one of the temp travels for that trip.
All and all, I think this is a great setup, can't beleive I never thought of it, and will use it wherever deemed necesary. Glad I stumbled back onto this thread today. Nice Work Airman!!
-Mohlvie
Actual Location: Inside the system itself.
"When the most exciting thing about Mace is AceMace's avatar, then it's time to get realistic."
Shield Guide
The only thing anyone in this game is "supposed to be doing" is having fun. Everything else is negotiable. -Jet Boy
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I couldn't remember yer exact slotting specs as I couldn't find this thread for so long so I did mine like so: I'll grab Hurdle and put one slot in that and one in sprint-Jump and Run respectively. Then I throw in CJ with Jump in the default. Thats it!
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Worth adding this nugget i forgot. i always take, well usually, I did with the three toons i mentioned, Swift with this setup and that rounds out the ground speed nicely for me!
Actual Location: Inside the system itself.
"When the most exciting thing about Mace is AceMace's avatar, then it's time to get realistic."
Shield Guide
The only thing anyone in this game is "supposed to be doing" is having fun. Everything else is negotiable. -Jet Boy
Yup, I do this on ALL my melee toons, as I take Stamina and Leaping on them anyway. I don't, however, slot them at all, just throw a jump enh in each's default slot and leave be, and I always make it to the mish with time to spare (at least until 14, and often then as that's when I take SJ). Seems to work great for me.
Doesn't work so well for those toons I don't plan on taking Leaping or Fitness with, though I suppose for some people you could take it with a respec in mind.
Also, this is very nice for PvP, where unsuppressed movement is very handy, as is low end cost movement. I've seen people with Sprint, Swift, Hurdle, and CJ all slotted up with some VERY good unsuppressable movement speeds, and they don't bother taking health on the way to Stamina, where health is debatibly useless to some builds (at least in some people's views)
/bumped - for the new folks!
I am Airman America... Super Hero... and I approve this message!
To the OP: What about those of us who don't slot powers until SO's, saving our inf throughout the early levels?
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To the OP: What about those of us who don't slot powers until SO's, saving our inf throughout the early levels?
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Hopefully you get drops that you may use in place of purchases. Even unslotted, you are fast and have the benefits provided by these powers. If you look at my points, above, you will see that.
I am Airman America... Super Hero... and I approve this message!
I've been doing this on a few of my characters for a while. Either this is their travel power, or they have SS, and the CJ + Hurdle + Sprint are adding much needed vertical height to traveling. I love it personally.
But, here's a thought:
After reading one of the above poster's guide to movement, something occured to me. Are we wasting one of these slots by putting it into sprint? Would 1 Jump Sprint, 1 Jump CJ and 3 Jump Hurdle not be faster and higher than a 2, 1, 2 slotting setup?
Has anyone tried to see if 3 slotted Hurdle, 1 jump in Sprint and CJ be faster? I know that CJ with more jump would be higher, but for the whole "Quick/cheap travel power" which would be IDEAL for vertical highth?
I'm thinking, If I took out the slot in Sprint, since i have SS, and put 1 more in either CJ or Hurdle, I'd jump higher. Probably CJ... For that matter, wouldn't 3 in CJ be the highest you could go with this?
You can adjust my formula a bit, however, I got it from crunching numbers for the MAXIMUM speed. Now, you may not care about 1 or 3 mph and then you may... either way, I simply presented the way to get the max benefit.
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Ran some numbers from HeroBuilder.
sprint/hurdle/cj - unslotted
54.31 fps/ 37.032 mph/ 25.27 height
sprint/hurdle/cj - 1 SO each
65.40 fps/ 44.59 mph/ 25.27 height
sprint 1SO/ hurdle 2SO/ cj 1SO
73.47 fps/ 44.59 mph/ 25.27 height
sprint 2SO/ hurdle 2SO/ cj 1SO
76.41 fps/ 52.10 mph/ 25.27 height
sprint 1SO/ hurdle 3SO/ cj 1SO
80.34 fps/ 54.787 mph/ 25.27 height
sprint 1TO/ hurdle 3TO/ cj 1TO
59.09 fps/ 40.29 mph/ 25.27 height
The numbers in HeroBuilder show the jump height never changes. Hurdle adds some height and then CJ adds a little more. Slotting did not change that number.
I use this method as a travel power in the early levels and I normally add 2 slot to hurdle and none to sprint. I will buy the jump TO's for these slots even though I only use drops for everything else. Another advantage I find in this is that you can now jump over the Perez Park wall.
Hero builder isn't shwing the height increase then. The SO's should change the height as well as the speed.
Any of my characters that goes to the leaping pool automatically takes hurdle on the way to stamina and combat jumping on the way to SJ/Acro. I don't use it as a travel power, but it makes a freakin awesome unsurpressed battle movement power and also doubles as an acceptable indoor mission travel power. What surprises me even more is just how slow CJ is without hurdle.